BMW 5 Series v 3 Series maintenance costs

bazz26

Right, started the search for my next car and was keeping a look out for a used E90 320d SE. Finding it difficult to find one with the spec I want such as leather seats, auto wipers and lights, etc. So started looking at a similar year E60 520d SE. The 520d can be bought for not alot more money than a similar 320d but there is a better choice of cars with the spec I want.

Have around €23k max to spend including my current 06 S40 1.6d SE to part exchange or attempt to sell privately. So really the only thing that is putting me off the 520d is the potential maintenance costs of the 5 Series over the 3 Series.

Anyone any advice or experience of owning or running both cars?

BrianD3

Don't have any experience but when I was looking up info on service inclusive for new BMWs, I found there is also a service inclusive for used, "Premium Selection" BMWs.
http://www.bmw.ie/ie/en/owners/maintenance/Model_Range_And_Costs_Downloads.html

bazz26

Thanks for that, not sure I'll be buying through the main dealer network as they tend to be very expensive to purchase. Probably looking at getting it serviced at my local BMW specialist, just want to have an idea what will potentially be instore with regards servicing and repairs on these cars.

Gumbo

bazz26 wrote: »

Thanks for that, not sure I'll be buying through the main dealer network as they tend to be very expensive to purchase. Probably looking at getting it serviced at my local BMW specialist, just want to have an idea what will potentially be instore with regards servicing and repairs on these cars.

general servicing is ok, i had mine for 6 months and nothing needed to be done on it. My other half has her E90 since dec and so far nothing has popped up yet.

the cars have Condition based servicing built into the OBC so one year you might get a pop up for an oil change and nothing else then the following year pads or a visual inspection and fluids etc.

BMW charge 135e for a complete oil and filter change on the E90 so thats not too bad tbh as the oil is castrol Edge and would set you back 70-80e in the motor factors alone and a genuine BMW oil filter is about 15e then add on the time to do it etc and 135 isint too bad and to also get the stamp into the book and your car registered on the BMW internal system which makes it easier for selling on as a buyer can check with BMW to confirm its history.

i'd imagine the 5er is a little bit more to service but not a hole lot, maybe 20% more.

http://www.bmw.ie/ie/en/owners/maintenance/BMW_Oil_Service.html

bazz26

Thanks, I know what it is like to get stung for multiple things at once. My S40 has needed a few things done to it now over the last couple of months that has clocked up a few nice bills.

unkel

bazz26 wrote: »

My S40 has needed a few things done to it now over the last couple of months that has clocked up a few nice bills.

Sorry if it sounds a bit off topic in your thread looking for your next car but we would like to know a bit more about the details of those bills. What went wrong and how much did it cost?

bazz26

unkel wrote: »

Sorry if it sounds a bit off topic in your thread looking for your next car but we would like to know a bit more about the details of those bills. What went wrong and how much did it cost?

Not at all.

Full service including new fuel filter: €230 (indy)
Front brake pads & front left tie rod bushing: €200 including parts (indy)
Intermediate service: €170 (main dealer)
DPF additive: €220 (main dealer)
Front left and right wishbones: €350 including parts (indy)
2 sets of front tyres due to worn wishbone bushings: €300

Now most of the above is normal wear and tear, maintenance, etc but over an 18 month period it is higher than I am used to.

PaulKK

bazz26 wrote: »

Not at all.

Full service including new fuel filter: €230 (indy)
Front brake pads & front left tie rod bushing: €200 including parts (indy)
Intermediate service: €170 (main dealer)
DPF additive: €220 (main dealer)
Front left and right wishbones: €350 including parts (indy)
2 sets of front tyres due to worn wishbone bushings: €300

Now most of the above is normal wear and tear, maintenance, etc but over an 18 month period it is higher than I am used to.

Some pricey enough costs there.


Don't want to play the broken record again but would you consider the UK if you can't find the spec/mileage you want here?

E.G:
http://www.buyyourcar.co.uk/used-car/bmw/3-series/awb_amsvehicles_10660003.aspx

ShadowHearth

kceire wrote: »

general servicing is ok, i had mine for 6 months and nothing needed to be done on it. My other half has her E90 since dec and so far nothing has popped up yet.

the cars have Condition based servicing built into the OBC so one year you might get a pop up for an oil change and nothing else then the following year pads or a visual inspection and fluids etc.

BMW charge 135e for a complete oil and filter change on the E90 so thats not too bad tbh as the oil is castrol Edge and would set you back 70-80e in the motor factors alone and a genuine BMW oil filter is about 15e then add on the time to do it etc and 135 isint too bad and to also get the stamp into the book and your car registered on the BMW internal system which makes it easier for selling on as a buyer can check with BMW to confirm its history.

i'd imagine the 5er is a little bit more to service but not a hole lot, maybe 20% more.

arent newer BMW with black boxes now? was told alot that new bmw cars can be servised and repaired only at bmw dealers, as they made allot of stuff to be very specific, and only the dealer can deal with it. all the point of that was to get cars back in dealerships, and get that few extra quid... i might be wrong now...

135eu for service is really damn good thought! even if its only oil/air filters + oil!

bazz26

PaulKK wrote: »

Some pricey enough costs there.


Don't want to play the broken record again but would you consider the UK if you can't find the spec/mileage you want here?

E.G:
http://www.buyyourcar.co.uk/used-car/bmw/3-series/awb_amsvehicles_10660003.aspx

Thanks, I think I have just been a bit unlucky that all these bills have piled up together, other than that the S40 has been a fine car to own if a little lacking in power.

Always liked the Le Mans blue and that is a nice example but hopefully trying to get a 08 within budget to avail of the new tax system and the 177bhp ED engine, the UK is an option, even though the exchange rate is high at the moment and used cars are not so cheap over there anymore, the fact is that the choice of spec, on the 3 Series anyway, is superior to what is on offer here.


This looks nice too but given the price and no mention of mileage I would guess it is on the high side:
http://www.buyyourcar.co.uk/used-car/bmw/5-series/spi_18809_25706188.aspx

PaulKK

Thats a lovely looking 5, and seems like a bargain price too. Your probably right about the mileage though.


Yes I agree about the exchange rate etc, but the market is just so big over there that you just have the choice of spec and low mileages, even if you pay similar money to here. Not to mention that they actually take care of their cars a lot better than the Irish.


If your trying to get a 08, I personally would really try get a 330d, they are somewhere around the €450 to tax. Not sure if it would fall anywhere near budget though.

dergside

I have e36 and e46 3 series and e39 5 series and can't say that there is a huge diference in servicing costs between 3's and 5. Budget an extra 10-20% and you'll be fine.

One caveat, buy the best car your money will stretch to (even if it means buying a little older) and keep a couple of hundred notes to spend in the first while. I've rarely bought a BMW that didn't need a couple of bushes or balljoints that the previous owner either didn't particularly notice being awry or didn't replace, regardless of service history.

Otherwise, great cars. Not as keen on the e90, but that's a personal viewpoint. Fine car. If going diesel, be careful of tired turbo's and fuel pumps and be aware of known swirl flap issues. Turbo and fuel pump are general diesel concerns, but the swirl flaps are a BMW specific issue.

Gumbo

ShadowHearth wrote: »

arent newer BMW with black boxes now? was told alot that new bmw cars can be servised and repaired only at bmw dealers, as they made allot of stuff to be very specific, and only the dealer can deal with it. all the point of that was to get cars back in dealerships, and get that few extra quid... i might be wrong now...

135eu for service is really damn good thought! even if its only oil/air filters + oil!

not that i know of, theres the hidden menu in the OBC that you can reset all the servicing items without having to hook up any computers etc so if you wanted to servie yourself you can reset the indicators to suit too.

very easy car to work on the E90 imo. the worst part is the air filter, its a cyclinder type filter and loads of engine bay items need to be removed to change it :mad:

jock101

If you even think you might have problems with the cost of running the car! Dont buy, simple as! If you cant afford it, do without it!:rolleyes:

-Chris-

jock101 wrote: »

If you even think you might have problems with the cost of running the car! Dont buy, simple as! If you cant afford it, do without it!:rolleyes:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=66760537&postcount=14

JHMEG

bazz26 wrote: »

tie rod bushing: €200 including parts (indy)
Front left and right wishbones: €350 including parts (indy)

Presume 1st one should be tie-rod end (or TRE)?

Is your mileage very high - I'm surprised you needed a new TRE and wishbones ona 4 year old. Last time I replace a TRE it was 17 years old.

bazz26

jock101 wrote: »

If you even think you might have problems with the cost of running the car! Dont buy, simple as! If you cant afford it, do without it!:rolleyes:

This is why I am doing my homework now to see if I can afford to run one of these cars. :rolleyes:

JHMEG wrote: »

Presume 1st one should be tie-rod end (or TRE)?

Is your mileage very high - I'm surprised you needed a new TRE and wishbones ona 4 year old. Last time I replace a TRE it was 17 years old.

It was a tie rod end alright. The other bushings worn were on the lower front control arms on both sides. I was advised to replace the entire wishbone as it was an easier job than pressing new bushings into the existing wishbones. There is 80k miles on the car, the suspension is a weak point on the S40 and the previous owner probably drove on crap roads

PaulKK

dergside wrote: »

Turbo and fuel pump are general diesel concerns, but the swirl flaps are a BMW specific issue.

No they aren't.. affecting a number of modern cars, e.g:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=64791062

I sorted the swirl flap issue on mine, £6 each for blanks from ebay and fitted by my local mechanic. No big deal/expense and piece of mind.

I wouldn't let the manifold issue put anyone off buying a 320d, its really easy to sort out and not expensive.

kceire wrote: »

very easy car to work on the E90 imo. the worst part is the air filter, its a cyclinder type filter and loads of engine bay items need to be removed to change it :mad:

The E46 is the same, a complete bitch to get the airfilter out

bazz26

Thanks for the valuable info guys, keep it coming. Does the swirl flap issue effect both the 163bhp and 177bhp engine?

Gumbo

bazz26 wrote: »

Thanks for the valuable info guys, keep it coming. Does the swirl flap issue effect both the 163bhp and 177bhp engine?

i havent heard of any E90's with the swirl flap issue, didnt they sort it out after the eary 150bhp E46's?

the most common thing that i have heard to go on the E90 is the DSC control unit. BMW will give a good will gesture on most cars that have a FBMWSH, but beware its a 2k fix.

it went on my old E90 but was repaired under goodwill by BMW to the previous owner.

bazz26

kceire wrote: »

i havent heard of any E90's with the swirl flap issue, didnt they sort it out after the eary 150bhp E46's?

the most common thing that i have heard to go on the E90 is the DSC control unit. BMW will give a good will gesture on most cars that have a FBMWSH, but beware its a 2k fix.

it went on my old E90 but was repaired under goodwill by BMW to the previous owner.

Thanks, the ABS/traction control unit on the S40 is also a known issue and costs around the same to replace but I heard you can get a reconditioned unit for a fraction of the price. I have been lucky so far on that front (tips wood) though.

Had my eye on this but it's bit of a trip for me at the moment and warranty work would be awkward and involve taking a day off work:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201025198565811

It does look very well in black and clean though.

unkel

Looks tidy but what do they mean by NCT: June 2011? The car obviously doesn't need its first NCT until next year

Also - surprised nobody has mentioned this so far - are you sure you want a manual? The benefits of a modern steptronic automatic on this size executive car, coupled with the plentiful torque of a modern turbo diesel engine are overwhelming

And it will cost no more than 5% extra in fuel. It will be faster accelerating and much faster overtaking. And you will actually be able to sell the car once you're finished with it...

PaulKK

kceire wrote: »

i havent heard of any E90's with the swirl flap issue, didnt they sort it out after the eary 150bhp E46's?

AFAIK the manifold was upgraded mid 2004, but there are instances of failure in all E46 150bhp models even with the updated manifold. Mine is a Nov 2004 which had the upgraded one, but I whipped them out anyway as I had read of failures.

I believe the E90 manifold is of a completely new design and is unaffected by swirl flap issues so bazz need not worry

bazz26 wrote: »

Had my eye on this but it's bit of a trip for me at the moment and warranty work would be awkward and involve taking a day off work:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201025198565811

It does look very well in black and clean though.

Looks well, and lowish milage too!

Gumbo

unkel wrote: »

Looks tidy but what do they mean by NCT: June 2011? The car obviously doesn't need its first NCT until next year

instead of leaving the field blank, the dealer is probably just pointing out when its due its first NCT.

bazz26 wrote: »

Had my eye on this but it's bit of a trip for me at the moment and warranty work would be awkward and involve taking a day off work:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201025198565811

It does look very well in black and clean though.

looks an ok car, decent spec, MFSW, Xenons, Leather, cant tell whether it has bluetooth or not. i personally dont like the SE trim, i prefer the M-Sport but thats personal choice.

if it is indeed a June 2007 car then it will be the older 163bhp version engine and a personal opinion is that manual is not suited to this car, has to be auto, again in my opinion.

bazz26

unkel wrote: »

Looks tidy but what do they mean by NCT: June 2011? The car obviously doesn't need its first NCT until next year

Also - surprised nobody has mentioned this so far - are you sure you want a manual? The benefits of a modern steptronic automatic on this size executive car, coupled with the plentiful torque of a modern turbo diesel engine are overwhelming

And it will cost no more than 5% extra in fuel. It will be faster accelerating and much faster overtaking. And you will actually be able to sell the car once you're finished with it...

I am quite open to an auto but most of them command a hefty premium over their manual counterparts. I really do have to stay within my budget when all things are considered.

unkel

Aye. I understand budget is tight. It might look like a good deal getting a manual now though but you don't want to shoot yourself in the foot. Manuals will be very hard to sell sometime in the future though

bmw535d

unkel wrote: »

Looks tidy but what do they mean by NCT: June 2011? The car obviously doesn't need its first NCT until next year

Also - surprised nobody has mentioned this so far - are you sure you want a manual? The benefits of a modern steptronic automatic on this size executive car, coupled with the plentiful torque of a modern turbo diesel engine are overwhelming

And it will cost no more than 5% extra in fuel. It will be faster accelerating and much faster overtaking. And you will actually be able to sell the car once you're finished with it...

rubbish, official 0-60 times state manual BMW's are .1 of a sec faster to 60 than automatics as far as i know, maybe somebody can clarify? defiantly not much faster as you say.

daveharnett

bmw535d wrote: »

rubbish, official 0-60 times state manual BMW's are .1 of a sec faster to 60 than automatics as far as i know, maybe somebody can clarify? defiantly not much faster as you say.

AFAIK the techniques used to achieve an 'official' time in a manual car are pretty ruinous for the clutch/box. Not the case with an autobox. Given two sanely driven cars, the auto will be quicker off the line.

As to overtaking acceleration, the kickdown in good autos is very good these days. It's quite possible to do the same by blipping the throttle on the downshift, but it's hard to be as consistent as the computer.

Gumbo

bmw535d wrote: »

rubbish, official 0-60 times state manual BMW's are .1 of a sec faster to 60 than automatics as far as i know, maybe somebody can clarify? defiantly not much faster as you say.

you try beat an auto in everyday conditions!
manual 520d V auto 520d on the M50 from a standing start with each car containing an average drive, say myself and my dad and i guarantee the auto witll be quicker.

official figures are advertising BS!

Squall19

kceire wrote: »

you try beat an auto in everyday conditions!
manual 520d V auto 520d on the M50 from a standing start with each car containing an average drive, say myself and my dad and i guarantee the auto witll be quicker.

official figures are advertising BS!

Exactly!

Modern auto's are faster now, its that simple.Off the line you have to almost kill your clutch to stay with like for like power now.

unkel

bmw535d wrote: »

rubbish, official 0-60 times state manual BMW's are .1 of a sec faster to 60 than automatics

The only person in the world that can do the official acceleration time in a BMW 520d manual, is the BMW professional test driver, where as anybody that can stamp their foot down hard on the gas pedal can do it in the auto

sk8board

unkel wrote: »

The only person in the world that can do the official acceleration time in a BMW 520d manual, is the BMW professional test driver, where as anybody that can stamp their foot down hard on the gas pedal can do it in the auto

completely agree. just ask anyone with a 5series steptronic.

with the auto's now as cheap to tax as the manuals, it beggers belief why someone would buy a manual executive car

Anan1

sk8board wrote: »

with the auto's now as cheap to tax as the manuals, it beggers belief why someone would buy a manual executive car

Because it doesn't look as cool as an MPack?;)

You're right though, I wouldn't even consider a manual executive car.

sk8board

I'm prob going to hold on to Jan to change my old heap of junk, but a '08 520d is top of the list.

as I see it there are 3 types for sale all about 3k diff in price:

1. entry level manuals; no spec, no leather
2. great spec steptronics, with leather and sports steering
3. m-sport version man or auto

I like the look of the msport, but the family man in me says its impossible to overlook the steptronic SE over a manual msport. Plus I drive motorway every day, and would keep it for a good few years most likely

I don't even view the ad's for the entry level manuals.

romperstomper

Ihave a manual 'executive spec' 520d and my dad has the auto and I can assure you that there I a huge difffere in mpg. Iget 1200km per 70 litre tank and he barely gets 1000. Keep that in mind especially as there will be likely tax hikes on the pumps soon

Drummerboy08

Bazz, this is more or less a big part of my job, predicting maintenance costs.

The good news is that most BMW's have timing chains, which means you dont have to fork out for the expensive job of changing the belt and tensioners. They're also fairly reliable, so there should be too many "unknowns" if you get me.

The bad news is that the standard run flat tyres are often expensive to replace. I'd recommend putting a good non run flat on as they are cheaper, and can be repaired. I know BMW recommend run flats, but I know plenty of people who change the tyres.

On the 3 series, the ABS unit is a known problem. I've had to replace 3 or 4 on high milers, at a fairly serious cost. I havent seen it go on a low miler yet, but.... Also, only yesterday I replaced the steering column on a 08 318i with only 27k on the clock. BMW covered all the cost under good will as it was out of warranty, but only because its always been serviced with BMW. If it wasnt covered under warranty, it would have cost €1000.

The 5 series i've had very few problems with. I'd maybe PM ROR and Chris and see if they know of any problems with them. Running costs and general servicing wouldnt be too far ahead of the 3 series IMO.

Hope this helps.

Anan1

romperstomper wrote: »

Ihave a manual 'executive spec' 520d and my dad has the auto and I can assure you that there I a huge difffere in mpg. Iget 1200km per 70 litre tank and he barely gets 1000. Keep that in mind especially as there will be likely tax hikes on the pumps soon

That'd make sense, i'm pretty sure the gearing is lower on the automatics. Still worth every penny extra though, IMO.

romperstomper

Obviously I disagree or I wouldn't have bought it, but consider that u will pay a 5k premium on the 08s or later for the auto and u will pay an extra 20% at the pumps as long as you have the car. If money is tight, that must be a factor. And a 156pa tax car will always be worth more than the nom emissions based cars auto or not. Resale has to be a factorr or else you could save a fortune and buy a peughot. 607

Anan1

romperstomper wrote: »

Obviously I disagree or I wouldn't have bought it, but consider that u will pay a 5k premium on the 08s or later for the auto and u will pay an extra 20% at the pumps as long as you have the car. If money is tight, that must be a factor. And a 156pa tax car will always be worth more than the nom emissions based cars auto or not. Resale has to be a factorr or else you could save a fortune and buy a peughot. 607

True, but if the autos are fetching €5k more then they're holding their value better, no?

romperstomper

They are five more new but only one new aftr two years so they aren't holding their value!

sk8board

interestingly the split of auto v manual is exactly even on carzone for an '08

44 manuals and 45 Autos.

cheapest manual (non UK): 25,750
http://www.carzone.ie/search/BMW/5-Series/520D-SE-/201030198992783/advert?channel=CARS

cheapest auto: (non UK): 27,950. has cream leather
http://www.carzone.ie/search/BMW/5-Series/520-D-SE/201027198712732/advert?channel=CARS

the autos tend to have a better spec, and theres a decent batch of them between 27 and 29k, sports steering wheel etc (which costs about 1k to add as a retro if I'm not mistaken).

love that new steptronic gear shifter too; like something from a Playstation

EDIT: heres one with the sports wheel + leather, also for €27,950
http://www.carzone.ie/search/BMW/5-Series/520-SE-A/201031199062307/advert?channel=CARS

prices have been almost static on them lately, but there are more becoming available for sale. there should be a decent(ish) cut in price come Jan and the new one is fully availabale

veetwin

romperstomper wrote: »

Obviously I disagree or I wouldn't have bought it, but consider that u will pay a 5k premium on the 08s or later for the auto and u will pay an extra 20% at the pumps as long as you have the car. If money is tight, that must be a factor. And a 156pa tax car will always be worth more than the nom emissions based cars auto or not. Resale has to be a factorr or else you could save a fortune and buy a peughot. 607

If that's the situation maybe a large executive saloon is not the best purchase. Personally I think a manual 5 series is a crazy buy. This car absolutley needs the auto box. I have driven both and there is no comaparison. Auto all the way

romperstomper

why wouldn't it be? I drove both and dislike the auto box for the reason that I didn't think it was as responsive. If I liked the auto box enough then i'd have bought it. my point is that the amount I would have needed to like the autobox was (as I bought new) 5K upfront and then another 5K for the first five years (after which I'd be looking at changing), so cost to me would would have been 10K. as I didn't like it as much there was no way I was forking that out, but even if you prefer the auto do you prefer it to the tune of 10k? FYI new 5 series + 10K is jag xf s money and thats a step up in class

bmstuff

kceire wrote: »

i havent heard of any E90's with the swirl flap issue, didnt they sort it out after the eary 150bhp E46's?

The design has been improved so there is less issues with these, but still there is and it is recommend to replace them with the opened ones.

bmstuff

bazz26 wrote: »

Thanks for that, not sure I'll be buying through the main dealer network as they tend to be very expensive to purchase. Probably looking at getting it serviced at my local BMW specialist, just want to have an idea what will potentially be instore with regards servicing and repairs on these cars.

You would be surprised that BMW Value services can be much better value than most indy.
It cost me more to buy a set of 4 large discs and pads (OEM sizes) from ATE (OEM manufacturer for BMW) and pay my local mechanic 100 euro to get them fitted than going to BMW...
Their oil service is interresting too.

veetwin

romperstomper wrote: »

why wouldn't it be? I drove both and dislike the auto box for the reason that I didn't think it was as responsive. If I liked the auto box enough then i'd have bought it. my point is that the amount I would have needed to like the autobox was (as I bought new) 5K upfront and then another 5K for the first five years (after which I'd be looking at changing), so cost to me would would have been 10K. as I didn't like it as much there was no way I was forking that out, but even if you prefer the auto do you prefer it to the tune of 10k? FYI new 5 series + 10K is jag xf s money and thats a step up in class

Not saying that you a wrong or anything but as far as I can see from the BMW website auto is €2,200 approx extra. Just wondering where you are getting the 10K figure from. If the used autos are commanding a 5K premium then surely it only reinforces the necessity of getting one. Of course if its a personal preference thats fine but it appears that manual 5 series depreciate much quicker than the autos.

romperstomper

I think you have mis-understood. there is a 5K difference between the SE and m-sport model when new. After 2 years they will be about 2.5K apart ALL things being equal.

The 2K difference the auto is when new is almost nothing after 2 years. As said you have to balance the hit at the pumps when considering it

veetwin wrote: »

Not saying that you a wrong or anything but as far as I can see from the BMW website auto is €2,200 approx extra. Just wondering where you are getting the 10K figure from. If the used autos are commanding a 5K premium then surely it only reinforces the necessity of getting one. Of course if its a personal preference thats fine but it appears that manual 5 series depreciate much quicker than the autos.

veetwin

romperstomper wrote: »

I think you have mis-understood. there is a 5K difference between the SE and m-sport model when new. After 2 years they will be about 2.5K apart ALL things being equal.

The 2K difference the auto is when new is almost nothing after 2 years. As said you have to balance the hit at the pumps when considering it

OK so you are saying that the 2K spent on the auto when new is not reflected in the price of a 2 year old 5 series? I still don't get where the 10K figure comes in. Also I suspect that you would need to be putting up a serious amount of miles to save on fuel over 2 years in a manual.

romperstomper

its a 10K difference over 5 years, not 2.
say they started @ 45 new for manual SE and 50 new for auto M-sport

5 years later, showroom condition with 100K miles, they are both worth ~15K
meanwhile you spent an extra 5 initially and an extra 5 at the pumps

unkel

romperstomper wrote: »

its a 10K difference over 5 years, not 2.
say they started @ 45 new for manual SE and 50 new for auto M-sport

5 years later, showroom condition with 100K miles, they are both worth ~15K
meanwhile you spent an extra 5 initially and an extra 5 at the pumps

I really don't get any of your figures. The official mixed driving figures for the current model manual (auto) are 5.0l (5.2l) /100km

This means over 100k miles, the difference is 320l, or about €400. Also good luck trying to sell a 5 year old manual for the same asking price as the automatic for sale next door to ya

romperstomper

official me hole. its a 20% difference. and as already stated previously there is an almost even split of auto vs manual for sale on carzone and next to now difference all things being equal