Peckham's sub-3 odyssey - Round 3: Berlin

Peckham

Here we go again. Have learned a lot of lessons from the previous two attempts and have made necessary adjustments to the training. Have set myself a challenging, yet achieveable 13 week training plan.

Have kept the miles ticking over since London, with one decent 10k race on June bank holiday. However was surprised to see last night that I've put on about half a stone since London (:eek:). Must watch the diet a little closer - too much unnecessary rubbish sneaking in.

Key focus this time will be:
1) Go slower on the long runs (i.e. keep them closer to a minute slower than PMP rather than 40 secs)
2) Include more speedwork in the long runs - following Daniel's plan of tempo sessions in the middle of long runs. Injury prohibited this last time.

Week 1 of 13 finished. Total of 40 miles, versus a planned 38 so off to a solid start.

Monday: Rest (unscheduled rest day, not how you want to be starting a training plan!)

Tuesday: 6 miles with 2x10min tempo pace (tempo pace being about 6:45/mile at the moment)

Wednesday: 8.4 miles @ 7:31/mile

Thursday: 7.5 miles @ 7:33/mile

Friday: 3.5 miles recovery

Saturday: 15 miles @ 7:43/mile

Sunday: Rest

Something similar next week, but will be pushing out to a midweek run of 11 miles with 4x10min tempo pace.

ecoli

Best of luck with the attempt seem to have clear grasp on areas of your training you want to improve and i am sure that you will get there

Sosa

If you stay injury free its there for you,you know that.

Best of luck with it.

Krusty_Clown

Nice one Peckham. Good luck with the training. Will be great to see how you get on with Daniels' plans. Our own running guinea pig.

village runner

When i broke the 3 hrs i ran most of my long ones at 8 min mile.
Doing Daniels myself. best of luck.
See you at the line

RacoonQueen

Best of luck Peckham. Look forward to following this log.

heffsarmy

Good luck Peckham with the log, third time lucky sub 3 all the way. Just looking at your first week, I would have done 5miles rec on wed and 11miles on thursday rather then split the total mileage over 2 days, just my 2cents.

misty floyd

Best of luck with the log Peckham. Its amazing how fast the weight can catch up with ya. I've put on about 8lbs since mid April.

Enjoy the training.

Peckham

heffsarmy wrote: »

Good luck Peckham with the log, third time lucky sub 3 all the way. Just looking at your first week, I would have done 5miles rec on wed and 11miles on thursday rather then split the total mileage over 2 days, just my 2cents.

You're correct, and ideally I would have done that....but circumstances meant that getting 11 miles wasn't feasible. However, from now on I have a midweek 12 miler that will incorporate tempo work.

tisnotover

All best with log Peckham, will follow with interest !

Would agree on the going slower bit for the long runs, + with village runner on long-run pace of 8min/mile. I guess it depends on where you are now and how you feel during the long run itself. Would you do the long run over hills ?

SUNGOD

best of luck peckham
roll on your sub 3

Peckham

tisnotover wrote: »

Would you do the long run over hills ?

Yes, where I live is quite hilly so my long runs generally include lots of rolling hills. Am going to struggle to slow my long run pace down to 8min/mile - I can barely keep my recovery run pace to this!

theboyblunder

Best of luck peckham. 3rd time's a charm!

corked

best of luck with it! looking forward to keeping track of your training.:)

shels4ever

Best of luck with the new plan.

metamorphosis

Best of luck with the new log and goal. Will be interesting to follow.

seanynova

Peckham wrote: »

Am going to struggle to slow my long run pace down to 8min/mile - I can barely keep my recovery run pace to this!

good luck with the training, daniels plan seams good, but you need to know what to do on the other 4 or 5 days of running, when not doing Q sessions, like you ive opted for general aerobis runs for the most part.
squeezing in a mid week med long run also, srarting at 7m but will gt up to 13m.

why do you think the above is the case? im finding it hard not to run at less than 7:20ish at the moment, trying to keep my cadence high like

Peckham

seanynova wrote: »

why do you think the above is the case? im finding it hard not to run at less than 7:20ish at the moment, trying to keep my cadence high like

I think that 7:30ish pace just feels like a comfortable natural pace, and that going slower than this involves effort and concentration.

heffsarmy

Go on how you feel is the best way, if 7.30min/mile feels natural and easy stick with it, don't see the point in trying running an 8min/mile because someone else finds that an easy pace or because a book tells you. Easy running is supposed to be easy, not something you have too think about. Just once your not over cooking the miles you will fine.

seanynova

heffsarmy wrote: »

Go on how you feel is the best way, if 7.30min/mile feels natural and easy stick with it, don't see the point in trying running an 8min/mile because someone else finds that an easy pace or because a book tells you. Easy running is supposed to be easy, not something you have too think about. Just once your not over cooking the miles you will fine.

thats my problem, it feels like im over cooking it when trying to keep the legs truning over....for tomorrows 11miler i will slow it down at all costs cos my groin is acting up!

but in your case peckham it sounds as if its jest natural, just make sure that 7:30m/m is ok not to tire you out for the Q sessions....maybe you might be revising your target

Peckham

Excellent week this week. Finished it off with 16 glorious miles through some torrential rain showers - the first shower was annoying, but once you're soaking wet the following showers become strangely enjoyable!

45.5 miles in total

Monday: 8.4 miles @ 7:15/mile. Finished off with 6xstrides

Tuesday: 4.1 recovery miles @ 8:15/mle

Wednesday: 13.4 miles @ 7:09/mile - included 4x3k tempo with 2 mins recovery - tried to keep the tempo pace at 6:40/mile, but went a bit faster than that (pace was 6:38, 6:29, 6:41, 6:35) - mind you, I'm probably being a little conservative with my tempo pace

Thursday: Rest

Friday: 3.5 recovery miles @ 8:21/mile

Saturday: 16 miles @ 7:52/mile

Sunday: Rest

Pretty much same again next week, except will push the long run out to 18 miles and do some tempo miles during the long run.

Krusty_Clown

McMillan suggests 6:11-6:27 for tempo runs, and 6:06-6:18 for tempo intervals (though I imagine these are far shorter than 3k) for a 2:58 marathon. P&D would be 6:18-6:27. Is Daniels's tempo approach different (e.g. by HR?). Solid running by the way. What will the plan max out at in terms of mileage?

Peckham

Daniels uses what he calls VDOT values (i.e. related to your V02max value) - but I think Pfitinger "borrows" this theory in setting his plans. A 2:58 marathon equates to a VDOT value of 54, which is a tempo pace of 6:26/mile (his VDOT table is reproduced on page 313 of Lore of Running). However as with all these things you need to train at the intensity that equates to where you are, rather than where you want to be. I'm not at 2:58 marathon fitness.......yet!

So, I've relegated myself two values below that to VDOT of 52, which is a tempo pace of 6:38. VDOT of 52 is 3:04 marathon, or more relevant to where I am at the moment - 39:59 10k.

However, my midweek tempo session suggests that I could do faster tempo - and maybe I could run a 10k faster than 39:59.......so my new tempo pace will be 6:32 (VDOT of 53).

Lots of numbers there!

Plan maxes out at 60 miles - have two of these weeks currently scheduled at 7 weeks and 5 weeks out from the race, although may delay the second one to be a week later.

Krusty_Clown

Peckham wrote: »

However as with all these things you need to train at the intensity that equates to where you are, rather than where you want to be.

That's my one foolhardy indulgence with all this training. I train according to my target, rather than my current state. Injury risks go up, but progress is also a little swifter.

Peckham

Not a great week, but finished on a high. Ended up aborting Wednesday's medium long run due to a large lunch causing me some digestive issues - schoolboy error.:o

45 miles in total

Monday: 8 miles @ 7:27/mile. Finished with 6 x strides.

Tuesday: 4 recovery miles @ 8:04/mile

Wendesday: 8.4 miles. Plan was 13 miles with 4x1mile tempo with 1min recovery in between, then 5mins recovery, then 3x1mile tempo with 1 min recovery. Got through the first 4 tempo miles no bother - probably a little too fast as they were all between 6:20 and 6:30 pace. Then the digestive issues hit, and I only got one more of them done (at 6:38), then I had to abandon. Silly, silly error have a large pasta with prawns at lunchtime!

Thursday: Rest

Friday: 5.6 miles @ 7:51 pace

Saturday: My first Daniels long run with some fast sections - schedule called for 18 miles (2 miles easy, 4x5min tempo with 1 min rest, 7 miles easy, 15min tempo, 2 miles easy)....so that's what I did, although I pushed the warmup and cooldown out a bit, and did 8 miles easy in the middle, so it brought me up to 19 miles in total. Hit the tempo pace very well - the first four tempos were between 6:20 and 6:30, and the 15 min tempo was done at 6:21 on some very tired legs! Was totallly shattered after this run, but feel very positive about it. Have two more of these in the schedule, along with two PMP runs.

Sunday: Rest

Plan next week is to push out the distance on the 8 mile run to 13 miles, so that will give me two midweek 13 mile runs - one at easy pace, and one with tempo pace in it. Am really doing this for convenience reasons, as getting the miles in coming home from work is a handy way to do it.

seanynova

Peckham wrote: »

Saturday: My first Daniels long run with some fast sections - schedule called for 18 miles (2 miles easy, 4x5min tempo with 1 min rest, 7 miles easy, 15min tempo, 2 miles easy)....so that's what I did, although I pushed the warmup and cooldown out a bit, and did 8 miles easy in the middle, so it brought me up to 19 miles in total. Hit the tempo pace very well - the first four tempos were between 6:20 and 6:30, and the 15 min tempo was done at 6:21 on some very tired legs! Was totallly shattered after this run, but feel very positive about it. Have two more of these in the schedule, along with two PMP runs.

great session, with a fast tempo session, that will stand to you! have a few of those coming up in a few weeks myself...in a way im looking forward to them, but not so much in other ways

by the end of the training schedule, a sub3 will be a walk in the park for ya! you are hitting sub3 times at this stage to be fair like.

Peckham

Another strong week. 52 miles in total

Monday
3.1 miles @ 8:03

Tuesday
13.1 miles total
20 mins tempo (avg 6:22)
20 mins tempo (avg 6:23)
12 mins tempo (avg 6:23)
...with 3 mins recovery between each
Probably a little too fast on the tempo pace, but felt in a groove. Don't mind the sessions with 3 mins recovery - I could have kept going beyond 20 mins. The killer for me is the shorter sessions with less recovery!

When I got to the end of the session a quick tally shows I did 18.5 miles at tempo pace across 3 sessions in the previous 7 days. Injury waiting to happen! Must keep a closer eye on scheduling.

Wednesday
Rest

Thursday
14.2 miles @ 7:30

Friday
3.6 miles @ 8:03

Saturday
18 miles including 8 miles PMP (6:43)

Sunday
Rest

My intention to run correct PMP and tempo paces (i.e. running them at the level I'm at, rather than the one I want to be at) has gone out the window and my competitive self has emerged!

Feeling very positive and hopefully another good week ahead. Should hit 1,000 miles for the year on Tuesday.

Sosa

Your going very well Peckham,keep up the good work
I believe recovery inbetween sets of pmp and/or tempos is the way to go also,it builds confidence way more than doing them all in one go.

seanynova

very good week peckam, paces are spot on!

tunguska

How are you getting on with JDs Q sessions? Any races coming up, gauge your progress?

Peckham

Have been slacking a bit in updating my log, and being on boards in general. Have only really had the opportunity to make flying visits.

Anyway, here's the story.


Week 5
35 miles

Monday: 4 miles recovery

Tuesday: 13 miles with 2 x 20min tempo (avg paces: 6:16, 6:25), 10min recovery between each

Wednesday: Rest

Thursday: 14 miles @ 7:24

Friday: 4 miles recovery

Saturday: Rest

Sunday: Unplanned rest due to hangover, so missed a scheduled 18 mile run. I guess this week turned into an unplanned recovery week.


Week 6
57 miles

Monday: 11 miles @ 7:01, clearing out the frustration of the missed run the previous day

Tuesday: 3 miles recovery

Wednesday: 13.5 miles with 8 x 5 min tempo with 30 secs recovery (paces: 6:23, 6:26, 6:23, 6:19, 6:18, 6:18, 6:27, 6:22). Was delighted with this session, as I wasn't really into it when starting out (and it was the session in my plan that I was dreading) but got into the mood and pushed on. Paces are at the fast end, but am taking it that fitness is improving. Nearly got knocked down by a car on Griffith Avenue during the 6th rep. That would not have been a good result.

Thursday: 4 miles recovery

Friday: 20 miles @ 7:33. Was staying in Castle Leslie in Monaghan for a few nights, so took the opportunity to run around the grounds there whilst Mrs Peckham was using the spa facilities. Had scoped out a nice 6 mile loop that I was going to run repeats of, but about on part of it I got chased by a rather nasty looking dog, so I binned that loop. Ended up figuring out a 6 mile figure of 8 loop, and just did a few repeats of this. Nice session as I was under no time pressure at all, and had a lovely pint of Guinness and tasty ham and cheese sandwich for post-run recovery.

Saturday: 6 miles recovery around one of my favourite trails in Donegal.


This week is 60 miles, ending with 21 miles with 13 PMP on Saturday before jetting off to the sun, and a planned recovery week.