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Luas Cross City (Line BX/D) [now open]

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    #2642
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,345 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    This is a fairly straightforward extension to the Green line. Why is there any need for blue at all?

    Isn't blue being used for Metro North?


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    #2643
    Pixel Eater
    Registered Users Posts: 486 ✭✭Pixel Eater


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    It was up to me I'd scrap all individual luas branding and go for more TFI branding.

    I'd definitely be in favour of scrapping it and replacing it with something much stronger and definitive. I actually think Dublin Bus has very strong branding; that could be used as a starting point for a more integrated transport design perhaps.


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    #2644
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    marno21 wrote: »
    This is a fairly straightforward extension to the Green line. Why is there any need for blue at all?

    Isn't blue being used for Metro North?

    Blue indicates lines under construction apparently


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    #2645
    D14Rugby
    Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭D14Rugby


    How do people think the whole buses on the luas line will work? Personally I think first while there'll be a few close calls but as the drivers get more used to it it'll be fine


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    #2646
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    D14Rugby wrote: »
    How do people think the whole buses on the luas line will work? Personally I think first while there'll be a few close calls but as the drivers get more used to it it'll be fine

    Luas has operated with shared space for over 12 years. There won't be any major issues


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    #2647
    D14Rugby
    Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭D14Rugby


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    Luas has operated with shared space for over 12 years. There won't be any major issues

    Oh yeah, forgot about those sections already there, approach to Harcourt street being one?


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    #2648
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    D14Rugby wrote: »
    Oh yeah, forgot about those sections already there, approach to Harcourt street being one?

    The Red Line around James' shares with private car traffic too.

    My main concern with Luas + Buses will be on OCS, where tour buses have a habit of not properly pulling into the kerb and kind of jutting out into the non-bus-lane, which is now a Luas track.


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    #2649
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    D14Rugby wrote: »
    Oh yeah, forgot about those sections already there, approach to Harcourt street being one?

    The majority of the red line post St James


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    #2650
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 4,959 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    D.L.R. wrote: »
    Simple, its where the old Broadstone alignment goes. Cheap and easy is the name of the game when it comes to public transport in Dublin.

    Why on earth would you use the Navan Road when you had a former railway line available.


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    #2651
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Is it really wise to have a load of trees in the middle of the O'Connell St stop? Looks like they will impede access especially for the disabled


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    #2652
    FreudianSlippers
    Registered Users Posts: 20,397 ✭✭✭✭FreudianSlippers


    spacetweek wrote: »
    Why on earth would you use the Navan Road when you had a former railway line available.
    I don't think it could have been more obvious that it was referring to Parkway station and not the actual Navan Road (which is a ****show as is).


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    #2653
    Pixel Eater
    Registered Users Posts: 486 ✭✭Pixel Eater


    If it went to the Navan Road Parkway would not just be duplicating the already exciting rail line? On paper it somewhat makes sense to go to Broombridge; it's just a pity that the station is such a kip.


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    #2654
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    Pixel Eater wrote: »
    If it went to the Navan Road Parkway would not just be duplicating the already exciting rail line? On paper it somewhat makes sense to go to Broombridge; it's just a pity that the station is such a kip.

    How else would you suggest regenerating the area as an alternative to building new infrastructure?


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    #2655
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Pixel Eater wrote: »
    If it went to the Navan Road Parkway would not just be duplicating the already exciting rail line? On paper it somewhat makes sense to go to Broombridge; it's just a pity that the station is such a kip.

    Duplicating, but also then able to reuse Navan Road station's Park and Ride, which would provide a substantial boost to commuters from the N3 direction.


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    #2656
    Pixel Eater
    Registered Users Posts: 486 ✭✭Pixel Eater


    AngryLips wrote: »
    How else would you suggest regenerating the area as an alternative to building new infrastructure?

    Simply build residential units on the vacant line/closed industrial units in the area but I agree, hopefully the Luas stop will make this happen and improve the station, and area in general.
    MJohnston wrote: »
    Duplicating, but also then able to reuse Navan Road station's Park and Ride, which would provide a substantial boost to commuters from the N3 direction.

    Shouldn't the park and ride allow people to use the train and then hop on the Luas at Broombridge?


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    #2657
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Pixel Eater wrote: »
    Shouldn't the park and ride allow people to use the train and then hop on the Luas at Broombridge?

    That could happen, but it probably won't because the Maynooth line is considerably lower frequency compared to the Luas, the ticketing isn't integrated, etc.


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    #2658
    markpb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,250 ✭✭✭markpb


    MJohnston wrote: »
    That could happen, but it probably won't because the Maynooth line is considerably lower frequency compared to the Luas, the ticketing isn't integrated, etc.

    There'll be no problem transferring from Western line to Luas, I'd be surprised if people don't do it. Going in the opposite direction just means that people will have to time their connection carefully but this is no difficult to people currently going to Pearse or Connolly by bus or red luas line today.

    Integrated ticketing does exist today both for occasional users and regular commuters. There'll be a price penalty which will discourage people from changing to Luas unless it's significantly closer to their destination but people transfer between train, tram and bus today, I don't see why Broombridge would be any different.


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    #2659
    D14Rugby
    Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭D14Rugby


    Is there a general luas developments thread or is this the appropriate one for me to ask questions just about the luas in general in?


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    #2660
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    markpb wrote: »
    There'll be no problem transferring from Western line to Luas, I'd be surprised if people don't do it.

    Yes, there will be people doing it, but I was referring specifically to people parking at Navan Road Parkway, then transferring to Luas at Broombridge. That particular switch I don't think will happen, because the hassle essentially outweighs the benefit.


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    #2661
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,550 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    markpb wrote: »
    There'll be no problem transferring from Western line to Luas, I'd be surprised if people don't do it. Going in the opposite direction just means that people will have to time their connection carefully but this is no difficult to people currently going to Pearse or Connolly by bus or red luas line today.

    Integrated ticketing does exist today both for occasional users and regular commuters. There'll be a price penalty which will discourage people from changing to Luas unless it's significantly closer to their destination but people transfer between train, tram and bus today, I don't see why Broombridge would be any different.

    The frequency may militate against that.

    People are happy to transfer between modes when both services are high frequency, but when one isn't then it can be a disincentive.

    The Maynooth line is hourly off-peak, while only half the trams will go to Broombridge, so it's a lot more difficult to predict when the trams will get to Broombridge, and a long wait for the next train!

    At least if you miss a train at Heuston or Connolly, there are facilities and buses aren't too far away. That's not the case at Broombridge.


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    #2662
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    lxflyer wrote: »
    The frequency may militate against that.

    People are happy to transfer between modes when both services are high frequency, but when one isn't then it can be a disincentive.

    The Maynooth line is hourly off-peak, while only half the trams will go to Broombridge, so it's a lot more difficult to predict when the trams will get to Broombridge, and a long wait for the next train!

    At least if you miss a train at Heuston or Connolly, there are facilities and buses aren't too far away. That's not the case at Broombridge.

    In the long term there may be a Dart extension to Maynooth so that will increase Maynooth line frequency dramatically. I'd say in the shorter term passengers will just have to leave good timing in order to get to Broombridge.

    Tbh I reckon the luas station will mainly serve people living in the local area rather than interconnecting rail passengers. Unless facilities and frequency are improved.


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    #2663
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,852 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    Have Irish Rail any plans to upgrade Broombridge stn after the Luas opens next door?


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    #2664
    Jamie2k9
    Registered Users Posts: 10,668 ✭✭✭✭Jamie2k9


    Zebra3 wrote: »
    Have Irish Rail any plans to upgrade Broombridge stn after the Luas opens next door?

    What do you want upgraded??


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    #2665
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    Jamie2k9 wrote:
    What do you want upgraded??


    An actual station and not just 2 platforms would be a start?!


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    #2666
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Tbh I reckon the luas station will mainly serve people living in the local area rather than interconnecting rail passengers. Unless facilities and frequency are improved.

    Cross City's Broombridge interchange will allow people in the N3 corridor and along the Maynooth commuter lines to work in places with heavy amounts of offices like Sandyford, which aren't really accessible right now to them without driving.


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    #2667
    Jamie2k9
    Registered Users Posts: 10,668 ✭✭✭✭Jamie2k9


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    An actual station and not just 2 platforms would be a start?!

    So build an actual station?

    IE won't staff it so why wast the money, you might get a TMV back if your lucky.


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    #2668
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Im not familiar with Broombridge station does it presently even have ticket machines. I dont think opening a ticket office is a good idea with ticket machines becoming the norm these days I cant really see it being nessecary. Also most people use leap cards now.


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    #2669
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    It has a couple of shelters, and maybe Leap validators iirc. That's it.


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    #2670
    ongarboy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,201 ✭✭✭ongarboy


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Im not familiar with Broombridge station does it presently even have ticket machines. I dont think opening a ticket office is a good idea with ticket machines becoming the norm these days I cant really see it being nessecary. Also most people use leap cards now.
    Agreed. They opened a manned ticket desk at Hansfield back in 2013 when that station opened and an IR worker sat there every morning twiddling his thumbs as not one passenger required his services until they eventually shut it a  couple of months later. As long as there are several ticket machines and some shelters with seating, RTPI and intercoms and those facilities maintained, I don't see what a physical station can add to the passenger experience.


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    #2671
    D.L.R.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,283 ✭✭✭D.L.R.


    MJohnston wrote: »
    Cross City's Broombridge interchange will allow people in the N3 corridor and along the Maynooth commuter lines to work in places with heavy amounts of offices like Sandyford, which aren't really accessible right now to them without driving.

    It'll be quicker for Maynooth-Sandyford commuters to stay on the train till Tara St and just walk across to Trinity. Broombridge interchange will only really be useful for people headed to the north city.


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