Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

phog

Some stats from the June Internationals.

.ak

phog wrote: »

Some stats from the June Internationals.

Owch, if stat 3 is correct that is shockingly embarrassing for us. Although not surprising.

CatFromHue

.ak wrote: »

Owch, if stat 3 is correct that is shockingly embarrassing for us. Although not surprising.

ESPN have us down as having missed 14, 20, and 32 tackles in each of the tests!

bilston

The number of errors made by the ABs is fascinating. Is this down to a higher risk brand of rugby I wonder. Do they just accept that yes they will make some errors but the reward is worth the risk? Are we too risk averse in our brand of rugby?

.ak

bilston wrote: »

The number of errors made by the ABs is fascinating. Is this down to a higher risk brand of rugby I wonder. Do they just accept that yes they will make some errors but the reward is worth the risk? Are we too risk averse in our brand of rugby?

Well, there was some fresh faces in the ABs team, including the coaching staff...

profitius

bilston wrote: »

The number of errors made by the ABs is fascinating. Is this down to a higher risk brand of rugby I wonder. Do they just accept that yes they will make some errors but the reward is worth the risk? Are we too risk averse in our brand of rugby?

Yes. The ABs play at a high tempo and look to offload the ball in the tackle etc. Thats risky but as we saw in the series against Ireland, its the correct way to play. There was also interesting stats regarding the amount of time and possession the ABs had in the Ireland 22 compared to Ireland. It was not that dominant but the scoreboard was very dominant.

Australia had the most mistakes but they play a fast brand of rugby and like to keep the ball. They were also missing a few players who normally would make less errors.

CatFromHue

Interesting comments from London Irish's Brian Smith about TOL today.

"Tomas O'Leary was hung out to dry. He was a starting player for Ireland and they came under a bit of pressure in the warm-up games for the World Cup.

"He threw an intercept pass in a game that didn't go well for Ireland and he was hung out to dry. O'Leary has never stopped being a brilliant player.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/smith-hits-out-at-kidneys-treatment-of-oleary-3159272.html

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London Irish endearing themselves to the Irish as usual.

bilston

CatFromHue wrote: »

Interesting comments from London Irish's Brian Smith about TOL today.

"Tomas O'Leary was hung out to dry. He was a starting player for Ireland and they came under a bit of pressure in the warm-up games for the World Cup.

"He threw an intercept pass in a game that didn't go well for Ireland and he was hung out to dry. O'Leary has never stopped being a brilliant player.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/smith-hits-out-at-kidneys-treatment-of-oleary-3159272.html

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London Irish endearing themselves to the Irish as usual.

Ah well I wouldn't have much love for London Irish at the moment while Brian Smith is there but it's good to see a bit more of an Irish influence in the playing squad now with O'Leary, Humphreys, Sandford and Gaston. Hopefully it goes well for TOL.

CatFromHue

CatFromHue wrote: »

Interesting comments from London Irish's Brian Smith about TOL today.

"Tomas O'Leary was hung out to dry. He was a starting player for Ireland and they came under a bit of pressure in the warm-up games for the World Cup.

"He threw an intercept pass in a game that didn't go well for Ireland and he was hung out to dry. O'Leary has never stopped being a brilliant player.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/smith-hits-out-at-kidneys-treatment-of-oleary-3159272.html

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London Irish endearing themselves to the Irish as usual.

Hardly going to slag off his new player, but come on now...

Hilarious mis-use of facts/stats in that article too.

O'Leary was restricted to nine starts for Munster last season, with Conor Murray preferred at scrum-half.

Fail to mention that Murray only got 8 in the preceding season, the season in which he broke through to earn Irish caps.

Also that O'Leary only started 8 himself in that season, so the rot started well before the French game.

Big Nelly

Deleted User wrote: »

Hardly going to slag off his new player, but come on now...

Hilarious mis-use of facts/stats in that article too.



Fail to mention that Murray only got 8 in the preceding season, the season in which he broke through to earn Irish caps.

Also that O'Leary only started 8 himself in that season, so the rot started well before the French game.

Hi Guys, no point slagging off O'Leary, Murray plays the exact game as he does. I was one of the happiest people when he was removed but bringing in Murray didn't change a whole lot.

I am not having a go at Murray but I think he needs more experience. And the bigger problem is why Kidney always has to play a 9/10 who don't play club football together. Sexton/Redden have won all around them. Why not stick with that? its more of a management problem than picking out players

Murray's a lot better at TO'L's game than O'Leary is. He will also be a lot better than him at being a scrum half if he gets told to play as a scrum half.

thomond2006

CatFromHue wrote: »

Interesting comments from London Irish's Brian Smith about TOL today.

"Tomas O'Leary was hung out to dry. He was a starting player for Ireland and they came under a bit of pressure in the warm-up games for the World Cup.

"He threw an intercept pass in a game that didn't go well for Ireland and he was hung out to dry. O'Leary has never stopped being a brilliant player.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/smith-hits-out-at-kidneys-treatment-of-oleary-3159272.html

---

London Irish endearing themselves to the Irish as usual.

There's backing your man and then there's that...****ing hell

GerM

To be honest, I think TOL was hung out a little bit. Ireland had a horrorshow in the warm ups and TOL was the fall guy. Yes, he was poison but there was a serious smell of panic off his culling that was reminiscent of Stringer being dropped in 2007. He was first choice scrum half for Ireland and went from that position to his international career being scrapped in the space of a few days. I think his dropping was more to do with being seen to do something to shake things up rather than actually dropping him on merit.

Boss played about 20 minutes for DK in 3 years and all of a sudden had leapfrogged the guy who was always first choice? Doesn't wash.

Cpt_Blackbeard

GerM wrote: »

To be honest, I think TOL was hung out a little bit. Ireland had a horrorshow in the warm ups and TOL was the fall guy. Yes, he was poison but there was a serious smell of panic off his culling that was reminiscent of Stringer being dropped in 2007. He was first choice scrum half for Ireland and went from that position to his international career being scrapped in the space of a few days. I think his dropping was more to do with being seen to do something to shake things up rather than actually dropping him on merit.

Boss played about 20 minutes for DK in 3 years and all of a sudden had leapfrogged the guy who was always first choice? Doesn't wash.

I agree completely. TOL shouldn't have been in with a shot of traveling to the WC; especially not as first choice. He was made an example of due to his intercept. He has been given more chances than anyone else, but he ended up losing his place and a big payday, due a mixtures of his own and Heaslip's mistake.

leftleg

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

and Heaslip's mistake.

oh yeah missed that It was Heaslip that threw the intercept; Somethings never change :mad:

GerM

leftleg wrote: »

oh yeah missed that It was Heaslip that threw the intercept; Somethings never change :mad:

Heaslip, in fairness, didn't cover himself in glory. He put TOL under big pressure 5m from his own line. Perhaps it was poor communication but it's something that Heaslip normally would be aware of and wouldn't have thrown the pass.

ed7890

leftleg wrote: »

oh yeah missed that It was Heaslip that threw the intercept; Somethings never change :mad:

Heaslip did make a mistake, and TOL was scrambling to recover when he threw the intercept, whats the problem.

leftleg

GerM wrote: »

Heaslip, in fairness, didn't cover himself in glory. He put TOL under big pressure 5m from his own line. Perhaps it was poor communication but it's something that Heaslip normally would be aware of and wouldn't have thrown the pass.

If you look at the clip in slow motion, TOL has completely overrun the pass; Heaslip has absolutely no chance of passing to him without it being forward.

And all aside nothing excuses that suicidal pass from TOL straight after; awful stuff altogether.

CatFromHue

I do feel a bit sorry for TOL I have to say. Not that I think he should have been playing for Ireland but that I think he was managed badly. He seemed to be going from injury to injury but was still being thrown in the deep end when he wasn't ready. No player is going to say to his coach don't pick me I'm not ready and he is as eager as they come.

In a way his position with Munster and Ireland almost became untenable as the fans had turned against him. Even when he was playing well enough he wasn't getting much credit.

Even when it was announced he was leaving the Munster website weren't very, well weren't very nice to him. This is what they had up for when he was leaving http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10264.php. Granted it was his choice to leave and they did offer him a contract but he did 87 games for em and had another 40 appearances from the bench. They should have done better. Compare it to what they had for when Dennis Fogarty was leaving http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10414.php.

I hope he does well at Irish and manages to work out the weaknesses in his game.

Cpt_Blackbeard

leftleg wrote: »

oh yeah missed that It was Heaslip that threw the intercept; Somethings never change :mad:

Exactly. You jumping to the unabashed defense of your heroes. :rolleyes:

CatFromHue wrote: »

I do feel a bit sorry for TOL I have to say. Not that I think he should have been playing for Ireland but that I think he was managed badly. He seemed to be going from injury to injury but was still being thrown in the deep end when he wasn't ready. No player is going to say to his coach don't pick me I'm not ready and he is as eager as they come.

In a way his position with Munster and Ireland almost became untenable as the fans had turned against him. Even when he was playing well enough he wasn't getting much credit.

Even when it was announced he was leaving the Munster website weren't very, well weren't very nice to him. This is what they had up for when he was leaving http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10264.php. Granted it was his choice to leave and they did offer him a contract but he did 87 games for em and had another 40 appearances from the bench. They should have done better. Compare it to what they had for when Dennis Fogarty was leaving http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10414.php.

I hope he does well at Irish and manages to work out the weaknesses in his game.

The press release on the Munster site announcing TOL's departure was very unprofessional. While I can fully understand why some involved with Munster would be spiteful - TOL was given every possible chance, yet he jumped ship at the first opportunity - it wasn't handled correctly.

leftleg

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Exactly. You jumping to the unabashed defense of your heroes. :rolleyes:

As someone once said to me a short while ago; go check through my posts; I've never sworn allegiance to any province or player unlike some; and my posts reflect that.

If you check and have a good auld look at the replay of the blunder you'll see TOL way ahead of the pass hence it didn't go to him.

Another one of your favourite's Luke Fitz is also prone to overrunning them passes, seems to be an awful thing for him to do (which it very definitely is)but then its not even refenced by you when it involves TOL.

Ive said it before and ill say it again there's a but in all your comments especially when Heaslip is the subject. You seem to have it in for him in a big way.

Cpt_Blackbeard

leftleg wrote: »

As someone once said to me a short while ago; go check through my posts; I've never sworn allegiance to any province or player unlike some; and my posts reflect that.

If you check and have a good auld look at the replay of the blunder you'll see TOL way ahead of the pass hence it didn't go to him.

Another one of your favourite's Luke Fitz is also prone to overrunning them passes, seems to be an awful thing for him to do (which it very definitely is)but then its not even refenced by you when it involves TOL.

Ive said it before and ill say it again there's a but in all your comments especially when Heaslip is the subject. You seem to have it in for him in a big way.

TOL did over-run the pass, but that does not excuse the quality of the offload. Anyway, Heaslip should not have passed the ball anyway. He carried the ball from the base with no conviction, and he was unwilling to attack the gainline with ball in hand - A problem which he displayed for much of 2011.

Your general POV can be summed up nicely in the following video. Obviously, you'll need to alter the dialogue to suit your current stance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHmvkRoEowc

leftleg

Ill just reply to the bit about rugby and ignore the rest which has nothing to do with this thread or conversation;

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

TOL did over-run the pass, but that does not excuse the quality of the offload.

How do you offload to someone miles ahead of you?? isn't that how a forward pass occurs??

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Anyway, Heaslip should not have passed the ball anyway. He carried the ball from the base with no conviction, and he was unwilling to attack the gainline with ball in hand - A problem which he displayed for much of 2011.

That's it, revert to what you know best.

I rest my case

Cpt_Blackbeard

Sorry, you're right. Heaslip was completely infallible in that case. He is a world-class #8 who never makes mistakes and can in no way improve as either a player or a person. Keiran Read wishes he could be as good as our Heaslip.

leftleg

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Sorry, you're right. Heaslip was completely infallible in that case. He is a world-class #8 who never makes mistakes and can in no way improve as either a player or a person. Keiran Read wishes he could be as good as our Heaslip.

HereS something to cheer you up so;)

.ak

leftleg, cpt, if you want to talk about players constructively that's fine, but less of the useless sniping at each other.. it's very boring the rest of us!

CIARAN_BOYLE

.ak wrote: »

leftleg, cpt, if you want to talk about players constructively that's fine, but less of the useless sniping at each other.. it's very boring the rest of us!

Your first Mod warning???

Congratulations

danthefan

GerM wrote: »

To be honest, I think TOL was hung out a little bit. Ireland had a horrorshow in the warm ups and TOL was the fall guy. Yes, he was poison but there was a serious smell of panic off his culling that was reminiscent of Stringer being dropped in 2007. He was first choice scrum half for Ireland and went from that position to his international career being scrapped in the space of a few days. I think his dropping was more to do with being seen to do something to shake things up rather than actually dropping him on merit.

Boss played about 20 minutes for DK in 3 years and all of a sudden had leapfrogged the guy who was always first choice? Doesn't wash.

Whatever the motives, it was right to leave him out. Him being first choice for so long is, imo, the worst selection Kidney has made during his tenure. It was a disgrace tbh.

And I know you haven't said so but on a general point there was far more than that intercept in the France game. His box kick to the middle of the field that was returned for a DG, he passed to the floor a couple of times, the pass from the base of a ruck that went about 10 feet over Sexton's head, all added to his general ponderousness. His first 10 minutes of the game were actually very good but beyond that he was just awful.

justsomebloke

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Your first Mod warning???

Congratulations

*sniff* they grow up so quickly!

Fishooks12

.ak wrote: »

leftleg, cpt, if you want to talk about players constructively that's fine, but less of the useless sniping at each other.. it's very boring the rest of us!

A swift hand