Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

ScissorPaperRock

molloyjh wrote: »

This is the kind of comment I was referring to. It says absolutely nothing yet at the same time suggests that there's something more to what we're talking about. All it does is cause confusion. There are 3 simple possibilities:

1. The offer is no longer on the table and you know this, in which case there's no point in you saying anything.

2. The offer is still on the table and you know that, in which case you should just come out and say so unless you can't for contractual reasons. In this instance you should obviously say nothing.

3. You don't know, in which case as someone who we all know is in the IRFU you're better off saying nothing as it will only cause confusion.

Reading into it a bit much maybe? I think it's pretty clear what he meant to say. It's probably safe to assume he's not talking in an official capacity here on boards.ie, so it might be better to use your discretion and weigh things up the same way you do with any other poster.

Fishooks12

LUKKKKKKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE (hup)

pickarooney

I'll miss this due to playing a match at 9am. Feck it.

watching this today

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5QJXRbmQ8&feature=player_embedded

how good is the offloading game at 35:50?

get the lads back!

Fishooks12

No match thread for tomorrow yet??

Clegg

I saw this on Planet Rugby.

Irelands record since Kidney took over:

2008-2009 – won 11 of 13 games (Including 3 vs. Canda(2) and USA)

2009-2010 – won 4 of 10 games (Including 1 vs. Fiji

2010-2011 – won 5 of 9 games (1v. Samoa)

2011-2012 – won 6 of 17 games (2 vs. Usa and Russia)

Now Kidney isn't solely to blame for this poor record. We've had players performing well below their level and also some unfortunate injuries. But Kidney and his coaching team must take the blame for our outdated tactics. No backs coach in over a year, tactics that boil down to kicking the leather off the ball and then one outs to forwards off of slow ruck ball. All these things could have been fixed with proper coaching but they've only gotten worse over time.

tolosenc

George Hook has been sticking his oar in this evening, including this gem...

https://twitter.com/ghook/status/217011365070643201

Hook is the best.

I'd love to get paid to troll.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Deleted User wrote: »

Hook is the best.

I'd love to get paid to troll.

In fairness he's not wrong in everything he said, he just approached it in the George Hook way. ROG is a better kicker and passer than Sexton. Doesn't mean he should be included in the national team though.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

In fairness he's not wrong in everything he said, he just approached it in the George Hook way. ROG is a better kicker and passer than Sexton. Doesn't mean he should be included in the national team though.

Old ROG might well have been a better kicker than Sexton, but the last 6 months of ROG have well and truly shown that he's tapering badly.

I certainly refute the passing comment though. ROG's ability to run a backline had been diminishing pretty much on a weekly basis since before the WC.

Hook has suggested that we have two more years of #10 ROG, and #12 Sexton. Simply to shoe-horn an aging and diminishing player, though once a great, into the team. We play our best 10 at10, and our best inside centre at inside centre. This isn't rocket science.

The only way shape or form that we would ask Sexton to play at inside centre, in a legitimate and logical sense, would be he was the best choice available at 12, and there was someone pushing hard for a 10 spot.

danthefan

ROG has not demonstrated he's a better kicker than Sexton (assuming we're talking about from hand here) at any stage in the recent past.

From the tee Sexton obviously had his issue but they're well in the past, his % at international level is up there with anyone. I think he was 2nd in the 6N, and his goal kicking was excellent on this tour.

As for passing - don't make me laugh. Not worthy of comment.

Podge_irl

ROG is not a better kicker and passer then Sexton. His physical pass is about equal but he is infinitely poorer at actually using it (and that double pump thing is ridiculous) be that through passing too early without committing defenders or passing to the wrong person. He never gives inside balls because he doesn't commit inside defenders . His kicking has regressed and is no longer any better then Sexton's and he again constantly uses it at the wrong time.

Its just Hook being spectacularly wrong as usual. The man is an idiot.

tolosenc

To be honest, I thought he'd been hacked...

errlloyd

To be fair to the hook man, he's one of the first pundits to talk about a replacement for Deccie, GT has hinted it in the IT today as well. So maybe time is short for his tenure.

I genuinely do love reading what Hook writes. He's perfectly happy to present and discuss an opinion, even though I don't agree with it at all.

He's entertaining and absolutely loves rugby. He's not going to be happy at all with how we've been doing in recent seasons, and I imagine that had we AN Other instead of DK at the helm, that he'd be vociferously tearing him asunder. DK's prior involvement in Irish rugby and so "heritage" make him a dangerous problem as a national coach. People who loved everything he did with Munster are always going to find it tough to turn against him and honestly analyze things that he's done with the national side.

Next coach needs to be a complete newbie to Irish rugby imo.

jimbomalley

On the honeymoon in Thailand and Darren cave and dan touhy have just checked into our resort on their way back from new zealand! Hopefully a few more might turn up, even if they don't, still pretty class. Told the wife it's been the best bit so far, wasn't impressed!

padraig.od

jimbomalley wrote: »

On the honeymoon in Thailand and Darren cave and dan touhy have just checked into our resort on their way back from new zealand! Hopefully a few more might turn up, even if they don't, still pretty class. Told the wife it's been the best bit so far, wasn't impressed!

Did they get married too?

.ak

I don't know how anyone who watches Rugby can think ROG is anyway better passer than Sexton. It's just not true, Sexton is easily the 2nd best passer in the country (2nd only to Madigan imo). The reason Leinster play so well is he uses his passing game to pull the strings in the backline - his passing is sublime and yet very simple.

As for kicking - I'm not sure. It was defo ROG's prime asset in the day, but I wouldn't go as far as to say it's infinitely better than Sexton's. Having said that, Sexton's weakness is his kicking from hand imo. He puts in some lovely gems, but often scuffs the simple ones.

irishbucsfan

Agreed, although I'd say Paddy Wallace is better than Sexton and possibly Madigan with his technical passing ability... He's just so good.

durkadurka

jimbomalley wrote: »

On the honeymoon in Thailand and Darren cave and dan touhy have just checked into our resort on their way back from new zealand! Hopefully a few more might turn up, even if they don't, still pretty class. Told the wife it's been the best bit so far, wasn't impressed!

She'll get her own back when you cop her looking at them sunning themselves on the beach.

.ak

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Agreed, although I'd say Paddy Wallace is better than Sexton and possibly Madigan with his technical passing ability... He's just so good.

True, maybe a different type of passer. He knows when and how to get an offload or pass off which is a skillset he has head above anyone else... but I think Madigan has the nicest long pass in the country. He can land it on a penny the width of a field, whilst putting the player on the front foot. It's impressive to watch, and almost negates the crossfield kick.

Tox56

I think Sexton is a better passer than Madigan at the moment, although his pass not as flashy as Madigan's, he puts real fizz on it.

Madigan specialises in the big loop pass, and the rip he puts on the ball is great to watch, but I think Sexton's overall passing game is better.

irishbucsfan

.ak wrote: »

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Agreed, although I'd say Paddy Wallace is better than Sexton and possibly Madigan with his technical passing ability... He's just so good.

True, maybe a different type of passer. He knows when and how to get an offload or pass off which is a skillset he has head above anyone else... but I think Madigan has the nicest long pass in the country. He can land it on a penny the width of a field, whilst putting the player on the front foot. It's impressive to watch, and almost negates the crossfield kick.

Wallace has shown an ability to do that a few times as well. That pass in the H Cup final being an example.

Madigan is special though.

shuffol

Paddy Jackson is an excellent passer too, very effortless. Sextons a very accurate passer but I sometimes think his technique can be a bit long, dont think he's as wristy as the others.

totallegend

George Hook wrote:

The Cork man is an infinitely better passer and kicker

See, this is the problem with the perception in Ireland of the outhalf's role. Hook shares Kidney's view that the role of the out-half is to get rid of the ball, either by passing or kicking, as quickly as possible. It's aeons behind the likes of New Zealand and Australia in terms of progressing the game and it's why we'll never catch up so long as this sort of attitude gets any sort of credence.

Look at Aaron Cruden's performance on Saturday; they scored three tries in the brief time he was on the field. How many times did Cruden kick it? How many times did he go for long looping passes across the back line?

The out-half should be the main attacking fulcrum of the team. Cruden, Dan Carter, Quade Cooper, Kurtley Beale, James O'Connor; what do they all have in common? That their main threat is with the ball in their hands, running at the opposing defence. If the defence knows what you're going to do, it makes it so much easier to snuff out the threat, but when someone like Cooper is running at you, you haven't a clue what he's going to do (neither does he), so how do you defend it? Berrick Barnes would probably be the most conservative option at OH for Australia and even he was tearing Wales apart with his running game over the last few weeks.

Picking an out-half on the basis of his kicking and passing is a 1980s attitude that I'm not surprised to hear from Hook; the depressing thing is that we'll see a lot more of ROG in the Six Nations meaning not only will we not develop a young out-half, we'll also miss the chance to develop a replacement #12 for D'Arcy. Our only hope is that Penney drops ROG for Munster and Kidney comes under pressure to do likewise.

It's like posters on here saying Madigan can't be considered for Ireland until he proves his goalkicking ability. Ireland must be the only country left where it's written in stone that the out-half kicks the goals; we have a young guy coming through with a wicked step, serious gas and lovely vision, but because he's not the regular kicker for his province, he can't be considered. I don't give a f**k about posters here, but when the national coaching staff takes a similar view, then I get frustrated.

[I would also dispute that O'Gara is better at either passing or kicking, especially at this stage, and no way in hell does he have two more seasons in him, but that's besides the point]

Tox56

totallegend wrote: »

It's like posters on here saying Madigan can't be considered for Ireland until he proves his goalkicking ability. Ireland must be the only country left where it's written in stone that the out-half kicks the goals; we have a young guy coming through with a wicked step, serious gas and lovely vision, but because he's not the regular kicker for his province, he can't be considered. I don't give a f**k about posters here, but when the national coaching staff takes a similar view, then I get frustrated.

I agree with everything apart from this, I do think Madigan should be considered for Ireland and I agree it shouldn't be written in stone that the out-half kicks.

However, teams like France or Wales don't require an outhalf who kicks because they have other options. If Madigan was to hypothetically replace Sexton, who else would kick?

Madigan is a more than capable kicker, but he has to become more than 4th choice at Leinster. Ireland don't have the luxury Leinster have of having 3 almost certain starters who kick well.

Right now I'm sure we could work around it, but in the long-term Madigan will have to be kicking regularly for his province.

I hope Schmidt will start pushing Madigan up the pecking order soon, at least above Nacewa. He was keeping the pressure off so Madigan could work on his game, and I think the time has to come for Madigan to take the responsibility.

tolosenc

Tox56 wrote: »

If Madigan was to hypothetically replace Sexton, who else would kick?

What do you mean "else"? Madigan is a perfectly capable kicker. Even still, there'd be Ferg there, or Rob Kearney.

Taco Corp

tolosenc wrote: »

Tox56 wrote: »

If Madigan was to hypothetically replace Sexton, who else would kick?

What do you mean "else"? Madigan is a perfectly capable kicker. Even still, there'd be Ferg there, or Rob Kearney.

Never understood why Kearney doesn't take more pens, especially in his own half and when the angle suits a left footer.

Tox56

tolosenc wrote: »

Tox56 wrote: »

If Madigan was to hypothetically replace Sexton, who else would kick?

What do you mean "else"? Madigan is a perfectly capable kicker. Even still, there'd be Ferg there, or Rob Kearney.

It's not absolutely certain Ferg would be there, whether that be through injury or non-selection.

I wouldn't mind Kearney having a go more often, but how often does he kick at any level, nevermind in an international environment.

My point is, he needs to push himself up the pecking order and start kicking more regularly. Going from fourth choice for his club and the odd kick against treviso to being the only option for your country is a huge step up.

I would like to see him take the responsibility with Leinster soon.

Hagz

Tox56 wrote: »

It's not absolutely certain Ferg would be there, whether that be through injury or non-selection.

I wouldn't mind Kearney having a go more often, but how often does he kick at any level, nevermind in an international environment.

My point is, he needs to push himself up the pecking order and start kicking more regularly. Going from fourth choice for his club and the odd kick against treviso to being the only option for your country is a huge step up.

I would like to see him take the responsibility with Leinster soon.

The chances of both McFadden and Nacewa not being on the team would be pretty slim. If it were to happen, Madigan has proven that he is a capable goal-kicker anyway.