what use is Irish?

nbrome

Crosáidí wrote: »

Turas teanga is great intermediate resource
start reading adult learner novels

Can anyone recommend a good adult learner novel? I'm on lesson 23 of Learning Irish by O'Siadhail (if that means anything to anyone).
I like detective-type stories, and would like to avoid love stories and teen stories. As with other languages I find it productive to read, even when I don't understand every word.
I must admit I've been a bit put off by the simplistic covers of some of the adult learner books I've seen on the net.

Enkidu

nbrome wrote: »

Can anyone recommend a good adult learner novel? I'm on lesson 23 of Learning Irish by O'Siadhail (if that means anything to anyone).
I like detective-type stories, and would like to avoid love stories and teen stories. As with other languages I find it productive to read, even when I don't understand every word.
I must admit I've been a bit put off by the simplistic covers of some of the adult learner books I've seen on the net.

Hi nbrome,

Sceon na Mara by Liam Ó Muirthile is a recently published detective novel (2010). You can see the details of it here:
http://coislife.ie/Leabhar.aspx?ID=105

I read the start of it and really liked it, planning on buying it myself.

pog it

An siondacáit by Eoghan Ó Grádaigh

Another detective novel. Tis perfect for intermediate level reading.

nbrome

Thanks guys. I think An siondacáit would be too much for me, it seems to be a normal detective novel and not a learners' one.
Don't know about Sceon na Mara. There is an excerpt from it on that link and I'm undecided as to whether I can manage it. However, will have a longer look at it.
Otherwise I might end up with a love story in a book with a red heart on the cover.

pog it

nbrome wrote: »

Thanks guys. I think An siondacáit would be too much for me, it seems to be a normal detective novel and not a learners' one.
Don't know about Sceon na Mara. There is an excerpt from it on that link and I'm undecided as to whether I can manage it. However, will have a longer look at it.
Otherwise I might end up with a love story in a book with a red heart on the cover.

For someone on lesson 23 of Learning Irish An Siondacáit is a great progression. It was the first book that I read when I first went back to Irish.
Anything you don't know, you can look up, or ask here. Simple.

flynnboy

What is the 'use' of trying to preserve endangered species ?

Enkidu

pog it wrote: »

An siondacáit by Eoghan Ó Grádaigh

Another detective novel. Tis perfect for intermediate level reading.

Hey pog it,

Never tried the book, did you find it a good read storywise? Also is it in standard Irish or a dialect?

pog it

Enkidu wrote: »

Hey pog it,

Never tried the book, did you find it a good read storywise? Also is it in standard Irish or a dialect?

It's a grand little book.. it's not heavily colloquial but I think it's in Munster dialect. That or it's someone very fluent who concentrated on Munster dialect! It's more than decent. Was published in 1969 but it doesn't come over as overly dated to its credit!

Cú Giobach

Crosáidí wrote: »

Níl sí marbh, tá mé ag scríobh chugat anois i nGaeilge, Tá sí beo agus tá sí go maith. Is Éireannaigh muide, is í ár dteanga dhuchais. glac leis. tá sí anseo a fhanacht

Maith an fear/bean, níl a lán Gaeilge agam ach tá mé i nGrá leis an teanga,
Rud amháin, Tá sí beo ach níl sí "go maith", tá sí go hálainn!!! Gaeilge Abú!!!!

Fuinseog

But- to be honest, i can't agree that is is something of a wasteland. There is RnaG and a lot of reading material in current affairs, and in literature. And there is TG4. So once you have the basics, like any language, you need to push yourself up to the next level. Lament the lack of resources, but for sure, it's not an excuse for not progressing.[/QUOTE]

RnaG I cannot listen to. it is a bit too localised with very local issues that are not of interest to urban dwellers.
it also give sthe impression that bog Irish is the norm.

Fuinseog

Crosáidí wrote: »

Turas teanga is great intermediate resource
start reading adult learner novels

the problem with these novels is that they are not very interesting and are like soemthing a 12 year old would write, although I did enjoy AN Swatiska Glas.

Agus

Fuinseog wrote: »

RnaG I cannot listen to. it is a bit too localised with very local issues that are not of interest to urban dwellers.
it also give sthe impression that bog Irish is the norm.

What do you mean by "bog Irish" and "gives the impression that bog Irish is the norm"?

Aard

Fuinseog wrote: »

RnaG I cannot listen to. it is a bit too localised with very local issues that are not of interest to urban dwellers.

I can identify a bit. Comment and analysis on international, or at least national, affairs would be of more interest to me. I have little interest in the bingo session in some village. It may be of interest to local people, but not a publicly-funded national station.

Krusader

Fuinseog wrote: »

the problem with these novels is that they are not very interesting and are like soemthing a 12 year old would write, although I did enjoy AN Swatiska Glas.

Well I'm not looking to read the Irish equilvalent of Ulysses, I read the books because then aren't long and you do pick up a few phrases/verbs/nouns/adjectives that you haven't seen before in each book

I'm not much of a reader of novels in anyways, so they do me fine

Krusader

Aard wrote: »

I can identify a bit. Comment and analysis on international, or at least national, affairs would be of more interest to me. I have little interest in the bingo session in some village. It may be of interest to local people, but not a publicly-funded national station.

Yeah but the clue is in the name
Ráidió na Gaeltachta
Gaeltacht Radio - It's a station for the gaeltachtaí, you have ráidió na life for the east coast

dlofnep

the_syco wrote: »

I've found that classroom learning of any sort doesn't suit me, so a week would be a waste, until I learn more than just the bare basics.

Well, it was highly recommended by a polyglot, so I'd say it's worth a shot. The course is great from what I've heard and will give you a solid foundation. After that, it's up to yourself to put it into use, otherwise it's wasted.

I've done 2 courses, but to be honest I've learned most from just speaking it with a few people once a week in a pub.

deise go deo

I'd suggest ráidio Rí-Rá.
Is availible online. Easier to listen to and possibly more relavant to urban dwellers to.;)

Fuinseog

Agus wrote: »

What do you mean by "bog Irish" and "gives the impression that bog Irish is the norm"?

it is still the widely held belief that good Irish should be nigh incoherent and farmers with strong brogues are the ones who speak the good Irish.

conamara Irish is highly regarded although native speakers make grammatical mistakes like a mac instead of a mhic. i cannot imagine someone in Ireland who says i seen instead of i saw as being regarded as speaking good english.

Fuinseog

Aard wrote: »

I can identify a bit. Comment and analysis on international, or at least national, affairs would be of more interest to me. I have little interest in the bingo session in some village. It may be of interest to local people, but not a publicly-funded national station.

in addition RnaG also fuelled the notion that Irish speakers did not like english. there is no reason why the two languages cannot co exist together (thank you eye 102!) even today people in the east think we in the west only listen to fiddle music.

Fuinseog

Crosáidí wrote: »

Well I'm not looking to read the Irish equilvalent of Ulysses, I read the books because then aren't long and you do pick up a few phrases/verbs/nouns/adjectives that you haven't seen before in each book

I'm not much of a reader of novels in anyways, so they do me fine

then you could read a few ladybirds. Luidin o Laoi is the biz.

BTW there is chic lit by tina nic enri darbh ainm 'An Coimhthioch Caol Dubh'. spicy and easy to read.

Fuinseog

deise go deo wrote: »

I'd suggest ráidio Rí-Rá.
Is availible online. Easier to listen to and possibly more relavant to urban dwellers to.;)

nios mo sonrai le do thoil

Krusader

Fuinseog wrote: »

even today people in the east think we in the west only listen to fiddle music.

:rolleyes: If you believe that then i bet you have a warped perception of leinster people

deise go deo

Fuinseog wrote: »

nios mo sonrai le do thoil

Is staisún raidió gaeilge ar on idirlion é.

Its like 2fm or Beat, Its aimed at a younger audience than RnaG.They play alot of pop music both As gaeilge agus bearla.
Go to their website if you want to listen.;)

Enkidu

Fuinseog wrote: »

it is still the widely held belief that good Irish should be nigh incoherent and farmers with strong brogues are the ones who speak the good Irish.

conamara Irish is highly regarded although native speakers make grammatical mistakes like a mac instead of a mhic. i cannot imagine someone in Ireland who says i seen instead of i saw as being regarded as speaking good english.

I've heard this before. Apparently Gaeilge Chonamara has simplified grammar compared with the original literary standard found back in the 16th and 17th century. (What the bards wrote)
In other words it's possible that back when Irish was spoken across the country it would not have been "good Irish". Munster Irish is apparently what would have been thought of as "good Irish".

Very interesting stuff.

deise go deo

Enkidu wrote: »

I've heard this before. Apparently Gaeilge Chonamara has simplified grammar compared with the original literary standard found back in the 16th and 17th century. (What the bards wrote)
In other words it's possible that back when Irish was spoken across the country it would not have been "good Irish". Munster Irish is apparently what would have been thought of as "good Irish".

Very interesting stuff.

I'd say that conamara Irish became concidered to be 'Good Irish' because it is the strongest Gaeltacht,

I Heard that in the Early days of the galic revival Munster Irish was concidered best because alot of writings were done in it, Peig for example

Agus

Fuinseog wrote: »

it is still the widely held belief that good Irish should be nigh incoherent and farmers with strong brogues are the ones who speak the good Irish.

What Irish do you think is "good" if not the Munster, Ulster and Connacht dialects? Why do you feel they are not "coherent"? And why would a more anglicised accent be preferable to a "brogue"?

Fuinseog

Agus wrote: »

What Irish do you think is "good" if not the Munster, Ulster and Connacht dialects? Why do you feel they are not "coherent"? And why would a more anglicised accent be preferable to a "brogue"?

I do not really buy into good and bad dialects. I do find some farmers incomprehensile and object to them being labelled as fior ghael because of some thick tongued mumble.
maybe its time for urban gaelgeoiri to set the standard. they generally have good grammar which is more than I can say about some people in the reservations known as the fior ghaeltacht.

deise go deo

Fuinseog wrote: »

I do not really buy into good and bad dialects. I do find some farmers incomprehensile and object to them being labelled as fior ghael because of some thick tongued mumble.
maybe its time for urban gaelgeoiri to set the standard. they generally have good grammar which is more than I can say about some people in the reservations known as the fior ghaeltacht.

Ya, those damm gaeltachtí with their alcohol proplems and their casinos,
on land thet WE gave them.....:rolleyes:

pog it

Fuinseog wrote: »

I do not really buy into good and bad dialects. I do find some farmers incomprehensile and object to them being labelled as fior ghael because of some thick tongued mumble.
maybe its time for urban gaelgeoiri to set the standard. they generally have good grammar which is more than I can say about some people in the reservations known as the fior ghaeltacht.

Wow. What a negative and backward attitude.

I think Fuinseog is a troll- instead of feeding it, we are all better off ignoring it.

deise go deo

pog it wrote: »

Wow. What a negative and backward attitude.

I think Fuinseog is a troll- instead of feeding it, we are all better off ignoring it.

Nah hes not that bad, Id say hes just been compared unfavourably to a farmer in the past, Which ( im guessing hes a dub) crushed him.

Still hes intitled to his opinion and it not the worst iv heard.