Gardaí - Cut our pay and we will become corrupt

darkman2

Bit of a stupid thing to say given what went on in Donegal for years and the numerous cases of corruption in the Gardaí over the years. It did not take a pay cut for them to be corrupt. Looks like more of them are easily corruptable. And this Union want guns for Gardaí at the same time as coming out with statements like this!?

http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/national-news/corruption-warning-over-gardai-2153496.html

PCPhoto

someone should ask them if we keep their pay at the same rate and take away their allowances would that be ok (all 57 allowances)

even the "Lanzarotte allowance" ..... its well known that Gardai get an "allowance" for the overtime they miss while they are on holidays !!!


NOTE: Gardai cant quality for ALL 57 Allowances (some of the allowances are job specific - ie. working with dogs allowance would only apply to those who work with garda trained dogs) - but if you add up all the allowances an individual garda is allowed then it would be pretty high.

toomevara

Cut our pay and we will become corrupt...ahem...I think that train may have left the station some time ago. Arguably the opposite may in fact be the case, cut pay and you may attract folk to the force who are genuinely interested in policing rather than the ludicrously cushy pay, conditions and 'extras'.....

Sofa King Great

What he said was:

"There is always the likelihood - and it has been proved in other countries where you pay police forces at a rate of pay that puts them in a vulnerable place - that there is a risk of people being got at and that's a fact of life,"

Just because there was corruption in the past does not mean it should not be exposed as a risk now. Would you prefer they ignored the possibility of some debt ridden Gardai being "got at"

silent gav

Sofa King Great wrote: »

Just because there was corruption in the past does not mean it should not be exposed as a risk now. Would you prefer they ignored the possibility of some debt ridden Gardai being "got at"

Not when it's being used as threat.

kodute

Its a pretty ****ty job separating drunken, fighting shams outside supermacs at 2 in the morning. Give them a fair wage.

Sofa King Great

silent gav wrote: »

Not when it's being used as threat.

Read the article and find where it is being used as a threat?

silent gav

Sofa King Great wrote: »

Read the article and find where it is being used as a threat?

Of course it's not an explicit threat. Don't think he's that stupid. If a politician had said it. i.e due to our pay cuts we may become corrupt would you be as simpathetic?

vodafoneproblem

kodute wrote: »

Its a pretty ****ty job separating drunken, fighting shams outside supermacs at 2 in the morning. Give them a fair wage.

Gardai, Nurses, Teachers, and everyone else in the PS make more than a fair wage at this juncture of our country.

You know it and I know it.

danbohan

Sofa King Great wrote: »

What he said was:

"There is always the likelihood - and it has been proved in other countries where you pay police forces at a rate of pay that puts them in a vulnerable place - that there is a risk of people being got at and that's a fact of life,"

Just because there was corruption in the past does not mean it should not be exposed as a risk now. Would you prefer they ignored the possibility of some debt ridden Gardai being "got at"

they can resign and get a much better paid job! in private sector anytime they want , they can then contribute average 1500 per month into a private pension to give them equivalent of their current garda pension at 57 , hold on for the rush .!

kodute

vodafoneproblem wrote: »

Gardai, Nurses, Teachers, and everyone else in the PS make more than a fair wage at this juncture of our country.

You know it and I know it.

Here we go, another Public Sector vs Private Sector debate, whose shít smells the least. Thanks :pac:

I don't know that your incorrect statement is true and you certainly don't know it to be true.

pasha75

Stone was simply stating a fact that a young Garda caught in the situation of possibly losing his home may be tempted by, for example a gangland figure. However all right thinking members and despite what some of you think, is the vast vast majority would have no sympathy for any person who betrays the trust put in him or her.
When you talk about corruption is there anything in the last DECADE you can mention where Gardai deliberately were corrupt. Of course there will always be some rotten apples or operations where the Gardai are caught in the middle (SHELL etc) but I know the vast majority are honest decent people.
In relation to the allowances, if you actually check them out the are fairly meagre in the majority of cases and most do not qualify for them. However I do agree that they should be looked at and if needed some of them could be justifiably cut of abolished. JUST AS SOON AS THE TDS GET RID OF THERE WALKING AOUND EXPENSES.

hobochris

Emergency services pay should be the last on the list to be cut(if at all). Everyone else(including teachers), are fair game in my book.

Zebra3

One only has to look at the attacks carried out by guards on innocent civilians on Dame St a few years ago to see how corrupt they are.

How hard did members of the force work to ensure their thuggish collegues faced the laws like anyone else would have? :rolleyes:

vodafoneproblem

kodute wrote: »

Here we go, another Public Sector vs Private Sector debate, whose shít smells the least. Thanks :pac:

I don't know that your incorrect statement is true and you certainly don't know it to be true.

I know my correct statement is correct! The only problem is our politicians and judiciary and doctors and surgeons and everyone else paid by our taxes is overpaid as well. It's all knotted in together. Ireland in Wonderland! The only thing most of us are not sure of is NAMA the way to go. Oh, and some of the big private sector wages aren't helping our competitiveness or our economy, either!

kodute

vodafoneproblem wrote: »

Gardai, Nurses, Teachers, and everyone else in the PS make more than a fair wage at this juncture of our country.

vodafoneproblem wrote: »

I know my correct statement is correct! The only problem is our politicians and judiciary and doctors and surgeons and ....

Either you oversee the wages of every employee of the state or you are some kind of omnipotent being.

To suggest that everyone in the PS make more than a fair wage is simply incorrect. I'll agree that there is a huge amount of waste and "fingleton money" in the PS but there are far more people earning a whole lot less.

Back OT...

Pay, Reference Points, and Police Performance

Alexandre Mas
University of California, Berkeley - Economic Analysis & Policy Group; National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER)


May 2006

NBER Working Paper No. W12202

Abstract:
Several theories suggest that pay raises below a reference point will reduce job performance. Final offer arbitration for police unions provides a unique opportunity to examine these theories, as the police officers either receive their requested wage or receive a lower one. In the months after New Jersey police officers lose in arbitration, arrest rates and average sentence length decline and crime reports rise relative to when they win. These declines are larger when the awarded wage is further from the police union's demand. The findings support the idea that considerations of fairness, disappointment, and, more generally, reference points affect workplace behavior.

Job performance is worse when pay is not adequate. Simple, right?
Not a hard stretch to see some members become susceptible to corruption in low pay conditions.

vodafoneproblem

^Most people are doing very well in the PS/CS compared to the Real World. Especially the well-known jobs that I mentioned. Boo Hoo, they can't afford the mortgage repayments on their third house because the rents have gone down and now they're in the mire. (This is only semi-joking.) However, the private sector aren't helping, either, in a lot of cases.

Normal Garda on the street, dirrecting traffic, patrolling drunken folks after pubs and clubs close etc could be done by most of the population, therefore it shouldn't command a high salary. Rank and file members are paid very well for what they do.

kuntboy

Maybe if they all weren't so greedy and mortgaged up to their eyeballs with multiple properties. Maybe they can target those violent learner drivers in another "crackdown". I'm sure the fines won't magically "disappear" into the "fund".

heybaby

As we all know, many businesses have closed down due to the recession including pubs, EXCEPT ONE, public house on harcourt street frequented by public servants which judging by the article below seems to be positively thriving, which really speaks volumes about public service pay in this country!!!

http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2009/12/06/story46106.asp

jonsnow

pasha75 wrote: »

.
When you talk about corruption is there anything in the last DECADE you can mention where Gardai deliberately were corrupt. Of course there will always be some rotten apples or operations where the Gardai are caught in the middle (SHELL etc) but I know the vast majority are honest decent people.

.

yes.The advance pitstop scandal from 8 years ago.As far as i know nothing much ever came of it and all the gardai were probably promoted to more senior positions.

http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2002/12/29/story953513528.asp

Other controversies that continue to dog Byrne's term in office include the shooting dead of John Carthy during the Abbeylara siege, the false murder confession of drug addict Dean Lyons, and the purchase of Byrne's home from a convicted killer (the commissioner said he did not know the identity of the owner of the house).

This year saw a remarkable `restructuring' in the garda transport depot, according to Byrne's latest crime report.

No mention was made of The Sunday Business Post's exposé of the extraordinary prices charged to the depot by Advance Pitstop, and the junkets enjoyed by named officers at the depot, courtesy of Advance Pitstop.

Pitstop overcharged the gardai €264,000, and it is estimated that Pitstop's contract -- obtained with the most expensive tender -- cost the taxpayer €400,000. The junkets Pitstop laid on took in lavish late-night entertainment spots in Rome, Puerto Banus and the Algarve, as well as the set of Coronation Street, a Manchester United Champions League match and the Ryder Cup golf course in Valderama.

Travelling on each junket was Department of Justice official Olly Hanlon, then a technical adviser in the garda transport depot. Hanlon said he was "disappointed to find no tyre facilities" on each trip, and he characterised the €57,000 junkets spree as a series of "brainstorming sessions" about the tyre business. Now, under the `restructuring' at the transport depot referred to in Byrne's crime report, Hanlon has been given overall charge of the garda fleet.

heybaby

heybaby wrote: »

EXCEPT ONE, public house on harcourt street frequented by public servants

Anyone who has spent 10 mins outside that place can testify that loads of badge flashing goes on to get in free, bacon brigade club of choice.

baltimore sun

cut their wages, let them become corrupt, would ya rather give a copper 50 to make the penalty points disappear or get 2 anyway or 4 if you bring it to court, i'd rather give him a fifty anyday.

anyway there's plenty of garda corruption going on already

I just got this in a PM,

"Normal Garda on the street, dirrecting traffic, patrolling drunken folks after pubs and clubs close etc could be done by most of the population, therefore it shouldn't command a high salary. Rank and file members are paid very well for what they do."

Normal Garda on the street do all those things you've mentioned plus 10 times more, they are on standby all the time and are first responders to 999 calls and see and deal with the most horrific and hairiest of **** so you don't have to. I doubt most of the population could handle infant deaths, teen suicides road traffic collisions, having junkies threaten to prick you needles or have death threats on you. Members of An Garda Siochana agree that the normal Garda on the beat is the hardest and respected job of all An Garda Siochana, its the frontline. It deserves a decent wage.


I deal with scum of the earth and see the unimaginable, the heart breaking and get paid to engage with scum of the earth. We protect your friends and family from burglars, thieves and assault etc... more times than you know by patroling your neighbourhoods unseen while you sleep.

I earn 350 a week after tax and all those so called allowances. I have a mortgage of 1000 a month, a wife that works one day a week and has two kids to support. My bank goes to 0 each month i'm border line arrears as are many of my colleagues. I live in a ****ty 2 bedroom house. If i don't do overtime i won't make my bills... that simple.

So i've taken a bit of umbrage to your sweepingly stereotypical post. Those in management positions i.e. the bosses are well paid but the grunts get fook all - If our work was performance based the rank and file would get little and the grunt on the street would be the highest paid as they do all the work, you really have no idea what goes on behind the scenes


Paints a very good picture, no mention of

- dial 999 and have to wait up to 30 mins for a squad car to arrive
- the guards ferrying their girlfriends or random tramps home in squad cars on Saturday night at 2am ish in full view of the general population while on duty
- Guards ignoring blatent scum who terrorise the elderly and families in "rough" areas.
we can all add 3 or more points to the list.

That crap about them keeping us safe while we sleep is rich, my Dad was coming home from a few pints years ago when I was 10 or 11, two lads having a fight outside on the street, one of them ordered my Dad to let him in as the other guy was going to stab him, Dad wouldn't open the door, mum dialled 999 and told them the story. Dad had to give both of the scum a thumping to get rid of them (he was well into his 40s at the time). 40 mins later the squad car arrives, we felt rightly safe that night alright.

Who takes out a mortgage of a grand a month when they earn 350/week after tax. Five years ago I was on €50000/annum and thought long and hard about taking one for €850/month out.

I wouldn't be surprised if a uniform annoys me over the coming weeks after this to be honest.

kodute

RoverJames wrote: »

I just got this in a PM,

So you decided to post a PM in this thread to make your point, with the users permission I hope?

heybaby

RoverJames wrote: »

I just got this in a PM,

"Normal Garda on the street, dirrecting traffic, patrolling drunken folks after pubs and clubs close etc could be done by most of the population, therefore it shouldn't command a high salary. Rank and file members are paid very well for what they do."

Normal Garda on the street do all those things you've mentioned plus 10 times more, they are on standby all the time and are first responders to 999 calls and see and deal with the most horrific and hairiest of **** so you don't have to. I doubt most of the population could handle infant deaths, teen suicides road traffic collisions, having junkies threaten to prick you needles or have death threats on you. Members of An Garda Siochana agree that the normal Garda on the beat is the hardest and respected job of all An Garda Siochana, its the frontline. It deserves a decent wage.


I deal with scum of the earth and see the unimaginable, the heart breaking and get paid to engage with scum of the earth. We protect your friends and family from burglars, thieves and assault etc... more times than you know by patroling your neighbourhoods unseen while you sleep.

I earn 350 a week after tax and all those so called allowances. I have a mortgage of 1000 a month, a wife that works one day a week and has two kids to support. My bank goes to 0 each month i'm border line arrears as are many of my colleagues. I live in a ****ty 2 bedroom house. If i don't do overtime i won't make my bills... that simple.

So i've taken a bit of umbrage to your sweepingly stereotypical post. Those in management positions i.e. the bosses are well paid but the grunts get fook all - If our work was performance based the rank and file would get little and the grunt on the street would be the highest paid as they do all the work, you really have no idea what goes on behind the scenes


Paints a very good picture, no mention of

- dial 999 and have to wait up to 30 mins for a squad car to arrive
- the guards ferrying their girlfriends or random tramps home in squad cars on Saturday night at 2am ish in full view of the general population while on duty
- Guards ignoring blatent scum who terrorise the elderly and families in "rough" areas.
we can all add 3 or more points to the list.

Who takes out a mortgage of a grand a month when they earn 350/week after tax. Five years ago I was on €50000/annum and thought long and hard about taking one for €850/month out.

I wouldn't be surprised if a uniform annoys me over the coming weeks after this to be honest.

Great post, look as far as im concerned,

the gardai = civil servants in peaked caps

Far too much respect is given to this pampered, over paid, under worked motley crew whose list of benefits and allowances is as long as your arm. Unfortunately with the badge and a guaranteed job for life (till 50 anyway) comes a sense of entitlement and a god complex. Its only by the grace of god for the gardai that the irish people are a docile people and violent crime is not along the same lines as parts of the UK or USA because I shudder to think how our keystone cops would cope with crime on an american scale. What the gardai needs is a massive reality check, renewable 6 months contracts for the lot based on a performance review with an emphasis on proactive policing, not the current reactive model where the guards only get involved grudgingly as a last resort because, god forbid they might have to write up a report. This nonsense where gardai must attend the district court tieing them up for hours at a time must end also, particularly when the offense is a minor one, surely an on the spot fine would suffice with a three strike clause coming into effect, either that or the use of video conferencing would ensure that officers spend more time out looking to catch people offending instead of sitting in a court room waiting for the inevitable adjournment.

vodafoneproblem

Got the exact same PM, RoverJames. Someone's doing a lot of undercover PR work! No mention of the incremental scale, I notice...

Rookster

They were corrupt before the pay cuts anyway so this argument does not stand up.

Also they knew the wage rates before they entered the job so why did they go mad with property and cars etc.

SlabMurphy

God love them - and the rest of our public ' servants ' ( or the public circus as i8 call it ) and semi state employees. Agood proportion of them are driving taxi's, just like the army, porters and ambulance and fire brigade crews etc in hospitals ( reguliar shift hours ,plenty of time off ), and the very hard working teachers ( do around 25 hours a week, off 4/5 months of the year ).

Also Gurads, Army and prison officers retire early, 55 or what ever. A full decade to do offical nixers. Some neck :mad:

Andrew33

I'm actually too embarrassed to say how little I earned for 8 hours last night (less than half the minimum wage) but I certainly won't be turning to crime as a result. I think its an insult to everybody in the State to suggest that Gardai might become corrupt if their pay is cut. I think its very unfair that they could be sacked for getting into debt though. That's just a ridiculous rule.

kodute

kodute wrote: »

So you decided to post a PM in this thread to make your point, with the users permission I hope?

No, I didn't seek permission, I did not reveal who it was from so no permission required

PCPhoto

vodafoneproblem wrote: »

Got the exact same PM, RoverJames. Someone's doing a lot of undercover PR work! No mention of the incremental scale, I notice...

I got a similar PM - some of the same sentences....but my PM also said the person only earns €350 a week and pays a mortgage of €1000 a month.

I havent responded to the person but if he/she is reading .... I couldnt afford to get a mortgage during the last 10years of my working existence (I've been working for over 15yrs but wouldnt even dream of applying for a mortgage until I had some money to back it up...even now I couldnt afford a mortgage)

so boo fúckin hoo !!

And while I'm at it ....A mortgage of €1000 a month means you got approx €200,000 from the bank - given the repayment amount I can guess that you purchased in the late 90's early 2000's and your property is still worth more or less the same if not slightly more than what you originally paid.

The Maverick

RoverJames wrote: »

I wouldn't be surprised if a uniform annoys me over the coming weeks after this to be honest.

All Gardai are going to be on the look out for "RoverJames" for the next while because of his comments on an internet forum? Wow,they must be incredibly well resourced if they can track you down with this to go on.

The Maverick

The Maverick wrote: »

All Gardai are going to be on the look out for "RoverJames" for the next while because of his comments on an internet forum? Wow,they must be incredibly well resourced if they can track you down with this to go on.

That was a tongue in cheek comment, however as I have posted pictures of my car in recent posts it would take a Garda about 2 minutes to find my address The Gardai are not as thick as you seem to be.

Liam Byrne

kodute wrote: »

Its a pretty ****ty job separating drunken, fighting shams outside supermacs at 2 in the morning. Give them a fair wage.

+1

In addition, isn't the same bull**** line used by politicians to justify their sickening, self-interested salaries, pensions and perks ?

What goes around comes around.......no harm to give the clueless asses a taste of their own bull****.

paraletic

should a mod not move this to the emergency service forum - and let the gardai reply?

nah-they'd only get rowdy!

The Gardai are already PM ing us

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

The Maverick

RoverJames wrote: »

That was a tongue in cheek comment, however as I have posted pictures of my car in recent posts it would take a Garda about 2 minutes to find my address The Gardai are not as thick as you seem to be.

Yet you're the one who is giving out personal information on a highly trafficked website?

Madilynn Chubby Jeans

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

Applying your "logic" (I use the term very loosely) if the Publi S is so bad why didn't ye all leave it at the height of the boom ? Or now even. As you mention stopping with assumptions, isn't the point of this thread a chap implying / assuming / suggesting that the pay may encourage Gardai to be corrupt ?

The Maverick

The Maverick wrote: »

Yet you're the one who is giving out personal information on a highly trafficked website?

I don't give a rats sh1t who looks at this site to be honest, or who deduces where I live. My point was in reply to a suggestion that it would take substantial Garda resources to identify me.

Sofa King Great

RoverJames wrote: »

Applying your "logic" (I use the term very loosely) if the Publi S is so bad why didn't ye all leave it at the height of the boom ?

It was a guaranteed income, pay was lower but certain. Risk was higher in the private sector but return was higher.

Public Sector: Higher Certainty/Lower Return
Private Sector: Lower Certainty/Higher Return

RoverJames wrote: »

Or now even. As you mention stopping with assumptions, isn't the point of this thread a chap implying / assuming / suggesting that the pay may encourage Gardai to be corrupt ?

It is more that the burden of debt (as a result of pay cuts & restrictions on second jobs) may cause one or two vulnerable people to be turned by the lure of cash from criminals.

PCPhoto

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river,

- havent been pulling the body out - but have been at the scene of plenty of dead bodies - with the eyes staring blankly at me.

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision,

- been there done that ...loads of times, seen my share thank you very much

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where,

.... strange .... I have 2 answers for that one ..... 1) ....are you talking about a murder scene or do you just have some fascination with childrens body parts - and figuring out which part goes where ?
2) ... I have yet to experience a childs body torn apart - please tell me when you have seen this - I cant find any record online of a dismembered child body found in the state.

Have you personally experienced any of these things ?

The gardai do work hard - but they are paid a LOT more than any other person who might expect to work in a similar fashion.....personally I would prefer if the government hired loads more gardai - and put them on the street, this would mean paying out less in overtime and have an increased presence on the roads which could in theory lead to more criminals caught..... and of course remove the excessive allowances.

I would also accept less tolerance by gardai - rules of the road are ignored by a lot of motorists, even today I saw a guy with no rear licence plate and on the phone while driving ....all this AFTER he was before the courts in contempt of court orders (he's a car dealer).

Rookster

RoverJames wrote: »

Applying your "logic" (I use the term very loosely)

if the Publi S is so bad why didn't ye all leave it at the height of the boom ?

Or now even. As you mention stopping with assumptions, isn't the point of this thread a chap implying / assuming / suggesting that the pay may encourage Gardai to be corrupt ?

Because they are too thick to work in the private sector.

danbohan

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where,


yea i can see how that would be very difficult for the average garda

Sofa King Great

Rookster wrote: »

Because they are too thick to work in the private sector.

Says the fella who can't seem to use the quote function....

OutlawPete

danbohan wrote: »

yea i can see how that would be very difficult for the average garda

You're taking him up wrong.

On an average day most Guards will have to tackle something like this:

*NSFW* ...

Donkey Oaty

When I reassemble corpses from fragments I find the following song useful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVoPG9HtYF8

twowheelsonly

Firstly, I'm not a Guard and neither am I related to any Guards.
I do however recognise that they have a tough job and deserve to be well paid for it. Most of them are decent enough individuals doing a job that many others either have no interest in doing or don't have the b alls to do. Allowances and time off (they're technically never off duty once they're in this country) are supposedly perks of the job. Does nobody else get time off from their jobs?? Allowances are exactly that - allowances to cover working unsocial hours, weekends, plain clothes, shoes/boots etc.
I would have more respect from some of the critics on here if they first declared what they do for a living and how much they earn so we could make a fair comparison.

Back on topic - The bottom line is that you have to pay for honesty regardless of what business you're in. This is especially true of any of the security services. You don't pay for honesty then you don't get it. Simple. Imagine that you own a shop/pub/restaurant or any cash business and you're paying somebody €5 an hour to work there. Do you honestly think that they're coming in to work for the €5 ? No, they're coming in to rob you!!!
If somebody in the Guards/Prison/Army etc can't meet their living expenses in a Private Sector driven economy then they will be wide open to corruption and human nature dictates that there will be those that succumb to temptation. A lot of that temptation is eliminated if they don't have to worry whether or not they can pay the mortgage next month.

paraletic

SlabMurphy wrote: »

God love them - and the rest of our public ' servants ' ( or the public circus as i8 call it ) and semi state employees. Agood proportion of them are driving taxi's, just like the army, porters and ambulance and fire brigade crews etc in hospitals ( reguliar shift hours ,plenty of time off ), and the very hard working teachers ( do around 25 hours a week, off 4/5 months of the year ).

Also Gurads, Army and prison officers retire early, 55 or what ever. A full decade to do offical nixers. Some neck :mad:

waffle!

you don't know my hours, roster conditions etc, because even i don't.
i only find out a week in advance, so do lots of nurses in hospitals, and other paramedics and other public servants,

and what is "a good proportion"? is that an exact figure or just crap?

there are enough anti public service threads on this site, with out adding to it with bull like this.

i know you should be allowed say what you like on the internet, but sometimes, the following rule should apply:
- if you don't know what you are talking about, then, keep it to yourself!

PCPhoto

twowheelsonly wrote: »

Firstly, I'm not a Guard and neither am I related to any Guards.
I do however recognise that they have a tough job and deserve to be well paid for it. Most of them are decent enough individuals doing a job that many others either have no interest in doing or don't have the b alls to do. Allowances and time off (they're technically never off duty once they're in this country) are supposedly perks of the job. Does nobody else get time off from their jobs?? Allowances are exactly that - allowances to cover working unsocial hours, weekends, plain clothes, shoes/boots etc.
I would have more respect from some of the critics on here if they first declared what they do for a living and how much they earn so we could make a fair comparison.

Back on topic - The bottom line is that you have to pay for honesty regardless of what business you're in. This is especially true of any of the security services. You don't pay for honesty then you don't get it. Simple. Imagine that you own a shop/pub/restaurant or any cash business and you're paying somebody €5 an hour to work there. Do you honestly think that they're coming in to work for the €5 ? No, they're coming in to rob you!!!
If somebody in the Guards/Prison/Army etc can't meet their living expenses in a Private Sector driven economy then they will be wide open to corruption and human nature dictates that there will be those that succumb to temptation. A lot of that temptation is eliminated if they don't have to worry whether or not they can pay the mortgage next month.

do you know that they have a lot of allowances which simply dont make sense. my main example is the "lanzarotte allowance"

which means they get an allowance to give them money for the overtime they missed while they were on holidays !!!!

I dont understand the "Plain Clothes" allowance .... they get paid to buy ordinary clothes which they can wear as part of work if they are required to not use their uniform - whats wrong with using their normal clothes - why do they have to get money to compensate them for not wearing their uniform....apologies to gardai but in my opinion the allowances are too much.

(how many people remember bringing money to school for charity so instead of wearing your uniform you could wear your ordinary clothes)

I agree that the gardai need to be paid accordingly for the fact that they deal with the scummiest of scum on the streets - but they have a core salary ....overtime ...and then allowance after allowance....I suppose the general population want transparency - when you look at politicians you cant see what they earn due to their "allowances" - the general public is annoyed with the higher section of society giving themselves bonuses/allowances while the rest of us are taxed through the hole.

I'm self employed and have to work 7 days a week to make sure I can pay my bills and cover my debts - I dont own any property....so with regards to garda allowances for anti social hours .... if you dont want to work shiftwork ...get an office job !! ..... I work whenever I get a call asking if Im available - this sometimes means changing my plans within minutes of receiving a phonecall .......... in my line of work - if you want work you make yourself available at ANY time. (infact I just got a call a few mins ago asking if I'm available for the next 3hrs .... so... thats me outta here.)