Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

Catch15

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Doubt we'll sign another front rower, we have three NIQ props (du Preez, Botha and Borlase). Can see us (and Leinster) throwing our toys out of the pram if Connacht are allowed have more NIQ's than us so though.

So far we've 5 I think which would allow us sign at least 1 but if we get mouthy we might get another one. One centre and one backrower would be ideal.

Oops, well spotted, actually meant back-rower! I really think a centre is needed though to slot in around the lads already there and improve the young players such as Barnes, who had a good end to the season.

GerM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Anyone else getting the feeling that Munster aren't going to sign any more players and just make do with what we have?

Nah, I think they're just biding their time and holding off on their announcement. I suspect it's someone who is going to the WC. They didn't announce Howlett until September in 2007. I think a big name is coming and it's going to be Toeava if I had to put money on it. Fourie also notable in the absence of any announcements in relation to re-signing with the Stormers. These guys are weighing up their options and I'd be surprised if Munster aren't offering big cash to at least one of them. Toeava would make sense. Versatile Kiwi who would know Howlett from his Auckland days and Munster have a few Kiwis on their books. If Munster don't make a big name signing it won't be for lack of trying. McGahan is on the record as saying they are looking to sign a centre.

Amazotheamazing

Catch15 wrote: »

Oops, well spotted, actually meant back-rower! I really think a centre is needed though to slot in around the lads already there and improve the young players such as Barnes, who had a good end to the season.

What's the feeling on Mafi? I know it's getting carried away but Mafi and Barnes seemed to work in a way that Mafi has worked as well with since Tipoki. Maybe just suit each other.

I despair when I look at the backrows, loads of young guys but not enough mean bastards, what happened to Young Munster and Shannon producing socially maladjusted backrowers?

CatFromHue

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I despair when I look at the backrows, loads of young guys but not enough mean bastards, what happened to Young Munster and Shannon producing socially maladjusted backrowers?

that's the celtic tiger for you. it made people soft. in a few years there'll be some mean so and so's because of this recession. :pac:

you're right about the mafi barnes partnership it has been blown out of proportion. it was only two games but it also looked very promising. there isnt a huge amount of depth if either of them get injured, or banned! the only other out and out centre i can see in the squad is gleeson.

Amazotheamazing

CatFromHue wrote: »

that's the celtic tiger for you. it made people soft. in a few years there'll be some mean so and so's because of this recession. :pac:

you're right about the mafi barnes partnership it has been blown out of proportion. it was only two games but it also looked very promising. there isnt a huge amount of depth if either of them get injured, or banned! the only other out and out centre i can see in the squad is gleeson.

Maybe, I think the Limerick schools system doesn't help players get into the Academy but no doubt we could use some toughening up.

We could def use another centre, would like to see Keatley tried at 12.

PhatPiggins

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

What's the feeling on Mafi? I know it's getting carried away but Mafi and Barnes seemed to work in a way that Mafi has worked as well with since Tipoki. Maybe just suit each other.

I despair when I look at the backrows, loads of young guys but not enough mean bastards, what happened to Young Munster and Shannon producing socially maladjusted backrowers?

:pac:

Amazotheamazing

PhatPiggins wrote: »

:pac:

Don't know why you think I'm joking, our pack used to be made up of narky **** who really didn't give a ****, now we've too many gentlemen.

theKramer

He doesnt think you are joking. He appreciates your sarcasm. It was a funny way to put it

profitius

I'm not worried about the Munster forwards. The front row willbe stronger this season, the second row is fine and the backrow has some quality young players coming through. Also, Axel Foley is taking over and he'll bring some more bite back into the forwards.

Its the midfield that isthe main concern. I'd love to see some more local players coming through but that doesn't seem to be the case.

ormond lad

profitius wrote: »

I'm not worried about the Munster forwards. The front row willbe stronger this season, the second row is fine and the backrow has some quality young players coming through. Also, Axel Foley is taking over and he'll bring some more bite back into the forwards.

Its the midfield that is the main concern. I'd love to see some more local players coming through but that doesn't seem to be the case.

The back row is a slight problem next season, Our back row options for next year are: Coughlan, Wallace, Leamy, Ryan, O'Mahony, Butler and O'Donnell. Butler has played in a total of 2 pro12 games last season and at least 2 of the above will be at the world cup

If we signed someone like rhys ruddock who is stuck behind SOB, Heaslip and Jennings, Dominic Ryan, Kevin Mc Loughlin at leinster, it would be a great signing. He has similar pedigree in playing ireland u20s as guys like peter o mahony and tommy o donnell except whereas rhys ruddock has played 17 games for leinster including 13 starts in 2 seasons tommy o donnell has 7 starts and 19 sub appearances in 4 seasons despite being 3 years younger

profitius

ormond lad wrote: »

The back row is a slight problem next season, Our back row options for next year are: Coughlan, Wallace, Leamy, Ryan, O'Mahony, Butler and O'Donnell. Butler has played in a total of 2 pro12 games last season and at least 2 of the above will be at the world cup

If we signed someone like rhys ruddock who is stuck behind SOB, Heaslip and Jennings, Dominic Ryan, Kevin Mc Loughlin at leinster, it would be a great signing. He has similar pedigree in playing ireland u20s as guys like peter o mahony and tommy o donnell except whereas rhys ruddock has played 17 games for leinster including 13 starts in 2 seasons tommy o donnell has 7 starts and 19 sub appearances in 4 seasons despite being 3 years younger

While I agree that Ruddock would be a good signing I think its time for Munster to give POM, TOD and Butler a chance to get more games under their belts. Dave O'Callaghan is also a big unit who could slot into the backrow if needed.

Munster have the biggest squad in the Pro12 now, I'd say, so theres plenty of cover for the players who'll be at the world cup.

ormond lad

ormond lad wrote: »

The back row is a slight problem next season, Our back row options for next year are: Coughlan, Wallace, Leamy, Ryan, O'Mahony, Butler and O'Donnell. Butler has played in a total of 2 pro12 games last season and at least 2 of the above will be at the world cup

If we signed someone like rhys ruddock who is stuck behind SOB, Heaslip and Jennings, Dominic Ryan, Kevin Mc Loughlin at leinster, it would be a great signing. He has similar pedigree in playing ireland u20s as guys like peter o mahony and tommy o donnell except whereas rhys ruddock has played 17 games for leinster including 13 starts in 2 seasons tommy o donnell has 7 starts and 19 sub appearances in 4 seasons despite being 3 years younger

profitius wrote: »

While I agree that Ruddock would be a good signing I think its time for Munster to give POM, TOD and Butler a chance to get more games under their belts. Dave O'Callaghan is also a big unit who could slot into the backrow if needed.

Munster have the biggest squad in the Pro12 now, I'd say, so theres plenty of cover for the players who'll be at the world cup.

of course POM, TOD etc should be getting more gametime but they are not ready for starting HEC yet, they will need to start a run of games in the pro12 before they are even considered for HEC which is why a top class international back row would be a great signing even if it was only for 1 season while TOD etc are getting much more gametime

ormond lad

ormond lad wrote: »

of course POM, TOD etc should be getting more gametime but they are not ready for starting HEC yet, they will need to start a run of games in the pro12 before they are even considered for HEC which is why a top class international back row would be a great signing even if it was only for 1 season while TOD etc are getting much more gametime

the problem is that this becomes and endless circle and then the team is hollow and has no heart.

Give the lads the time and they will impress or fail.

Leave them on the bench and they are nothing.

Amazotheamazing

The backrower from the u20's, Shane Buckley, looked to have the physicality needed for the ML, we've a lot of good footballers but they aren't massive guys. Hopefully this preseason will sort at least some of that out.

messi1985

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/9187.php

draw for heineken cup fixtures.. brutal last game away to the saints..
anyone feeling positive bout it??

ormond lad

messi1985 wrote: »

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/9187.php

draw for heineken cup fixtures.. brutal last game away to the saints..
anyone feeling positive bout it??

Its up to us to do very well v Northampton in round 1 and ensure we don't need a big win in round 6 to get through(as going by some of he performances this season we would struggle if we needed 5 points from franklin gardens to qualify for 1/4s). We don't want to be in the same situation as we were in last year going to Toulon.
Do the business in Llanelli and Castres first, and not f**k up like we did against London Irish and Ospreys and we should be ok in franklin gardens in round 6.

Amazotheamazing

We have to win away to Castres and Scarlets and win our home games to make the last game somewhat irrelevant. Saints will be as badly hit by the RWC as us.

thomond2006

A lot depends on how seriously Castres take the competition. I don't think they would win the pool but you can bet they'll be tough to beat at home.

I think Saints at home is a good start. Losing over there in the first round 2 seasons ago meant we were playing catch up from the start, it was only 'that' win in Perpignan that saved us. Hopefully we can beat the Saints and deny them a BP to make them play catch up this time. Won't be easy of course.

PhatPiggins

Very true and unfortunately Castres seem to be taking more seriously of late. Was a time when they didn't even care about winning the home games but last season they were very competitive in the away fixtures as well.

Can't see us doing much past the quarter finals truth be told. Would imagine next season will be a transitional one and its about 18 months over due imo.

thomond2006

The biggest issue next season in terms of transition is grooming a successor to Wallace at 7. It sure as hell ain't Niall Ronan.

PhatPiggins

thomond2006 wrote: »

The biggest issue next season in terms of transition is grooming a successor to Wallace at 7. It sure as hell ain't Niall Ronan.

Seeing as Wallace is the only international class ball carrier in the pack he'll take some replacing. Ronan seems to have gone backwards in the last 12 months, he was never super but in 09/10 he was showing signs of becoming a decent HC player. Now he's back to being ML standard

I don't mind if next season isn't covered in glory as long as we make genuine steps towards rebuilding the team.

CatFromHue

well to be honest who can replace wallace?

one of his brothers was a prop, the other a winger. he was a mix of both.

there is only one person in the squad whos more points than him, rog.

i see it kinda like elsom at leinster. if you're looking for a like for like replacement it ain't going to happen. if you're looking for someone to bring something else to the table like what kev mcloughlinn did thats a possibility. it could be a case though that the whole munster team will have to try and replace him i.e. more fellas will have to step forward as ball carriers.

CiaranMT

CatFromHue wrote: »

there is only one person in the squad whos more points than him, rog.

Jeez, that's a bit of an indictment of the team (granted that Warwick has just left).

profitius

CatFromHue wrote: »

well to be honest who can replace wallace?

one of his brothers was a prop, the other a winger. he was a mix of both.

there is only one person in the squad whos more points than him, rog.

i see it kinda like elsom at leinster. if you're looking for a like for like replacement it ain't going to happen. if you're looking for someone to bring something else to the table like what kev mcloughlinn did thats a possibility. it could be a case though that the whole munster team will have to try and replace him i.e. more fellas will have to step forward as ball carriers.

In terms of ball carriers in th Munster pack, I think we're weak in that department.

Props - No real ball carriers. Horan used to be excellent but his carrying isn't what it used to be. Botha is more of scrummager and Mushy is off to Sale. John Ryan is a good ball carrier who makes the hard yards but he won't be used much next season.

Hookers - Munster are strong here. Varley is decent and Forgarty and Flannery are both good ball carriers. I think Mike Sherry is the best of the lot. He has power as well as a bit of pace.

Secondrow - POC is a good ball carrier but some people will say hes not. That debate is for another day. DOCs ball carrying is non existant. Donnacha Ryan and MOD are decent.

backrow - Leamys was never a great ball carrier and his knees are not the best anymore. Coughlan is decent. Wallace is world class. POM and Paddy Butler are looking good. Ronan is good in space but useless in tight areas.

So overall theres the hookers, POC, Coughlan and Walllace who Munster rely on to carry the ball. Thats less than half the pack and its one of the reasons why Munsters pack are not as dominant anymore. Compare them to Leinster who have Healy, Strauss, Hines, Heaslip and SOB as ball carriers. It makes them hard to defend. You also have the likes of Mike Ross who has really improved this area of his game and a few others like Ruddock.

Its an area that Munster can improve in.

Benny Cake

CiaranMT wrote: »

Jeez, that's a bit of an indictment of the team (granted that Warwick has just left).

Not really, Warrick played from 2007-2011 and was never given kicking duties when O'Gara played.. Wallace is in the team since 1997 & is one of our main ball carriers close to the line..

Amazotheamazing

D_Red_Army wrote: »

Not really, Warrick played from 2007-2011 and was never given kicking duties when O'Gara played.. Wallace is in the team since 1997 & is one of our main ball carriers close to the line..

Yeah, you'd expect one of our backrowers to be there or thereabouts as our top tryscorer, Foley was too, iirc. Wallace is an irreplaceable player but so was Foley, Galwey etc. The thing is to move on and not try to find an identical player to Wallace (some hope).

PhatPiggins

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Yeah, you'd expect one of our backrowers to be there or thereabouts as our top tryscorer, Foley was too, iirc. Wallace is an irreplaceable player but so was Foley, Galwey etc. The thing is to move on and not try to find an identical player to Wallace (some hope).

I think the real problem is there is nothing to compensate for his loss. You hardly even noticed when Galway and Foley moved on because we had a glut of talent to replace them.

Amazotheamazing

PhatPiggins wrote: »

I think the real problem is there is nothing to compensate for his loss. You hardly even noticed when Galway and Foley moved on because we had a glut of talent to replace them.

You never know who's going to turn up though, surely one or two of TOD, Grace, BOH, POM, Butler, Buckley or Cahill will come good?

phog

Our (Munster and Ireland's) fixture list as it stands now.

phog

phog wrote: »

Our (Munster and Ireland's) fixture list as it stands now.

Fancy doing one for "our" side? :pac: