average money on the dole

recylingbin

been trying to work this out.

Just heard them on Plank Kenny's show saying that, on average, a family with 2 children are pulling in 35 odd thousand a year.
Seemed rather high to me, though I'm sure some are on it and more.

I'd like to get the true average.

To do this, I'd need to find out how much the government pay out each month and divide that by the number of people on the dole that month.

This is a little simplistic, but would give a much truer figure than the ones I saw proposed on the plank's show.

Anyone got the figures for any given month or year?

El Weirdo

recylingbin wrote: »

been trying to work this out.

Just heard them on Plank Kenny's show saying that, on average, a family with 2 children are pulling in 35 odd thousand a year.
Seemed rather high to me, though I'm sure some are on it and more.

I'd like to get the true average.

To do this, I'd need to find out how much the government pay out each month and divide that by the number of people on the dole that month.

This is a little simplistic, but would give a much truer figure than the ones I saw proposed on the plank's show.

Anyone got the figures for any given month or year?

Someone should tell Average to get up off his arse and get a job.

Senna

You cant work it out like that, money can be allocated from a number of departments.
I'm sure you can go on the SW website and do the maths yourself.

Joey the lips

For what purpose?


What method are you using to calculate the true adverage

How many of the people on the dole have kids 1,2,3,4

How many have none.

How will these stats impact on easch other.

I think you will do no better than pat kenny. In fact I think you will do worse.....

trad

Just got called in today to be told my claim for JSB was successful. €26.90 per week and it took them from October 8th to figure that out. If you can tell me how to get €35k out of them let me know.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

It's quite possible for them to get that much if they claim everything and have their mortgage paid for too. Do they factor in medical cards also, which is going to be differant for each person? Is this the figure which the family get in their hand to spend on what they wish?

I guess we have a huge number of single people on there too which may get from 100 to 250 a week, factoring in rent allowance. Anyone I know on social welfare is on €196 a week.

I think you pay the first €24 or €25 on your rent and the government pay the rest up to €115 so you get €90 euro or there abouts for your rent in the best scenario. Figures may have changed over the past few months though.

cson

Unemployment benefit;

UK: ~ £50
Ireland: ~ €150

So that disparity is only 2hrs up the road to Newry from Dublin and it's explained how exactly? Cos I don't know. And please don't anyone start giving this ****e about VAT/higher cost of living/cheaper fags & drink.... and so on.

Edit: To put it in more simpler starker terms; is it almost 200% more expensive to live in Dundalk than in Newry?

My name is URL

There's a pajama forum

recylingbin

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

It's quite possible for them to get that much if they claim everything and have their mortgage paid for too. Do they factor in medical cards also, which is going to be differant for each person? Is this the figure which the family get in their hand to spend on what they wish?

I guess we have a huge number of single people on there too which may get from 100 to 250 a week, factoring in rent allowance. Anyone I know on social welfare is on €196 a week.

I think you pay the first €24 or €25 on your rent and the government pay the rest up to €115 so you get €90 euro or there abouts for your rent in the best scenario. Figures may have changed over the past few months though.

I don't doubt it, but the plank and his panel were making it out that most of the dolers were on this.
An average would be alot closer to the truth, I'd imagine.

You cant work it out like that, money can be allocated from a number of departments.
I'm sure you can go on the SW website and do the maths yourself.

I never said sw payments, I said how much the govt pay out i.e. total benefits.

recylingbin

cson wrote: »

Unemployment benefit;

UK: ~ £50
Ireland: ~ €150

So that disparity is only 2hrs up the road to Newry from Dublin and it's explained how exactly? Cos I don't know. And please don't anyone start giving this ****e about VAT/higher cost of living/cheaper fags & drink.... and so on.

Edit: To put it in more simpler starker terms; is it almost 200% more expensive to live in Dundalk than in Newry?

How much is the dole in sweden?

PirateShampoo

Ive been turned down the JSA twice now, ive been means tested both times. I have been unemployed for 16 months and cant get a job anywhere. I have been completely honest with the social both times and we are struggling living off her wages alone.

When i apply again for a 3rd time im going to lie threw my teeth to get JSA, the system is a joke.

AnonoBoy

I got average money when I was on the dole.

I was so p*ssed off I marched right in there and confronted them. Average money just doesn't cut it for me I said and by god they jumped to it. From then on out I got excellent money, far far better than average money. Not more money just better money.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

recylingbin wrote: »

I don't doubt it, but the plank and his panel were making it out that most of the dolers were on this.
An average would be alot closer to the truth, I'd imagine.

Yea, this is not a good thing if that's their plan. Last thing we need is another "the dole is too much" thread. We all know how that went.

The public will now think that people on social welfare have fantastic lives... :rolleyes:

Wurly

My name is URL wrote: »

There's a pajama forum

Sorry, I know you're trying your best to be funny here but I think the above is grossly offensive to people like myself who are not pajama layabouts but rather, made redundant.

Think its a very insensitive and generalistic comment which labels all of the posters in a particular forum within the Boards community.

munstergirl

That example on pat kenny 35k = 20k dole (person 1 10k,person 2 - 6k, 2 kids 4k + extras 15k (extras = rent allowance + medical card.) what they forgot to mention rent allowance goes to the LANDLORD! Single parent can get up to 1200 in rent allowance but its not spending money for them its for landlord.
Basically family 4 survive on 20k,

My name is URL

Trí wrote: »

Sorry, I know you're trying your best to be funny here but I think the above is grossly offensive to people like myself who are not pajama layabouts but rather, made redundant.

Think its a very insensitive and generalistic comment which labels all of the posters in a particular forum within the Boards community.

It was meant in a sarcastic way.. sorry if I offended you

Wurly

Cheers for that URL. Much appreciated.;)

questionmark?

El Weirdo wrote: »

Someone should tell Average to get up off his arse and get a job.

Slightly unfair comment IMO! The majority of people on the Dole want to work including Average and are unable to gain employment. Dont get me wrong their are people out their that see SW as a way of life these are the people who should be punished if they fail to look for a job or take a fas course.

35K??? seriously i find that hard to beleive.

Also the medical card is handy yes however they seem to take this as income but isnt it only of benefit to average if they have the misfortune to actually use it?

phantom_lord

recylingbin wrote: »

been trying to work this out.

Just heard them on Plank Kenny's show saying that, on average, a family with 2 children are pulling in 35 odd thousand a year.
Seemed rather high to me, though I'm sure some are on it and more.

I'd like to get the true average.

To do this, I'd need to find out how much the government pay out each month and divide that by the number of people on the dole that month.

This is a little simplistic, but would give a much truer figure than the ones I saw proposed on the plank's show.

Anyone got the figures for any given month or year?

how the hell is a family with two kids meant to live on 35k?

Red_Marauder

trad wrote: »

Just got called in today to be told my claim for JSB was successful. €26.90 per week and it took them from October 8th to figure that out. If you can tell me how to get €35k out of them let me know.

I thought Jobseekers Benefit was always about €200? Since it isn't means tested.

I might be going on JSB if I dont find a new job before my current contract expires and if account dries up, I was hoping it will be more than thirty euro... for the old hunger and all.

drunkmonkey

PirateShampoo wrote: »

I have been unemployed for 16 months and cant get a job anywhere.

Nothing? Nada?, Not a sausage? Nobody would give you anything to do a few hours work in the last 16mts, seems impossible.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

My name is URL wrote: »

It was meant in a sarcastic way.. sorry if I offended you

If you are really sorry, you should edit that link to read: "Unfortunate but awesome people"

bryaner

My name is URL wrote: »

There's a pajama forum

Tosser

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

bryaner wrote: »

Tosser

No need for that, he did apologise...

El Weirdo

questionmark? wrote: »

Slightly unfair comment IMO! The majority of people on the Dole want to work including Average and are unable to gain employment. Dont get me wrong their are people out their that see SW as a way of life these are the people who should be punished if they fail to look for a job or take a fas course.

35K??? seriously i find that hard to beleive.

Also the medical card is handy yes however they seem to take this as income but isnt it only of benefit to average if they have the misfortune to actually use it?

I knew there'd be one.

bryaner

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

No need for that, he did apologise...

Sorry my fault I should have read on

Sharpshooter

bryaner wrote: »

Tosser

Do not post in this thread again.

PirateShampoo

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Nothing? Nada?, Not a sausage? Nobody would give you anything to do a few hours work in the last 16mts, seems impossible.

Well of course a few days here and there, it all goes on bills or food. Its not living, its surviving. In FAS atm, so hopefully something will come out of this.

Which is another gripe. FAS will now only pay you the same as what the dole pays you. So for me its 0 euro for 10 weeks.

RayM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Nothing? Nada?, Not a sausage? Nobody would give you anything to do a few hours work in the last 16mts, seems impossible.

There are so many people applying for every available job out there right now, that it seems very, very possible that somebody could be unlucky every time they apply.

axel rose

munstergirl wrote: »

That example on pat kenny 35k = 20k dole (person 1 10k,person 2 - 6k, 2 kids 4k + extras 15k (extras = rent allowance + medical card.) what they forgot to mention rent allowance goes to the LANDLORD! Single parent can get up to 1200 in rent allowance but its not spending money for them its for landlord.
Basically family 4 survive on 20k,

Of course RA goes to the landlord. All rent (regardless of where it comes from) goes to the landlord. However the service (rented accommodation) is paid for by the government. It can be considered as part of the monies provided by the state to a person on SW.

For most people, working or not-rental and mortgage costs are probably their biggest expense.

cloneslad

Been on the dole since finishing my masters in September. Graduated in December, got sick of being rejected job after job after job I applied for. When I got turned down for the last one I interviewed for (made it to the final four) I had enough and my old boss in Korea had been offering me a job back over there, so I decided to take it.

Worked my ass off here to get to college, get a degree, worked to pay for my masters then spent the past year blowing all my savings and studying like mad to achieve it.

Now I can't get a job and have to leave the country just to be guaranteed a job because sitting on the dole is not good for your sanity.

Thank you Ireland

Oh, I get 196 a week, don't claim rent allowance or anything else (except medical card)

questionmark?

El Weirdo wrote: »

I knew there'd be one.

u knew their would be one what?

One that would say that the vast majority of people wanted to work?

Or one that would find it hard to beleive that the average person on SW is on 35K a year?

Its an unfair figure to give as it paints a picture that everyone on the Dole is living it up? Their not.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

axel rose wrote: »

Of course RA goes to the landlord. All rent (regardless of where it comes from) goes to the landlord. However the service (rented accommodation) is paid for by the government. It can be considered as part of the monies provided by the state to a person on SW.

For most people, working or not-rental and mortgage costs are probably their biggest expense.

I think the point he was trying to make is that the family have 20K to spend on what they need. That's a very very humble amount to live off for 2 grown ups and 2 children.

snow ghost

The problem with some of the analysis on the Kenny show was that when that guy kept harping on about the system in Australia, he didn't seem to have any comprehension that in Australia - unlike Ireland - there is a plethora of available job vacanacies.

He also didn't seem to realise that Australia also has a different work culture where casual work in prevalent and it is relatively very easy to quit a job and get another one the next day.

The program should have spent more time discussing the benefit cheats... notably couples who pretend they aren't living together and whereby the mother claims full benefits and the male partner is often in full time employment.

Then there is the nod and wink culture of people working in the benefits system who help out family friends, etc, and actually advice others not to bother getting a job as they would be worse off.

The genuine unemployed are not an issue, they are just unfortunate to lose work... and they are often penalised for being honest.

I know one guy who was unemployed for years and then when he ws told he could get back to work allowance and keep his rent allowance and full benefits he happily got a job until that ran out 4 years later. With his rent allowance, full unemployment benefit and medical card, as well as full time wages he was on as much money as a solicitor... farcical.

axel rose

No IAMXAVIER I wouldn't call it humble, nor would I claim that its massive either. If a family has no debts prior to finding themselves on SW and their basic needs are taken care of (IE rent, and medical costs, back to school allowance etc plus unforeseen costs can be dealt with by CWO). Then I consider it fair.

You couldn't live the high life but you wouldn't exactly be on the gutter either. Most people week to week. (but that's going off topic....sorry )

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

axel rose wrote: »

No IAMXAVIER I wouldn't call it humble, nor would I claim that its massive either. If a family has no debts prior to finding themselves on SW and their basic needs are taken care of (IE rent, and medical costs, back to school allowance etc plus unforeseen costs can be dealt with by CWO). Then I consider it fair.

You couldn't live the high life but you wouldn't exactly be on the gutter either. Most people week to week. (but that's going off topic....sorry )

Ah it's fairly humble alright AXEL ROSE... You wouldn't be buying any luxeries with that now. You can survive on it. That's about it.

axel rose

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

Ah it's fairly humble alright AXEL ROSE... You wouldn't be buying any luxeries with that now. You can survive on it. That's about it.

But isn't that the point? I don't mean this in a 'lazy spongers on the scratch' kind of way. However there are a lot of working people out there who cant afford luxuries now. Social Welfare is supposed to be about providing a person with the necessities until they can sort themselves out with a job. (granted that my take a while these days).

Do you feel that with a slowing economy, rising unemployment and reduced tax intake, that SW should be increased?



Apologies for the capitals, blame it on quick editing....

K-9

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

It's quite possible for them to get that much if they claim everything and have their mortgage paid for too. Do they factor in medical cards also, which is going to be differant for each person? Is this the figure which the family get in their hand to spend on what they wish?

I guess we have a huge number of single people on there too which may get from 100 to 250 a week, factoring in rent allowance. Anyone I know on social welfare is on €196 a week.

I think you pay the first €24 or €25 on your rent and the government pay the rest up to €115 so you get €90 euro or there abouts for your rent in the best scenario. Figures may have changed over the past few months though.

It was factored on a married couple having 2 kids.

From memory, married couple would have about 16/17k on the dole, with 3/4k child dependent allowance.

Rent Allowance or mortgage interest relief needs to be added on, because if you work full time, you pay that yourself.

AFAIK, FIS was not factored in which could change the figures, though you could still end up better of on the dole.

Something is wrong there.

PS. Dogma will not help us out of this crisis. If you are earning 35k working with 2 kids, you should not be better of on Social Welfare.

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

I think the point he was trying to make is that the family have 20K to spend on what they need. That's a very very humble amount to live off for 2 grown ups and 2 children.

WalterMitty

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

Ah it's fairly humble alright AXEL ROSE... You wouldn't be buying any luxeries with that now. You can survive on it. That's about it.

35k is about the average wage. Many people in this country raise families on that amount and less as one person usually only worls and the other only works part time. Social welfare is just to get by on not to do anything non essential. You could feed a family of four for 100 a week. It's no suprise that the busiest dominos pizza store in the world is in Tallaght where there is a huge amount of welfare recipients.

USA

snow ghost wrote: »

The program should have spent more time discussing the benefit cheats... notably couples who pretend they aren't living together and whereby the mother claims full benefits and the male partner is often in full time employment.

This point can't be emphasized enough.

The total jobseekers benefit/allowance comes to roughly €4.5 billion per year. The total social welfare spending comes to roughly €21 billion per year.

This means if every single person in the country was in employment, we would STILL be spending €16.5 billion on social welfare.

It's the rent allowance (going into private landlords pockets) and childrens allowance that is driving the social welfare bill so high. This must stop.

I think people should leave the unemployed alone, the vast majority of them are there through no choice of their own and would jump at the chance of employment. The unemployed aren't the problem with social welfare spending.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

axel rose wrote: »

But isn't that the point? I don't mean this in a 'lazy spongers on the scratch' kind of way. However there are a lot of working people out there who cant afford luxuries now. Social Welfare is supposed to be about providing a person with the necessities until they can sort themselves out with a job. (granted that my take a while these days).

My point is that people on social welfare do not have the great life that employed people think we do. People are on social welfare for over a year, if given the choice, those same people would be working now.

Do you feel that with a slowing economy, rising unemployment and reduced tax intake, that SW should be increased?

Not at all. They made a mistake raising it last year. I have no idea why they done that. I don't believe you should be able to buy luxeries, go out every weekend, have big buying power when you are on social welfare, I also believe that those on social welfare should not be held responsible nor should they be punished for being on social welfare, they should not have to answer to other citizens or have to put up with abuse that is regularly thrown at them.

K-9 wrote: »

It was factored on a married couple having 2 kids.

From memory, married couple would have about 16/17k on the dole, with 3/4k child dependent allowance.

Rent Allowance or mortgage interest relief needs to be added on, because if you work full time, you pay that yourself.

AFAIK, FIS was not factored in which could change the figures, though you could still end up better of on the dole.

Something is wrong there.

PS. Dogma will not help us out of this crisis. If you are earning 35k working with 2 kids, you should not be better of on Social Welfare.

If they took out a PPP then I wouldn't begrudge them that, although, those who took out massive mortgages that did not take on the PPP should be held accountable for their actions in some way.

For somebody on 35K a year to pay rent for themselves, they should not be paying a huge amount on rent. If they are, then it's time for them to move. Same said for people on social welfare. The limit is 115 a week (or there abouts) for a single person, and you have to put the first 25 to that. So you are getting 90 euro a week, roughly 4500 a year. I am not sure what that is for a family though.

WalterMitty wrote: »

35k is about the average wage. Many people in this country raise families on that amount and less as one person usually only worls and the other only works part time. Social welfare is just to get by on not to do anything non essential. You could feed a family of four for 100 a week. It's no suprise that the busiest dominos pizza store in the world is in Tallaght where there is a huge amount of welfare recipients.

I agree to the first part of your post, but not the last part.

You know where the second busiest AIB in Ireland is? Tallaght village
By your logic, this means that they are also the richest...

Seriously though, why are you making the connection between a pizza take out and Tallaght?

I can guarantee that this dominos pizza take out caters for more than any other dominos in Ireland. By that I mean, that shop covers a larger area and has a much bigger market. Tallaght is massive.

Also, fast food take outs thrive in a recession... It can be cheaper to buy a take out than to buy the food and cook it yourself.

Pdfile

Trí wrote: »

Sorry, I know you're trying your best to be funny here but I think the above is grossly offensive to people like myself who are not pajama layabouts but rather, made redundant.

Think its a very insensitive and generalistic comment which labels all of the posters in a particular forum within the Boards community.

i was poor before the recession, ive not sympathy for anybody on the dole so enjoy your 4 cans of karpackie* and your pennys clothing, ima keep my job

* cheap polish beer - all dole heads drink it

snow ghost

Pdfile wrote: »

i was poor before the recession, ive not sympathy for anybody on the dole so enjoy your 4 cans of karpackie* and your pennys clothing, ima keep my job

* cheap polish beer - all dole heads drink it

A similar sentiment was often historically expressed by court jesters... they also got paid to be ar*eholes.

Sir Oxman

USA wrote: »

This point can't be emphasized enough.

The total jobseekers benefit/allowance comes to roughly €4.5 billion per year. The total social welfare spending comes to roughly €21 billion per year.

This means if every single person in the country was in employment, we would STILL be spending €16.5 billion on social welfare.

It's the rent allowance (going into private landlords pockets) and childrens allowance that is driving the social welfare bill so high. This must stop.

I think people should leave the unemployed alone, the vast majority of them are there through no choice of their own and would jump at the chance of employment. The unemployed aren't the problem with social welfare spending.

Rent Supplement cost 1.636billion euros over a 6 year period 2000-2005
http://www.audgen.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=1030&CatID=5&StartDate=1+January+2010

Do local authorities have stocks of unused properties (bought up in the 'boom') that could be used at a decent rent-controlled rate for folks needing a hand with a roof over their heads?

Sir Oxman

Quincy Sharp Between wrote: »

My point is that people on social welfare do not have the great life that employed people think we do. People are on social welfare for over a year, if given the choice, those same people would be working now.




Not at all. They made a mistake raising it last year. I have no idea why they done that. I don't believe you should be able to buy luxeries, go out every weekend, have big buying power when you are on social welfare, I also believe that those on social welfare should not be held responsible nor should they be punished for being on social welfare, they should not have to answer to other citizens or have to put up with abuse that is regularly thrown at them.



If they took out a PPP then I wouldn't begrudge them that, although, those who took out massive mortgages that did not take on the PPP should be held accountable for their actions in some way.

For somebody on 35K a year to pay rent for themselves, they should not be paying a huge amount on rent. If they are, then it's time for them to move. Same said for people on social welfare. The limit is 115 a week (or there abouts) for a single person, and you have to put the first 25 to that. So you are getting 90 euro a week, roughly 4500 a year. I am not sure what that is for a family though.



I agree to the first part of your post, but not the last part.

You know where the second busiest AIB in Ireland is? Tallaght village
By your logic, this means that they are also the richest...

Seriously though, why are you making the connection between a pizza take out and Tallaght?

I can guarantee that this dominos pizza take out caters for more than any other dominos in Ireland. By that I mean, that shop covers a larger area and has a much bigger market. Tallaght is massive.

Also, fast food take outs thrive in a recession... It can be cheaper to buy a take out than to buy the food and cook it yourself.

Ah now, that bit is bull, that is!

Magenta

questionmark? wrote:

Slightly unfair comment IMO! The majority of people on the Dole want to work including Average and are unable to gain employment. Dont get me wrong their are people out their that see SW as a way of life these are the people who should be punished if they fail to look for a job or take a fas course.

35K??? seriously i find that hard to beleive.

Also the medical card is handy yes however they seem to take this as income but isnt it only of benefit to average if they have the misfortune to actually use it?

El Weirdo wrote: »

I knew there'd be one.

There's about 500,000 and maybe you should come down off your high horse, you could be next.

El Weirdo

questionmark? wrote: »

u knew their would be one what?

One that would say that the vast majority of people wanted to work?

Or one that would find it hard to beleive that the average person on SW is on 35K a year?

Its an unfair figure to give as it paints a picture that everyone on the Dole is living it up? Their not.

No. One that didn't get it.

Edit: Two.

Magenta wrote: »

There's about 500,000 and maybe you should come down off your high horse, you could be next.

Joey the lips

I have worked out that there is an adverage chance of 3.17 that this thread is fook all use at showing any stats........and to think the op though the govt could not do it. :D:D

Magenta

El Weirdo wrote: »

No. One that didn't get it.

Edit: Two.

Maybe you should try to string bigger sentences together so people understand what you are trying to say.

Joey the lips

Magenta wrote: »

Maybe you should try to string bigger sentences together so people understand what you are trying to say.

eyee! Words of wisdom indeed! :D:D:D

El Weirdo

Magenta wrote: »

There's about 500,000 and maybe you should come down off your high horse, you could be next.

Magenta wrote: »

Maybe you should try to string bigger sentences together so people understand what you are trying to say.

Or maybe I should draw pictures for some people who don't seem to get the joke.