Rotations?

Anti

/thread

Ivan

696 has been THE paladin tank rotation since paladin's last pass. If you think otherwise then kudos to you. You are wrong, but at least you are a free spirit. Way to fight the powah.

Rotations come about because they are the most efficient use of global cooldowns. People far smarter and far more anal than you or I create spreadsheets of numbers and compare one to the other. The best one becomes the commonly accepted rotation.

Yes, you can go against the grain if you wish. Go crazy and do whatever the hell you want. What you can't do is say that, "My rotation is better than the one EVERYONE else uses, or at least just as good". It isn't, or it would be the one being used by the majority of good raiders.

Also, I must admit, I'm somewhat surprised that Anti is on Uttik's side in this. I thought you had learned this lesson the hard way.

And without trying to sound elitist though I almost certainly will, if you are having no problems with threat without a 696 rotation, then that is one of two possible reasons...
A) Your entire DPS sucks - either through gear or through basic skill.
You are using 696 without even consciously realising it.

][cEMAN**

To reiterate, it's about giving people the best factual information rather than just opinion, or trying to win an argument.

When I first started tanking I thought my method of going in with the biggest threat dealers and then just working randomly on CDs was the way to go, but I found out about 696 early enough to correct myself before I got into a bad habit. So yeah, at one point I thought I was right about it when I really wasn't - but I can admit that I was wrong. Now i'm just passing on what's been passed on to me.

Ivan

Anti wrote: »

Ah you want to go back to this old chestnut Ivan, are you sure about that? I understand you are a mod here, and this will more then likely get me banned.. But **** me, you really have your head firmly wedged up your hole. Do you get some type of power trip hard-on when you act like a pompus bellend, are you sitting there now rubbing one out while thinking "Har Har Har, i sure did show those people on the internets"

/careface tbh

That's exactly how it happened and one more for your nerdrage rant. ^^ :rolleyes:

Uttik

Ivan wrote: »

696 has been THE paladin tank rotation since paladin's last pass. If you think otherwise then kudos to you. You are wrong, but at least you are a free spirit. Way to fight the powah.

Rotations come about because they are the most efficient use of global cooldowns. People far smarter and far more anal than you or I create spreadsheets of numbers and compare one to the other. The best one becomes the commonly accepted rotation.

Yes, you can go against the grain if you wish. Go crazy and do whatever the hell you want. What you can't do is say that, "My rotation is better than the one EVERYONE else uses, or at least just as good". It isn't, or it would be the one being used by the majority of good raiders.

Also, I must admit, I'm somewhat surprised that Anti is on Uttik's side in this. I thought you had learned this lesson the hard way.

And without trying to sound elitist though I almost certainly will, if you are having no problems with threat without a 696 rotation, then that is one of two possible reasons...
A) Your entire DPS sucks - either through gear or through basic skill.
You are using 696 without even consciously realising it.

I got to say, I have seen your "advice" If you want to call it that, on other class's and it made me laugh!

People like you are so funny, You are what makes the world a very interesting place. And i thank you for that.

But i got to say, You are a

"I'll get banned"

I really really cba to get in to a tit for tat debate. There would be no enjoyment in showing you up for the %$^$" you are.


But simply put you and Iceman are just :rolleyes:

---

PS:: I would recommend you do some reading on class Mechanics, Instead of leeching off others hard work.

---

PPS:: Iceman,

The guild voted not to let you in, Not just me. So don't flatter you're self, And stop sending /tells to members, begging its really sad.

---

/end

Ivan

Fine, don't get involved in a constructive debate where we might all learn something, or "tit for tat debate" as you prefer to call it. Fine with me, take my advice or leave it, I've never even heard of you before this thread so I'm not particularly bothered.

Continue on the path of making/insinuating insulting remarks against other posters and you will be banned from the forum. Simple as. That isn't a power-trip, I've never banned someone from a forum that I moderated when they abused me personally (unless I was the only moderator of that forum) and I don't intend to start now. T-man can look at all these posts and make his own mind up. I'm merely reiterating the forum policy for you as you seem to have missed it.

Magill

Only way to sort this... everyone post there Gear score highest wins (Obviously anti cant be included since hes got 2 alts with over 5600 gs !).

Everyone needs to stop pretending wow is a hard game, from what i've seen Iceman is correct on the rotation front.. now stop whining Uttik, everyone knows your the best wow player on these forums, can stop trying to prove it, your UI owns everyones, your knowledge of class mechanic's is second to none and your guild leadership is ze best ! /sarcasm

Uttik

Magill wrote: »

Only way to sort this... everyone post there Gear score highest wins (Obviously anti cant be included since hes got 2 alts with over 5600 gs !).

Everyone needs to stop pretending wow is a hard game, from what i've seen Iceman is correct on the rotation front.. now stop whining Uttik, everyone knows your the best wow player on these forums, can stop trying to prove it, your UI owns everyones, your knowledge of class mechanic's is second to none and your guild leadership is ze best ! /sarcasm

LoL!

I couldn't put it better myself!



Even tho you are saying it to be a funny cnut.


Anyways, the fun is gone out of this.


later!


PS:: Ivan, I have been reading the boards for a long time, We even met i think once or twice! And i would gladly say it to you're face! or any other self Righteous fool. What i thought of them, So don't flatter you're self like Iceman, You're not worth any personally attention

Magill

Uttik wrote: »

PS:: Ivan, I have been reading the boards for a long time, We even met i think once or twice! And i would gladly say it to you're face! or any other self Righteous fool. What i thought of them, So don't flatter you're self like Iceman, You're not worth any personally attention

And then punch him in the face and stamp all over his face while shouting "LOL YOU SUCK AT WOW,NOOB!" ?

Uttik

Magill wrote: »

And then punch him in the face and stamp all over his face while shouting "LOL YOU SUCK AT WOW,NOOB!" ?

:rolleyes:

Ivan

Uttik wrote: »

PS:: Ivan, I have been reading the boards for a long time, We even met i think once or twice! And i would gladly say it to you're face! or any other self Righteous fool. What i thought of them, So don't flatter you're self like Iceman, You're not worth any personally attention

Err... right. I still have no idea who you are, but good for you!

WellyJ

I have no opinion on the matter but just want to say this.

Uttik, please learn when it is correct to use "you're"

Uttik

WellyJ wrote: »

I have no opinion on the matter but just want to say this.

Uttik, please learn when it is correct to use "you're"

Thanks for the Grammar lesson :P

Kinetic^

Take your trolling elsewhere. Anti infracted for personal abuse.

Ivan

7 day suspension for Anti for personal abuse (and not the first offense on these forums)
3 day suspension for Uttik for personal abuse.

Thread reopened because I won't let the few dictate what threads continue on these forums and which ones must be closed due to muppetism.

][ceman and I_am_Xavier, careful now.

Spam removed. Have a nice day.

Magill

owned

kayos

Hmmm playing since vanilla, rotations were always the way to go. As where those nerdy spreedsheets spoken of. After all end game raiding in WoW is just one big maths equation and a little skill.

Frope

Why is everyone so bitter here someone beat somebody else to a server first? Also saying you would say this to someoneS face in real life is honestly cringeworthy.

Back to the point of priorities if you feel good doing what you're doing there's no problem with that but if you want the best possible rotation priority list it's already done up for you on spreadsheets and sites like EJ by people with way to much time on their hands but if they all say 696 or whatever is the best for pally tanks keeping threat why bother argue in the end you're most likely going to be wrong. I've heard of EJ being wrong twice once with yogg+0 and the other was when a feral dps from ensidia did his own spreadsheets and had worked out a slightly better cat dps system. One was a miscalculation on group dps to get down a hardmode the other was one worlds first player managing to squeeze out more dps onreadsheet than another.

So unless you're using spreadsheets and competing for world first hardmodes I'm going to go with spreadsheets and simulators accounting for every possible detail on the best possible system not your "969/696 feels odd I go with my feel you can't tell me 969 is better" yes yes they can cold hard numbers will always win out in WoW.

I sound elitist but I'm not really bothered If you want to get the most out of your class there is always a best possible way of doing it without exception.

][cEMAN**

kayos wrote: »

After all end game raiding in WoW is just one big maths equation and a little skill.

/agree

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Let me just say that "cookie cutter" rotations do not work for everyone, they do not facilitate everybodies playing style etc etc.

Some people come on here and think that one way is the only way and if you are doing it another way, then you are doing it wrong. You need to tell them people to go jump.

Many times I have come accross people saying "OMG WTF!!!1 you don't use >insert move< or >insert spell<" when I say no, they go on a rant that I am crap and don't know how to tank, yet, I ask them "have you pulled aggro? Has anybody? No? Then what exactly are you talking about"...

Each to their own I say, if it works for you and you do your job right then why change that?

People posting here, saying their way is the one and only way is a complete load of crap and is the height of ignorance. That type of elitest crap needs to be left at the door, along with the ego and attitude.

Frope

If thats a response to me then I never said people have to use the optimal spreadsheeted system I'm all for letting people play the game however they want I'd never correct someone from gemming for crit when haste would suit them better or having a pvp piece or two on but don't say your way is the better for you when its not their is proven best systems and people who want to get the most out of their class and use the cookie cutter specs and rotations are the ones generally who I want to be raiding with. My daily randoms or pugs are a free for all unless its a prot pala w/o righteous fury on or something obviously hampering the group I'll usually w them something in what I hope is a helpful way. I dont think I've ever called someone a noob/nab/scrub etc or come across as a tyrant in game as I might appear here. As I said though when raiding with my guild I want everyone to be getting the absolute most out of their class as I know I try and make sure I'm getting the most out of mine and not doing what they feel suits them best which could be holding all your dps back as they're still right behind in threat even after using their aggro dumps for example since we're on threat here.

kayos

People are right you can not use a cookie cutter rotation and hold it up as the one and only way. Many factors come into account and these can be as simple as lag or a oh crap moment which means you need to break the rotation for one reason or another e.g. a rogue spending energy on a kick or a dps shaman throwing out a couple of heals to save somebodies bacon.

Being able to adapt to the situation is the skill you need, everything else is maths. Your gear? Maths. Rotation/Priorty? Maths. Enchants to suit your spec with the gear you have right now? Maths.

You give the same dps toon to two people one who follows priorty/rotations or one that just face rolls. Who will produce most dps?

Now in saying the the spreedsheets are theory and in practice you could do better not following the rotations/priorties that come from them. But in most cases they give you a damn good guide line to trying to improve.

Shougeki

kayos wrote: »

e.g. a rogue spending energy on a kick or a dps shaman throwing out a couple of heals to save somebodies bacon.

Rogue is a bad example. Current mutilate rotation is mutilate, possible second mutilate, envenom. You have a 20sec window for these which costs a total 150 energy or so. The only reason you are restricted to 20 sec is so Slice n Dice doesnt drop. Rogue can very easily throw things into their rotations as they only have two buttons (three if you take into account dropping HfB once a minute). They use vanish, tott, kick etc with ease as they have a large window for their rotation.

however if you want to maximise your DPS to the last .01% then you are entering the world of microseconds and envenom clipping. But thats all a bit stupid...

Uttik

Ivan wrote: »

7 day suspension for Anti for personal abuse (and not the first offense on these forums)
3 day suspension for Uttik for personal abuse.

Thread reopened because I won't let the few dictate what threads continue on these forums and which ones must be closed due to muppetism.

][ceman and I_am_Xavier, careful now.

Spam removed. Have a nice day.

haha!!!

The fool, Couldn't do anything else but ban us. It's ok Ivan, I wouldn't expect anything less from you or iceman.


BTW :: To clear things up, The only "muppetism" Was from you and iceman!. :rolleyes:

Ivan

And 2 weeks suspension for Uttik for personal abuse/discussing moderating on-thread. Please read the charter found here:
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=230314

and here:
http://boards.ie/terms/tou.php

StinkyMunkey

Just started tanking on my DK, but am finding it hard to keep aggro on mobs. Any one got hints or tips?

Ive often heard people talking about rotations, and i think i understand the principal ie diseases first then attacks the do better damage with diseases etc.

Bear in mind, ive never tanked before. My armor is mostly gemmed for def and stamina. I have a couple of enchants for attack power aswell.

Magill

make a sure your using runestrike when it procs, suggest binding it to heartstrike(?) or whatever you spam. If its just in hc's, dont worry about it too much, get stupid dps going straight on a different mob than you pull and then blame your for not holding aggro. Just check out MMO-champion tbh, its got guides for every spec etc.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Uttik wrote: »

haha!!!

The fool, Couldn't do anything else but ban us. It's ok Ivan, I wouldn't expect anything less from you or iceman.


BTW :: To clear things up, The only "muppetism" Was from you and iceman!. :rolleyes:

Why the hell would anybody want to be apart of this guys guild...? Really?

These are the people you must avoid in wow.

Ivan

StinkyMunkey wrote: »

Just started tanking on my DK, but am finding it hard to keep aggro on mobs. Any one got hints or tips?

Ive often heard people talking about rotations, and i think i understand the principal ie diseases first then attacks the do better damage with diseases etc.

Bear in mind, ive never tanked before. My armor is mostly gemmed for def and stamina. I have a couple of enchants for attack power aswell.

More info here:
http://elitistjerks.com/f72/

Feel free to make a new thread about DK tanking if you want. Might get better/more responses.

Ivan

Magill, just because he isn't on these forums anymore, doesn't mean he shouldn't be afforded the same protection from personal abuse as everybody else.