MLIS (Masters in Library and Information Studies)

Linho

the west wing wrote: »

How did everyone get on?

Overall I thought it was grand. Web publishing sounds a bit scary, but really anything to do with computers scares the crap out of me!

Didn't love Archives Preservation, mainly though because of the lecturer. Found it boring though the content was interesting.

Management for Information Professionals was like Weepsie said fine. The course seems a little wishy washy but it seems relatively easy. Though was anyone else like 'wtf' when she says we have to bring snacks for the class!?!? Can't we all just bring food if we want to?

I was looking out for Boardsies but alas came across none

Like what the hell with the snacks....I thought I heard that wrong...rota to bring snacks for 40 people in the class...????

saraocallaghan

Hey all,

Just to answer the question on why people didn't like Mgt for Info Prof. It was most definitely lecturer based. The entire module is wishy washy but the lecturer didn't make it any better. Now I didn't mind it but I already had a business degree going into that. But the lecturer last year is out on leave this year so possibly there will be a different attitude.

Ah, Dr. Souden. She was my Capstone supervisor this summer and is lovely! Very American but earnest and very approachable! With regards to snacks, it's up to the class. I think it's her way of getting people to socialise with each other and have a nice break. But don't feel under obligation to actually provide the snacks. I know what it's like to work on a tight budget and buying food for your classmates doesn't usually get scheduled into that. Just say it to her and let her know. She'll be awesome about it.

Hope that helps, any other questions let me know!

plainone

Shammers wrote: »

Has anyone else encountered problems with the quiz for Info & Ref - I got the 100%, but Blackboard hasn't given me an option to view and print it to prove it's done and dusted?!

And tomorrow looks like a long aul day!

Do you mean the plagiarism quiz?

I did it but I didn't get a result

saraocallaghan

plainone wrote: »

Do you mean the plagiarism quiz?

Anybody know if we are marked on that?

As I recall from last year, no you're not marked on it but it is required for info and ref when you had your assignments in. It has to be attached to your submission as long with your cover sheet and your assignment.

eepha

eclectichoney wrote: »

Out of interest, how many students are registered for either the Grad Dip or the MLIS this year do ye know?

I think there are 75 ish overall. Or did someone say over 80? Somewhere around that figure anyway.

Shammers wrote: »

Has anyone else encountered problems with the quiz for Info & Ref - I got the 100%, but Blackboard hasn't given me an option to view and print it to prove it's done and dusted?!

I can't find the certificate they promised either!

Miss Smilla

the west wing wrote: »

Can I ask why this module was so hated? I was thinking of doing either that or Professional Issues in Information and Library Careers. Does anyone have any info on Pro Issues?

As already mentioned, the lecturer was 100% the problem though as she is now on leave the course might be ok. Who is taking it this year?

Miss Smilla

Weepsie wrote: »

I was just on changing my modules and noticed that some of the modules that had been listed as full are no longer listed as such. Not the archives ones though. I've given myself a little bit more work to do in the second semester but with the expectation that they're the module's I'd hope to do well in.

I think I might sit in on the web publishing anyway and attempt to pick it up as much as possible

Strongly recommend going heavy on modules in semester 1. Semester 2 core mods were harder/more demanding/more time consuming and somehow the enthusiasm you start the course with really does fade. Also, Capstone prep will start to eat into your time. Be kind to yourself!

Miss Smilla

The notice seems to suggest that these are the capstone groups, where as I was under the impression people could form their own teams, though this could be just for the initial process of it.[/QUOTE]

You are definitely allowed put your own group together. It's funny but by Christmas you'll have a pretty good idea of who you could/not work with.

I did Capstone and it worked out well-get the right group/supervisor and it's a lot less taxing than an individual thesis.

raher1

After many posts is the ucd course better or worse than most English courses?

reddan

kopite4 wrote: »

After many posts is the ucd course better or worse than most English courses?

I did the course last year and I found it excellent to be honest. I came from an arts undergraduate degree background and it gave me the chance to pick up some very practical skills, report writing, presentation and getting used to group dynamics, as well as having a bang at some techie subjects that I usually wouldn't have thought of doing.

All in all a really good course. The capstone thing, although annoyingly demanding, is a lot more practical than writing an individual thesis on some obscure library subject. I'm in London at the moment temping, and the capstone report that we did has come across really well in my interivews.

raher1

I meant uk college courses.sorry late on.

Chinafoot

kopite4 wrote: »

I meant uk college courses.sorry late on.

The course in Aberystwyth is good. For years it was the only place you could go to become qualified, and when I say "go" I mean go. There was a time when you had to actually attend the college in Wales. No such thing as distance learning.

The current course outline is:

Information & Society - 20 credits
Studies in Management - 20 credits
Information Organisation and Retrieval - 20 credits
Information Services : Planning for delivery - 20 credits
Research in the Profession - 10 credits
Collection Management - 10 credits

You then pick two 10 credit option modules (I did Focus on the Child: Libraries & Literature and Digital Information: from discovery to delivery) and then you complete a dissertation.

raher1

chinafoot
why is this course better than ucd?

Chinafoot

kopite4 wrote: »

chinafoot
why is this course better than ucd?

Well, I can't really comment on content as obviously I haven't done the UCD course. However, I did my undergraduate degree in UCD and, as a result, would be incredibly reluctant to attend the university again. But thats just me.

A number of my colleagues who did this course in UCD do not speak highly of it and have recommended others considering the qualification to look into the Aberystwyth course.

In terms of reputation, the Aberystwyth course is internationally recognised and continues to hold a lot of weight. In terms of library qualifications the UCD course is still regarded as being relatively new whereas this course would be very well known in the library world.

Also, the fact that you can do this course while continuing to work full-time is a huge plus as far as I am concerned. As far as progression in the library profession is concerned experience is a huge factor. Personally, I think anyone who undertakes a qualification like this without actually having worked in a library (and the 6 weeks experience does not count) is insane. There is absolutely no way to know that the job is for you without actually doing it. Taking a year to do a course like this is a huge commitment which could end up being a waste of time when people realise the job is rather different to what they thought.

In my honest opinion, I think that those undertaking a qualification like this should have a substantial amount of experience, and should preferably be employed in a library position. The amount of unrealistic people leaving courses like this, calling themselves a librarian, is such a pity. But again, thats just my opinion.

eclectichoney

Great post Chinafoot - the gulf between people's idea/perception of what working in a library is like and what the reality is, is vast. There should be a min of 6 month work experience requirement imo - it is not fair on colleges to take thousands of euro from people with no real experience, who ultimately have no real chance of getting a job and are just wasting their time and money - and destined for disappointment. At least if people have a more accurate idea of what working in a library actually entails, they can make a more informed decision before making the investment.

ambersand

I'm doing the UCD masters and am quite pleased with it so far. The core modules are okay, but the choice modules are where the strength of the course lies, as far as I can see. The course seems to be undergoing a complete shift towards the digital/electronic aspect if that's where your interest lies, and there's also an emphasis on the 'information' aspect as opposed to a strict 'librarianship' qualification (whilst still having a lot of options to go down the more traditional route). Personally, I'm not sure how well I'd manage doing a distance-learning course, although I have heard from people in the industry who have done the Aberystwyth course that it's a great option too.

Chinafoot wrote: »

The amount of unrealistic people leaving courses like this, calling themselves a librarian, is such a pity. But again, thats just my opinion.

But why wouldn't they call themselves a librarian, or at least 'qualified to be a librarian'? They've done an internationally recognised course, usually at a great financial cost to themselves (if done full-time, there's very little option to actually work to finance it). The people who are just doing it for the sake of getting a masters will either be weeded out in the class or weeded out when it comes to getting employment in the real world.

eclectichoney wrote: »

who ultimately have no real chance of getting a job and are just wasting their time and money - and destined for disappointment. At least if people have a more accurate idea of what working in a library actually entails, they can make a more informed decision before making the investment.

I think most people in my class are well aware of the lack of job opportunities available to us when we leave. The same applies to nearly every masters that can be done in college at the moment. I'm not sure why anbody would do a (generally unpaid) work experience placement for 6 weeks if they weren't dedicated. Maybe a small percentage do, but again, these people are probably ripe for weeding.

eclectichoney

ambersand wrote: »

But why wouldn't they call themselves a librarian, or at least 'qualified to be a librarian'? They've done an internationally recognised course, usually at a great financial cost to themselves (if done full-time, there's very little option to actually work to finance it). The people who are just doing it for the sake of getting a masters will either be weeded out in the class or weeded out when it comes to getting employment in the real world.



I think most people in my class are well aware of the lack of job opportunities available to us when we leave. The same applies to nearly every masters that can be done in college at the moment. I'm not sure why anbody would do a (generally unpaid) work experience placement for 6 weeks if they weren't dedicated. Maybe a small percentage do, but again, these people are probably ripe for weeding.

A course does not a librarian maketh - I think that is the point a lot of people make, and I would go along with it to be honest.

I think the employment situation is particularly bad in the case of the MLIS compared with other Masters degrees because 90% of the employment is in the public sector where there is a recruitment embargo - unlike finance, IT, management etc. Throw in the added difficulty that a lot of people are working in contract / short term placements in libraries these days and often have an 'inside track' as internal candidates for any vacancies that do pop up - meaning new grads are really up against it.

Working for 6 weeks for free is dedicated / committed? I know many recent grads who have worked for over a year in voluntary placements / unpaid internships and still have barely had an interview for a paid library job. How does one keep going in that situation, even if you desperately want to work in the profession? It's very disappointing for the individuals - and I don't think people are aware how difficult it really is, and in my opinion the situation is getting worse and will continue to do so I'm thinking of all the shiny passionate future grads who might be setting themselves up for a hard slog, as I know how disappointed / frustrated I have been over the past couple of years since graduating.

ambersand

eclectichoney wrote: »

A course does not a librarian maketh - I think that is the point a lot of people make, and I would go along with it to be honest.

It goes a great deal of the way, though. When you qualify as a doctor, you're a doctor (or: a course does a doctor maketh). And as mentioned elsewhere here, the course has recognised the need to diversify, and so can qualify you to work in other areas not necessarily restricted to librarianship.

eclectichoney wrote: »

I think the employment situation is particularly bad in the case of the MLIS compared with other Masters degrees because 90% of the employment is in the public sector where there is a recruitment embargo - unlike finance, IT, management etc. Throw in the added difficulty that a lot of people are working in contract / short term placements in libraries these days and often have an 'inside track' as internal candidates for any vacancies that do pop up - meaning new grads are really up against it.

This may be true, but there are so many factors you're omitting that it's nearly pointless to state: what are the percentage of non-public companies hiring in comparison to those who are firing/making redundant? Are the instances of internship higher in finance/management than in areas of librarianship? Does your masters in finance/management travel with you in other countries? How is your university perceived in terms of business in these countries?

But yeah, it'll be incredibly difficult. Hopefully the future prospects of the economy in conjunction with the ability to emigrate (with a nice shiny masters) will help ease this process.

eclectichoney

ambersand wrote: »

It goes a great deal of the way, though. When you qualify as a doctor, you're a doctor (or: a course does a doctor maketh). And as mentioned elsewhere here, the course has recognised the need to diversify, and so can qualify you to work in other areas not necessarily restricted to librarianship.



This may be true, but there are so many factors you're omitting that it's nearly pointless to state: what are the percentage of non-public companies hiring in comparison to those who are firing/making redundant? Are the instances of internship higher in finance/management than in areas of librarianship? Does your masters in finance/management travel with you in other countries? How is your university perceived in terms of business in these countries?

But yeah, it'll be incredibly difficult. Hopefully the future prospects of the economy in conjunction with the ability to emigrate (with a nice shiny masters) will help ease this process.

At least job turnover / churn in other sectors gives more opportunities to those unemployed to apply etc. for jobs even if it is a zero sum game essentially. Also yes, most qualifications can be 'travelled with'. As far as I am aware I would not think that the degree in UCD is particularly well perceived internationally (not saying it has a bad rep but I believe your point was the opposite)?


As Weepsie stated - a large % of clinical training is hospital-based, ergo not comparable really with a one year Masters.

parker kent

I'm presuming the poster that said that just used the example of a doctor without thinking it through (as in right idea, wrong example). If the MLIS had the amount of actual practical experience that any doctor gets in their education (obviously far longer than a one-year masters), then you could compare them. But as it stands, 6 weeks work experience is no way comparable to the training a doctor receives.

Plus the masters is about more than libraries. It is something often missed by people applying for the course and even many who graduate, but it is a masters in library AND information studies. So that can lead to mildly disillusioned students when they realise it is not exactly as they hoped (of course there will be many more who don't make this mistake, but there are always a number of people in the MLIS unhappy).

It would be interesting to see the stats UCD compile on graduates. I wonder what percentage of MLIS grads in the last 3-4 years are in paid library positions? I imagine those with just the 6 weeks experience would find it extremely difficult. As electichoney says, as there are people out there with vastly more experience struggling to get even an interview.

As for the ability to "travel" with the MLIS from UCD, I don't see it as being particularly well regarded world-wide. Now that is very different from being poorly regarded, but most countries tend to focus on their own universities. Only a small amount of Universities have strong reputations around the world. Outside of Ireland and perhaps the UK, I'm not sure how recognisable UCD will be to employers.

The MLIS in UCD is a mixed bag. I enjoyed it whilst having reservations about certain aspects which I've talked about earlier in the thread.

eclectichoney

Parker kent - great point about the grad stats. Gives me an idea in fact - would be well worth surveying recent grads to find out how many are employed within the LIS sphere (anyone want to join me on my research study? /me digs out log-in for survey monkey )

I totally agree that the MLIS programme is also for those who wish to work in the information field more generally - however, the truth is the vast number of people who do the course, do so because they pretty much want to work in a library (even if it is a special / non-traditional library e.g. a tax library, ngo library etc.)

This also makes interesting reading for anyone considering entering the profession:
http://www2.libraryassociation.ie/2011/10/26/task-force-on-employment-support-report-to-the-executive-board/

parker kent

eclectichoney wrote: »

I totally agree that the MLIS programme is also for those who wish to work in the information field more generally - however, the truth is the vast number of people who do the course, do so because they pretty much want to work in a library (even if it is a special / non-traditional library e.g. a tax library, ngo library etc.)

Yeah that's the issue. I don't think I remember many, if any, in my class who did not regard it as just the "library course". I'd say a lot have ended up in other information related roles.

You can start the MLIS grad survey, I'll be happy as the inspiration :pac:

escargotbleu

Really glad I found this thread! Loads of good advice - and great to hear from people who have actually done this course!

I'm starting a nine-month internship in a public library soon and I can't wait...despite my reservations about Job Bridge. I think it'll work for my particular circumstances.

I was planning to apply for the MLIS in UCD up until the fees and maintenance grant for post-grads got cut this week. Now a tiny part of me is actually starting to see the positive side of this; If I have to pay fees and support myself anyway, I'm no longer limited to Ireland. I'm interested to hear more opinions on the UCD course versus those in Aber, UWE etc.

Thanks!

raher1

There is no work!

BG2

kopite4 wrote: »

There is no work!

Do you mean that it is difficult to find work in libraries? Or that you are too lazy and do not have the intelligence or motivation to discover other areas in which you can apply this degree?

Raphael

Probably the first one, and leave the abuse out please.

raher1

BG2 there is no work,unless 9 months of internship thats usually cover for illness of childbirth is work,you go man. its not me anyway,

parker kent

kopite4 wrote: »

BG2 there is no work,unless 9 months of internship thats usually cover for illness of childbirth is work,you go man. its not me anyway,

I think the mildly irritated point being made was that the MLIS is about more than just libraries. Yes I know 95% of people consider it "the library course", but there is more to it than that.

eclectichoney

parker kent wrote: »

I think the mildly irritated point being made was that the MLIS is about more than just libraries. Yes I know 95% of people consider it "the library course", but there is more to it than that.

Where are these other areas with jobs though? I have seen very few information-type roles being advertised over the past couple of years, and one or two I can think of were more IT-centred knowledge management ro,es where you absolutely needed an IT background as well.
Sure you can apply for other jobs (admin etc.) having an MLIS - but you could probably apply for thos jobs without the MLIS or with another Masters degree as well.

I agree with Weepsie that most of the positions advertised are very short term contracts (maternity leave etc.) and so the organisations understandably need someone ready to hit the ground running rather than a new grad with a year or two experience who is going to take a couple of months to feel their way into the job. These days they can get plenty of the former applying, so recent grads don't get a look in.

Compounding the problem, a lot of vacancies are advertised internally which means LAs fill the AL jobs and then the LA jobs are never advertised externally as these are the jobs that suffer the hit from the need to cut staff budgets by 5-10% in many institutions (as well as the obvious difficulties caused by the PS Recruitment embargo)

parker kent

eclectichoney wrote: »

Where are these other areas with jobs though? I have seen very few information-type roles being advertised over the past couple of years, and one or two I can think of were more IT-centred knowledge management ro,es where you absolutely needed an IT background as well.

I wasn't actually saying that was my opinion, just interpreting what I thought the poster above meant in his/her post.

The MLIS is not really any different to most other post grads in that a very limited number of positions are longer than temporary contracts. There are not many people getting longer than a 1 year contract outside of those applying to graduate programmes (your KPMG type programmes for example). Somebody getting a maternity leave role is actually not to be sniffed at as it opens doors.

I would agree that the only specific area the MLIS qualifies a graduate for is library related roles. However, it can be used to get more general information related roles, albeit roles where you are competing with graduates from other areas. So the benefit to postgrads would be having a masters (I know not exactly what many will have signed up for) and having demonstrated a certain level of knowledge in information environments.

I can only speak from personal experience and that of my friends and I do know that there are recent grads getting "decent" jobs (even maternity leave positions). Like I said in the other thread a few weeks ago, of course it is extremely, extremely tough to find a job. I'm not denying that as it would basically be a lie. But there are some people getting lucky.

Also just to re-iterate the above posters point (as I slightly meandered through various topics!), there is more to SILS (or SISC as it now is!) than libraries. It is not all about getting a job in a library. Many enter it with that specific aim and I don't think the School do much to alter that mindset of MLIS students, but it is supposed to be about more than libraries.