Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

Grandeeod

Muckyboots wrote: »

There is now zero party political support for WOT.

While I despise the WRC, do not get sucked into the current political situation. We have been here before and it can change.

eastwest

Grandeeod wrote: »

Muckyboots wrote: »

There is now zero party political support for WOT.

While I despise the WRC, do not get sucked into the current political situation. We have been here before and it can change.

As far as I can see, there are three national politicians supporting WOT. One senator and one TD are embedded in the organisation and unlikely/unable to change, and one minister who is expert at riding two horses and telling people what they want to hear.

Coillte_Bhoy

westtip wrote: »

It hasn't got planning permission yet, but that hasn't stopped the project from going forward with track clearing and some old tracks delivered to Kiltimagh to replace those stolen a few years ago. Mayo CC have been referred to the ombudsman about the fact they are allowing this project to go ahead without planning permission.

The Kiltimagh Greenway group are putting pressure on the council to have a parallel greenway run alongside the bit of closed railway being used for the velorail, in short things are hotting up in KM.

Why would they need planning permission to replace track?And things arent hotting up, there is no active Greenway group to speak of afaik, there is a facebook group yes but there has been been no public meetings etc

eastwest

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

westtip wrote: »

It hasn't got planning permission yet, but that hasn't stopped the project from going forward with track clearing and some old tracks delivered to Kiltimagh to replace those stolen a few years ago. Mayo CC have been referred to the ombudsman about the fact they are allowing this project to go ahead without planning permission.

The Kiltimagh Greenway group are putting pressure on the council to have a parallel greenway run alongside the bit of closed railway being used for the velorail, in short things are hotting up in KM.

Why would they need planning permission to replace track?And things arent hotting up, there is no active Greenway group to speak of afaik, there is a facebook group yes but there has been been no public meetings etc

Youre right, they don't need permission to replace track, but they probabky need permission for the velorail.

westtip

eastwest wrote: »

Youre right, they don't need permission to replace track, but they probabky need permission for the velorail.

No probably about it, change of use means they must apply for planning permission, but we can let the ombudsman decide that....who has of course been asked.

eastwest

westtip wrote: »

No probably about it, change of use means they must apply for planning permission, but we can let the ombudsman decide that....who has of course been asked.

A bit silly of them to try to skirt around the planning rules. A case of don't do as I do, do as I say?
Even if it was a case of not being sure, surely the interests of good governance would dictate a planning application?
In fairness, I think this wouldn't happen in most other counties.

westtip

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Why would they need planning permission to replace track?And things arent hotting up, there is no active Greenway group to speak of afaik, there is a facebook group yes but there has been been no public meetings etc

Quietly slowly gently the silent majority are moving forward......;)

eastwest

westtip wrote: »

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Why would they need planning permission to replace track?And things arent hotting up, there is no active Greenway group to speak of afaik, there is a facebook group yes but there has been been no public meetings etc

Quietly slowly gently the silent majority are moving forward......;)

I see that the Sligo county plan has just been amended to facilitate the development of a greenway on the track bed.
The decision was made by councillors a couple of months ago, apparently, but it has physically been amended in the last couple of days.
(Speaking of moving forward.....)

serfboard

eastwest wrote: »

I see that the Sligo county plan has just been amended to facilitate the development of a greenway on the track bed.
The decision was made by councillors a couple of months ago, apparently, but it has physically been amended in the last couple of days.
(Speaking of moving forward.....)

Ye can find it here.

Sligo County Council wrote:

Seek the development of a footway and cycleway (greenway) on or alongside the closed railway line from Collooney to Bellaghy (Sligo/Mayo county boundary) insofar as such route does not compromise the reopening of the Western Rail Corridor, if reopening the railway line is deemed feasible.

Still covering their tracks (geddit? ), but movement at least and at last.

eastwest

It's great, the barriers are falling, one at a time.

westtip

When the last Sligo county plan was approved in 2011, for the county plan 2011-2016 it would have said a greenway only "alongside" the closed railway, which was a stalling methodology of certain cllrs to stop the greenway. For those of us who have been involved in this long arduous battle for years the significance of the new county plan using the phrase a greenway can go on or alongside the closed railway is indeed a huge breakthrough as it means the greenway on the old trackbed lifting the rusting no longer fit for purpose railway can actually happen as it is now officially approved by the council

Getting the idea of a greenway into the last county plan only came about because of the campaigning of one person, and despite general agreement from cllrs back in 2011 that a greenway was a good idea a small handful of cllrs insisted on the stalling phrase "alongside" being used in the county plan as they knew it could effectively be used stop the greenway. It has taken the entire period of the county plan to build a movement to get the cllrs on board, to get the official policy documentation changed; West on Track used to own the political high ground, and they used to dominate how policy was written and how the words crafted in policy were written; they no longer do. The significance of this minor change in wording in the Sligo county plan to "build a greenway on or alongside the closed railway" is huge. West on Track for years played the game that you can't have a greenway as it is official council policy and government policy to build a railway - even though we all knew it would never happen, the significance of now changing the policy documentation so that a greenway is perfectly acceptable means there is now no official reason for any cllr to object to it. It has taken six years for this slight change in wording but it means the project can no go ahead. Anyone who has been involved in this campaign understands the significance of this moment. It is a pity that a handful of cllrs have allowed Sligo tourism to be stymied for so long, but don't worry it will now happen of that I am increasingly confident:D

Can I have some of whatever this guy is smoking

http://connachttribune.ie/galway-td-slams-misinformation-over-western-rail-corridor/

Galway TD slams misinformation over Western Rail Corridor
By Our Reporter - August 19, 2017

Galway Bay fm newsroom – A Galway East TD is slamming what’s being described as ‘consistent misinformation’ being spread about the performance of the Western Rail Corridor.

Deputy Sean Canney says the first phase of the corridor has exceeded the projected level of use – with 279 thousand passengers using the Galway to Limerick line in 2015.

He says the second and third phases of the Western Rail Corridor will further revitalise towns such as Tuam, Milltown, Athenry, Ardrahan, Gort and Craughwell.

However, the Independent Deputy is warning the continued spreading of misinformation is a direct threat to these plans and increased investment across the west.

Deputy Canney says the railway is hugely important to the regions future development as a counterbalance to the greater Dublin area.

marno21

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Can I have some of whatever this guy is smoking

http://connachttribune.ie/galway-td-slams-misinformation-over-western-rail-corridor/

He will lose his seat if he carries on with this rubbish.

It would be more in his interest to get the completed motorway to Tuam which isn't supposed to open for another 4 months and build a greenway to get some proper investment in Tuam rather than this nonsensical drivel.

Of course the likes of Google and Intel are waiting in the wings for this to open so they can open their Ballyglunin campus. :rolleyes:

eastwest

Deleted User wrote: »

Can I have some of whatever this guy is smoking

http://connachttribune.ie/galway-td-slams-misinformation-over-western-rail-corridor/

Galway TD slams misinformation over Western Rail Corridor
By Our Reporter - August 19, 2017

Galway Bay fm newsroom – A Galway East TD is slamming what’s being described as ‘consistent misinformation’ being spread about the performance of the Western Rail Corridor.

Deputy Sean Canney says the first phase of the corridor has exceeded the projected level of use – with 279 thousand passengers using the Galway to Limerick line in 2015.

He says the second and third phases of the Western Rail Corridor will further revitalise towns such as Tuam, Milltown, Athenry, Ardrahan, Gort and Craughwell.

However, the Independent Deputy is warning the continued spreading of misinformation is a direct threat to these plans and increased investment across the west.

Deputy Canney says the railway is hugely important to the regions future development as a counterbalance to the greater Dublin area.

What he's having is just a large dose of parish pumpery, shovelling out the usual blather about 'them crowd up in Dublin has the dart so we are entitled to a railway.'
He'd be better off getting behind the voters who increasingly are getting very tired of this nonsense and this 'fake news' about railway usage figures. People see the success of greenways in places like waterford and won't continue to allow wot and it's handful of politicians to deny these amenities to east Galway.
Canney will be looking for another job after the next election.

Sloopys

eastwest wrote: »

What he's having is just a large dose of parish pumpery, shovelling out the usual blather about 'them crowd up in Dublin has the dart so we are entitled to a railway.'
He'd be better off getting behind the voters who increasingly are getting very tired of this nonsense and this 'fake news' about railway usage figures. People see the success of greenways in places like waterford and won't continue to allow wot and it's handful of politicians to deny these amenities to east Galway.
Canney will be looking for another job after the next election.

It's like watching the first dreaded back to school ads on the telly isn't it. We had three weeks break from all of this codology so I guess we are now back to business as usual here. But before I go back to lurking I will say this; Canney is going to top the poll - again.

road_high

eastwest wrote: »

What he's having is just a large dose of parish pumpery, shovelling out the usual blather about 'them crowd up in Dublin has the dart so we are entitled to a railway.'
He'd be better off getting behind the voters who increasingly are getting very tired of this nonsense and this 'fake news' about railway usage figures. People see the success of greenways in places like waterford and won't continue to allow wot and it's handful of politicians to deny these amenities to east Galway.
Canney will be looking for another job after the next election.

"phase" 2, whatever chance it may have had it about to be killed stone dead by the new M17/18 motorway. Fair enough, leave phase 1 as it has it some in merit in that it (badly) connects Limerick, Ennis and Galway to eachother.
The rest well we don't need to repeat what's been said 1000 times over here.

eastwest

road_high wrote: »

"phase" 2, whatever chance it may have had it about to be killed stone dead by the new M17/18 motorway. Fair enough, leave phase 1 as it has it some in merit in that it (badly) connects Limerick, Ennis and Galway to eachother.
The rest well we don't need to repeat what's been said 1000 times over here.

Every time the former Junior Minister comes out with this nonsense, he throws another hundred votes over the side. Fewer and fewer people believe this blather any more. He had a chance to do something for Tuam when he held the balance of power, and he decided not to avail of it in favour of his cronies' dreams in WOT. He will live to regret that stance come next election. He had a chance to do something locally, and he turned his back on it.
What is certain therefore is not his re-election, but that the upcoming railway review will look coldly at the figures and recommend the closure or downgrading of the three major lossmaking lines, including Ennis Athenry. The seemingly healthy figures for the entire Limerick Galway route cannot get away from the fact that the Ennis Athenry bit has failed abysmally. The review cannot possibly recommend throwing good money after bad by developing a railway north of Athenry; it just won't happen. Anyone who thinks otherwise is simply in absolute denial of reality.
What people around Tuam and Collooney and places in between need isn't a slow train, its the development of a decent road link north of Tuam on the N17. They also need the defunct rail line to be developed for their benefit, same as was done for the people in Waterford.

Muckyboots

Sloopys wrote: »

It's like watching the first dreaded back to school ads on the telly isn't it. We had three weeks break from all of this codology so I guess we are now back to business as usual here. But before I go back to lurking I will say this; Canney is going to top the poll - again.

You are probably right. He's a smooth operator and there won't be an envelope opened in Tuam in the next 12 months with out his presence . He has lost the "young family" town vote.

end of the road

eastwest wrote: »

Every time the former Junior Minister comes out with this nonsense, he throws another hundred votes over the side. Fewer and fewer people believe this blather any more. He had a chance to do something for Tuam when he held the balance of power, and he decided not to avail of it in favour of his cronies' dreams in WOT. He will live to regret that stance come next election. He had a chance to do something locally, and he turned his back on it.

we will see at the next election but i suspect you may be engaging in wishful thinking. the reality is a minority of people are focused on the greenway issue over all just like the railway, most people have more important issues to worry about in reality.

eastwest wrote: »

What is certain therefore is not his re-election, but that the upcoming railway review will look coldly at the figures and recommend the closure or downgrading of the three major lossmaking lines, including Ennis Athenry. The seemingly healthy figures for the entire Limerick Galway route cannot get away from the fact that the Ennis Athenry bit has failed abysmally. The review cannot possibly recommend throwing good money after bad by developing a railway north of Athenry; it just won't happen. Anyone who thinks otherwise is simply in absolute denial of reality.

ennis athenry is unlikely to close. the couple of small stations on it maybe but not the line itself. busier lines will go before it. in fact, there are a number of through busy trains on the galway limerick line i believe anyway.

eastwest wrote: »

What people around Tuam and Collooney and places in between need isn't a slow train, its the development of a decent road link north of Tuam on the N17. They also need the defunct rail line to be developed for their benefit, same as was done for the people in Waterford.

they are getting a road. it will be enough to meet the traffic needs, the needs in that area aren't that great in reality anyway.

Muckyboots

http://www.seancanney.com/western-rail-corridor-crucial-future-development-west-canney

He's coming out fighting.

marno21

Muckyboots wrote: »

http://www.seancanney.com/western-rail-corridor-crucial-future-development-west-canney

He's coming out fighting.

This rubbish sums up what's wrong with Irish politics. Money has to be wasted in the West to achieve parity with Dublin's spending. The main reason why Dublin has a project backlog and there are empty trains chugging in the rest of the country.

An N17 upgrade Tuam-Collooney and minor regional road upgrades would do 100x what this mess would do

JCX BXC

Can't find a used section thread so gonna ask here, what trains are normally used on the Limerick-Galway route? What 3 carriage train was I on yesterday evening?

eastwest

Muckyboots wrote: »

http://www.seancanney.com/western-rail-corridor-crucial-future-development-west-canney

He's coming out fighting.

It's all a load of nonsense. The bulk of the passenger numbers are on ennis-Limerick and Athenry- Galway. The investment in the wrc was the bit in between, characterised by the empty trains.
Unfortunately this kind of bullchit is never called out by the media, and gullible people believe it.
There is one truth that cannot be escaped however, regardless of passenger numbers on the wrc. There is no money and they're won't be any money for another white elephant north of Athenry.

JCX BXC

eastwest wrote: »

It's all a load of nonsense. The bulk of the passenger numbers are on ennis-Limerick and Athenry- Galway. The investment in the wrc was the bit in between, characterised by the empty trains.
Unfortunately this kind of bullchit is never called out by the media, and gullible people believe it.
There is one truth that cannot be escaped however, regardless of passenger numbers on the wrc. There is no money and they're won't be any money for another white elephant north of Athenry.

Train between Ennis-Athenry had more passengers yesterday than Athenry-Galway. Do you travel the route?

eastwest

JCX BXC wrote: »

Train between Ennis-Athenry had more passengers yesterday than Athenry-Galway. Do you travel the route?

I do, occasionally.
I agree, selected trains on weekends can be busy-ish, but the majority are not.
Successive governments have clearly stated that this mistake won't be repeated.
There is no possibility of EU funding for the route.
The motorway is opening shortly.
Mayo is already served by a railway.
Population densities north of Tuam do not justify a train.
It's simply not going to happen.

serfboard

JCX BXC wrote: »

Train between Ennis-Athenry had more passengers yesterday than Athenry-Galway. Do you travel the route?

I'm guessing he doesn't, but then not that many people are - on a regular basis.

What you report is interesting - am I understanding you right - that the Ennis->Athenry section carried more passengers yesterday than the Athenry->Galway section on the train you were on? Where did they all get out? Athenry?

In any case, the real usefulness of any train line comes not from Sunday trippers during the busiest tourist month of the year, but all-year around commuters - of which there are very few on the Ennis->Athenry section. The empty car parks at Gort and Craughwell stations will tell you that.

Furthermore, from this December, the X51 bus will be going along the full M18, reducing the Inter-City time to (I'm guessing about) an hour and ten minutes - while the train will still be trundling around the countryside taking two hours.

westtip

Wow I missed all this fun on Canney in the past couple of days. What on earth is wrong with this man? Did he not see 600 people in a small little town like Tuam take peacefully to the streets recently asking for a greenway? All politics in Ireland we often hear are local; why is this man so obsessed with a project he knows full well cannot be delivered, why doesn't he put his shoulder to the wheel for something which with the full support of all cllrs and the likes of Canney would be a shoe in of an idea. What is this obsession with the Western Rail Corridor a project that simply is not going to happen. From what I have heard in Tuam the tide has turned and Canneys' opposition to the greenway could well lose him his seat. I do hope so.

marno21

westtip wrote: »

Wow I missed all this fun on Canney in the past couple of days. What on earth is wrong with this man? Did he not see 600 people in a small little town like Tuam take peacefully to the streets recently asking for a greenway? All politics in Ireland we often hear are local; why is this man so obsessed with a project he knows full well cannot be delivered, why doesn't he put his shoulder to the wheel for something which with the full support of all cllrs and the likes of Canney would be a shoe in of an idea. What is this obsession with the Western Rail Corridor a project that simply is not going to happen. From what I have heard in Tuam the tide has turned and Canneys' opposition to the greenway could well lose him his seat. I do hope so.

He can retire to spend more time watching construction begin on Bank of America's new Milltown campus after their post Brexit decision to relocate to the bustling Galway metropolis in anticipation of construction of Phase II of the Western Rail Corridor.

Meanwhile workers for Bank of America in Dublin have no way of getting to work and nowhere to live. But it's ok cos Galway has its trains.

JCX BXC

eastwest wrote: »

I do, occasionally.
I agree, selected trains on weekends can be busy-ish, but the majority are not.
Successive governments have clearly stated that this mistake won't be repeated.
There is no possibility of EU funding for the route.
The motorway is opening shortly.
Mayo is already served by a railway.
Population densities north of Tuam do not justify a train.
It's simply not going to happen.

I would agree fully, no scope for any railway after Athenry. However, for both sides, I don't think you can use the figures for Ennis-Athenry as any indication of demand for a railway to Tuam or further on.

Ennis to Athenry figures are not too bad, and a big plus is the train is cheaper than the bus currently. They're not brilliant however, but much better than lines like LJ-WAT (which Imo could be improved with ease) and Limerick to Ballybrophy (needs to die).

JCX BXC

serfboard wrote: »

What you report is interesting - am I understanding you right - that the Ennis->Athenry section carried more passengers yesterday than the Athenry->Galway section on the train you were on? Where did they all get out? Athenry?

That's exactly what I'm implying, several people got out in Athenry.

The empty car parks at Gort and Craughwell stations will tell you that.

Why would they? Surely stops on a line don't prove how well a line is doing?

Furthermore, from this December, the X51 bus will be going along the full M18, reducing the Inter-City time to (I'm guessing about) an hour and ten minutes - while the train will still be trundling around the countryside taking two hours.

Personally I don't think so, the M18 will just be bringing you further outside Galway to near Athenry and onto the M6, the potential congestion on the way into galway could well negate any time savings during peak times.

Speed improvements could be well worth it along the line, at some stages the train slows to 50km/h, which to me seems rather strange, shouldn't the issues have been sorted out before they rebuilt the line?