Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

end of the road

Stephen15 wrote: »

Limerick Junction is not a town or a city

so what? it offers connections to other services.

Stephen15 wrote: »

Waterford is a dump.

how so.

Stephen15 wrote: »

Everyone wants to go to Dublin or Cork not Waterford or Limerick Junction.

and to get to cork or dublin, for this line, they have to go to either waterford or limerick junction. + those who work in waterford (which believe it or not people do work in waterford)

Stephen15 wrote: »

Trains need to connect population centres in order to be viable not some rural backwater which the Limerick Junction to Waterford line

all our trains do connect some decent sized towns to the main population centres, either directly or with a change, aka the vast majority of ireland's lines are viable.
wrong, the limerick junction to waterford line is not a rural backwater. a couple of decent sized towns on the line and between 2 cities technically.

Stephen15 wrote: »

In fact nearly all the lines in Ireland just connect rural areas to cities even Dublin to Cork none of the stops are large places. Only line in Ireland that doesn't do this is Dublin to Belfast which has some biggish towns on the line.

they connect mostly towns to dublin. there are a couple of rural stops per line and they act as railheads for all the rural stations that were closed.

Stephen15

end of the road wrote: »

and to get to cork or dublin, for this line, they have to go to either waterford or limerick junction. + those who work in waterford (which believe it or not people do work in waterford)



all our trains do connect some decent sized towns to the main population centres, either directly or with a change, aka the vast majority of ireland's lines are viable.
wrong, the limerick junction to waterford line is not a rural backwater. a couple of decent sized towns on the line and between 2 cities technically.



they connect mostly towns to dublin. there are a couple of rural stops per line and they act as railheads for all the rural stations that were closed.

Do people really want to be changing at Limerick Junction when they can drive or get a bus direct which is quicker.

We don't have any decent sized towns in Ireland compared to the rest of Europe. I never knew Limerick Junction was a city. Compared to the rest of Europe those towns on the line are very small.

end of the road

Stephen15 wrote: »

Do people really want to be changing at Limerick Junction when they can drive or get a bus direct which is quicker.

We don't have any decent sized towns in Ireland compared to the rest of Europe. I never knew Limerick Junction was a city. Compared to the rest of Europe those towns on the line are very small.

they are still towns, and the vast vast majority still have enough patronage to justify a rail service where such exists. on limerick waterford the bus service is actually slower then the train believe it or not.
and again, you are the only one mentioning limerick junction as being a city.

Markcheese

hytrogen wrote:

If they had kept the branch line as far as Ballina/Killaloe you wouldn't have the mayhem each day on that bridge and plenty more people would be using it to commute to Limerick each day. It's quite a busy and scenic twintownship to be fair but a bottleneck nonetheless with commuters getting onto the motorway or to Nenagh.

When did the killaloe line close?
. . Shure maybe they should have subsidised the canals more and you could have traveled to the centre of town by barge

hytrogen

Grandeeod wrote:

Back in the 1970s and as recently as 2002, the Rosslare - LJ and Ballybrophy - Limerick routes were used as kite flying exercises to highlight funding shortages. In fact much of the closure of the network in the early 60s was based on "funding shortages" and happened because road congestion wasn't an issue. I appreciate completely that many closures were justified, but the policy took a lot of railways with it that we would really appreciate today.

It was because of that Andrew's clan in the 40's & 50's, Todd being the first Judas with his anti-british establishmentarianism rants feeding Erskine Childers lest we forget.

hytrogen

eastwest wrote:

A train carrying eight or ten passengers is anything but green; a minibus or a couple of cars will generate far less greenhouse gases than a locomotive hauling tons of empty carriages through the countryside. Still, you can set you watch by it, if you still use a watch.

It's a lot greener hauling TEU freight empty and/or full on rails than having one 5l diesel truck hauling one 40ft TEU across the island so haul your wool over something else

hytrogen

Markcheese wrote:

When did the killaloe line close? . . Shure maybe they should have subsidised the canals more and you could have traveled to the centre of town by barge

1948. Services ceased in 1931

eastwest

hytrogen wrote: »

eastwest wrote:

A train carrying eight or ten passengers is anything but green; a minibus or a couple of cars will generate far less greenhouse gases than a locomotive hauling tons of empty carriages through the countryside. Still, you can set you watch by it, if you still use a watch.

It's a lot greener hauling TEU freight empty and/or full on rails than having one 5l diesel truck hauling one 40ft TEU across the island so haul your wool over something else

Did I mention freight?

thomond2006

The new motorway from Limerick to Galway that is set to open will surely kill off the WRC. The bus alternative will be nearly twice as fast. Who on earth signed off on that investment thinking a service that slow would be viable?! Was it ever proposed to build a train line alongside the M20 with perhaps a new station in Limerick to create a Cork-Limerick-Galway service?

The Waterford to Limerick Jctn line is at least one where there are decent sized towns on the line, particularly Clonmel. If the train continued to Limerick City and the speed was increased then perhaps it could be a commuter service.

westtip

thomond2006 wrote: »

The new motorway from Limerick to Galway that is set to open will surely kill off the WRC. The bus alternative will be nearly twice as fast. Who on earth signed off on that investment thinking a service that slow would be viable?! .

New to this thread? The "investment" in the Galway Limerick link between Athenry/Ennis is one of the greatest white elephant legacies of the Tiger. Indeed it will be very interesting to see the new bus timetables for express services from Limerick to Galway on the new motorway route, meanwhile north of Athenry we shoudl see quicker bus times for Tuam to Galway busess when the motorway opens, if they follow the old route N17 they will be quicker because of less through traffic clogging up the Claregalway bottleneck, if they follow the albeit slightly longer seamless motorway route via M17 and M6 interchange at Rathmorrisey they will be quicker - simply because of the quality of the road, and with bus lanes into the city totally reliable.

BTW a long time ago I suggested a bus interchange at Rathmorrisey N6/N17 i for Dublin-Galway East West buses to interchange with North South buses on the N17 going Sligo Limerick Cork. Would not have to be complicated a four bay bus pull in would probably do, ah well wonder what happened to that idea which was sent to the department and BE.

thomond2006

westtip wrote: »

New to this thread? The "investment" in the Galway Limerick link between Athenry/Ennis is one of the greatest white elephant legacies of the Tiger. Indeed it will be very interesting to see the new bus timetables for express services from Limerick to Galway on the new motorway route, meanwhile north of Athenry we shoudl see quicker bus times for Tuam to Galway busess when the motorway opens, if they follow the old route N17 they will be quicker because of less through traffic clogging up the Claregalway bottleneck, if they follow the albeit slightly longer seamless motorway route via M17 and M6 interchange at Rathmorrisey they will be quicker - simply because of the quality of the road, and with bus lanes into the city totally reliable.

BTW a long time ago I suggested a bus interchange at Rathmorrisey N6/N17 i for Dublin-Galway East West buses to interchange with North South buses on the N17 going Sligo Limerick Cork. Would not have to be complicated a four bay bus pull in would probably do, ah well wonder what happened to that idea which was sent to the department and BE.

I dip in and out occasionally.

Having gone on the train and the BE expressway I'd have to go with the Expressway. It is slightly more expensive than the train but is currently 30 minutes faster iirc. The difference in comfort between the expressway and the train (2800) was very little.

Did anyone even question the train speeds at the time? I know linking the train with Shannon Airport was deemed too expensive but a Limerick to Galway via Shannon that took an hour might have been the only option that could compete with road/bus. The current service is utterly useless and the current discounted fares are unsustainable.

Muckyboots

westtip wrote: »

New to this thread? we should see quicker bus times for Tuam to Galway busess when the motorway opens, if they follow the old route N17 they will be quicker because of less through traffic clogging up the Claregalway bottleneck, if they follow the albeit slightly longer seamless motorway route via M17 and M6 interchange at Rathmorrisey they will be quicker - simply because of the quality of the road, and with bus lanes into the city totally reliable.

And this.....

http://connachttribune.ie/tuam-road-bus-corridor-at-detailed-design-stage-110/

westtip

Muckyboots wrote: »

And this.....

http://connachttribune.ie/tuam-road-bus-corridor-at-detailed-design-stage-110/

The end is nigh, I call this a conspiracy theory against WOT

Grandeeod

thomond2006 wrote: »

I dip in and out occasionally.

Having gone on the train and the BE expressway I'd have to go with the Expressway. It is slightly more expensive than the train but is currently 30 minutes faster iirc. The difference in comfort between the expressway and the train (2800) was very little.

Did anyone even question the train speeds at the time? I know linking the train with Shannon Airport was deemed too expensive but a Limerick to Galway via Shannon that took an hour might have been the only option that could compete with road/bus. The current service is utterly useless and the current discounted fares are unsustainable.

Loads did. It was discussed in detail as far back as 2004. But ultimately it was very much a political decision to reopen this line.

serfboard

Muckyboots wrote: »

http://connachttribune.ie/tuam-road-bus-corridor-at-detailed-design-stage-110/

The Connacht Tribune wrote:

Phase One of the Tuam Road bus corridor would encompass the stretch from Claregalway to the junction at Flemings motors in the city.

This phase could be done relatively quickly as Compulsory Purchase Orders would not be needed as far as Castlegar church.

Burke's Bus I suspect will still go along the old N17, due to picking up passengers along the way, but this will be a great boost to them when they reach the outskirts of Galway. They are already taking advantage of the Bus Lane in Claregalway, sailing by all the traffic in Loughgeorge.

Bus Eireann could run a service via the Motorway (X64 anyone?), taking advantage of the Bus Lanes beside Merlin Park Hospital.

The M17 plus more Bus Lanes in the City are the final nails in the coffin of any hope of a train line north of Athenry.

Muckyboots

Searching through the archives and...http://galwaybayfm.ie/economic-review-rail-line-athenry-claremorris/ Blows off dust and wonders !

Muckyboots

Muckyboots wrote: »

Searching through the archives and...http://galwaybayfm.ie/economic-review-rail-line-athenry-claremorris/ Blows off dust and wonders !

And this- https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/dispute-over-future-of-disused-western-rail-corridor-1.1506366
"Protecting the route
This view is supported by Iarnród Éireann. Asked about greenways by George Hook on Newstalk radio earlier this month, company spokesman Barry Kenny said: “Greenways actually protect the alignment in case we ever want to use them as railways again.” Minister for Transport Leo Varadkar also made it clear last month that the Government had “no plans to extend the Western Rail Corridor nor any other heavy rail line in the State. We do not have the funds. Our priority is to keep the existing lines open”.

marno21

A tender has been issued for a feasibility study on a greenway between Collooney and Bellaghy, Co. Sligo on the disused Claremorris-Collooney railway line.

https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase.asp?PID=115687

hytrogen

eastwest wrote:

Did I mention freight?

Does it always have to be about passengers? How many times have you been on the N17 or other roads stuck behind a truck doing 80 in a 100 zone or in traffic through towns and can't see ahead if it's clear to overtake the lump?
What about being on a bike on the same roads and towns and nearly getting killed by the same lorry because there's no cycle track or hard shoulder? Wouldn't it make more sense both for safety and environmentally to get as many trucks off the road as possible for these expected touring cyclists??

westtip

marno21 wrote: »

A tender has been issued for a feasibility study on a greenway between Collooney and Bellaghy, Co. Sligo on the disused Claremorris-Collooney railway line.

https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase.asp?PID=115687

This news makes me so proud of the efforts I have personally made to bring this idea into the public domain, well done Sligo Greenway co-op for picking up the mantle to make this happen, one person cannot act alone but can influence others to do so.

Muckyboots

hytrogen wrote: »

Wouldn't it make more sense both for safety and environmentally to get as many trucks off the road as possible for these expected touring cyclists??

The notion that rail freight will take trucks off the road in any noticeable numbers is just hogwash and you wont get away with that on an informed forum like this. Freight has to get to a destination - not a station, and that means trucks and vans at point of delivery. BTW, as a cyclist, truck drivers are generally the best trained and safest motorised companions you could have on a road.

eastwest

marno21 wrote: »

A tender has been issued for a feasibility study on a greenway between Collooney and Bellaghy, Co. Sligo on the disused Claremorris-Collooney railway line.

https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase.asp?PID=115687

Anyone who thinks that they can continue to block this community-driven initiative is seriously deluded.
This initiative has the support of all the councillors in Sligo with the exception of three who have their own reasons for opposing the wishes of the public. In Waterford there were nine 'flat-earthers' but the deise greenway still got built. Three Luddites is nothing by comparison.

Markiemarkso

marno21 wrote: »

A tender has been issued for a feasibility study on a greenway between Collooney and Bellaghy, Co. Sligo on the disused Claremorris-Collooney railway line.

https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase.asp?PID=115687

Is this not what was already done last year with public money?

westtip

Markiemarkso wrote: »

Is this not what was already done last year with public money?

No the Meehan-Tully report looked at the options open including re-opening the railway and concluded a greenway was the best option for the time being in order to protect the route, the report was funded by Sligo county council as they were being lobbied by both West on Track and the Greenway campaign. It was more of an economic broad brush study as to what could actually be achieved. The recommendation for a greenway from this independent report which Sligo Greenway Co-op had nothing to do with resulted in a greenway on the route been written into the county plan; whilst this all seemed long and laborious it was necessary to finally win the argument for cllrs against the anti-tourism lobby trying as hard as they could to stop the greenway from happening, which is really now down less than a handful of cranks in the council chamber, thankfully the vast majority of Sligo Cllrs now support the greenway and see the benefits it will bring to Sligo.

The commissioned feasibility study (which will as I understand it be co-funded by the council and the greenway co-op in a public/private partnership) will look at the nuts and bolts of achieving the greenway, how much will it cost to take up the closed railway that is no longer fit for purpose, how much will it cost to actually construct a greenway and hopefully will come up with a detailed costed plan on how it can be achieved, this properly costed blueprint will go to the department asking for funding. It will be the blueprint used for tenders to construct. It marks the beginning of the actual process of building the Sligo greenway, the northern section of the Western Rail Trail, the touch paper has now been lit, the project is now officially off the ground.

The greenway co-op is actually spending members money on this feasibilty study so it is not just about spending public money, businesses in Sligo have supported the co-op to get this moving, ordinary folk have bought shares in the co-op, even children have bought €1 shares in the co-op. This is real people saying what is left of the tiny anti-tourism lobby in the council chamber we want to see this happen. It is a fantastic day for job creation and tourism in the north west and everyone involved should be commended.

Del.Monte

How's the Velo Rail project going?

westtip

Del.Monte wrote: »

How's the Velo Rail project going?

It hasn't got planning permission yet, but that hasn't stopped the project from going forward with track clearing and some old tracks delivered to Kiltimagh to replace those stolen a few years ago. Mayo CC have been referred to the ombudsman about the fact they are allowing this project to go ahead without planning permission.

The Kiltimagh Greenway group are putting pressure on the council to have a parallel greenway run alongside the bit of closed railway being used for the velorail, in short things are hotting up in KM.

Del.Monte

Collooney or bust - I only need one trip in the Sligo direction.

westtip

Del.Monte wrote: »

Collooney or bust - I only need one trip in the Sligo direction.

DM sorry can't ever see your train trip on the burma road happening! Would you like to rent a bike?:D

end of the road

Muckyboots wrote: »

The notion that rail freight will take trucks off the road in any noticeable numbers is just hogwash

it's not hogwash at all. it can be done to a greater extent if there is a genuine push by government to do it. it can be done. there are flows in this country being brought by truck that could be transferred to rail if the government had a policy to encourage shift. would save a lot on the roads budget as well no doubt. of course it would mean the removal of power from the road lobby so forget it.

Muckyboots wrote: »

and you wont get away with that on an informed forum like this.

he has made a good point, unfortunately however some don't like the idea of anything that doesn't mean an over dependance on road and any suggestion to move traffic to rail is met by some with all sorts. yes you will never move all road traffic to rail and nobody is suggesting it but there is lots of room for a greater shift currently.

Muckyboots wrote: »

Freight has to get to a destination - not a station, and that means trucks and vans at point of delivery.

some of it yes. not every single bit. lots of it is brought to distribution centres first which with government policy could have been built beside rail.
the fact is relying on trucks for all freight is not cost effective to the tax payer and not sustainible. even with electric vehicles the electricity costs could potentially add up once they become the main stay.

eastwest

Muckyboots wrote: »

hytrogen wrote: »

Wouldn't it make more sense both for safety and environmentally to get as many trucks off the road as possible for these expected touring cyclists??

The notion that rail freight will take trucks off the road in any noticeable numbers is just hogwash and you wont get away with that on an informed forum like this. Freight has to get to a destination - not a station, and that means trucks and vans at point of delivery. BTW, as a cyclist, truck drivers are generally the best trained and safest motorised companions you could have on a road.

Ah no, the west of Ireland is different from any other thinly populated area, anywhere. It's a special case that bucks all trends.
The western rail corridor will be great for the kind of freight that is common around that part of the world. Collecting milk from farms, delivering blocks, concrete and stone to one-off housing sites, bringing fuel to filling stations -- these are all jobs that are eminently suited to the western rail corridor. And don't forget bringing loads of straw and hay from meath and Dublin to mayo and sligo; sure the thrain is yer only man.
It's not all about bringing the contents of animal stomachs to Claremorris for composting, you know, despite the benefits of leaving these waggons in Tuam overnight to help dissipate the smell.