Anything in the pipeline to prevent shoppers crossing the border?

Bottle_of_Smoke

So last year retailers took a massive hit due to many people shopping up north.

Cheaper cost of living, lower vat rate and weak sterling brought people up. I think the weak sterling was the main factor - At time of posting one euro equals 89p.

Last year Lenihan admitted he made a mistake on vat which cost the economy millions.

Anyone heard if they're goign to do anything to keep shoppers in the 26 counties this year? Or any ideas for things they should do?

Hootanany

This Crowd expect vat to come down half percent so they can still live like royalty :mad:

givyjoe81

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

So last year retailers took a massive hit due to many people shopping up north.

Cheaper cost of living, lower vat rate and weak sterling brought people up. I think the weak sterling was the main factor - At time of posting one euro equals 89p.

Last year Lenihan admitted he made a mistake on vat which cost the economy millions.

Anyone heard if they're goign to do anything to keep shoppers in the 26 counties this year? Or any ideas for things they should do?

I would be very cautious due to your phrasing of the thread, i.e. 'prevent', The government shouldnt even dare think about 'preventing' (nor are they entitled to, EU-Free market) us from going up North, they should be incentivising us not too, as should retailers down here. Im sure that's what you meant (although you do say 'keep' us here too?!)

What about lowering the Vat rate for Christmas to the same as UK.

leddpipe

givyjoe81 wrote: »

What about lowering the Vat rate for Christmas to the same as UK.

I thought thats what the (their) plan was!?

crossmolinalad

more wage cuts
more sw cuts
more taxes to pay
more more more from everything

so more people to the north

murphaph

givyjoe81 wrote: »

What about lowering the Vat rate for Christmas to the same as UK.

A VAT rate is for the entire financial year, not just for christmas.

mikemac

"Random" checkpoints just inside the border
Just random checks but will cause hours of delays.

Now if I were a senior civil servant it's something that could be done.

gurramok

As far as I know, there is no VAT rate on food so no gain there. Lets face it, the pimary mover of shopping up there is the booze which leads to all the other bargains that can be obtained.

Also, we had Tesco's change for good campaign here which slowed the exodus a bit but sadly they u-turned and put prices up again so the exodus will resume unless retailers cop the feck on we're not stupid.

I plan to get a few 1L bottles of the Irish made product Baileys. Retailing for about 28quid here or a lucky 26quid in a special offer, its usually 11quid Stg in Asda/Sainburys/Tesco or 10quid in a northern special offer.

Now, where is the incentive for me to buy Baileys here? (Multiply that for whiskey/Vodka..any spirit and of course beer & cider)

Why don't they lower the taxes & excise on alcohol considering southern shoppers form a huge % of the Northern off trade?

If they cut the taxes & excise to be competitive, so what if we buy more? I'm not gonna drink more in a session, i'm a responsible drinker so it will have no affect on the majority of us that are responsible with alcohol so no justification for the high taxes & excise there.

DublinWriter

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Anyone heard if they're goign to do anything to keep shoppers in the 26 counties this year? Or any ideas for things they should do?

There's nothing they can do - it's called the EU baby!

mikemac

gurramok wrote: »

As far as I know, there is no VAT rate on food so no gain there. Lets face it, the pimary mover of shopping up there is the booze which leads to all the other bargains that can be obtained.

Entirely correct sir.
Booze is a major factor though not the only one.
Baby products like nappies in ROI attract VAT so if you're close to border you'd be mad to buy baby products here

gurramok wrote: »

Also, we had Tesco's change for good campaign here which slowed the exodus a bit but sadly they u-turned and put prices up again so the exodus will resume unless retailers cop the feck on we're not stupid.

Yep, as an example, in 2008 Tesco Kick (basically Red Bull) was 89c. They kicked it up to 99c and in early 2009 it was 1.27. Pre-Euro, £1 was €1.27.
Went to 99c in their change for good campaign a few months back and now it's €1.05, a 6% increase

6% increase in a recession?
In summary, Tesco's campaign is pure spin

Bottle_of_Smoke

givyjoe81 wrote: »

I would be very cautious due to your phrasing of the thread, i.e. 'prevent', The government shouldnt even dare think about 'preventing' (nor are they entitled to, EU-Free market) us from going up North, they should be incentivising us not too, as should retailers down here. Im sure that's what you meant (although you do say 'keep' us here too?!)

What about lowering the Vat rate for Christmas to the same as UK.

DublinWriter wrote:

There's nothing they can do - it's called the EU baby!

Ok I have a feeling you guys knew what I meant but just to clarify -
Yes, by "prevent" I meant incentivising shoppers to buy stuff in the 26 counties.

Good suggestions from Gurramok about alcohol. However I think there's other areas like electronics which could be motive alone. I saved the equivelent of approx €60 on a sony mp3 player last year - €220 in dublin, £140 in the UK.

So even if we got the booze down to the same level people would go up for offers like the above and while there get cheaper clothes etc as well.

Absurdum

mikemac wrote: »

Yep, as an example, in 2008 Tesco Kick (basically Red Bull) was 89c. They kicked it up to 99c and in early 2009 it was 1.27. Pre-Euro, £1 was €1.27.
Went to 99c in their change for good campaign a few months back and now it's €1.05, a 6% increase

6% increase in a recession?
In summary, Tesco's campaign is pure spin

another example: 500g bag of Tesco Fusili Pasta was 99c, went down to 49c, now back up to 99c

Bottle_of_Smoke

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Last year Lenihan admitted he made a mistake on vat which cost the economy millions.

Anyone heard if they're goign to do anything to keep shoppers in the 26 counties this year?

Probably going to do bugger all to be honest and just drive even more up north.

cavedave

They could build some sort of wall? The germans could advise us on how.

Kered75

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Anyone heard if they're goign to do anything to keep shoppers in the 26 counties this year? Or any ideas for things they should do?

Wait until they bring in a carbon tax this budget,fuel will be cheaper in the North too.

_Kooli_

crossmolinalad wrote: »

more wage cuts
more sw cuts
more taxes to pay
more more more from everything

so more people to the north

Increase any taxes and im off up the North for my Prezzies, booze, fags and a new LCD TV. For every € my taxes increase thats a € i have to save somewhere - the North.
Ive also thrown a few thousand into a UK banks account that i changed at 91p just to cover me for next years shopping too. Shopping trips up North will save me the few % interest im losing out on

Even food with no VAT is way cheaper up North too.
And with a carbon tax on Petrol, i'll be filling up North of the border too.

And any public servants ive spoken too feel the same - more so even. So they are off up North anyway since they are definitely going to be down in their pay packets.

If the shops quit this fake sale BS that they have going on and had proper sales maybe people might shop here.

Harpic

I'm not sure that the bozos in Government have a clue what to do.
It is estimated over 500 million has been lost to the economy this year.
They should have done something drastic at the time but it is too late now for Christmas.
I dont have a lot of sympathy anymore for the retailers in the South but I do feel sorry for their employees.

I reckon he will reduce VAT in the Budget??

irish_bob

while the benefits of heading north are clear for all to see , the drawbacks are more hidden , what you gain in savings , you loose out in some other form , not one job will be created or saved by shopping up north , state revenue will be lost which will result in reduced available public spending and thus further tax hikes will be nesscery , personally , unless i was facing ruin , i would not shop up north , retailers down here simply cannot compete with the north and the reasons are much greater than the present currency exchange , the local authority charges for business has actually increased in the past year , add to that the fact that we have the 2nd highest electricity costs in europe and southern retailers really have not a chance

we need to get rates down which will mean cutting civil servant wages
we need to get electricity costs down which will also mean cutting public servant ( ESB staff ) wages
we need to lower vat

doc_17

We're doomed!!!! Finna Fail haven't a clue. Twice in 20 years they've led us to financial catastrophe and still the fools that we are keep them in power! Maybe we should send them north and prevent them from coming back! As someone else said if they increase petrol/diesel in the budget then people will fill their cars up north when they do their weekly shopping, further weakening the tax take. The councils need to cut rates, the regulator needs to cut energy prices, the people need to speak out and the government need to get out and give us a government that can get things done.

MysticalRain

Sweet FA is the short answer. This is the same government that told us all to be "good Europeans" and vote for the Lisbon Treaty. They can't complain now when we embrace all those EU values of open markets and free movement of labour and goods.

skearon

crossmolinalad wrote: »

more wage cuts
more sw cuts
more taxes to pay
more more more from everything

so more people to the north

Apart from the carbon tax, he has stated there will be no new taxes.

More people going up North means less jobs, means less taxes and therefore less money for welfare and public pay.

If you have an ounce of patriotism, then shop in your own state, and assist in our Country's economic recovery.

The UK Government has admiited cutting their VAT rate was a mistake as the saving was not passed onto the consumer and is returning to 17.5% from January 1st.

mikemac

irish_bob wrote: »

while the benefits of heading north are clear for all to see ,

Eh, if you're in Kerry or Cork or tbh most of Munster, the benefits are not clear to see.
Not if you're spending €50 to €60 on fuel and you have interest in cheap booze or baby products.
You can't buy a few hours of your life back

skearon

skearon wrote: »

If you have an ounce of patriotism, then shop in your own state, and assist in our Country's economic recovery.

My patriotism is to my family first, the government are certainly not showing any patriotism to the thousands of Irish families trying to make ends meet.

Maybe if I had a job and it wasn't so expensive here I like many others would be able to shop here in the south, but for now I'm sticking with doing all my shopping up north as that's what I can afford and the savings I make help pay the bills.

Absurdum

Town and city chambers of commerce need to get together and come up with some meaningful proposals if they are to encourage shoppers to stay in the 26 counties. Reduced or free parking in town centres, special bus and train services (free or reduced prices) to take shoppers into towns or shopping centres, invest in Christmas lights/displays etc. to give a real Christmas feel! Most importantly they need retailers to make meaningful price reductions across the board, and get that message out. Maybe that means having to take a hit on their margins, or to push their suppliers but it's the only way. Too many of them are still living in 2005.

_Kooli_

skearon wrote: »

Apart from the carbon tax, he has stated there will be no new taxes.

More people going up North means less jobs, means less taxes and therefore less money for welfare and public pay.

If you have an ounce of patriotism, then shop in your own state, and assist in our Country's economic recovery.

The UK Government has admiited cutting their VAT rate was a mistake as the saving was not passed onto the consumer and is returning to 17.5% from January 1st.

Im not a patriot. Im a tax payer. Patriotism works both ways tbh. And i dont see any coming our way from the government.

Lets not forget that public sector workers and their families can shop up North too. So tax them and they will make the biggest group going up after the budget. Then next year it will be tax on the rest of us too.

We're even thinking of leaving the country for good at this point, never mind just shopping up north.

And as a previous poster has mentioned about overtime. We've given up doing overtime now too. Not worth it at the current tax rates. Rather have the time off. FF lose their half of it too.

skearon

hellboy99 wrote: »

My patriotism is to my family first, the government are certainly not showing any patriotism to the thousands of Irish families trying to make ends meet.

Maybe if I had a job and it wasn't so expensive here I like many others would be able to shop here in the south, but for now I'm sticking with doing all my shopping up north as that's what I can afford and the savings I make help pay the bills.

So put your family first, put your country first, and spend your money in your state.

Every euro lost to the UK, is one Euro lost of the State to pay for the services and/or welfare for 'the thousands of Irish familes trying to make ends meet.', not the mention the lost retail jobs in the South.

Open you eyes and see the big picture, prices are higher here because of excessive profits and highers costs. If you see something cheaper in the UK, they use that to bargin with a local retailer.

Absurdum

I'd also like to add that we need to investigate what and why costs are so much higher here for businesses - if indeed they are. I feel that a VAT reduction may not be passed on to the consumer in full; but the "feelgood factor" of it would make it worthwhile.

dresden8

Absurdum wrote: »

I feel that a VAT reduction may not be passed on to the consumer in full; but the "feelgood factor" of it would make it worthwhile.

McCreevy already cut vat and the thieving gits kept the difference. Vat subsequently returned to it's previous level.

Irish consumers have been taking a reaming from retailers down here for years and have now woken up.

skearon

mikemac wrote: »

41% tax
2% health levey
% not sure what PRSI is (and I'll be called a scrounger on boards if I ever go on the dole!)
1% income levy

Yep, that's almost half my overtime, but wait there is more

Foreign resident landlord so 20% deducted for tax
Employer pays for my cycle scheme so more tax (though possibly a tax saving)
Benefit in kind tax is paid
21% on everything I buy

And yet this isn't enough???
That is easily close to half my salary that is paying over 50% tax.

I'm sorry, not sure what more I can do

And if people continue to spend their Euros outside the state, more people will lose their jobs

Likewise, the more money spent within the State, the more likely you and others will still be in employment.

Cause and effect...

_Kooli_

skearon wrote: »

And if people continue to spend their Euros outside the state, more people will lose their jobs

Likewise, the more money spent within the State, the more likely you and others will still be in employment.

Cause and effect...

Your p!ssing into low cost northerly wind. Cause and effect.

skearon

_Kooli_ wrote: »

Your p!ssing into low cost northerly wind. Cause and effect.

No, I'm articulating sensible ideas to protect our children's future.

old boy

the goverment will try to use nationalistic bull schite, coughlan and lenihan will try to appeal to our sense of irishness, do not cross the BORDER, spend your money, where it can keep us finna failures in pensions and our buddys the bankers and developers, in muna,
yeah right ted.

gurramok

skearon wrote: »

And if people continue to spend their Euros outside the state, more people will lose their jobs

Likewise, the more money spent within the State, the more likely you and others will still be in employment.

Cause and effect...

Give me the money to afford the prices down here as I certainly don't have it!:D

skearon

old boy wrote: »

the goverment will try to use nationalistic bull schite, coughlan and lenihan will try to appeal to our sense of irishness, do not cross the BORDER, spend your money, where it can keep us finna failures in pensions and our buddys the bankers and developers, in muna,
yeah right ted.

It's not bull, its plain simple economics.

We are borrowing €500m a week to just balance the books, that's another fact.

skearon

skearon wrote: »

So put your family first, put your country first, and spend your money in your state.

I am putting my family first and that's why I go up north, otherwise it would be bread and jam on the table every week, and bills not getting paid.

skearon wrote: »

Open you eyes and see the big picture, prices are higher here because of excessive profits and highers costs. If you see something cheaper in the UK, they use that to bargin with a local retailer.

I "opened my eyes this time last year" and now shop up north, have you tried to bargin with any of your local retailers, it sure as hell doesn't work where I live :rolleyes:

It's our government that need to be patriotic to the Irish people first and foremost, they drove even more up north by highering VAT at a time when it should of been lowered and then the minister said it was a mistake but what did he do, nothing. The only thing this current government are good at is screwing this country up, and you can bank on them making things even worse with the coming budget.

skearon

hellboy99 wrote: »

I "opened my eyes this time last year" and now shop up north, have you tried to bargin with any of your local retailers, it sure as hell doesn't work where I live :rolleyes:

Don't know what planet you're living in then, as retailers are most certainly prepared to bargain.

hellboy99 wrote: »

It's our government that need to be patriotic to the Irish people first and foremost, they drove even more up north by highering VAT at a time when it should of been lowered and then the minister said it was a mistake but what did he do, nothing. The only thing this current government are good at is screwing this country up, and you can bank on them making things even worse with the coming budget.

Are you seriously suggesting a mere 0.5% change in VAT (21 to 21.5%) 'drove' people up North?

When VAT was reduced here previously from 21 to 20% the evidence showed prices did not decrease, likewise the UK have admitted their reduction of VAT to 15% has been a failure and it is reverting to 17.5% on January 1st.

In the budget the Government will do precisely what needs to be done to ensure the economy recovers from the worldwide recession. Short term pain, for long term gain.

The only people 'screwing' their country are those who are too short sighted to see the damage they are doing by not spending their hard earned euros in their own state.

miftha

Simple answer, NO.

It is not going to change until we get real down here at all levels. I hear the government crap that it is due to the exchange rate being so good, absolute rubbish!!!! Even when it was .69 to € I always made huge savings up north (cover petrol + toll and still make a huge saving - full car, even back seat). The reality is the taxes/excise on alcohol down south are way too high, highest in Europe, the base price of many products is far cheaper in the north (toiletries just one example), they give far better deals (2 for 1), so as I said currency difference is a false argument, it only makes it even better

Prices are higher down south due to profiteering, rates and government taxes/duties/VAT. Thus it is up to the government to reduce the second two, and it is up to us to stop the first one. How do we stop the first one, shop elsewhere - no business will make them reduce prices and pressurise the government to reduce rates/taxes! Shop up north or online for example, as are Mary Horney said.... 'shop around'. Government also fails to realise the PRF is also having an effect on where people by electronics, why will I buy a TV here when it is more expensive and if I buy it outside the state I do not pay an extra €8 for the privilege.

My position as a tax payer, as they government have failed miserable to do, it get value for my money. It is not to be PATRIOTIC!!! I am not going to cut off my nose despite my face for this BS, at the end of the day where I spend my money is my business and that will never change. My family obligation is to balance the books, spend less than I earn - unlike the government who spend more than they earn (and don't get me started on the unions who are so up their own self interested behinds).

Dannyboy83

mikemac wrote: »

Eh, if you're in Kerry or Cork or tbh most of Munster, the benefits are not clear to see.
Not if you're spending €50 to €60 on fuel and you have interest in cheap booze or baby products.
You can't buy a few hours of your life back

Yes, the alternative for those of us in Cork, Kerry, Munster is just to not spend.;)

I'll be buying a small present for my partner, parents, and my brother as its his birthday.
I already told most of the rest of my family and friends not to buy me anything cause I won't be buying for them, given the circumstances.
Far from embarrassed, everybody I said that to was relieved tbh:).

I don't plan on having any headaches or worries to start off 2010, and clearly plenty of other people feel the same.

irish_bob

mikemac wrote: »

Da Da dam, not my problem!
If local authorities have no money maybe they should they should stop sending councillors and their husbands/wifes to Boston/New York or wherever else for "fact-finding" missions over St Patrick's weekend
In fact, why are councillors taking their spouses on foreign trips at rate payers expense??? Surely they should pay themselves!

I'm nowhere near the border, the cost in fuel to get from North Tipp to Enniskillen woud nullify any savings really.

But I do pay 41% tax plus levies plus BIK plus PRSI so don't fecking me tell guilty for shopping in the EU!
Ever hear of diminishing returns? Charge excessive taxation and people won't bother working overtime. I have and my teammates, what's the point in paying 55% tax for your overtime, no point at all!

i wasnt for a second defending local authorites , i was trying to explain the predicament facing businees in ireland when it comes to increased rates , vat , minimum wage being far higher than in the north , energy costs etc , untill state costs come down , it is impossible for retailers in the south to compete with those in the north unless they actually decide to loose money on sales

anyone who shops north has less entitlement to complain about the state of the country as far as im concerned , by all means , hammer the politicans but dont give your money to the queen of englands goverment , she wont build any roads or hospitals for us

skearon

skearon wrote: »

Don't know what planet you're living in then, as retailers are most certainly perfared to bargain.

Well not here.

Mate of mine went looking for a TV a few weeks back, Curry's was the cheapest out of all the shops in the town with not one other retailer willing to match the price. As we're only 15 minutes from Newry and a price difference of just over €100 between Curry's price here in the south to Curry's in Newry he asked would they lower or match the price, he got told no to both, so he went up north :rolleyes:

mikemac

Understood Irish_Bob I went off on a bit of a rant about my local councillors who seems to have no issue heading off to Boston every March 17th. Oh but it's a working trip but yet, the rate payers pay for their wife/husband 0oto go to.

Maybe your councillors do the same.

I don't blast TD's on boards as I reckon the majority of corruption is done by councillors

But apologies if I've gone offtopic.
And having lived in Belfast on £56 Job seekers and £42 rent allowance and I still lived very comfortably.
Everything was so much cheaper

PCPhoto

irish_bob wrote: »

i wasnt for a second defending local authorites , i was trying to explain the predicament facing businees in ireland when it comes to increased rates , vat , minimum wage being far higher than in the north , energy costs etc , untill state costs come down , it is impossible for retailers in the south to compete with those in the north unless they actually decide to loose money on sales

anyone who shops north has less entitlement to complain about the state of the country as far as im concerned , by all means , hammer the politicans but dont give your money to the queen of englands goverment , she wont build any roads or hospitals for us

Horsesh1t !!! .... I havent shopped up north (YET) but have bought plenty of things online as I find it a lot cheaper.....several thousand cheaper !!

example: a Canon camera due to be released in December (Canon 1D mkIV)......up north price is £3699-£4000 (+VAT) .... in a Dublin shop SAME CAMERA €4999 (+VAT) ...online price is between €4000-€4500.

Wasnt Mary Harney whinging a few years ago telling people to "Shop around"....and when they did (and discovered cheaper prices outside of the state).... herself and the Government called for patriotism !!!

eddiehobbs

Im amazed how uninformed many people seem to be on this forum. There seems to be a misguided perception that retailers are still creaming it. Speaking as someone who works in retail (grocery) ive seen prices, margins take a hammering, seen paycuts and colleagues lose their jobs. I do most of my shopping where i work because at the end of the day they pay my wages. I would never dream of going up north to do my shopping.

In response to the OP i reckon the goverment should look at reducing the vat rate to the english level, look at the level of excise duty, lowering the minimum wage and also rates. Weakness of sterling is a huge factor also but unfortunatly that is beyond our control. Unfortunatly ireland has priced itself out of competitiveness and it is only with a big and painfull adjustment downwards that we can start to get back on track.

mikemac

eddiehobbs wrote: »

In response to the OP i reckon the goverment should look at reducing the vat rate to the english level,

When Charlie McCreevy was around, Vat was reduced to 21% to 20%.
And yet, consumers saw no savings.

So the government who have access to all the figures after all had to reintroduce the 21% rate.

You're calling for a 15% rate, well realy imo the retailers would keep that extra margin for themselves.
I'm only going on past records here

Taxipete29

eddiehobbs wrote: »

Im amazed how uninformed many people seem to be on this forum. There seems to be a misguided perception that retailers are still creaming it. Speaking as someone who works in retail (grocery) ive seen prices, margins take a hammering, seen paycuts and colleagues lose their jobs. I do most of my shopping where i work because at the end of the day they pay my wages. I would never dream of going up north to do my shopping.

In response to the OP i reckon the goverment should look at reducing the vat rate to the english level, look at the level of excise duty, lowering the minimum wage and also rates. Weakness of sterling is a huge factor also but unfortunatly that is beyond our control. Unfortunatly ireland has priced itself out of competitiveness and it is only with a big and painfull adjustment downwards that we can start to get back on track.

The exchange rate is a red herring. Its been cheaper to go up North for years. I have gone up when it was .70 and it was still far cheaper.

The fact is irish retailers have been creaming it for years and are now looking for patriotism. Where was the patriotism when they were charging astronomical prices during the boom times. Get real. Times are tough and people need to do the best for their family and if that means spending money up north then so be it.

Lest it not be forgotten that most of the Election posters for the council and European elections were printed up North. "Do as I say dont do as I do" imo

PCPhoto

eddiehobbs wrote: »

Im amazed how uninformed many people seem to be on this forum. There seems to be a misguided perception that retailers are still creaming it. Speaking as someone who works in retail (grocery) ive seen prices, margins take a hammering, seen paycuts and colleagues lose their jobs. I do most of my shopping where i work because at the end of the day they pay my wages. I would never dream of going up north to do my shopping.

In response to the OP i reckon the goverment should look at reducing the vat rate to the english level, look at the level of excise duty, lowering the minimum wage and also rates. Weakness of sterling is a huge factor also but unfortunatly that is beyond our control. Unfortunatly ireland has priced itself out of competitiveness and it is only with a big and painfull adjustment downwards that we can start to get back on track.

its not ill informed people - we all understand and know that many retailers are feeling the pinch and I think I speak for EVERYONE (except the few that keep telling us to be patriotic and protect jobs for our kids etc etc)...its the Government that are forcing prices to be high, but we have a system in this country which needs reform.

IN GENERAL - manufacturers sell only to wholesellers, wholesellers sell to retailers and retailers sell to the public.....each time the seller adds their margin... and the public are at the bottom of the list - getting shafted !!

in the republic SOMEHOW the costs involved in adding a margin are significantly higher than in the North so every time something is added to cover costs .... the price is significantly increased.

if the Government lowered VAT - theres no guarantee the retailers will pass it on - actually you can almost be guaranteed that they would and could rightfully argue they couldnt pass on the savings directly as they would have purchased at the higher rate and would need to recoup that....same way petrol stations up the prices on budget day (to maximise profits)

eddiehobbs

mikemac wrote: »

When Charlie McCreevy was around, Vat was reduced to 21% to 20%.
And yet, consumers saw no savings.

So the government who have access to all the figures after all had to reintroduce the 21% rate.

You're calling for a 15% rate, well realy imo the retailers would keep that extra margin for themselves.
I'm only going on past records here

True, but we're living in a different ireland now, in the current economic climate i dont think any retailer could afford not to pass on those savings to the consumer.

Taxipete29

eddiehobbs wrote: »

True, but we're living in a different ireland now, in the current economic climate i dont think any retailer could afford not to pass on those savings to the consumer.

Well considering many publicans didnt pass on the reduction in the price of the Bulmers pint bottle when it was introduced I dont think Ireland has changed all that much. Still a rip off republic

Test For Echo

I don’t live too far from the border with NI. Sure ‘tis great, we’ve just recently had two major road work projects carried out (one project was on the road leading north) and, no surprises here, both projects were carried out by companies from Northern Ireland!

Patriotism my arse…

eddiehobbs

Taxipete29 wrote: »

Well considering many publicans didnt pass on the reduction in the price of the Bulmers pint bottle when it was introduced I dont think Ireland has changed all that much. Still a rip off republic

Fair comment

Dannyboy83

mikemac wrote: »

When Charlie McCreevy was around, Vat was reduced to 21% to 20%.
And yet, consumers saw no savings.

So the government who have access to all the figures after all had to reintroduce the 21% rate.

You're calling for a 15% rate, well realy imo the retailers would keep that extra margin for themselves.
I'm only going on past records here

In the past, it was lowered during a boom.
Therefore, retailers were able to disguise it.

I don't think retailers would keep it (or most of it at least) for themselves now, not in the current economic climate. There would be a few short term gains at the expense of longer term extinction.
Besides, most people are not willing to calculate a 1% difference, whereas a 6.5% difference is massively noticeable.

If the UK are raising their rates to 17.5 in January, then we should be lowering it to 15%, not only to stop business fleeing the state, but to attract business.