College View dissing Boards

Somnus · 13-10-2009 8:47pm #1

Did anyone see that article in college view about being politically correct?

I don't have the paper with me so I can't give a direct quote right now but basically the guy was saying something along the lines of "Politicians and the nearly - human members of Boards.ie are crying about things being too PC"

How dare he disgrace such a fine website in that manner!

monument · 13-10-2009 11:26pm

Dr.Poca wrote: »

Did anyone see that article in college view about being politically correct?

I don't have the paper with me so I can't give a direct quote right now but basically the guy was saying something along the lines of "Politicians and the nearly - human members of Boards.ie are crying about things being too PC"

The paragraph you're talking about is as follows:

"Nowadays everyone from politicians to barely-human members of boards.ie are crying about the onslaught of political correctness and the tragedy of how the nanny society we live in has stopped them from calling people ****** and paki."

I believe the writer is taking about barely-human members of boards.ie, and is not saying all users are such.

As the article is not online yet, here's the text in full:

Apparently I'm a PC Fascist
Sean McTiernan

I know, right? Another article about political correctness. Another opinionated student using poor prose to blow the minds of all those old timers who think it's ok to be the mind police.

Yeah, that sounds excruciating to me too. Well this isn't going to be that. I'm actually in favour of political correctness. Sort of. As with most arguments like this both sides tactics and rhetoric are equally lame and laughable.

If you make a joke and feel the need to mock Asian people or some other group of non-straight white males, you can just fob your detractors off with the claim that "political correctness is out of control!" Similarly, if anyone goes any way to offend a group of which you are a member even if it is a tangential and not even really that offensive way you can slather them with the racist glue and stick them to a cross.

Nowadays everyone from politicians to barely-human members of boards.ie are crying about the onslaught of political correctness and the tragedy of how the nanny society we live in has stopped them from calling people ****** and paki.

How will free speech recover? What political correctness is, in essence, is being fair to everyone.

It's protecting those that are unfairly marginalized and it is to stop people all being tarred with one brush or reduced to a single stereotype.
I doubt anyone would disagree that this is a noble goal and one everyone should do their best to uphold. Where PC goes wrong though, and where it earns itself the reputation that allows barely-comedic windbags like Roy Chubby Brown and Jeff Dunham to claim it is out of control, is how people think it should be implemented. It is the mere mention of the words that people seem to freak out at.

Most of the PC warriors of old, Mary Whitehouse etc, wanted all implications of the existence of sex stricken from the public media (the interesting shift from concern with sexual taboos to concern with racial taboos between generations is another flaw in the rigid rules of political correctness).

What political correctness should consist of is an intelligent assessment of any contentious remark in the context in which it was spoken. Of course, it's not like either side would want this shift to occur. It is better for both left and right if political correctness remains a senseless all-purpose-battering ram, ending careers and creating hours of pointless debate.

I have mentioned several times in this article comedians that use political correctness and how mad it has become as an excuse for their use of “taboo” words to mask their tired premises and decade old jokes.
There is one comedian though who is not only not doing this, but is actively campaigning for a re-evaluation of political correctness. And when I say campaigning I don't mean wearing horrible t-shirts and mugging on Richard and Judy - this comedian manages to make his point with funny jokes.

Stewart Lee, stalwart of the last two decades of British comedy, is this comedian. His well-made and well-thought out ideas on the matter were one of the main inspirations for my thinking on this subject.

If more funny people and public figures expanded their ideas and thinking instead of hiding behind hoary old cliches then maybe we could advance instead of having a large section of society fighting against what is really, at its worst, institutionalised politeness.

Dr.Poca wrote: »

How dare he disgrace such a fine website in that manner!

Hear, hear!

And that comment editor should be... oh, no, wait...

GLaDOS · 13-10-2009 11:26pm

Somebody got banned

Somnus · 15-10-2009 10:02am

monument wrote: »

I believe the writer is taking about barely-human members of boards.ie, and is not saying all users are such.

Yeah you're probably right, although it comes across in a more general way I thought :P

phasers · 15-10-2009 11:39am

Barely human? Hmmph.

The College View is trash anyway

robby^5 · 15-10-2009 5:44pm

This isn't an article, it's a rant... or barely-an-article.

15-10-2009 9:28pm

How come this was put up here before the paper was out?

GLaDOS · 15-10-2009 10:04pm

Deleted User wrote: »

How come this was put up here before the paper was out?

The papers were left in the science building the evening before the date on the paper, was 'bout 4 (I was with the OP)

monument · 16-10-2009 6:46pm

robby^5 wrote: »

This isn't an article, it's a rant... or barely-an-article.

Why is that? I mean, what exactly do you thing is wrong with it and how does it compare to what you'd find in the adverage comment section?

phasers wrote: »

Barely human? Hmmph.

Did you read my last post?

phasers wrote: »

The College View is trash anyway

Trash? Do you want to qualfy that in any way? Otherwise it sounds like trash talk.

phasers · 16-10-2009 7:17pm

monument wrote: »

Trash? Do you want to qualfy that in any way? Otherwise it sounds like trash talk.

I think it's trash because the articles are poorly written and the only place it's of any value is at the bottom of my budgie's cage.

Obviously you're associated with the College View and you will disagree, which is fine, but as you can see my post was thanked 4 times, so obviously people agree with me.

dead-bob · 16-10-2009 7:27pm

phasers wrote: »

so obviously people agree with me.

Have to agree with him there, I wasn't sure before but when over three people on the internet put their weight behind his claims it sealed the deal for me.

I don't agree with the article at all, all PC is anathema to expression especially journalism, but I don't see how it was particularly poorly written.

Somnus · 16-10-2009 7:33pm

phasers wrote: »

I think it's trash because the articles are poorly written and the only place it's of any value is at the bottom of my budgie's cage.

Obviously you're associated with the College View and you will disagree, which is fine, but as you can see my post was thanked 4 times, so obviously people agree with me.

I think that's being a bit harsh. I mean I don't think all the articles are particularly badly written. I don't usually read it but when I have they seem ok. I mean keep in mind that a lot of them are probably written by students in their first and second years. It's a good opportunity for people doing Journalism to get some experience writing for a paper of any kind.

phasers · 16-10-2009 7:41pm

Dr.Poca wrote: »

I think that's being a bit harsh. I mean I don't think all the articles are particularly badly written. I don't usually read it but when I have they seem ok. I mean keep in mind that a lot of them are probably written by students in their first and second years. It's a good opportunity for people doing Journalism to get some experience writing for a paper of any kind.

You're right, I was a bit mean tbh. Sorry bout that monument, long day.

What I should have said is I don't enjoy it personally, but I honestly do think it's great to have a realistic enough outlet for Journalism students

mark renton · 16-10-2009 7:52pm

Dr.Poca wrote: »

Did anyone see that article in college view about being politically correct?

I don't have the paper with me so I can't give a direct quote right now but basically the guy was saying something along the lines of "Politicians and the nearly - human members of Boards.ie are crying about things being too PC"

How dare he disgrace such a fine website in that manner!

Actually reality check - ive been banned for daring to say that dentists charge too much on the dental forum and received numerous infractions on the Christianity forum for daring to mention taht if Jesus returned and wanted to prove himself a miracle worker then he could compile a crack for Nagra3

PC ?? ffs its almost censorship or dictatorship at times

dead-bob · 16-10-2009 10:42pm

john47832 wrote: »

Actually reality check - ive been banned for daring to say that dentists charge too much on the dental forum and received numerous infractions on the Christianity forum for daring to mention taht if Jesus returned and wanted to prove himself a miracle worker then he could compile a crack for Nagra3

PC ?? ffs its almost censorship or dictatorship at times

I don't think he was saying boards.ie is too PC, he was saying people on boards.ie members use it to complain about the world at large.

I don't really read the college view but I don't understand why people **** on it so much.

Nanaki · 19-10-2009 1:31am

I don't believe I've ever read every word in the college view, cover to cover, but that article in particular was not well written.
I'll not tar the whole paper with the one brush.
If the author was targeting only the barely human members then "the barely..." would have specified such
(as oppposed to "barely..." which implies all members of boards.ie are barely human)

Something tells me, however, that Mr McTiernan wasn't quite aware of such a subtlety.

GLaDOS · 19-10-2009 3:00am

Nanaki wrote: »

I don't believe I've ever read every word in the college view, cover to cover, but that article in particular was not well written.
I'll not tar the whole paper with the one brush.
If the author was targeting only the barely human members then "the barely..." would have specified such
(as oppposed to "barely..." which implies all members of boards.ie are barely human)

Something tells me, however, that Mr McTiernan wasn't quite aware of such a subtlety.

I quite like College View (one of the few it seems..) but yeah, that article was very poor.

Shea O'Meara · 20-10-2009 6:37pm

The College View is a great concept. We should allow people to learn as they go, especially in a student paper*. However, the College View, like most young writers, can seem pretentious. This is generally in all innocence an attempt to write at a higher level, but failing. So in closing, the College View is needed and well worth while, but can be a tad up it's own arse.

*The opener for the journalistic ploy of attempting to endear oneself to the reader to facilitate and ease the readers acceptance of the criticism to follow.

:| · 20-10-2009 10:06pm

I like The College View too, much better than the excuse for a magazine that is Campus, "The o-fish-al publication" or whatever the hell is written on the front of it

Shea O'Meara · 21-10-2009 6:36pm

Ah, it's not meant to be a real magazine publication. It's an SU newsletter with a little glitter;)

Urizen · 21-10-2009 9:37pm

If I wanted to read what a first year Journalism student thinks of NAMA...

Wait, I DON'T. I buy a real paper for a reason. The College View 'news' should relate to DCU. And while I have good friends on the staff, I still think it's too much recycling what other papers say and repackaging it with an amateur spin. Which, let's face it, is not exactly a selling point.

As for Campus, it has gone downhill. However, I have noticed several of you have simply declared a vendetta against the magazine. And instead support the CV. Which is, in most cases, all it's used for: CV padding.

I have serious doubt that, even if massive changes to Campus were brought in, those opinions would change.

However, I'm still intrigued. Who wrote this particular article?

aDeener · 24-10-2009 9:07pm

The quality of the material in the college view increases substantially with every wipe of my arse

:| · 24-10-2009 9:59pm

Urizen wrote: »

If I wanted to read what a first year Journalism student thinks of NAMA...

Wait, I DON'T. I buy a real paper for a reason. The College View 'news' should relate to DCU. And while I have good friends on the staff, I still think it's too much recycling what other papers say and repackaging it with an amateur spin. Which, let's face it, is not exactly a selling point.

As for Campus, it has gone downhill. However, I have noticed several of you have simply declared a vendetta against the magazine. And instead support the CV. Which is, in most cases, all it's used for: CV padding.

I have serious doubt that, even if massive changes to Campus were brought in, those opinions would change.

However, I'm still intrigued. Who wrote this particular article?

Not true, I honestly think the college view is pretty good, much better than it was two years ago. And I honestly think Campus is unbelievably bad, much worse than it was two years ago. I think I actually defended it sometime in the past saying it wasn't that bad but this year....it really is. Campus be learning you....wtf?

Urizen · 24-10-2009 10:28pm

wrote: »

I honestly think the college view is pretty good, much better than it was two years ago. And I honestly think Campus is unbelievably bad, much worse than it was two years ago.

I don't disagree, Campus has gone downhill and CV has improved. Just not to the extents being claimed.

Shea O'Meara · 26-10-2009 4:57pm

I think the person responsible for writing 'Dear Mammy' should return to writing short stories for the elderly...actually, I must apologize to the elderly, this treacle tripe is too Ireland's Own even for them. It's like a Daniel O’Donnell segue from his forthcoming concept album, 'A slice a cake with the Mammy.'
Seriously, have some pride, self respect, concern for how your mag (Campus) is viewed and stop this syrup now!
Was this the brain child of someone who may be an avid fan of 'last of the Summer wine'? Which you probably think is a little too racy.
You suck!

g5fd6ow0hseima · 26-10-2009 5:15pm

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

Ah, it's not meant to be a real magazine publication. It's an SU newsletter with a little glitter;)

I always thought that style soc and dramasoc co-produced campus mag....

Shea O'Meara · 26-10-2009 5:52pm

It's the SU's publication. It use to be soley edited by the SU with contributions from class reps and students who fancied writing an article. Then it had a make over where an Editor was hired and an effort was made to turn it into Just Seventeen. I'd consider it very confused at the moment.

PixyChick · 26-10-2009 6:18pm

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

It's the SU's publication. It use to be soley edited by the SU with contributions from class reps and students who fancied writing an article. Then it had a make over where an Editor was hired and an effort was made to turn it into Just Seventeen. I'd consider it very confused at the moment.

That rag is run by the student union!!! I pay for that car crash of design? Seriously, it's woeful. Loads of spelling mistakes, and obvious injokes, which origins are now clear - the SU.

How much money do we waste on hiring this person for each edition? I cannot believe we actually pay for that. Who hires this person? Im a first year, so I don't know about previous editions, but from asking around the person is hired by interview. Is the person just a friend of the SU or is there an independent panel of interviewers. Either way they need a good smack for hiring this person. The design is just horrible, the pictures are off the same people all the time, there is no thought gone into most of the articles....unless they are student contributions.... its just a total embarrassment!

DCU is not a design college, and it clearly shows from that magazine. Would the Union not just hire someone on retainer, I know loads of designers who would kill to do something like that in the current economic climate, and would do a far better design job than that. The design appeals to a very very small community of students, as a SU publication it should appeal to the masses.

And while I think of it, what is with the attitude of those who hand it out!!!??? They shove it in your face, and give out to you when you don't take it, or if you flash a copy that you have, they ask you to take two, or three!!!

Seriously!!!

Cy_Revenant · 29-10-2009 2:45am

PixyChick wrote: »

the pictures are off the same people all the time,

That can't be helped by them. The pictures are submitted by students, so tend to be people who are friends of those with a hobby in photography and frequently get involved in SU and Society Events.

Also, whatever anyone thinks about Campus, it's still better than its predecessor An Tarbh ever was.

Shea O'Meara · 29-10-2009 2:52pm

So it may be crappy, but the previous one was crappier?
That's all right then;)

monument · 11-11-2009 12:50am

Urizen wrote: »

If I wanted to read what a first year Journalism student thinks of NAMA...

That's great, because the main person I know of who has given their view on Nama in an article in The College View has been Tony Foley, DCU.ie describes him as "a senior lecturer and is head of the economics finance and entrepreneurship group in [the DCU Business School]."

Urizen wrote: »

Wait, I DON'T. I buy a real paper for a reason.

You buy a real paper so to "to read what a first year Journalism student thinks of NAMA"? :rolleyes:

Urizen wrote: »

The College View 'news' should relate to DCU.

I'd be quite happy to bet that the vast bulk of the news in The College View is related to DCU or general student news. Are you up for such a bet?

Urizen wrote: »

...I still think it's too much recycling what other papers say and repackaging it with an amateur spin. Which, let's face it, is not exactly a selling point.

I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say here. Your other points seem a bit confused, but I'd still love to know: What "other papers" covers DCU news and other student-related articles so closely?

Urizen wrote: »

As for Campus, it has gone downhill. However, I have noticed several of you have simply declared a vendetta against the magazine. And instead support the CV. Which is, in most cases, all it's used for: CV padding.

You on the other hand seem to be flinging mud at the CV and seeing what will stick, because your criticism seems rather flawed.

However, I'm still intrigued. Who wrote this particular article?

His name is on the article, it's even on the version I posted above. Have you really read any of the other posts on the thread?

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

...However, the College View, like most young writers, can seem pretentious. This is generally in all innocence an attempt to write at a higher level, but failing. So in closing, the College View is needed and well worth while, but can be a tad up it's own arse...

So it other words it sounds like many people here?

PixyChick wrote: »

DCU is not a design college, and it clearly shows from that magazine. Would the Union not just hire someone on retainer, I know loads of designers who would kill to do something like that in the current economic climate, and would do a far better design job than that. The design appeals to a very very small community of students, as a SU publication it should appeal to the masses.

News design (newspaper and news magazine design) is part is part of the journalism degree and those skills can be easily enough be expanded on to do general magazine design.

I guess the problem is getting somebody with the design experience who is also interested and willing to edit the SU mag, take/source images and content, and do research for the SU which is apparently part of the role. And then still design Campus to a high standard while being paid not a huge amount compared to how much designers are paid generally.

Urizen · 11-11-2009 1:14am

Well SOMEONE got defensive.

NAMA was just an example of something I don't want to hear about from a Journalism student stuck up their own hole.

In relation to the CV padding and recycling comments: Deliberately missing my point to try to discredit me? That sounds like an amateur journalist to me. You're a good advocate for them so. You know perfectly well what I was saying, and that I am right in most of it.

Twisting someone's words is an art, monument. Take the time to do it right.

monument · 11-11-2009 2:05am

Urizen wrote: »

Well SOMEONE got defensive.

I'm just fed up of your nonsense, it'd be ok if you were giving constructive criticism, but to date you've only posted an untrue example plucked out of your head.

Urizen wrote: »

NAMA was just an example of something I don't want to hear about from a Journalism student stuck up their own hole.

It'd be great if your example was based on fact rather than on fantasy.

If you want a more general reply: Most comment articles in most newspapers are written by commentators. More often than not, they are not experts. In any case, if a first year was making a point about Nama, it's no more of less valid than a point made by most professional columnists. It should be based on the merit of what they are saying not who they are (unless one is an expert). However, generally, I agree with you, I don't see much point in a first year commenting about Nama, but such has not been published so your example is not valid.

As an extension of that, I don't care who you are, I just think your point is highly flawed when you continue to use a highly flawed example. If on the other hand your point is valid, you should have practice examples rather than a fictional example.

And another general point, it's very likely -- just like in other papers -- that people won't like all comment articles. And just like with all comment sections many people will just want to skip by, and that's grand. It's only four pages, including letters and the Irish column.

Urizen wrote: »

In relation to the CV padding and recycling comments: Deliberately missing my point to try to discredit me? That sounds like an amateur journalist to me. You're a good advocate for them so. You know perfectly well what I was saying, and that I am right in most of it.

No, I was not deliberately missing your point, I was deliberately highlighting that your highly flawed example had no bases in fact to show you up. It's not me who is discrediting you, by using such an example you're doing that your self.

If you want to deal with real examples, or even general ideas of what topics this happens with in reality, that'd be helpful, but otherwise you're not dealing with reality, and you might as well be talking nonsense.

Urizen wrote: »

Twisting someone's words is an art, monument. Take the time to do it right.

I'll take your word for it.

thusspakeblixa · 11-11-2009 10:56am

I just laugh at the fact that The College View gets more stick than Campus, even when the latter engages in homophobic slurs.
It is no coincidence that the people who give out about the CV here are not Journalism students.

Urizen · 11-11-2009 10:22pm

I didn't start against the College View. I'm obviously not going to get anywhere reasoning with anyone here, you both write for the damn thing.

The DCU related news is good, and often well written. But it is a college newspaper, and in my opinion should deal more or less only with college related issues.

I've gotten carried away, so I'll reiterate: I am NOT completely and irrevocaby against the College View. It simply takes itself too seriously and, evidently, so do many of its contributors.

I would ask you both to deny that you'll put contributing to College View on your CV. I would also like you to tell me that NO ONE uses it soley for CV padding. I already know the answer to both, and you have blown everything I said far out of proportion.

In fact, this whole thread has blown out of proportion.

And blixa, there's a whole other thread discussing Campus, and that particular segment. Which I also find a terrible lapse in judgement.

monument · 12-11-2009 12:07am

Urizen wrote: »

I didn't start against the College View. I'm obviously not going to get anywhere reasoning with anyone here, you both write for the damn thing.

On boards.ie there's a general rule to play the ball and not the man.

Urizen wrote: »

The DCU related news is good, and often well written. But it is a college newspaper, and in my opinion should deal more or less only with college related issues.

The vast bulk of content does relate to college related issues.

And, yes, in this I'm including topics relating to DCU, Dublin student issues, national student issues, general third level issues which affect students, issues relating to the local community near DCU, and some international student stories.

DCU and its students after all are not living in a bubble so some issues will affect them outside the college directly. And then you'll have major issues with will affect students.

Urizen wrote: »

I've gotten carried away, so I'll reiterate: I am NOT completely and irrevocaby against the College View. It simply takes itself too seriously and, evidently, so do many of its contributors.

Good to hear you're not completely against the paper, but I'm unsure what you mean by "It takes itself too seriously" and your latter comment is just more mud slinging.

Urizen wrote: »

I would ask you both to deny that you'll put contributing to College View on your CV. I would also like you to tell me that NO ONE uses it soley for CV padding. I already know the answer to both,

You mean you don't put relevant experience in your CV?

Who are we to tell you what "NO ONE" does? We can't speak for anybody other than our selves. Is it just the newspaper you like making wide generalisations about?

Urizen wrote: »

and you have blown everything I said far out of proportion.

What exactly has been blown out of proportion?

Urizen wrote: »

In fact, this whole thread has blown out of proportion.

The whole thread has?

Urizen · 12-11-2009 1:01am

I wasn't mudslinging, nor am I naming names. I'm just saying, a few people that write for it put in **** all effort and do it just to say they did it. You probably know yourself the kind. However, I'm not insinuating you or blixa have that kind of agenda.

PixyChick · 12-11-2009 9:49am

Urizen wrote: »

I wasn't mudslinging, nor am I naming names. I'm just saying, a few people that write for it put in **** all effort and do it just to say they did it. You probably know yourself the kind. However, I'm not insinuating you or blixa have that kind of agenda.

Name names or STFU.

Urizen · 12-11-2009 1:07pm

PixyChick wrote: »

Name names or STFU.

That's a bit much there. There is a modicum of decency on this forum ya know.

Also, I have no intention of getting the ****e eaten out of me for 'defamation of character'.

Nanaki · 12-11-2009 1:58pm

wuss

irlande · 12-11-2009 9:24pm

I love how any attempt to discuss publications on campus immediately turns into the pathetic camp-argument of:

"omg campus > college view"
"no stfu college view > campus"

It's the same every year and yet both sides remain so pathetically arrogant that it actually never goes anywhere further than those two arguments.

Makes for a fun read on boards though.

adamski8 · 12-11-2009 10:18pm

irlande wrote: »

I love how any attempt to discuss publications on campus immediately turns into the pathetic camp-argument of:

"omg campus > college view"
"no stfu college view > campus"

dont forget the "college view=campus=crap" camp :P

Urizen · 12-11-2009 11:15pm

Or the pathetic descent into name calling.

MonaghanPenguin · 13-11-2009 11:02am

irlande wrote: »

I love how any attempt to discuss publications on campus immediately turns into the pathetic camp-argument of:

"omg campus > college view"
"no stfu college view > campus"

It's the same every year and yet both sides remain so pathetically arrogant that it actually never goes anywhere further than those two arguments.

Makes for a fun read on boards though.

ah god I hate when I agree with you :P

College View dissing Boards

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