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swine flu

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    #62
    ebmma
    Closed Accounts Posts: 631 ✭✭✭ebmma


    zenno wrote: »
    A mass swine flu vaccination programme in the U.S. in 1976 caused far more deaths than the disease it was designed to combat, and the Health Protection Agency watchdog has asked doctors to look out for cases of GBS when the vaccinations begin.
    There are also concerns the jab can spark cases of Guillain Barre Syndrome, which can lead to paralysis and even death

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1208716/Half-GPs-refuse-swine-flu-vaccine-testing-fears.html#ixzz0VyHHyZQC

    why would a person want to inject themselves with a vaccine that has not being fully tested, it's absolutly crazy.

    it's a FLU vaccine, that's as tested as it's gonna get.


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    #63
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    ebmma wrote: »
    it's a FLU vaccine, that's as tested as it's gonna get.

    that doesn't make sense. what is that supposed to mean ?.


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    #64
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    I can see soon how people that die from ordinary flu will be categorized as dying from swine flu. this is from sept...2007 http://archives.tcm.ie/irishpost/2007/09/05/story6226.asp


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    #65
    CathyMoran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭CathyMoran


    zenno wrote: »
    any mercury is harmful if injected into a human use common sense.

    Thimerosal was eliminated in many countries over 20 years ago due to safety concerns. In 1977, a Russian study found that adults exposed to ethylmercury, the exact form of mercury injected with thimerosal, suffered brain damage years later. Studies on thimerosal poisoning also describe tubular necrosis and nervous system injury, including obtundation, coma and death. As a result of these findings, Russia banned thimerosal from children’s vaccines in 1980. Denmark, Austria, Japan, Great Britain and all the Scandinavian countries have also banned the preservative.
    If that is the case how come Pandemix is being used in the UK in pregnant women?


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    #66
    CathyMoran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭CathyMoran


    zenno wrote: »
    I can see soon how people that die from ordinary flu will be categorized as dying from swine flu. this is from sept...2007 http://archives.tcm.ie/irishpost/2007/09/05/story6226.asp
    And what is the age profile of the deaths and how many were pregnant women etc...


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    #67
    ebmma
    Closed Accounts Posts: 631 ✭✭✭ebmma


    zenno wrote: »
    any mercury is harmful if injected into a human use common sense.

    Thimerosal was eliminated in many countries over 20 years ago due to safety concerns. In 1977, a Russian study found that adults exposed to ethylmercury, the exact form of mercury injected with thimerosal, suffered brain damage years later. Studies on thimerosal poisoning also describe tubular necrosis and nervous system injury, including obtundation, coma and death. As a result of these findings, Russia banned thimerosal from children’s vaccines in 1980. Denmark, Austria, Japan, Great Britain and all the Scandinavian countries have also banned the preservative.

    It's Thiomersal.
    If you are so intent on scaremongering, at least get what you are talking about right.


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    #68
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    CathyMoran wrote: »
    If that is the case how come Pandemix is being used in the UK in pregnant women?

    well they don't seem to be much concerned about health in the uk by the looks of it.

    pandemix...

    SIDE EFFECTS OF PANDEMRIX
    Very common (more than one in ten): headache, sore muscles and joints, fatigue, swelling and pain and redness at the injection site.
    Common (between one and ten out of hundred): enlarged lymph nodes, chills, flu-like illness, increased sweating, injection site reactions.
    Uncommon (between one and ten thousand): Insomnia, dizziness, numbness, extreme fatigue, indigestion, stomach and intestine as vomiting and nausea, itching, rash, malaise, generalized skin reactions.
    Rare (between one and ten out of ten thousand): Seizures, nerve pain, temporary shortage of blood platelets, allergic reaction.
    Very rare (less than one in ten thousand): vasculitis with transient renal involvement. Neurological disorder, Guillain-Barre syndrome, and nerve inflammation.
    Source: European Medicines Agency.


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    #69
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    ebmma wrote: »
    It's Thiomersal.
    If you are so intent on scaremongering, at least get what you are talking about right.

    i'm not scaremongering just pointing you to the facts.
    it's up to you whether you take the vaccine or not. bit i do think that more testing needs to be done thats for sure. I for one will not go near it.


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    #70
    ebmma
    Closed Accounts Posts: 631 ✭✭✭ebmma


    zenno wrote: »
    well they don't seem to be much concerned about health in the uk by the looks of it.

    pandemix...

    SIDE EFFECTS OF PANDEMRIX
    Very common (more than one in ten): headache, sore muscles and joints, fatigue, swelling and pain and redness at the injection site.
    Common (between one and ten out of hundred): enlarged lymph nodes, chills, flu-like illness, increased sweating, injection site reactions.
    Uncommon (between one and ten thousand): Insomnia, dizziness, numbness, extreme fatigue, indigestion, stomach and intestine as vomiting and nausea, itching, rash, malaise, generalized skin reactions.
    Rare (between one and ten out of ten thousand): Seizures, nerve pain, temporary shortage of blood platelets, allergic reaction.
    Very rare (less than one in ten thousand): vasculitis with transient renal involvement. Neurological disorder, Guillain-Barre syndrome, and nerve inflammation.
    Source: European Medicines Agency.

    what's your point? Every drug and every vaccine has some side effects. Mild ones are more common, severe ones are less common. This is what it says.
    Read an aspirin leaflet - rare severe reactions to it are pretty scary. But they are what they are - extremely rare.
    This is when every individual has to sit down and think about it: do I not bother with the vaccine because I am afraid of less than 1 in 10000 chance of a side effect, or will I risk the consequences of getting a flu and passing it on.
    Remember - you are in a pregnancy forum, we can't just shrug it off, nobody here wants to put the life of their unborn baby at risk. But also no one wants to risk miscarriage or premature labour if any complications from flu arise.

    Funny thing is, it looks like most people ARE going to get vaccinated (judging by how fast time slots in HSE clinics disappear. By virtue of herd immunity people who aren't will probably be fine. But they are going to assume it wasn't a big deal anyway:rolleyes:


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    #71
    ebmma
    Closed Accounts Posts: 631 ✭✭✭ebmma


    CathyMoran wrote: »
    If that is the case how come Pandemix is being used in the UK in pregnant women?


    Cathy, I'm originally from Russia myself and I doubt what zeno is saying very much.
    There's a pretty vocal 'against all vaccinations' camp in Russia and it is largely based around a supposed Thiomersal-Autism link. So his claims that it has been removed from vaccines in the 80s doesn't make sense.

    btw, it has been removed from MMR and it did absolutely nothing to slow down the rates of autism.


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    #72
    CathyMoran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭CathyMoran


    I had the Pandemix vaccine, I would just hate other women not to get it out of misguided fear when the sources are not the most reliable at best. Thanks.


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    #73
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    ebmma wrote: »
    Cathy, I'm originally from Russia myself and I doubt what zeno is saying very much.
    There's a pretty vocal 'against all vaccinations' camp in Russia and it is largely based around a supposed Thiomersal-Autism link. So his claims that it has been removed from vaccines in the 80s doesn't make sense.

    btw, it has been removed from MMR and it did absolutely nothing to slow down the rates of autism.

    I see your point but what i am trying to say is this..the vaccine has not been fully tested properly how can anyone say that it will be ok when a vaccine has not being tested. sure look what happened with BAXTER the company that makes the swine flu vaccine. they sent the vaccine to 18 countries and the vaccine was contaminated with h5n1 and h3n2 virus if this wasn't tested on one of their test animals it could have killed god knows how many people. this is the whole reason why it should be properly tested especially before being given to pregnant women. http://www.wiseupjournal.com/?p=816


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    #74
    Khannie
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 37,485 Mod ✭✭✭✭Khannie


    Zenno: Can you ease off on the scaremongering please.


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    #75
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    CathyMoran wrote: »
    I had the Pandemix vaccine, I would just hate other women not to get it out of misguided fear when the sources are not the most reliable at best. Thanks.[/quote

    don't forget BAXTER is very unreliable as well you have to look at both sides properly before you make up your mind falling headfirst into something like this is not an intelligent way of thinking. to roll out a drug like this without proper testing is unprofessional. a lot of scientists would agree.


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    #76
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    Khannie wrote: »
    Zenno: Can you ease off on the scaremongering please.

    scaremongering. ? I don't see that i am scaremongering here as these people seem quite adult enough to see both sides to this. the facts are there in black and white the vaccine has not been properly tested what part of that is scaremongering i ask you.


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    #77
    Khannie
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 37,485 Mod ✭✭✭✭Khannie


    You're upsetting people. I know this because my inbox is full of reported posts.

    I told you to stop. You didn't. Take a break.


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    #78
    silja
    Registered Users Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭silja


    Actually, at least here in the USA where I currently live, the swine flu vaccine is far more tested than the seasonal one (This includes testing on pregnant women in a volunteer study.), because of all the scare mongering- the seasonal flu vaccine receives little testing anymore, because even though it changes every year depending on the prevalent strains, it has been given for many years without major incidents. Let's also keep in mind that if they had found out about the swine flu only a couple of months earlier than they did, this strain would have been included in the normal, seasonal flu vaccine, but by the time they realise dit would become a big issue, it was to late for manufacturers to include it.

    On the mercury thing: the flu jab has about as much mercury as a tuna fish sandwhich, and many of us eat fish (though I am a veggie). Will you not eat any fish during pregnancy- or ever- to avoid mercury too? The link betwen autism and mercury in vaccines has been disproven.


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    #79
    Jip
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,418 ✭✭✭Jip


    zenno wrote: »
    well they don't seem to be much concerned about health in the uk by the looks of it.

    pandemix...

    SIDE EFFECTS OF PANDEMRIX
    Very common (more than one in ten): headache, sore muscles and joints, fatigue, swelling and pain and redness at the injection site.
    Common (between one and ten out of hundred): enlarged lymph nodes, chills, flu-like illness, increased sweating, injection site reactions.
    Uncommon (between one and ten thousand): Insomnia, dizziness, numbness, extreme fatigue, indigestion, stomach and intestine as vomiting and nausea, itching, rash, malaise, generalized skin reactions.
    Rare (between one and ten out of ten thousand): Seizures, nerve pain, temporary shortage of blood platelets, allergic reaction.
    Very rare (less than one in ten thousand): vasculitis with transient renal involvement. Neurological disorder, Guillain-Barre syndrome, and nerve inflammation.
    Source: European Medicines Agency.

    Have you ever read leaflets listing the side affects of most other regular prescribed medicine, they're as long, if not longer. By your argument people should stop taking any form of drug.

    I received a flu vaccination, most likely with the same preservative, 9 years ago. I'm still waiting for that leg to grow out of my head.


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    #80
    crazy cat lady
    Registered Users Posts: 1,196 ✭✭✭crazy cat lady


    I'm getting the vaccine on Wednesday. Apparently the mercury in Pandremix is the same preservative thats been used for years and is very safe. The HSE webside www.swineflu.ie explains all of this.

    I'm not concerned about the egg in the vaccine. I'm sure theres egg in half the foods I eat!

    For me the biggest selling point is that my baby will recieve passive immunity for up to 6 months after its born. I'd hate to think of a newborn baby trying to fight swine flu. It doesn't bear thinking about.

    As for all the possible side effects, I think I'll take my chances over premature labour etc... should I get swine flu! And apart from anything else, our baby is due in 7 weeks and I want to be in good health and stay in good health when he or she arrives!


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    #81
    ebmma
    Closed Accounts Posts: 631 ✭✭✭ebmma


    went to HSE clinic today without an appointment (walk-in) and got vaccinated within hour and a half. They were quite good and get every preg woman to see a doctor first. Also only give Celvapan vaccine (I didn't mind which one I get, but they just said it's recommended so I didn't relly mind either way).

    My appointment wasn't until next Tuesday, but I wanted to get it out of the way...so will just cancel that now.


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    #82
    CathyMoran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭CathyMoran


    ebmma wrote: »
    went to HSE clinic today without an appointment (walk-in) and got vaccinated within hour and a half. They were quite good and get every preg woman to see a doctor first. Also only give Celvapan vaccine (I didn't mind which one I get, but they just said it's recommended so I didn't relly mind either way).

    My appointment wasn't until next Tuesday, but I wanted to get it out of the way...so will just cancel that now.
    Opps, I had the Pandemix one as I was scared of waiting, got it early...ah, well.


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    #83
    ebmma
    Closed Accounts Posts: 631 ✭✭✭ebmma


    CathyMoran wrote: »
    Opps, I had the Pandemix one as I was scared of waiting, got it early...ah, well.

    I wouldn't worry about it, Cathy :)


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    #84
    Chesty LaRue
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 112 ✭✭Chesty LaRue


    zenno wrote: »
    scaremongering. ? I don't see that i am scaremongering here as these people seem quite adult enough to see both sides to this. the facts are there in black and white the vaccine has not been properly tested what part of that is scaremongering i ask you.

    Have you a document that actually says "vaccine not properly tested"? What do you suggest high-risk people (underlying conditions/pregnant) do? It's a fact, people are dying http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5hPamtiWEaIACnvWzl8UCP1JriBIQ
    more so than from the seasonal flu!!!)
    Are you pregnant or do you have any chronic illnesses?
    It is not an easy decision for any pregnant woman to make and I respect and understand whatever the woman decides. I have deliberated for weeks about this but as I said in my last post, I have a family to look after. I dont judge you for not getting it, and I hope you dont catch swine flu and pass it onto others!
    I got my jab this morn (Celvepan), I was nervous and I hope to God my baby is ok. If I didnt get it I would worry about catching the swine flu. The clinic was packed, which is reassuring. There were some sorry sights there (handicapped children & adults, heart, kidney patients etc.. etc...) and it brings it home to you just how fragile someone can be. It really is not a nice situation to be in. Zenno, this thread has been with pregnant woman offering support and advice at such a worrying time, not "scaremongering" and "judging people" (and yes you are scaremongering unless you have actual facts that the vaccine is unsafe!)....


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    #85
    Khannie
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 37,485 Mod ✭✭✭✭Khannie


    Chesty: Zenno wont be replying. He/she has been banned temporarily.


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    #86
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    Right guys, I'm closing this thread. There has been a lot of scaremongering on here and that will not be tolerated.

    The Swine Flu - Pros and Cons thread in the main parenting forum will be the place for discussing the subject. The reason for this is to avoid the need for duplication of information and because Swine Flu is a topic that concerns all parents and not just those who are at this moment pregnant.


This discussion has been closed.
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