Do you do anything about Climate Change

DigiGal

Smart arse replies aside for a moment(unless they are duurrty jokes)

Does anyone still care about his or is it just sort of fprgotten about.
I'm not trying to be Bono here or anything(self-righteous fool, blah bla blah the poor but I'll ignore the homeless guys sitting behind my hotel)

But do you turn of your lights or you t.v etc.
The world will be warming up by 2 degrees by 2012 which is going to have some pretty bad consequences(we can already see the effects of this now)
Irelands carbon emmissions have actually gone UP since we signed the Kyoto agreement which is subjecting us to all sorts of fines....and Obama so far hasn't done any of his wonerful energy saving initatives, then i read in the Irish Times today that Airtricity aren't green at all!

So whats the story, are we just gonna keep killing the planet or what?

No conspiracies here please.....

El Guapo!

Climate change is a natural occurance and no amount of turning off your tv is going to make a difference. Sit back, relax, and wear sun-screen! :cool:

TPD

Depending on who you listen to, climate change itself is the conspiracy. Dont cows contribute more to the greenhouse effect than humans?

Anyway, I think you're better off in the long run not worrying about it. If anything we do will have an effect, it will need to be on a massive scale, and therefore implemented by the governments as law. Until that happens, individuals being green won't really do much.

DigiGal

Dean09 wrote: »

Climate change is a natural occurance and no amount of turning off your tv is going to make a difference. Sit back, relax, and wear sun-screen! :cool:

It is natural but we are worsening it, its happening quicker than it should and its the fault of people who think like that

DigiGal

The Perfect Drug wrote: »

Depending on who you listen to, climate change itself is the conspiracy. Dont cows contribute more to the greenhouse effect than humans?

Anyway, I think you're better off in the long run not worrying about it. If anything we do will have an effect, it will need to be on a massive scale, and therefore implemented by the governments as law. Until that happens, individuals being green won't really do much.

Same thing, if everyone has this opinion, nobody will do anyhting it becomes a vicious cycle.

Nolanger

It's just another rung in the ladder of environmental 'causes' that people fill their sad lives with - greenhouse effect -> ozone layer -> global warming -> climate change -> the next big thing!

RandolphEsq

DigiGal wrote: »

It is natural but we are worsening it, its happening quicker than it should and its the fault of people who think like that

Hippy

TPD

DigiGal wrote: »

Same thing, if everyone has this opinion, nobody will do anyhting it becomes a vicious cycle.

Not really. There will be lobbyists etc. for any cause, and the government have already listened to the climate change groups. If the government still listen to these groups and implement some changes as law, the populace will carry out the changes, whether they care about/believe in climate change at all.

Mr.Obvious

hahaha. I love the way people are starting to deny global warming. It's not the type of thing you want to leave to chance.

If i was a eurocrat I'd know exactly what to do.

Ban women from wearing clothes.

Put it this way;

Ships full of clothes from asia produce loads of CO2. While men only buy what clothes they need, women go crazy and buy 10 times the clothes they actually need. They are by far the worst offenders in terms of clothes-related CO2 emmisions, and therefore measures should be taken against them in true eurocrat style (i.e tackling the problem in an ineffective roundabout way to suit your own agenda).

DigiGal

The Perfect Drug wrote: »

Not really. There will be lobbyists etc. for any cause, and the government have already listened to the climate change groups. If the government still listen to these groups and implement some changes as law, the populace will carry out the changes, whether they care about/believe in climate change at all.

Pity our government are idiots...

they were talking about nuclear power a while ago, well the Greens were but imagine if our government built a nuclear power plant, if te cracking spire and the luas with tyhe tracks that were too small and the millenium clock are anythign to go by....scary thought....prob better off with fossil fuels

skyhighflyer

I've started switching the car's engine off at night.

DigiGal

Mr.Obvious wrote: »

hahaha. I love the way people are starting to deny global warming. It's not the type of thing you want to leave to chance.

If i was a eurocrat I'd know exactly what to do.

Ban women from wearing clothes.

Put it this way;

Ships full of clothes from asia produce loads of CO2. While men only buy what clothes they need, women go crazy and buy 10 times the clothes they actually need. They are by far the worst offenders in terms of clothes-related CO2 emmisions, and therefore measures should be taken against them in true eurocrat style (i.e tackling the problem in an ineffective roundabout way to suit your own agenda).

I like your idea....benificial to both the enviroment and us...
but what about unattractive women...

dsmythy

How can we forget? There's plenty of ads on tv about it. I pull plugs and turn off lights to save money. And we are going to pay carbon tax "for the environment :rolleyes:" pretty soon too. How can we forget...

DigiGal

skyhighflyer wrote: »

I've started switching the car's engine off at night.

Do you kow how much energy you just wasted double posting...

DigiGal

dsmythy wrote: »

How can we forget? There's plenty of ads on tv about it. I pull plugs and turn off lights to save money. And we are going to pay carbon tax "for the environment :rolleyes:" pretty soon too. How can we forget...

and water tax...wtf is that about....

Acacia

Meh. The whole thing seems like a big money-spinner to me with everyone from (like the OP says) Bono to washing powder manufacturers (Ariel and their whole 15 degrees bollox) jumping on the band wagon.

Just another cause for the self-righteous to bleat on about "Oh, I only flew ten times this year to reduce my carbon number, aren't I the great fella...". :rolleyes:

mickdw

Climate change is all crap. Big news, the temperature is going to rise by x number of degrees. The whole problem is this is being based on the very short time for which records have been kept. What about the drastic changes that have taken since the ice age. What caused that change, it wasnt a few men driving around in some powerful cars thats for sure. I believe that over time, we will get natural changes in the planet. This happens so slowly that every living thing on the planet would have no problem adapting to the changes. Some people still feel its worth while to spend their life worrying about this. Well I dont.

DigiGal

Acacia wrote: »

Meh. The whole thing seems like a big money-spinner to me with everyone from (like the OP says) Bono to washing powder manufacturers (Ariel and their whole 15 degrees bollox) jumping on the band wagon.

Just another cause for the self-righteous to bleat on about "Oh, I only flew ten times this year to reduce my carbon number, aren't I the great fella...". :rolleyes:

Well I didn't fly at all

irish_bob

2009 is set to be the wettest year on record in ireland
2008 was the wettest to date
2007 was the wettest before that

no , i dont believe in climate change either:rolleyes:

Delta Kilo

Most people think that global warming is going to thaw the polar ice caps and it is the water from this that will rise the ocean levels. That ain't so. The big issue is that when water is heated, it expands, so the rising temp is causing the water to expand upwards, drowning us all. As more heat is in the environment, more water is evaporated into clouds, which means we get more rain, which is happening.

Things are happening quite quickly and we are a part of it. I still can't see why turning something off as opposed to leaving it on stand by makes any difference at all though.

El Siglo

"I wonder why progress looks so much like destruction." — John Steinbeck.

ejmaztec

Logically, thanks to the recession and drop in manufacturing worldwide, global warming should have reduced quite a bit. If it hasn't, then the mad scientists must be bullsh1tting us.

Pjays

I became a vegetarian. Save the planet and the animals!!!

gerry28

I don't worry too much about climate change or CO2 emissions. If there was no carbon dioxide then there would be no trees or life for that matter.

The planet can handle carbon dioxide.

I worry much more about over-population and all its associated problems. Such as the demise habitats and of species like rhinos, tigers, sea mammals and over fishing etc.

ejmaztec

Pjays wrote: »

I became a vegetarian. Save the planet and the animals!!!

But that's more animal farts for the atmosphere to contend with, not to mention human farts after all those sprouts:eek:


Think of the damage you're doing:eek::eek:

Pjays

ejmaztec wrote: »

But that's more animal farts for the atmosphere to contend with, not to mention human farts after all those sprouts:eek:


Think of the damage you're doing:eek::eek:

:eek::eek: I'm a goner now.

on a serious note, without intensive farming, there wouldn't be the huge number of cattle, sheep, pigs etc... on the planet. Additionally, at the moment, there has been research highlighting how the introduction of China and India to the superpowers is leading to an increased demand for meat, which in turn is putting great pressure on supplies. There are too many people on the planet as well.

Anyone do their ecological footprint? How many planets are you using?!

DigiGal

DigiGal wrote: »

.
The world will be warming up by 2 degrees by 2012 which is going to have some pretty bad consequences

Far better than the temperature dropping by just 1 degree.....nobody mentions that the little ice age which cause famine across Europe was caused by a drop of just a degree. A buffer of 2 degrees positive is a good thing....!

Global warming may take a hundred years but an ice age can come on in a decade or two.
The little ice age came on in an estimated 10 years. This caused famine in Europe.
http://books.google.ca/books?id=0aDsjjZrYCwC&pg=PA16&#v=onepage&q=&f=false

http://www.economicexpert.com/a/Little:Ice:Age.htm

The Great Famine of 1315-1317 killing 1.5 million people alone)

The IPCC describes the LIA as a modest cooling of the Northern Hemisphere during this period of less than 1°C.

Before all this global warming talk John Von Neumann wanted to spray the ice caps black to heat the planet up he reckoned we would be better off!
http://www.jstor.org/pss/2319080


Grain was grown in Greenland and Iceland over a thousand years ago
http://books.google.ie/books?id=6TCm8Xy-sLUC&pg=PA108&dq=average+temperature+drop+little+ice+age#v=onepage&q=average%20temperature%20drop%20little%20ice%20age&f=false

Europe isnt that hot and a drop of a degree would royally screw us:

It has snowed in Ireland before in June. All it takes is a long cold winter with snowfall to linger. The albedo effect of the snow will decrease the effects of the sun and it becomes a feedback loop. Again I want to emphasise its currently not that hot/warm when there is permanent snow in places like Scotland:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_patches_in_Scotland

Its not unusual to get frosts any month except in July and August here in Ireland.
And lets not forget the snow they had in Baghdad!!! http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5huPkYk4bGVvo1Sa1tWeH-tgENiFw

Warming means more farmland with melting tundra. Desertification:

We can desalinate seawater and we can irrigate. Look at arizona:


Be pragmatic, we can deal with rising sea levels:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuiderzee_Works
The Dutch reclaimed land from the sea with a project that began in 1918.

YFlyer

skyhighflyer wrote: »

I've started switching the car's engine off at night.

If it was an electric car it be best to only charge it during the night, unless we are dealing with localise solar units

BlueSpiral

I do my bit, recycling and turning the tap off, tackling my way through the cloud of flies to the brown bin.

Worst place I've ever been for pollution was India. The cities there will choke you up, you have to prepare yourself for the pollution in the air and the stuff in the streets before you go out. There was a number of times I saw rats just sitting at the side of the pavement. Most of it came from the cars and auto rickshaws, which they were changing the engines on so they wouldn't have as bad an effect on the environment and climate. You'd come back to your hostel and you'd have black nostrils and you'd get some serious dirt off when wiping your face from just walking through the city air. In complete contrast the people there are very hygienic, lining up at open water sources at the side of the street to wash in the morning and evening.

The countryside though in India is much different, amazing air for your lungs.

Turtwig

Deleted User wrote: »

Far better than the temperature dropping by just 1 degree.....nobody mentions that the little ice age which cause famine across Europe was caused by a drop of just a degree. A buffer of 2 degrees positive is a good thing....!

Ehh yeah riiggggggggggghtttttttt:rolleyes:
The temp rises....then drops.

All I'll say for now is this over 90% of the worlds UN scientists agree that Global Warming IS happening and that Humankind's activities are definitely speeding it up - the only thing they disagree over is how bad it'll actually be.

mickdw wrote:

Climate change is all crap. Big news, the temperature is going to rise by x number of degrees. The whole problem is this is being based on the very short time for which records have been kept. What about the drastic changes that have taken since the ice age. What caused that change, it wasnt a few men driving around in some powerful cars thats for sure. I believe that over time, we will get natural changes in the planet. This happens so slowly that every living thing on the planet would have no problem adapting to the changes. Some people still feel its worth while to spend their life worrying about this. Well I dont.

Well, if everyone has this attitude then we are DOOMED:(

Malty_T

Malty_T wrote: »

Ehh yeah riiggggggggggghtttttttt:rolleyes:
The temp rises....then drops.

All I'll say for now is this over 90% of the worlds UN scientists agree that Global Warming IS happening and that Humankind's activities are definitely speeding it up - the only thing they disagree over is how bad it'll actually be.




Well, if everyone has this attitude then we are DOOMED:(

:rolleyes:

I`ll put it in simpler terms. We are far better off with temps 2C above normal than just 1C below.

Yes temps are increasing and its because of us but its not all bad. Nothing is black and white. Check this out:

http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2009/january7/manvleaf-010709.html

Stanford University researchers have conducted a comprehensive analysis of data detailing the amount of charcoal contained in soils and lake sediments at the sites of both pre-Columbian population centers in the Americas and in sparsely populated surrounding regions. They concluded that reforestation of agricultural lands—abandoned as the population collapsed—pulled so much carbon out of the atmosphere that it helped trigger a period of global cooling, at its most intense from approximately 1500 to 1750, known as the Little Ice Age.

"We estimate that the amount of carbon sequestered in the growing forests was about 10 to 50 percent of the total carbon that would have needed to come out of the atmosphere and oceans at that time to account for the observed changes in carbon dioxide concentrations," said Richard

That would mean our impact on the planet is more than we think.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/climate-change-poised-to-feed-on-itself-20090731-e4gi.html

Other contributors include changes in the sun’s output associated with sunspots and solar flares, and volcanic dust. However, if these were solely responsible for temperature changes since 1850, the world should have cooled over the past half-century rather than warming at an increasing rate.

^^ So we would be in a mini ice age if we werent pumping out greenhouse gasses warming the place up.
Again I`ll state that its better for temps to rise a few degrees over a hundred years than for cooling to occur by just 1 degree.
Cooling occurs far quicker than warming. Get your head around it. We have been fed so much about how global warming is bad that few stop to consider the positive effects.

We can deal with the negative effects just look at my previous post.

Salvelinus

The Perfect Drug wrote: »

Depending on who you listen to, climate change itself is the conspiracy. Dont cows contribute more to the greenhouse effect than humans?

Anyway, I think you're better off in the long run not worrying about it. If anything we do will have an effect, it will need to be on a massive scale, and therefore implemented by the governments as law. Until that happens, individuals being green won't really do much.

methane is a greenhouse gas which cows emit. However due to food demand there are alot more cows in the world, and to raise them large amounts of rainforest get cut down in Brazil, cutting these forests add to the problem as trees use up greenhouse gas. Climate change has always been happening and has contributed to life on the planet but the problem is humans "intervening".

Seaneh

ejmaztec wrote: »

Logically, thanks to the recession and drop in manufacturing worldwide, global warming should have reduced quite a bit. If it hasn't, then the mad scientists must be bullsh1tting us.

the increase in fossil fuel usage in India and China alone each year is greater than the combinded usage of the EU.


Developing countries are burning more oil and coal every year, just because there is less manufacturing going on in the west doesnt mean the global usage of fossil fuels is going down, it's raising, A LOT.

Turtwig

Sighhhh

The naivety of some of you guys here is, well, disturbing.
What do you guys expect a little min ice age over the course of 100 yrs or so?
Jeez..

Firstly, Global temperatures rising = water level rises -> lowland areas flooded.
Melting of Artic Ice introduces fresh water into salt water making it more dense - not good at all. Ever hear of the North Atlantic Drift? You know the thing that makes our seas 'Ice Free' and our winters relativity warm. Well that drift thingy could shut down cause long harsh freezing winters.
Oh and not to mention that the increased body of seawater would cause heavier showers and increased flash floods. Oh and did anyone mention that the the rise in temperatures would also cause high temp summers with intense rainfall but also intense DROUGHT - best of luck to the farmers in growing crops (especially potato) in those conditions.

Oh and I forgot that permafrost ice contains methane..methane is a greenhouse gas..methane in atmosphere not good..melting ice releases more and more methane speeding up the entire warming process...so folks stop farting

Seaneh

The biggest problem is that people think it's "global warming" which isn't exactly true, it's Global Climate change. Ireland will have longer colder winters and shorter wetter summers, also in the next 10 years there is a massive change that we will lose the gulf stream because of it, cooler water from the ice caps will replace this which in result will mean even colder winters as in arctic circle conditions, we would pretty much have the same climate as iceland and we are a nation are not able for it, we don't have the infrastructure or the money to develop the infrastructure.

Turtwig

Seaneh wrote: »

The biggest problem is that people think it's "global warming" which isn't exactly true, it's Global Climate change. Ireland will have longer colder winters and shorter wetter summers, also in the next 10 years there is a massive change that we will lose the gulf stream because of it, cooler water from the ice caps will replace this which in result will mean even colder winters as in arctic circle conditions, we would pretty much have the same climate as iceland and we are a nation are not able for it, we don't have the infrastructure or the money to develop the infrastructure.

Beat ya:P:D

Forgot to add that Skin Cancer rates due to increased UV penetration are expected to rise..
I think...need to check up on this one again

Get down off yer high horses, Ive provided links to academic research and ye respond with none.

Firstly Malty T your wrong and here is why:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1176980-4,00.html

What usually keeps the Gulf Stream running is that warm water is lighter than cold water, so it floats on the surface. As it reaches Europe and releases its heat, the current grows denser and sinks, flowing back to the south and crossing under the northbound Gulf Stream until it reaches the tropics and starts to warm again. The cycle works splendidly, provided the water remains salty enough. But if it becomes diluted by freshwater, the salt concentration drops, and the water gets lighter, idling on top and stalling the current. Last December, researchers associated with Britain's National Oceanography Center reported that one component of the system that drives the Gulf Stream has slowed about 30% since 1957. It's the increased release of Arctic and Greenland meltwater that appears to be causing the problem, introducing a gush of freshwater that's overwhelming the natural cycle. In a global-warming world, it's unlikely that any amount of cooling that resulted from this would be sufficient to support glaciers, but it could make things awfully uncomfortable.

http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/res/div/ocp/gs/

Using observations and climate models we found that, at the latitudes of Europe, the atmospheric heat transport exceeds that of the ocean by several fold. In winter it may even by an order of magnitude greater. Thus it is the atmosphere, not the ocean, that does the lion's share of the work ameliorating winter climates in the extratropics. We also found that the seasonal absorption and release of heat by the ocean has a much larger impact on regional climates than does the movement of heat by ocean currents.

Bear in mind that "the Gulf Stream has slowed about 30% since 1957" according to the time article. So where is the colder weather? Global warming holding it back?

The Gulf Stream and future climate change
A slowdown of the Gulf Stream and ocean circulation in the future, induced by freshening of the waters caused by anthropogenic climate change (via melting glaciers and increased water vapor transport into high latitudes) or simply by warming, would thus introduce a modest cooling tendency. This would leave the temperature contrast across the Atlantic unchanged and not plunge Europe back into the ice age or anything like it. In fact the cooling tendency would probably be overwhelmed by the direct radiatively-driven warming by rising greenhouse gases.

Seaneh - there are several climatic projections for global warming. We can choose from a variety of them but each are different.

Have ye not read my posts? The fact is if we werent producing greenhouse gasses we would have cooled. One degree cooling gives us a mini ice age.

We can deal with warming but not with cold. Global warming is not all negative. They started building the Zuider Zee in 1918. I included the year in my post for emphasis that its not modern technology to reclaim land from the sea or to deal with sea levels rising.

IvySlayer

We are not damaging our environment by carbon emissions. We are hunting species to extinction and destroying natural habitats, that's the problem.

irish_bob

Seaneh wrote: »

The biggest problem is that people think it's "global warming" which isn't exactly true, it's Global Climate change. Ireland will have longer colder winters and shorter wetter summers, also in the next 10 years there is a massive change that we will lose the gulf stream because of it, cooler water from the ice caps will replace this which in result will mean even colder winters as in arctic circle conditions, we would pretty much have the same climate as iceland and we are a nation are not able for it, we don't have the infrastructure or the money to develop the infrastructure.

so what your saying is , our weather will be even worse than it is now , i thought climate change would result in wetter winters and wetter years over all but hot dry summers

mickdw

Malty_T wrote: »

Well, if everyone has this attitude then we are DOOMED:(

Ah bull sh1t.
So what is your worst case senario? Rising sea levels, colder winters, flash flooding, hot short summers.

Now if all this is to gradually occur over many many years, the changes will be small over a lifetime and man in general will be able to adapt be it by reclaiming land from the sea, putting suitable infrastructure in place to deal with weather, getting used to colder winter/hot wet summer, the next generation will be born to this climate, whats the big deal?
IMO, the planet & the people will cope with these changes. I would be more worried about things like nuclear fallout and not something as natural as carbon.

utick

is there any evidence of sea levels rising? i dont think so, people may point to a the sea coming further up a beach than in previous years as a sign of rising sea levels but this isnt necesarily true, that is most likely caused by erosion, in some areas land mass is expanding, does this mean sea level is falling, more likely it is caused by deposition.

If the sea levels were realy rising the heights of mountains would have to be lower on maps, due to higher sea levels, but im not sure that they ever update mountain heights, so rise in sea level most likely isnt happening

Bob_Harris

Global Warming => Huge Dollars.

mukki

like others have said, i turn stuff off to save moeny


inface for the laugh i have typed this up with the screen turned off



bUt i have to tune it back on noww to find the submret button

galwayrush

We've stopped putting kidney beans in our Chilli, every little bit helps.:cool:

ejmaztec

Seaneh wrote: »

the increase in fossil fuel usage in India and China alone each year is greater than the combinded usage of the EU.


Developing countries are burning more oil and coal every year, just because there is less manufacturing going on in the west doesnt mean the global usage of fossil fuels is going down, it's raising, A LOT.

I'm assuming that there is a global reduction in manufacturing, not just in the West, but also with the developing countries not producing as much, because us paupers in the West aren't buying as much from them.

gar_29

but if all the polar bears go then what will i eat?

i may have to switch to panda sandwiches.

Seaneh

ejmaztec wrote: »

I'm assuming that there is a global reduction in manufacturing, not just in the West, but also with the developing countries not producing as much, because us paupers in the West aren't buying as much from them.

doesn't change the fact that if the UK & Ireland stoped buring fossil fuels today the growth of India and China alone would wipe out and reduction in carbon output within 6 months.
This is fact.

Seaneh

gar_29 wrote: »

but if all the polar bears go then what will i eat?

i may have to switch to panda sandwiches.

They are just white grizzly's, plenty of the brown ones left.

gerky

Many threads ago I discovered that trying to discuss/debate the real science behind climate change in AH in very similar to banging my head against a wall, either way I'm almost certain to end up with a sore head.

So I'll refer anyone interested to these websites that are not iffy articles or personal blogs or some other non peer reviewed tripe.
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/corporate/pressoffice/myths/
http://www.edf.org/page.cfm?tagID=1011
http://royalsociety.org/page.asp?id=4761
http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/climatechange/guide/
http://www.realclimate.org/
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11462

These are proper sources of information, properly researched and backed by peer reviewed scientific studies/research/papers.
I'm not forcing anyone to read these and I won't start debating here so if you're interested in really understanding climate change then read away or if you'd prefer to keep your unscientific unfounded views don't bother.
The links above cover the vast majority of unfounded information, myths or simply bull**** put around about climate change.

Irish Trinity

Seaneh wrote: »

They are just white grizzly's, plenty of the brown ones left.

we've got white spray pain don't we??...sorted.

Biggins

DigiGal wrote: »

Do you do anything about Climate Change

Yes.
Next question!