Part of Dublin to Belfast rail line collapses

T Corolla

Roll on Navan I bet the line to Dunboyne will be open at the same time as this viaduct is open

IIMII

As a matter of interest, can drivers not radio from the cab? Why did the driver have to wait until he reached the station to call in the subsidence?

And how are the commuter railcars going to get 'home' to Drogheda? Can Inchicore deal with them? Or Port Laoise?

lostexpectation

DWCommuter wrote: »

The concrete beams were laid across the 1860 stone piers in 1967. When this work was carried out the level of the estuary was raised to reduce the tidal reflux. As we all know the problem appears to be with the much older stone pier. Looks like they thought it would last forever.

So I correct my earlier assumption. The spans are reasonably new. The piers date from 1860, when a wooden structure was replaced.

yeah i read that but didn't want to say it out loud, to think all wear they take which the old documents detail, it surprising that they havn't done a complete rebuild since 1869 or so.

one of those docs were vague about whether the whole thing was redone in 1965

Zoney

Maybe they should make up some of the loss by hiring out the spare railcars at Drogheda to NIR - although I suppose NIR aren't going to have something like the recent Tall Ships crowds again anytime soon.

Run_to_da_hills

murphaph wrote: »

Who would insure such a basket case?! Oh, wait, the taxpayer!

A tunnel under this estuary would be a far better and safer option in the long term. Build a temporary structure until they complete a tunnel, then they wouldn't have to worry about the elements. I don't think commuters are going to be confident with a patch up job even if speeds are reduced to 30mph. .

If they abandoned all the Dublin Metro projects and put the funding into this.

Jonathan

Malahide station is too close. The tunnel would be too steep.

mike65

Dunno if this has been mentioned but the structure was given the all clear 4 days ago!

positron

3 months of disruption, according to RTE 2fm news. :(:(

ttm

Does anyone (with an engineering background perhaps) have any idea of the original method of construction of the 1860's stone piers?

afaik the construction method of the period would have started with a foundation of wooden piles driven into the river bed, while these piles last a very long time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pile_bridge) after a 150 years how can you know its safe if the construction isn't under some form of 24hour electonic monitoring and what good is a visual inspection if the problem is with the very core of the foundations.

Just my two cents, perhaps someone can explain the flaws in my post?

Jonathan

mike65 wrote: »

Dunno if this has been mentioned but the structure was given the all clear 4 days ago!

By who?

mike65

Jonathan wrote: »

By who?

Somebody with the authority to do so I presume

Always number 1

Stevie Wonder?

lostexpectation

details of first rebuild from old book http://books.google.ie/books?id=Hx8wAAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&client=firefox-a#v=onepage&q=&f=false

ok IR said, person walks line inspection three times a week, then ever 2 years engineer does full structural inspection, this was was only carried out 4 days before the collapse both found bridge sound.

lucernarian

Before we forget, Irish Cement in Platin use rail freight for some cement shipments to dublin (the port I assume). That's actually alongside the Drogheda-Navan branch so IR would have to factor them in before considering the closure of it when Dublin-Navan is built.

Also, does any freight come from the harp brewery in Dundalk or indeed any NI freight come to/from Dublin?? I remember seeing large quantities of kegs making the journey northwards in Drogheda within the past couple of years. Also, I believe there is no branch in existence for several years from the northern line to the drogheda port area near Premier Periclase. Parts of the aligmnent were definitely removed when the Termon Abbey estate was built.

Tunnels are more unsafe in other ways. E.g. fires, escape routes, having to provide ventilation, more ways for a system to fail causing the tunnel to close. Besides, it's just simple to build a very safe and high-speed capable low bridge over some Irish Sea mud estuary. It's poor that a simple structure like that collapsed. I'm looking forward to reading the engineering reports...

Cookie_Monster

mike65 wrote: »

Dunno if this has been mentioned but the structure was given the all clear 4 days ago!

:eek:

There's something Ironically Irish about the whole situation now...

Run_to_da_hills

Jonathan wrote: »

Malahide station is too close. The tunnel would be too steep.

Make it an underground station.

Vibration and deadweight from the 201's over the last decade would not have helped.

North Cork

Dublin-Belfast line closed for three months

Iarnród Éireann has said rail passengers are facing three months of disruption to services on the main Dublin to Belfast line after part of it collapsed.

A 20-metre section of the viaduct over the Malahide estuary collapsed into the water at about 6.30pm yesterday evening.

The company has described the incident as being close to a "very serious tragedy" and a major investigation has been launched.

Bus transfers are being arranged for passengers on the northern commuter lines.

Iarnród Éireann spokesperson Barry Kenny said the alternative arrangements will be finalised before people go back to work on Monday.


Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/dublinbelfast-line-closed-for-three-months-423516.html#ixzz0OukCosYx

Jonathan

mike65 wrote: »

Somebody with the authority to do so I presume

I meant was it IR or FCC?

ronano

3 months gooood i'm paying an extra 600 euro at least overall til its back up and running

fml

Run_to_da_hills

The should halve the toll of the Port Tunnel during peak until such time as it is repaired. THere will be a lot of fed up commuters that will not take the bus option.

lostexpectation

don't worry these guys are on their way

The Rail Accident Investigation Unit
http://www.raiu.ie/




yyyhheooooowww .....


http://www.rsc.ie/

Rail safety commission

murphaph

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The should halve the toll of the Port Tunnel during peak until such time as it is repaired. THere will be a lot of fed up commuters that will not take the bus option.

This needs a whole raft of joined-up-thinking like this from IE/BE/BAC/DCC/FCC/MCC/LCC but it won't happen this way. It's IE's JOB to inspect and maintain all these structures and now 2 have failed in recent years. It'll be a fudge job because they'll get away with it. Somebody senior should lose their job(s) over this-people really did nearly die because of slipshod inspection and or maintenance. They would in this country.

Bluetonic

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The should halve the toll of the Port Tunnel during peak until such time as it is repaired. THere will be a lot of fed up commuters that will not take the bus option.

Any original ideas?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=61728422&postcount=50

Bluetonic

murphaph wrote: »

Somebody senior should lose their job(s) over this-people really did nearly die because of slipshod inspection and or maintenance. They would in this country.

I didn't realise the report into the incident had been published already.

That was quick.

SeanW

I was just thinking, would the Tara Mines and Irish Cement works be able to send their stuff by rail from Drogheda to a port in Northern Ireland?

The Hill Billy

mike65 wrote: »

Dunno if this has been mentioned but the structure was given the all clear 4 days ago!

Jonathan wrote: »

By who?

Here you go...

RTE.ie wrote:

Investigation of Dublin rail line collapse
Saturday, 22 August 2009 13:57

An investigation is to take place on the collapse of part of the main Dublin to Belfast line at Malahide in Co Dublin.

A spokesperson for Iarnród Éireann said that the section of the bridge that collapsed underwent a structural examination this week.

The inspection was carried out on the line by an engineer on Tuesday and no issues were identified.

Iarnród Éireann says it will be at least three months before the damage is repaired.

It says the incident had the potential to be a serious tragedy and will be trying to establish how the collapse happened.

The 18.07 Balbriggan to Connolly Station train was crossing the viaduct on the Broadmeadow Estuary between Malahide and Donabate at around 6.20pm yesterday evening.

The driver noticed subsidence on the rail line opposite, which he reported and all services were immediately stopped.

A 20-metre section of the viaduct then collapsed into the water.

There were between 40 and 50 people on the train, which had just crossed over but no-one was injured.

Iarnród Éireann says lines are inspected three times a week by a patrol man and they are given a structural assessment by an engineer every two years.

Rail Users Ireland has said it is extremely concerned following the collapse.

The group says the incident raises 'serious questions of Irish Rail's maintenance and inspection regime'.

It also called for cash refunds for all weekly, monthly and annual ticket holders that are unable to travel.

Disruption to services

Northern commuter services are seriously disrupted and there will be shuttle bus services between Drogheda and Skerries.

Belfast Enterprise services will operate with train services between Belfast and Drogheda.

Bus transfers will then operate between Drogheda and Connolly Station, with resulting delays.

DART services between Malahide and Howth Junction are running normally.

These arrangements will remain in place for tomorrow and weekday service details for next week are being arranged.

Hungerford

dowlingm wrote: »

@DWCommuter - I was just thinking that it might be time for a look at the Cahir report as a preview of what we'll read in the RSC's report on this disaster.

I am not Derek but I happy to oblige with some of the highlights from the report:

RAIU wrote:

While it is not possible to state definitively what caused the accident, it appears that shortcomings in the timber deck structure of the viaduct and shortcomings in the associated inspection and maintenance regime were the most significant causal factors. If these had been fit for purpose it is unlikely that the accident would have occurred.

Regarding maintenance standards, the RAIU found:

Other than in relation to the procurement of replacement timbers there were no written or diagrammatic standards or specifications regarding:
• tolerances for preparatory work and machining of way-beams and guard-beams,
• their relative positioning on the deck and to each other, or
• the number and location of securing bolts and tie-rods.
Training in relation to both the inspection of the Viaduct and the carrying out of maintenance and renewal works was not standardised. Instruction was provided on the job with skills and knowledge being passed on informally from more to less experienced team members.

And here's the kicker:

Significant evidence was lost as a result of the extensive damage sustained by the Viaduct in the accident. However, on the basis of available evidence it is possible to say with reasonable certainty that of the various factors than combined to cause the derailment, the safety critical shortcomings in the Viaduct secondary deck timber structure and its associated inspection and maintenance regime were principally responsible for the accident. These included the absence of:
• consistent design detail for what was arguably the most safety critical part of the Viaduct,
• a fully specified and risk based inspection regime,
• adequate standards and specifications for maintenance works,
• adequate training of staff involved in inspection and maintenance and
• effective provision for derailment containment.

The full report is available on the Railway Safety Commission website. Based on previous experience, it will be about 18 months before the RAIU get around to publishing their report into yesterday's incident.

sdanseo

Bluetonic wrote: »

Great idea, you should seriously contact your local representative in politics/FCC about this one.

Traffic would still be a nightmare from Lissenhall, to Seatown and on to Malahide but how and ever.

Well it can stay on the main road. If it all cuts through my estate people will be hurling eggs (no joke) , it's bad enough as it is - you cant move during term time on Yellow Walls Road, a lot of Estuary Road or Swords-Malahide Road.

Driving to Malahide station from Donabate, Balbriggan etc is not the answer nor will it turn out to be what the majority will do. Most will just drive - something the M1 can just about take if they get those roadworks finished before school starts. The N1 down through Drumcondra will be an absolute and utter nightmare for the forseeable future though.

If a head does roll over this though, it'll be that engineer's.

Off to snap a few pix, back with them soon.

Jonathan

sdonn wrote: »

Well it can stay on the main road. If it all cuts through my estate people will be hurling eggs (no joke) , it's bad enough as it is - you cant move during term time on Yellow Walls Road, a lot of Estuary Road or Swords-Malahide Road.

We could put the Centra boy racers on vigilante policing duties? :P

Run_to_da_hills

A Iarnrod Eireann structural inspection vehicle.