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C & C

  • 04-06-2009 11:03pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 117 ✭✭ An Capall Dubh


    Hi all,

    Just wondering if C & C is worth a punt for the summer months. Share price is rising steadily and with new management in place looks like fresh approach to turn things round. A sunny summer would be a bonus too!!


«1

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,509 Tiesto


    Hi there,
    I wouldnt..
    I bought in before the recession at 5.44.
    Then when they start to fall, i tried to cover some of my loss by buying more at 3.60 roughly..
    I cant ever see them climbing back to those previous highs..
    I wreckon if they reach 4, ill sell and take the hit..


  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ royaler83


    Why did you buy a stock that was clearly dropping? Just because you got stung doesnt mean their a bad buy now.
    SP is on the rise, Dolmen have them as a Buy.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,509 Tiesto


    they werent 'clearly dropping' at the time.
    I still dont think they are a good buy.
    Revenue has been falling consistently.
    Demand for cider is down
    They are too reliant on the performance of one product


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    I would vehemently disagree. This company is in all the right places right now and with a bit of good luck (weather) even better places. Most brokers now have this on their buy list. The new Pear cider is selling very well and the company has cut it costs to ensure it can now sell the pint bottle at under €5 over the counter nationwide. Likely to pay a dividend, albeit a small one, this year too. I can see this at €3.10 by end of Summer.

    Hope this helps.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭ finisklin


    Au contraire...it is meeting price resistance as a premium bottled product for cider! See the irish times link below......

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2009/0618/1224249067709.html

    I have my reservations about the Pear product, though it will initially do well on a halo affect from the bulmers brand and a curiosity factor. Long term I can't see it becoming a big part of their business......IMHO......


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    I was aware of this. It is up to the consumer to figure out whether the price cut is being passed on and I will certainly be checking as I frequent various pubs over the Summer months. Bulmers is not the only brand C&C owns,sells or promotes, it's important to remember this. Bulmers cider by itself in a good year would justify the current share price so anything above that would be an indication of improvements in its other lines.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,530 TheInquisitor


    If the weather is good buy C&C if it is bad sell them. Simple as


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    I suppose you can't go too wrong with that approach either. I like shares where you can decide to buy based on what you see. Many consumer goods are like this, whereas with some B2B stocks it's not that simple - case in point Smurfit Kappa.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,061 ✭✭✭ Dubh Geannain


    Hmm, I've got my reservations about the pear cider. I've heard a few too many stories of digestive system irregularities as a result of having a couple of bottles of it. They'll need to sort it out I reckon.

    On the share price if I had had the funds I would have bought a few shares back in January/February as the Summer was predicted to be a pretty good one.

    I know you'll say, sure don't they predict this every year :rolleyes:

    Of course normal meteorologists can't predict a week in advance let alone 5 months. It was a study I read from astronomical weather men who look at things like the earths tilt, solar activity, earths magnetic field activity and the like where they said it'd be a drier than average summer in this part of the world. Sorry, don't have a link to hand for this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    If you were to eat several pears you would probably have the same problem but I believe they have already started addressing this issue down in their research facility in Clonmel. Yes, towards the end of last year and Jan - Mar this year were good times too. However, at least one of the company directors was happy to buy at €2.28 so I guess €2 is good enough for me.

    18-05-2009 L. FitzGerald BUY 21,900 ORD 228 49,932 35,000 0.01
    18-12-2008 J. Dunsmore BUY 5,120,000 ORD 115 5,888,000 5,120,000 1.56
    18-12-2008 S. Glancey BUY 5,120,000 ORD 115 5,888,000 5,120,000 1.56
    17-11-2008 P. Lynch BUY 100,000 ORD 145 145,000 760,819 0.24
    21-10-2008 P. Lynch BUY 200,000 ORD 124.16 248,320 660,819 0.21


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭ finisklin


    At €2.46 at the moment....is the good weather having its affect or is the Pear cider really that good?

    Any thoughts?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    It was up around €2.53 earlier. I suspect both the pear and the weather plus several other initiatives, incl. recent dividend and new institutional investors building stakes. ACNielsen figures were very promising on Friday too. I can see this one up around €3.50-€3.75 in a couple of months, you heard it here first.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    €2.65 now


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,509 Tiesto


    :confused:damn
    i sold last week @ 2.33 to buy some Bank of Ireland!!
    I didnt sell all however.
    I still have about 500 shs of C&C


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    Very positive trading update released today. Definite 'BUY & HOLD' now up until Sept / Oct.


  • Registered Users Posts: 117 ✭✭ An Capall Dubh


    Trading update looked good, but doesn't seem to be enough to counteract the fall in share price since last Friday's high of €2.69. Did the issuing of an extra 1,000,000 shares yesterday really have that much of an effect on the share price dropping or what's going on at all?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    Just a small glitch, following market negativity and POO. Back at €2.40 now. Seems to be showing strong resistance around the €2.35 mark. I also see this one as a very likely takeover target over the next year or two which adds huge weight to share price. Carlsberg & Heineken as far as I know are now involved in the cider game so another drinks group is likely to move in and follow.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 89 ✭✭✭ TTNYWWBM


    I think the Pear Cider has inflated the sp since it's launch and while ago and it's falling back now.

    The pear cider, It's ok, it's a fad, a gimmick, for very little their new favourite, but for most a try it once product (from the publicans btw), C+C spent a bloomin fortune promoting the stuff! Kopparberg have been producing arguably better fruit ciders for years and never set the drinks market on fire now did they?

    C'mon now lads, strategy based on Irish weather ;) But the more we're all f**ked by the recession – the more we'll drink, we are Irish remember? :p

    In all seriousness, if you have made a few quick 'cider vouchers' on the pear cider rally then fair dues, I hope you cashed out near or just after the peak, if you're looking for a long term riser out of recession (once we get over the current dip then buy in IMO) it's a fair guess that it will continue to steadily rise (as it has done before pear) IMHO


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    The pear stuff is BIG in the UK (straight from the source too). Selling like crazy. Most seasoned cider drinkers I speak to from the UK are saying that the Kopperberg stuff is too sweet. The C&C dividend is the real threat though, especially in a downbeat market like this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 89 ✭✭✭ TTNYWWBM


    TTNYWWBM wrote: »
    I think the Pear Cider has inflated the sp since it's launch and while ago and it's falling back now.

    The pear cider, It's ok, it's a fad, a gimmick, for very little their new favourite, but for most a try it once product (from the publicans btw), C+C spent a bloomin fortune promoting the stuff! Kopparberg have been producing arguably better fruit ciders for years and never set the drinks market on fire now did they?

    C'mon now lads, strategy based on Irish weather ;) But the more we're all f**ked by the recession – the more we'll drink, we are Irish remember? :p

    In all seriousness, if you have made a few quick 'cider vouchers' on the pear cider rally then fair dues, I hope you cashed out near or just after the peak, if you're looking for a long term riser out of recession (once we get over the current dip then buy in IMO) it's a fair guess that it will continue to steadily rise (as it has done before pear) IMHO


    http://www.rte.ie/business/2009/0713/candc.html

    See this article on why the price has fallen so sharply.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    Does anyone know when the next trading update or press release will be?

    The share price seems to have hit resistance at around the €2.00-€2.05 level. Due a nice kick soon I'd imagine. Probably looking at a 7 cent dividend per share too this year which is rare in this environment.


  • Registered Users Posts: 418 ✭✭ Mort5000




  • Registered Users Posts: 870 ✭✭✭ woodseb


    their next update will probably be at its AGM on Aug 28th..........the correction to the update will be out the day after;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,149 Raskolnikov


    There was a very good article about C&C in The Phoenix. The thrust of the article was that if it wasn't for the fact that the current management team was so new, heads would have rolled after C&C filed dodgy accounts. The overall situation is still bad. Sales are falling and C&C have a massive amount of debt, especially since so much of their assets have been written down.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,509 Tiesto


    I hold about 400 shs foolishly bought at 5.30 and 3.70
    I'm thinking of liquidating and buying something else..
    Is there any reason why I should hold on?


  • Registered Users Posts: 84 ✭✭ makker


    08:28 27Aug09 RTRS-STOCKS NEWS EUROPE-Beer deal boosts Ireland's C&C 10 pct
    Irish drinks group C&C Group <GCC.I><GCC.L> jumps over 11 percent after it buys the Irish and Scottish businesses of Anheuser-Busch InBev <ABI.BR>, including Tennent's, Scotland's largest lager brand, for 205 million euros.
    "It looks like a very postive deal on the face of it," says one Dublin-based dealer. "It might go a small bit higher from here, maybe up 15 percent but it wouldn't go more than that."
    C&C said the deal would be immediately earnings accretive. Excluding the purchase, the group reiterated its guidance that full-year operating profit would be at the top end of previously stated guidance range of 77 million euros to 82 million euros.
    For Relevant Price Information, Double Click on one of these codes:<GCC.I> <GCC.L> <ABI.BR>
    Thursday, 27 August 2009 08:28:27RTRS [nLR714358] {EN}ENDS


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭ finisklin


    The market has responded very positively to the news that C&C are taking over AB's Tenneats brand in Ireland, UK & Scotland. The main advantage is scope economies with marketing and distribution coming to the fore. These include the responsiblity for Stella, Becks & Budweiser in NI & Scotland. That gives it a pretty serious portfolio and are now more than just a cider company! ;)

    Already some heavy volumes this am......over 8m shares traded!!!! Its at €2.50 now and interims coming tomorrow! :pac:

    From an investor persepctive its difficult to reconcile this initiative with the reporting fiasco in early July. Its certainly quelled any market fears over management's ability.....for the moment!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 562 Comordha


    Go on ya betsy, wish I had of bought more now haha


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,149 Raskolnikov


    With the huge amount of debt that has been taken on, you can forget about a dividend.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭ finisklin


    Its up to €2.70 now with under 3m shares traded......Yesterday there was massive volumes traded >10m.

    How long will this momentum sustain itself? The resistance over the last two days has been minimal. I reckon it could go to €3.


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