Impressive - Martin Fagan

pgibbo

A friend just passed on this link to a training session that Martin Fagan did. Awesome running. Them boys are fairly clipping along. :eek:

MCOS

Dem boys are stick insects :eek:

53.8 on the 16th rep... ffs!

Running Bing

Impressive, seems like a great group to train with.

I see MF's 3m half marathon record is up now:

http://www.flotrack.org/videos/coverage/view_video/234559-2009-3m-half-marathon/129963-3m-half-race-footage

tang1

Take it that it was him that won a 10k in Westmeath yesterday in 32.25. Results on precision timing.

johnruns

Great to have a drug cheat back on the scene:(

pconn062

johnruns wrote: »

Great to have a drug cheat back on the scene:(

Whatever your opinion about the man, he has served his ban and is free to compete if he so wishes.

dublin runner

pconn062 wrote: »

Whatever your opinion about the man, he has served his ban and is free to compete if he so wishes.

Agreed. Served his time, time to move on. Deserves a second chance in my opinion.

johnruns

yea just a shame the athletes records he broke,championships he denied them or international vests they will never get now cant get a second chance ah but he was "depressed" and sure only did it the once.

Chivito550

johnruns wrote: »

yea just a shame the athletes records he broke,championships he denied them or international vests they will never get now cant get a second chance ah but he was "depressed" and sure only did it the once.

To be fair, whatever records and vests you are talking about were almost certainly related to a time long before he took EPO.

johnruns

Chivito550 wrote: »

To be fair, whatever records and vests you are talking about were almost certainly related to a time long before he took EPO.

To be fair that's true if you believe what the drug cheat says.

Chivito550

johnruns wrote: »

To be fair that's true if you believe what the drug cheat says.

I don't believe what he says. But I also don't believe he was taking PED's for most of his career, when such records, championship titles and vests were achieved.

drquirky

Served his time - move on

nerraw1111

drquirky wrote: »

Served his time - move on

Woah. That's ridiculously over simplifying the issue.

There is no "move on" scenario here. Regardless of how you view any case of doping. No-one moves on from doping.

corny

drquirky wrote: »

Served his time - move on

He's earned the condemnation as far as i'm concerned. No i'd prefer not to move on.

rom

Back on the scene is not doing a 10k where 6 people break 40 mins. FFS parkrun is more competitive than that. Is he allowed do fun runs or sponsored walks? Come back to me when he enters a competitive race.

dublin runner

rom wrote: »

Back on the scene is not doing a 10k where 6 people break 40 mins. FFS parkrun is more competitive than that. Is he allowed do fun runs or sponsored walks? Come back to me when he enters a competitive race.

Not exactly his fault (6 under 40min) but I get your point. Where he takes it from here will be interesting though. I'd imagine his thinking was get back into racing by entering some of the lesser known races first.

thirstywork2

rom wrote: »

Back on the scene is not doing a 10k where 6 people break 40 mins. FFS parkrun is more competitive than that. Is he allowed do fun runs or sponsored walks? Come back to me when he enters a competitive race.

The reality is he can compete in whatever race he chooses and even if he jumped in a competitive race and did well im sure people will question the result.

rom

thirstywork2 wrote: »

The reality is he can compete in whatever race he chooses and even if he jumped in a competitive race and did well I am sure people will question the result.

Of course they will and so they should but he still remains a talented runner. Should he just stop running to make people happy? We live in a society of 2nd chances. He will always have this hanging over him.

PVincent

Fagan won a 5k in Coralstown on Wednesday night in 14.45( hand timed) . He has clearly been working very hard. Lindie Naughton mentions that he is targeting Dublin Marathon.

pconn062

PVincent wrote: »

Fagan won a 5k in Coralstown on Wednesday night in 14.45( hand timed) . He has clearly been working very hard. Lindie Naughton mentions that he is targeting Dublin Marathon.

I predict a serious sh*t-storm if he targets Dublin. Mainly from other Irish runners targeting the national champs. Fagan in any sort of shape would be big favourite.

average_runner

pconn062 wrote: »

I predict a serious sh*t-storm if he targets Dublin. Mainly from other Irish runners targeting the national champs. Fagan in any sort of shape would be big favourite.

Did the crime, did the time according to the rules.
Rest cant say a thing

pconn062

average_runner wrote: »

Did the crime, did the time according to the rules.
Rest cant say a thing

I agree with the time/crime thing. I guarantee you that won't stop other athletes commenting though, particularly if he targets Dublin.

nobody told me

Suppose they can comment all they like. Would fagan care what 2:17/2:18 marathon runners think of him?

eliwallach

PVincent wrote: »

Fagan won a 5k in Coralstown on Wednesday night in 14.45( hand timed) . He has clearly been working very hard. Lindie Naughton mentions that he is targeting Dublin Marathon.

Good for him.
Hope he wins it.

robinph

No problem with him running.
Would have a problem with him competing for prizes.

If someone previously banned wanted to get money from a race then I think the only way that would feel comfortable for me would be to run as a pacemaker for someone else. They get to run, which we all understand the joy of doing so shouldn't be stopped form doing that, but call pacemaking their "community service" equivalent.

Being allowed to compete again is not on, everyone knows the rules. I don't see a need for second chances.

eliwallach

robinph wrote: »

No problem with him running.

everyone knows the rules. I don't see a need for second chances.

Indeed, and it's those rules which allow him to compete after serving his ban.
Dem's the rules.

pconn062

eliwallach wrote: »

Indeed, and it's those rules which allow him to compete after serving his ban.
Dem's the rules.

Everyone knows the rules, and no one is disputing them (although they are far too lenient). However rules have nothing to do with his credibility in the running community which is forever tarnished. I, for one, would not be happy to see him ahead of our other clean Irish athletes in the Dublin marathon. It would be within the rules to for him to compete, but rules do not change people's perception of the crime.

And I'm saying all these things as a former fan of Fagan as an athlete whose career I followed for years.

robinph

There is surely nothing to say that a race has to allow him to compete, or that a club has to let him join their ranks? Does AAI have to let him register with them?

I'd be infavour of the position that the British Olympic Association tried to take in not allowing the likes of Chambers to compete for them, unfortunately the decision of a court went against them, but they had the right idea in that you may be able to run again, but you ain't going to do so in our colours.

yosser hughes

robinph wrote: »

No problem with him running.
Would have a problem with him competing for prizes.

If someone previously banned wanted to get money from a race then I think the only way that would feel comfortable for me would be to run as a pacemaker for someone else. They get to run, which we all understand the joy of doing so shouldn't be stopped form doing that, but call pacemaking their "community service" equivalent.

Being allowed to compete again is not on, everyone knows the rules. I don't see a need for second chances.

Everyone knows the rules? You don't obviously. You've no problem with him running though? How very noble of you.

johnruns

nobody told me wrote: »

Suppose they can comment all they like. Would fagan care what 2:17/2:18 marathon runners think of him?

I doubt many Drugs Cheats care what other athletes think of them.

nobody told me

johnruns wrote: »

I doubt many Drugs Cheats care what other athletes think of them.

I was commenting on a post that what other runners might think of him.
Martin fagan made a mistake, everyone in life makes mistakes, maybe his was made in the public eye and that makes it easier for people to comment.

Life is short.

Clum

You're all getting way ahead of yourselves. If his come back plans include a marathon he's learned nothing in his career. 1 finish from 4 and the one he finished injured him badly. His track record suggests a dnf in Dublin, if he makes the starting line.

robinph

yosser hughes wrote: »

Everyone knows the rules? You don't obviously. You've no problem with him running though? How very noble of you.

Aware of the rules. Doesn't mean that they are right though.

average_runner

Clum wrote: »

You're all getting way ahead of yourselves. If his come back plans include a marathon he's learned nothing in his career. 1 finish from 4 and the one he finished injured him badly. His track record suggests a dnf in Dublin, if he makes the starting line.

Thought alot of that was down to his coach training methods?

average_runner

robinph wrote: »

Aware of the rules. Doesn't mean that they are right though.

Did u ever make a bad mistake but was forgiven?
Now if he does again its goodbye

robinph

Goes to see what direction the group is thinking in the Tyson Gay / Russian marathon runner (who I'm not going to try and spell on the mobile) thread...


Hmm, so one guy should get a more severe ban, but our guy is alright really and just took a couple of bad cchoices and should be let back in.

These threads are normally a lot more critical in their opinion of the drug cheat, the ban handed out and what they should be allowed to do after the ban.

Clum

average_runner wrote: »

Thought alot of that was down to his coach training methods?

Maybe, but his last marathon was with a different coach to his first few. He had no difficulties running cross country or shorter road races (10k to half mara) under either coach so I think it's the marathons that didn't suit him, not the coaches.

Robin, I don't condone his return, just making observations on his previous form.

rom

If those in our society get a 2nd chance. An example is someone who drink drives and kills someone. An example from the other day. http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/civil-engineer-who-killed-man-while-drunk-driving-wrong-way-down-dual-carriageway-jailed-for-three-years-30236422.html

He gets a 15 years driving ban on top of a 3 years in Jail. If he is allowed behind the wheel of a car again then a drug cheat should get to run again. IMHO both should get life bans but this is how our society works.

curtisbrown

There's an interview with Fagan in yesterday's Irish Times, I can't post the link

Krusty_Clown

curtisbrown wrote: »

There's an interview with Fagan in yesterday's Irish Times, I can't post the link

Wondered how long it would be, before this thread was resurrected. I expect there will be some heated debate over the next couple of days. Here's the article: Irish Times.

And just for those who don't know yet, he won the Terenure 5 mile today, in a time of 24:23, out sprinting Freddy Sittuk. He was 30 seconds ahead of Joe Sweeney, so he seems to be in really good form. As a former hero of mine, I'm very much on the fence every time I hear a positive race result. I think it's great to see him re-gain his confidence and racing form, but I'm not sure how much I welcome the results. It's almost a shame that reformed drug-cheats who have served their time can't compete in a separete class in a race, that would allow them to compete against everyone else, but not enjoy the plaudits or rewards.

career_move

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Wondered how long it would be, before this thread was resurrected. I expect there will be some heated debate over the next couple of days. Here's the article: Irish Times.

And just for those who don't know yet, he won the Terenure 5 mile today, in a time of 24:23, out sprinting Freddy Sittuk. He was 30 seconds ahead of Joe Sweeney, so he seems to be in really good form. As a former hero of mine, I'm very much on the fence every time I hear a positive race result. I think it's great to see him re-gain his confidence and racing form, but I'm not sure how much I welcome the results. It's almost a shame that reformed drug-cheats who have served their time can't compete in a separete class in a race, that would allow them to compete against everyone else, but not enjoy the plaudits or rewards.

Thanks for the link. Nice article. Not too sure about the bit in bold though. It seems a bit patronising or something - ya we'll let you play with us but in a different part of the yard sort of thing He obviously trains as hard or harder than anyone else why shouldn't he get the plaudits and rewards for being the best on the day?

paddybarry

I can only imagine how tough it is struggling with a mental illness. I could easily see how someone could make some bad choices in that state of mind.

Should they have to pay for that mistake for the rest of their days? I dont think so. The shame and embarrashment is punishment enough, especially for someone who was revered in their chosen sport.

The lad made a mistake, held his hands up, took his punishment.

He now deserves a second chance. I hope he goes on and achieve great things.

groovyg

I wish he would stop giving interviews to Ian o Riordain and playing the friggin victim card.

rovers_runner

paddybarry wrote: »

I can only imagine how tough it is struggling with a mental illness. I could easily see how someone could make some bad choices in that state of mind.

Should they have to pay for that mistake for the rest of their days? I dont think so. The shame and embarrashment is punishment enough, especially for someone who was revered in their chosen sport.

The lad made a mistake, held his hands up, took his punishment.

He now deserves a second chance. I hope he goes on and achieve great things.

Why does mental illness serve as an excuse or reason even for breaking the rules in what was not a life or death situation. He was blessed with talent for a sport and chose to cheat to gain an advantage over his competition. IMHO it should be one strike and you are out, enter for fun if you like but never have the right to compete again.

He knowingly took the risk and has ruined his reputation and the faith people put in athlethes in general.

It's a sad day for any race organizer when a drug cheat turns up and wins against honest people. I feel very sorry for sportsworld and their race which has history.

overpronator

misread that post

paddybarry

rovers_runner wrote: »

Why does mental illness serve as an excuse or reason even for breaking the rules in what was not a life or death situation. He was blessed with talent for a sport and chose to cheat to gain an advantage over his competition. IMHO it should be one strike and you are out, enter for fun if you like but never have the right to compete again.

He knowingly took the risk and has ruined his reputation and the faith people put in athlethes in general.

It's a sad day for any race organizer when a drug cheat turns up and wins against honest people. I feel very sorry for sportsworld and their race which has history.

Mental illness is not an excuse. However, I can see how someone suffering mental illness can make bad choices. I dont think that such choices should result in 'life sentence'.

I have never suffered from a mental illness but in my job as a teacher, I have come across students who have had mental illnesses. It is really frightening the hold it can take over someone.

career_move

rovers_runner wrote: »

It's a sad day for any race organizer when a drug cheat turns up and wins against honest people. I feel very sorry for sportsworld and their race which has history.

Please spare us the sanctimonious rubbish. Sportsworld obviously have no problem with him if they invited him

rovers_runner

career_move wrote: »

Please spare us the sanctimonious rubbish. Sportsworld obviously have no problem with him if they invited him

Do you know that for sure ?
Wouldn't have thought anyone would queue up to invite a drugs cheat to head the field of their race...

career_move

rovers_runner wrote: »

Do you know that for sure ?
Wouldn't have thought anyone would queue up to invite a drugs cheat to head the field of their race...

As per the Irish times article

There are others who believe Fagan still has the talent which in 2009 saw him break John Treacy’s Irish half-marathon record, when running 60 minutes and 57 seconds for the 13.1 miles. They include the organisers of some better-known road races, including tomorrow’s Terenure 5 mile who have invited Fagan to run. He hopes he can return that favour by delivering a decent performance.

rovers_runner

career_move wrote: »

As per the Irish times article

There are others who believe Fagan still has the talent which in 2009 saw him break John Treacy’s Irish half-marathon record, when running 60 minutes and 57 seconds for the 13.1 miles. They include the organisers of some better-known road races, including tomorrow’s Terenure 5 mile who have invited Fagan to run. He hopes he can return that favour by delivering a decent performance.

I take my point back so, pity that some people are willing to allow this carry on.
Hope the Donore lads tell him where to go...

menoscemo

rovers_runner wrote: »

Do you know that for sure ?
Wouldn't have thought anyone would queue up to invite a drugs cheat to head the field of their race...

Yes, they announced earlier in the week on their FB page that they were inviting him.
https://www.facebook.com/terenure5mile/photos/a.722328414486453.1073741828.312594505459848/759341677451793/?type=1&theater