9/11 Opinion Poll - Whodunnit?

Kama

I'm highly sceptical of the 'all the Jews went home' theory. Assuming you had a conspiracy, telling all the members of your ethnic group to clear off is...problematic, and hardly a good strategy for an effective action. Unless you think that Teh Joos has a HiveMind...

Anyone got anything hard to confirm or refute?

(I'm a little depressed that I managed to find a list of Filipino deaths, but am as yet unable to find a comprehensie list of Jewish. Trawling through http://edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/lists/by-name atm. Where's Diogenes when you need him?)

2 Cohens, a Keohane, 1 Levi...Abraham Nethaniel Liebowitz...a Shai...Barry Simowitz, well, it'd be a lie to say I'm happy after only getting 6 likely suspects in a 10 mins trawl, but at least 'No Joos Died' is I think refuted. >< More than that is more effort than I want to go to this night...

Methodology: only the names Cohen, Levi, or Israel are near-certainly of Jewish origin, so I'm erring against false positives. Abraham Nethaniel seems pretty likely. Shai is a Hebrew name meaning 'gift', Simowitz is slightly less sure but highly probable. Many will be the Slavic or German names, but I'm unable to confirm any of these. Still, out of 2800-odd people, and a random trawl getting more than zero, can we discount the 'no joos died' theory yet?

Mahatma coat

Oh Me too Kama, but Just like the 'No Plane hit the Pentagon' Theory this one should be easy to refute, yet all you will seem to get is this incredulity that the question was even asked without any form of confirmation or denial, seriously its like they have something to hide

<edit>
Curious, The only Israeli Listed on that site was on Flight 175 not in the WTC


Dunno where Diogenes is tho, he's not banned at the moment
</edit>

Kama

Bah, google is not your friend on these matters...nothing but white supremacist sites going 'OMG JOOS 911', or 'sceptic' sites with precisely zero content that was in any way empirical, or referenced in any way.

Dunno which is worse tbh, both come out looking like pathetic caricatures...anyone gets a definitive list ever, pm me.

road_2_damascus

Happy Monday wrote: »

You cannot be serious!
The state of Israel's existence is dependent upon the US where its power base is New York.
This was an attack carried out by 19/20 Saudis masterminded by Osama bin Laden.
Even your poll suggests a large majority of Palestinians believe Osama did it.

The Palestinians do not have the same access to information they way we do, their internet is restricted. Watch the internet film called Loose Change, then come back to us with your better informed opinion

K-9

It was the IRA, to take pressure of them over the Peace Process and decommissioning.

Create a different enemy for the USA and UK.

Sofa_King Good

Hardly conclusive but the best I could find is 1 Israeli +

"A senior Jewish journalist friend called me before the first anniversary of 9/11 and said to me: 'You have to do something about the Arab concept that the Jews are responsible for 9/11. Can you find out how many Jews were killed there?'"

500 Jews Killed on 9/11

"A week later I called him and said 'about 500,' which is 15 to 17 percent of all the victims killed in the World Trade Center.

And Interestingly -

"The figure would have been even higher had it not been for the fact that many Orthodox Jews went to work an hour later because of the Selichot prayers recited in the days before the Jewish New Year."
http://www.jcpa.org/phas/phas-13.htm

The bigger question would be how many millionaires/billionaires lost their lives

Sofa_King Good

its a lot easier to find info on muslim casualties, can't imagine why?

http://islam.about.com/blvictims.htm

Quoted in the Jerusalem Post Sept 12th

"The Foreign Ministry in Jerusalem has so far received the names of 4,000 Israelis believed to have been in the areas of the World Trade Center and the Pentagon at the time of the attack." -- Shimon Perez

None Died, thankfully.

K-9

http://stnjs.civicactions.net/politics/story/2008/02/11/i-r-meets-p-l-o

IRA Meeting Palestinians.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1151116.ece

RIRA links with Palestinian militants

http://www.b92.net/eng/news/globe-article.php?yyyy=2006&mm=09&dd=07&nav_category=117

SF meets Hamas

Sofa_King Good

Bush meets Sharon

[IMG]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/MADELE%7E2/LOKALA%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.jpg[/IMG]

Sofa_King Good

Seanies32 wrote: »

It was the IRA, to take pressure of them over the Peace Process and decommissioning.

Create a different enemy for the USA and UK.

I thought you were taking the piss

Kama

I found plenty of uncorroborated figures, ranging from zero (the white supremacists), to 250-400 (deadlinked NYT), and so on. The sceptic/debunkers let me down I has to say, long on rhetoric short on facts.

Meh, tbh this is why I steer clear of a lot of this side of the thing...I find stuff like the Put options far more interesting.

Thread on these lines on the Randi forums was fairly unhelpful, they called each other Nazis inside of the first page, and questioned the motive of the guy asking, who wanted to debunk the '4000 joos stay home' meme. Only worthwhile post is

there were 6 Jewish members of FDNY (primary Irish/Italian Catholic), including Steve Belson, driver and aide to Battalion Chief Orio Palmer. Belson can be heard (and spoken to by Chief Palmer) on tapes of radio communications. Abraham (Avram) Zelmanowitz was programmer at Blue Cross...Glenn Winnuk was a lawyer at Holland and Knight...Richard Pearlman was only 18, messanger at law firm

I'd crosscheck the names, but the site won't connect, presumably due to a lizzard plot to stop the Truth!

Sofa_King Good

Seanies32 wrote: »

http://stnjs.civicactions.net/politics/story/2008/02/11/i-r-meets-p-l-o

IRA Meeting Palestinians.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1151116.ece

RIRA links with Palestinian militants

http://www.b92.net/eng/news/globe-article.php?yyyy=2006&mm=09&dd=07&nav_category=117

SF meets Hamas

What is wrong with meeting a democratically elected government to discuss peace?

K-9

Sofa_King Good wrote: »

I thought you were taking the piss

Well, the IRA have always had links to Ghadaffi, Arafat etc.

As Per my last post, look at the more recent links.

The IRA has always had empathy with Palestinians, even to this day.

K-9

Sofa_King Good wrote: »

What is wrong with meeting a democratically elected government to discuss peace?

Nothing whatsoever. One democratically elected Govt. meeting another!

Kernel

It would have to have been done with some involvement from the US Government.

Happy Monday

road_2_damascus wrote: »

The Palestinians do not have the same access to information they way we do, their internet is restricted. Watch the internet film called Loose Change, then come back to us with your better informed opinion

And what information source are you using?
The attacks on people in the occupied terriorities were recently carried out by pro Hamas Arab governments in the region.
They had a lot to gain and blamed the poor Israelis in the process.
I'll expect you and the other Arabs to issue apologies to Israel in due course.

Black Swan

What an amusing thread. Serious competition for the red tops at checkout!

Mahatma coat

Happy Monday wrote: »

And what information source are you using?
The attacks on people in the occupied terriorities were recently carried out by pro Hamas Arab governments in the region.
They had a lot to gain and blamed the poor Israelis in the process.
I'll expect you and the other Arabs to issue apologies to Israel in due course.

...........................................................................

humanji

Blue_Lagoon wrote: »

What an amusing thread. Serious competition for the red tops at checkout!

It's not funny, just disturbing.

thecommander

road_2_damascus wrote: »

Watch the internet film called Loose Change, then come back to us with your better informed opinion

Its comical that when the media is mentioned the CTers always tell us not to believe what you're told, yet Loose Change & Zeitgeist are taken as canon to world events.

Diogenes

,8,1 wrote: »

The repeated assertions of the White House and the Media Complex do not make irrefutable absolute truth.

But again - if you are a biased party you will not want to know this.

,8,1 wrote: »

I think there's considerably more evidence for Israel doing 9/11.



Israeli firms owning the contracts for airport security and Ground Zero cleanup are hard cold facts. A Zionist Israeli by the name of Larry Silverstein owning the WTC Complex is a also hard cold fact.

You'll find the above quoted on conspiracy theory websites, as you will on newspapers such as the New York Times.

Do you know of any huge fluffy bunnies with these crucial corporate relationships?

Please explain how this relationships were "crucial" The towers were destroyed by two jetliners that crashed into them and the subsequent fires, please explain, who leased the towers, and who was involved in the clean up were "crucial".

Also the dancing jews? Loose Change? 2005 called and they want their thread back.

Diogenes

Kernel wrote: »

It would have to have been done with some involvement from the US Government.

Um why?

toiletduck

humanji wrote: »

It's not funny, just disturbing.

Are you really surprised though?

road_2_damascus

it was Ryanair

Kama

Aer Lingus trying to frame Ryanair!

Ryanair wouldn't do it, it had to have government involvement, everyone knows that!

Aer Lingus, with the assistance of the IRA, in the Library, with the Lead Pipe!
Does I wins yet? :rolleyes:

,8,1

Please explain how this relationships were "crucial" The towers were destroyed by two jetliners that crashed into them and the subsequent fires, please explain, who leased the towers, and who was involved in the clean up were "crucial".

Well if you have access to airport security then you have the logistical means to pull 9/11 off. With the contract for clean up, you have the means to cover it up. Owning the building striken, you have the means to arm it with explosives, or otherwise cause the events to go to plan. That's why it's crucial.

Also the dancing jews? Loose Change? 2005 called and they want their thread back.

As far as I know there's nothing about the dancing Israelis in Jones/Bermas' Loose Change.

Diogenes

,8,1 wrote: »

Well if you have access to airport security then you have the logistical means to pull 9/11 off.

The hijackers purchased regular tickets, and were armed with small knifes that were acceptable to carry on planes before 911.

How would "access to airport security" be necessary for such a plan?

With the contract for clean up, you have the means to cover it up.

Would you like the list of federal and state agencies that had access to ground zero at the same time, and before the clean up started. Are all the thousands of people who worked at ground zero and contributed to rescue efforts involved?

Owning the building striken, you have the means to arm it with explosives, or otherwise cause the events to go to plan. That's why it's crucial.

You don't believe that the airplanes and subsequent fires caused the collapse? Where's your evidence that explosives were used or necessary. Do you know how long and complicated it is to wire a building with explosives. Can you tell me how large the largest building to be demolished is? Do you know how long it took. What kinds of explosives were used.

As far as I know there's nothing about the dancing Israelis in Jones/Bermas' Loose Change.

Which version of Loose Change have you seen? 1st Edition, 2nd Edition, or Final Cut? Did you know Bermas and Jones have publicly admitted there are mistakes and flaws in their film(s)?

Sofa_King Good

Happy Monday wrote: »

And what information source are you using?

Happy Monday wrote: »

The attacks on people in the occupied terriorities were recently carried out by pro Hamas Arab governments in the region.

eh, the only pro Hamas Governemnt in the region are Hamas.

Happy Monday wrote: »

They had a lot to gain and blamed th äpoor Israelis in the process.

Those poor, poor Israelis...are you for real?

Happy Monday wrote: »

I'll expect you and the other Arabs to issue apologies to Israel in due course.

You sound quite angry - Can I reccomend a song to calm you down before some local sikh gets attacked for being a muslim - http://english.wafa.ps/?action=detail&id=12575



And this was before there was 750,00 refugees.

PALESTINE:

[SIZE=-1]PALESTINE (West Bank and Gaza)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]PS - 2,611,904 population - Territory size: 6,242 sq km[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]Capital City: not available - population (n/a)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]355,500 users as of Mar/08, 13.6 % penetration, per ITU.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]25,800 Broadband Internet connections as of Sept/07, per ITU[/SIZE]

VS

IRELAND

I R E L A N D

[SIZE=-1]IE - 4,156,119 population - Country Area: 70,273 sq km[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]Capital city: Dublin - population 1,036,724 ('07)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]2,060,000 Internet users as of March/05, 49.6% p.r., per C.I.Almanac[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]653,000 Broadband subscribers as of June/07, per OECD, 15.9% p.r.[/SIZE]

Happy Monday

Sofa_King Good wrote: »

Happy Monday wrote: »

And You sound quite angry - Can I reccomend a song to calm you down before some local sikh gets attacked for being a muslim - http://english.wafa.ps/?action=detail&id=12575

Oh man and I've already torched that mosque.
Still - I can blame the Israelis for it! :pac:
To suggest that Israel - the beacon of the democracy and free thinking in the Middle East - carried out these attacks is madness.
Two generations from the concentration camps they have built an open, liberal, inclusive and progressive democracy in an area in which Arabs have practiced suppression, misogny, repression and denial of rights.
The US will also support Israel as an ally - from Truman to Obama.
Why bomb on 9/11?

Happy Monday

Sofa_King Good wrote: »

And You sound quite angry - Can I reccomend a song to calm you down before some local sikh gets attacked for being a muslim - http://english.wafa.ps/?action=detail&id=12575

Oh man and I've already torched that mosque.
Still - I can blame the Israelis for it! :pac:
To suggest that Israel - the beacon of the democracy and free thinking in the Middle East - carried out these attacks is madness.
Two generations from the concentration camps they have built an open, liberal, inclusive and progressive democracy in an area in which Arabs have practiced suppression, misogny, repression and denial of rights.
The US will also support Israel as an ally - from Truman to Obama.
Why bomb on 9/11?