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TII Motorway Service Areas (MSA) Progress Thread

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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,204 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    First MSA of Tranche 3 has been approved at Ringaskiddy on the M28. Will likely be built in conjunction with te motorway


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,981 ✭✭✭ tylercheribini


    From today's Gorey Guardian.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,299 ✭✭✭ serfboard


    From today's Gorey Guardian.
    There are serious questions to be asked of Transport Infrastructure Ireland and how they handled this process
    What about the serious questions to be asked of Applegreen and how they delayed the opening of the station with their legal carry-on? Why don't you ask that question?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 26,661 ✭✭✭✭ OldMrBrennan83


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,745 ✭✭✭✭ JupiterKid


    From today's Gorey Guardian.

    Long, long overdue. Now when will they get cracking on completing the other unfinished services?


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  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    Does Cllr Mythen think that TII funds local healthcare or that leaving the site unsecured would have been a good idea?

    Byrne trying to claim credit for something done on a national scale when he's a councillor; and the project that started this MSA was the pet project of the then minister with responsibility for funding it, from the same constituency is also particularly rich. His influence on it and my influence on it were identical (at nil), can I get my name on the front of the paper?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,299 ✭✭✭ serfboard


    Patww79 wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    If they had a fair reason to take it to court then why didn't they take it all the way?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 26,661 ✭✭✭✭ OldMrBrennan83


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 903 ✭✭✭ Wetasanotter


    serfboard wrote: »
    If they had a fair reason to take it to court then why didn't they take it all the way?

    Settlements are the norm, not the exception.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,885 ✭✭✭ Chris_5339762


    They knew full well what they were doing, merely forcing it to stay closed as long as possible.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,584 ✭✭✭ blackwhite


    serfboard wrote: »
    If they had a fair reason to take it to court then why didn't they take it all the way?

    The “challenge” served its purpose.

    Applegreen north of Ashford has had a good number of years as the closest thing to “online” along the M11, and is probably close to having paid back it’s initial investment at this stage.

    Same as M9, Applegreen Paulstown has a good 3/4 years before Topaz got their Carlow services opened, and the online services at Kilcullen are still lying dormant


  • Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭ Reuben1210


    blackwhite wrote: »
    The “challenge” served its purpose.

    Applegreen north of Ashford has had a good number of years as the closest thing to “online” along the M11, and is probably close to having paid back it’s initial investment at this stage.

    Same as M9, Applegreen Paulstown has a good 3/4 years before Topaz got their Carlow services opened, and the online services at Kilcullen are still lying dormant

    Exactly - a perfectly executed business protection move, taking advantage of the slowness and inefficiency of our planning/legal nexus!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,584 ✭✭✭ blackwhite


    Reuben1210 wrote: »
    Exactly - a perfectly executed business protection move, taking advantage of the slowness and inefficiency of our planning/legal nexus!

    Online MSAs in other countries typically have a payback period between 3-5 years, I’d be surprised if Applegreen have longer than 5-7 year payback at most on their off-line sites. Delays have definitely protected footfall on their sites for long enough to make it more than worthwhile.


  • Registered Users Posts: 903 ✭✭✭ Wetasanotter


    It is possible to seek damages for a vexatious/frivolous claim. Topaz did not do so.

    That the taxpayer are the ones left paying for the costs of the delay is a reflection of the poor tendering process that TII/NTA conducted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,981 ✭✭✭ tylercheribini


    Will future Circle K service area vendors most likely be McDonald's?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,299 ✭✭✭ serfboard


    That the taxpayer are the ones left paying for the costs of the delay is a reflection of the poor tendering process that TII/NTA conducted.
    How do you know it was a poor tendering process?

    Are you saying that if it was a good tendering process (whatever that is) and Applegreen lost, that they would not have taken their legal action?

    If so, God love your innocence.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,299 ✭✭✭ serfboard


    Will future Circle K service area vendors most likely be McDonald's?
    Based on what's been built so far, it looks like Circle K featuring McDonalds Vs Applegreen featuring BK.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,558 ✭✭✭✭ flazio


    Plus all the "plazas" with Supermacs. Although less loyal with the fuel suppliers, at least one is Texaco while the rest are Topaz.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,204 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    The Plaza Group seem to be expanding without playing any part in the official TII MSA tendering, they seem to be doing well out of it today.

    It's fully how back in the day the viability of some of these service areas were questioned. We'll soon have one at every junction and there'll still be demand for more.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,087 ✭✭✭ roadmaster


    Did the whole issue with applegreen and topaz come from applegreen lodging a complaint about the thickness of footpaths?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,635 ✭✭✭ plodder


    serfboard wrote: »
    How do you know it was a poor tendering process?

    Are you saying that if it was a good tendering process (whatever that is) and Applegreen lost, that they would not have taken their legal action?

    If so, God love your innocence.
    Applegreen have appealed a planning decision for another filling station in Swords (where they have two already). They seem to be quite protective of their territories.


  • Registered Users Posts: 903 ✭✭✭ Wetasanotter


    serfboard wrote: »
    How do you know it was a poor tendering process?

    Are you saying that if it was a good tendering process (whatever that is) and Applegreen lost, that they would not have taken their legal action?

    If so, God love your innocence.

    Because a transparent and safe tendering process would not have been able to generate such legal activity. One of the core aims of a tendering process is to protect against legal action by unsuccessful tenderers.

    You probably shouldn't talk about innocence unless your intention is to be unintentionally ironic, YMMV though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,885 ✭✭✭ Chris_5339762


    There is now a new sign on the N7 outbound. The old one said "No online services ahead, offline services at x y and z". Now the new sign says "Services ahead at Birdhill, junction number, and distance".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 26,661 ✭✭✭✭ OldMrBrennan83


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,584 ✭✭✭ blackwhite


    flazio wrote: »
    Plus all the "plazas" with Supermacs. Although less loyal with the fuel suppliers, at least one is Texaco while the rest are Topaz.

    Plazas are a Supermacs led development, not Topaz/Circle K.

    They work as a “dealer” and just buy fuel from Topaz/Circle K and licence the branding etc.
    Hence the shops aren’t the ReStore brand.

    Approx 2 years ago there was an exclusive deal for McD to be Topaz partner on an fast food developments owned by Topaz. Based on Carlow I’d assume it’s still the case


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,501 ✭✭✭ secman


    roadmaster wrote: »
    Did the whole issue with applegreen and topaz come from applegreen lodging a complaint about the thickness of footpaths?

    The judicial review was to ask why on a countback having scored equally in overall tender why the footpath was the deciding factor in awarding the contract to the then Topaz group.
    The fit out on M11 station is to start in early August and McDonald's will be in that site too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭ Ernest


    There is now a new sign on the N7 outbound. The old one said "No online services ahead, offline services at x y and z". Now the new sign says "Services ahead at Birdhill, junction number, and distance".

    That sounds, in one way, a disimprovement. Has the old sign saying "No online services ahead, offline services at x,y, and z" now actually been removed??

    If the new sign was additional to the old ond and said "Offline service ahead at Birdhill, junction No and distance" that would be helpful but if the old sign showing alternative service areas ahead including whether they are offline or online has been replaced by this new one, then this is a disgrace - removing information about choice and suggesting only one (off-line) service area option.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,981 ✭✭✭ tylercheribini


    secman wrote: »
    The fit out on M11 station is to start in early August

    Source?


  • Registered Users Posts: 646 ✭✭✭ s14driftking


    It should be compulsory fir any service station on a motorway to provide showers espically if there providing truck parking. Disgraceful that very few premises have showers


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,349 ✭✭✭ ezra_


    It should be compulsory fir any service station on a motorway to provide showers espically if there providing truck parking. Disgraceful that very few premises have showers

    What online motorway service stations don't have showers?


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