Undeniable Chemtrail Evidence

kippy

Hmmm,
One other thing that came into my head there......
Barium, is that what you are alleging is getting sprayed? And you are also alleging that this "barium" trail remains visible in the sky for "Days". ie it doesnt get dispersed.......by winnd for example? Theres not much that remains in the sky in a static location for "days" grid like or not. It may be more contrails the next day you see for a while.....and more again the next day, in the same place (seeing as flight paths dont change that much.
Well here is a Wiki page about Barium (granted it's wiki but its relatively laymans terms)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barium
And here also is a FAQ about it:
http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/tfacts24.html

I'd like you to let us know what type of barium you believe is being "sprayed" in the atmosphere?



For those of you taken in by this who chemtrail myth have a decent read here:
http://www.nmsr.org/chemtrls.htm
As well as all of the links off of it.
I would expect that you'd spend the same amount of time educating yourself about these things as you would in reading the links set forth by the OP already.

Kippy

Mahatma coat

Ah now they've gotten to Oscar, dude dont you know the second you look up and see them their magic mind control properties kick in frm 3K away and only effect you.

heres whats actualy happenin and how its kept so quiet

1) average Joes board regular plane
2) plane taxis down runway,
3) Plane takes off and begins ascent
4) Passengers on plane are hooked up to 'Inflight Entertainment' and subdued
5) Passenger jet is 'Beamed away' and replaced with tanker plane (which has the same markins as the original)
6) this Tanker is being flown by a Lizzzzard
7) the original passengers are held in a teleport buffer until the lizzards have done their thing and sprayed the population with a chemical that only affects us and not them
8) the passengers on the plane have their memories altered so that they recall a long and boring flight instead of the much more interestin truth
9) they are beamed down to their intended destination flightpath, (ever notice how most crashes happen close to airports? this is because thats the only point where humans are actually in control of the plane.)
10 ) all fatal crashes are planned and orchestrated by the Lizzzards to eliminate potential threats (CASEY, DONT FLY, they have you rumbled)



Lizzzard planes never land to refill, they are actualy interstellar spaceships that have holographic projection units to make em look like comercial jets, they drop in from high orbit and refill at the secret base on the dark side of the moon.

Aseth

I have only one problem with chemtrails conspiracy theory: if it is true and they are harmful/dangerous in any way to human then how you convince someone to spray them? I mean it's either done by unmaned crafts or someone steering them from a bunker :P
Pilots too have families, politicians as well, it's not as they can escape and live on the moon/under water or sth. If it's harmful it will affect every human being on earth including the ones that gave orders.

Kernel

Aseth wrote: »

I have only one problem with chemtrails conspiracy theory: if it is true and they are harmful/dangerous in any way to human then how you convince someone to spray them? I mean it's either done by unmaned crafts or someone steering them from a bunker :P

You convince them the same way the crew of the Enola Gaye were convinced to drop the H-bomb on a civilian city. Orders. Military are indoctrinated to follow order without question. As for not talking? Official secrets act. Would you like to lose your job and pension for talking out of school if you have a family to support? This of course assumes that the chemicals are dangerous to humans, and not a weather manipulation program, radar blocker or some other experiment. There's no evidence of mind control at all, I mean, the media does a good enough job at that already. Did you know that a lot of military pilots take amphetamines while flying missions?

http://lib.bioinfo.pl/pmid:7661838

Aseth

Kernel: what about the second part of my post/question?
Even if we assume the orders come from, lets say, president of US or some other officials, then still they are living here, among us and will be affected exactly in a same way.

Edit: I'm only considering at the moment that whatever they spray(if they do) in atmosphere is dangerous to our health/life.

beans

Whatever it is, it's pretty

bonkey

Kernel wrote: »

You convince them the same way the crew of the Enola Gaye were convinced to drop the H-bomb on a civilian city.

The crew of the Enola Gay had family in Hiroshima?

Orders. Military are indoctrinated to follow order without question.

Really?

Has this been properly tested? Have US military been asked to attack their own families, and been shown to do so without hesitation?

Because lets make no mistake here...family was the point that was raised, and this "follow orders" has been your answer to it.

As for not talking? Official secrets act. Would you like to lose your job and pension for talking out of school if you have a family to support?

If I understand this correctly...on one hand, you have these military types willing to do anything - including harming their own families - because they're ordered to. On the other hand, you have a need for an Official Secrets Act and fear for the very same family in order to prevent them talking about something they'll have been specifically ordered not to talk about.

That doesn't make sense.

I'm also a bit confused as to how you could find out about the strength of military indoctrination. Why wouldn't the military order people to be silent about that, and use the Official Secrets Act to scare them about it too? After all...why would anyone join the military knowing that they're going to be brainwashed into becoming a mindless drone?

This of course assumes that the chemicals are dangerous to humans, and not a weather manipulation program, radar blocker or some other experiment. There's no evidence of mind control at all, I mean, the media does a good enough job at that already.

There's no evidence of chemicals beyond what you'd find in normal exhaust either. How is it that you're willing to overlook that, but can cite the lack of evidence here as a reason to doubt something?

Did you know that a lot of military pilots take amphetamines while flying missions?

Why would they do that? They've been ordered to carry out a mission...what more could they possibly need?

tony 2 tone

So why would various aircraft from different companies be spraying chemicals? And why barium?

Kernel

bonkey wrote: »

The crew of the Enola Gay had family in Hiroshima?

No, but all humans are essentially related genetically speaking. So how do you convince a man to drop a nuclear weapon on a civilian city full of his fellow men? As I say, indoctrination and orders.

bonkey wrote: »

Has this been properly tested? Have US military been asked to attack their own families, and been shown to do so without hesitation?

Because lets make no mistake here...family was the point that was raised, and this "follow orders" has been your answer to it.

As I've said, you are assuming a lot if you assume that these chemtrails are harmful to the population. Compartmentalisation would also ensure that even if the chemicals were harmful, the pilots would probably not know about it.

bonkey wrote: »

If I understand this correctly...on one hand, you have these military types willing to do anything - including harming their own families - because they're ordered to. On the other hand, you have a need for an Official Secrets Act and fear for the very same family in order to prevent them talking about something they'll have been specifically ordered not to talk about.

Bonkey, with all respect, you are twisting my meaning in order to further one of your pedantic style arguments here. You are assuming too much. The pilots may not know that they are harming anyone, indeed, they may not be harming anyone. The pilots may also have no family, or have no family in the area being sprayed. As you aptly pointed out, the crew of the Enola Gaye had no family in Hiroshima and they had no problem dropping an atomic bomb on the city. The Official Secrets Act is a seperate issue ensuring that military personnel do not speak about orders which they are told not to speak about. If you knew anyone who is bound by such an act, then they will tell you that speaking out and risking their job and pension is a powerful method of prevention.

bonkey wrote: »

I'm also a bit confused as to how you could find out about the strength of military indoctrination. Why wouldn't the military order people to be silent about that, and use the Official Secrets Act to scare them about it too? After all...why would anyone join the military knowing that they're going to be brainwashed into becoming a mindless drone?

What's so confusing about having multiple layers of protection? Indoctrination, combined with misinformation, combined with compartmentalisation, combined with the legal protection of the Official Secrets Act? A solid system has multiple layers and procedures.
[/quote]

bonkey wrote: »

Why would they do that? They've been ordered to carry out a mission...what more could they possibly need?

They take amphetamines to maintain alertness and give them an edge while carrying out the missions. Read the link, or google it. It's all there.

Kernel

Aseth wrote: »

Kernel: what about the second part of my post/question?
Even if we assume the orders come from, lets say, president of US or some other officials, then still they are living here, among us and will be affected exactly in a same way.

As I've said to Bonkey, they may not be aware that they are doing anything harmful, or indeed the chemtrails themselves may not be harmful anyway. If I wanted poisonous or possibly harmful chemicals sprayed on civilians; I would screen pilots to select those who I know will follow orders without question, and are good at keeping their mouths shut about missions. Then I would tell them that they are taking part in a top secret radar manipulation program.
Blowback would not happen until many years later when rates of cancer were exploding (I could have a cover story ready for this in the form of another widespread agent - aspartame for example) and there is the possibility that some pilots would then come forward. But by that time, hey, it was a previous administration 30 years ago who did it, and we certainly wouldn't do anything like that nowadays.

bonkey

Kernel wrote: »

No, but all humans are essentially related genetically speaking. So how do you convince a man to drop a nuclear weapon on a civilian city full of his fellow men? As I say, indoctrination and orders.

Kernel....seriously....you're basically trying to argue here that the stranger on teh street means as much and as little to you as your family.

To put that in a context you'd perhaps associate with....do you hold the wellbeing of the NWO leaders that you believe are ruining this world as dearly as that of your parents, your partner, or your child? If not, then I would put it to you that you clearly can tell the difference between some nebulous, tenuous genetic association and family.

As I've said, you are assuming a lot if you assume that these chemtrails are harmful to the population.

I don't even assume they exist. I'm asking that whatever you posit their purpose to be, then you have to assume that those complicit in their usage are willinginly exposing themselves and their families to the same effects.

Bonkey, with all respect, you are twisting my meaning in order to further one of your pedantic style arguments here.

There's no twisting or pedanticism here at all, Kernel. I'm taking the argument that you put forward, and showing how it just doesn't make sense.

On one hand, you assert that people are brainwashed to the point where they will follow any order. You offered this argument in response to a question about them inflicting harm on their own family (a point you're not trying to distance yourself from). At the same time, you argued that legal protection and fear for their family was necessary to keep these brain-washed, blind-order-following automatons in line.

You can have one or the other, but not both.

The pilots may not know that they are harming anyone, indeed, they may not be harming anyone.

So then why are they remaining silent? What have they to hide?

The pilots may also have no family, or have no family in the area being sprayed.

At those altitudes, you have no control over where dispersed material would end up. Not only that, people like yourself who argue for the existence of chemtrails suggest that its happening everywhere.

The notion of spraying an area is ridiculous....as is the idea of some global-reaching plan where pilots involved in it wouldn't realise that they were involved in a globe-spanning operation.

But ok...at least you're recognising that your argument needs refining.

So now we have a secret (massive) group of pilots with no families, who have no idea what it is they're being asked to do, but who do so anyway. Not one of them is willing to disobey orders

The Official Secrets Act is a seperate issue ensuring that military personnel do not speak about orders which they are told not to speak about. If you knew anyone who is bound by such an act, then they will tell you that speaking out and risking their job and pension is a powerful method of prevention.

Wrong. The Official Secrets Act punishes people who do speak about things they're not supposed to. It does not ensure secrecy....it merely attempts to erect another barrier in an imperfect system.

Additionally - as I've noted - its existence proves false the notion of the army being some mass of automotons who will unquestionably do what they are told.

What's so confusing about having multiple layers of protection?

Nothing, as long as you implicitly acknowledge that the requirement for multiple layers is the imperfection of each and every layer. Once you acknowledge the imperfection of each and every layer, then one has to meaningfully ask whether or not the system can meaningfully work. On one hand, we have platitudes that properly-covered-up things never come to light. On the other hand, we have hard evidence that time and time and time again, when serious wrongdoing, illegal, unpatriotic, or just downright-secret activities are being hidden, this very system fails.

This leads to the inevitable question that if we are dealing with the notion of a global conspiracy - which is what would be necessary for the whole global chemtrail thing to carry any weight - and we look at who all must be keeping silent....its quite literally unimaginable that every single one of them is keeping silent.

They take amphetamines to maintain alertness and give them an edge while carrying out the missions. Read the link, or google it. It's all there.

Its all there? Including the relvance to this thread? Including how and why these secret-keeping people are letting out information like that which is effectively about how they are breaking the rules?

Smudgeyboy

Got loads of pics and videos today, started at about 9 O'clock, have been taking pics every 20 mins or so since. Got different stages of spreading out too.
We got it bad enough today too, whole skies nearly white already.

Will post up after I sort through them, organise them and find the USB cable!

oscarBravo

Smudgeyboy wrote: »

We got it bad enough today too, whole skies nearly white already.

By a staggering coincidence, the sky is almost completely white here also, despite there having been only a few contrails visible throughout the day - certainly none of the grids I've been hearing tell about.

Of course, it's entirely possible that the sky out west here is covered with cirriform clouds, and the sky where you are is covered with chemtrail residue.

Uh-huh. That's the most plausible explanation.

kippy

Smudgeyboy wrote: »

Got loads of pics and videos today, started at about 9 O'clock, have been taking pics every 20 mins or so since. Got different stages of spreading out too.
We got it bad enough today too, whole skies nearly white already.

Will post up after I sort through them, organise them and find the USB cable!

Did you call the cops or report it to your local TD.
Moaning about it on an internet message board isnt gonna make them stop.
Kippy

espinolman

KILLER CHEMTRAILS : THE SHOCKING TRUTH (5 MINUTES)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Psdg3OAw_a8

Ciaran500

espinolman wrote: »

KILLER CHEMTRAILS : THE SHOCKING TRUTH (5 MINUTES)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Psdg3OAw_a8

Hmm, Casey? Or just another blow in?

espinolman

Ciaran500 wrote: »

Hmm, Casey? Or just another blow in?

Over the christmas i was looking at the chemtrails over dublin and the amount of them ,it is just unbelievable and they are coming down on my house here and this is just disgraceful .

King Mob

I'm still waiting for any kind of evidence that these chemtrails do anything let alone exist.

espinolman

King Mob wrote: »

I'm still waiting for any kind of evidence that these chemtrails do anything let alone exist.

Are you still waiting for any kind of evidence that the world is round.

King Mob

espinolman wrote: »

Are you still waiting for any kind of evidence that the world is round.

No because there is good solid verifiable evidence that it is round.
There is no such evidence for chemtrails.

Maybe you can tell me: what do chemtrails actually do and can you back it up with evidence?

espinolman

King Mob wrote: »

No because there is good solid verifiable evidence that it is round.
There is no such evidence for chemtrails.

Maybe you can tell me: what do chemtrails actually do and can you back it up with evidence?

Long before i learned to even turn on a computer i observed chemtrails and no one told me about it that was nine years ago , today i see that people all over the world have observed this phenomenon on the internet , and yet i have not heard anything from the mainstream media about this , now if the authoriies and whoever is behind this will not talk about it then how could i possibly know what chemtrails do let alone prove it , i have asked on other forums on boards.ie and gotten no answer , now this forum is called CONSPIRACY THEORIES .

Chemtrails are observable and i can not prove they are bad but the fact that there seems to be a media blackout on this would indicate that they probably are toxic chemicals , and thats the reason i am posting it in the conspiracy theory forum , it i could prove this , i would be posting elsewhere

King Mob

espinolman wrote: »

Long before i learned to even turn on a computer i observed chemtrails and no one told me about it that was nine years ago , today i see that people all over the world have observed this phenomenon on the internet , and yet i have not heard anything from the mainstream media about this , now if the authoriies and whoever is behind this will not talk about it then how could i possibly know what chemtrails do let alone prove it ,

So not only have you no proof of chemtrails being harmful, you have no idea what they actually do.
So why exactly do you believe it a conspiracy?
Is it possible you and many other are just misidentifying contrails and normal clouds?

espinolman wrote: »

i have asked on other forums on boards.ie and gotten no answer , now this forum is called CONSPIRACY THEORIES .

NOW HERE IS MY CONSPIRACY THEORY :THAT YOU KING MOB ARE A PLANT AND YOU ARE BEING PAID TO POST HERE BY THE NEW WORLD ORDER.

Yea that's exactly it. I'm trying to brainwash you with science and critical thinking.

espinolman

King Mob wrote: »

So not only have you no proof of chemtrails being harmful, you have no idea what they actually do.
So why exactly do you believe it a conspiracy?
Is it possible you and many other are just misidentifying contrails and normal clouds?

.

Nine years ago i was looking into the sky and wondered to myself why the contrails off aeroplanes' were not dissipating , vanishing in a few seconds to a minute like they used to , one and a half years ago i started using the internet and stared reading about chemtrails and i presume what i was reading is true, because i myself have observed this phenomenon
Nevertheless i do understand that not everyone would have noticed the change in the contrails and would not be able to differentiate the differences between today and a decade or so ago in contrails ,i swear they used to vanish in seconds to a minute .

King Mob

espinolman wrote: »

Nine years ago i was looking into the sky and wondered to myself why the contrails off aeroplanes' were not dissipating , vanishing in a few seconds to a minute like they used to , one and a half years ago i started using the internet and stared reading about chemtrails and i presume what i was reading is true, because i myself have observed this phenomenon
Nevertheless i do understand that not everyone would have noticed the change in the contrails and would not be able to differentiate the differences between today and a decade or so ago in contrails ,i swear they used to vanish in seconds to a minute .

Do you know how contrails are formed?
How do you know "they vanish in seconds to a minute?"

espinolman

King Mob wrote: »

Do you know how contrails are formed?
How do you know "they vanish in seconds to a minute?"

As exhaust gases cool and mix with the surrounding air humidity becomes high enough for liquid water to condense on particals and form liquid droplets , now if the air is cold enough these liquid droplets will freeze and become ice particles that make up a contrail .
And i know that normal contrails vanish in a few seconds to a minute through observations of the skies 10 to 20 years ago .,

King Mob

espinolman wrote: »

As exhaust gases cool and mix with the surrounding air humidity becomes high enough for liquid water to condense on particals and form liquid droplets , now if the air is cold enough these liquid droplets will freeze and become ice particles that make up a contrail .

Fair enough, should've given you more credit on that front.

espinolman wrote: »

And i know that normal contrails vanish in a few seconds to a minute through observations of the skies 10 to 20 years ago .,

Did you time them and take note of stuff like speed, height and type of plane?

Still no proof that these chemtrails are actually doing anything?

Sofa_King Good

In south Dublin over Christmas, (my girlfriend is asthmathic? so I smoke outside) I did notice especially that the skies were abnormal, there were planes in the sky with unusual flight patterns. The sky was like a large blue X's and O's board, and the trails were staying a lot longer,as were the planes.

I don't know what to make of it, but here is an example of a government secretly and harmfully testing on its people - http://www.gulfweb.org/bigdoc/rockrep.cfm.


This invention looks like it could facilitate it, perhaps for reduction of global warming? - http://www.iddd.de/umtsno/chemtrailswelsb.pdf

Huges Aircraft had been acquired by General Motors at that time.

Maybe not. Here is GM Vice Chairman on Global Warming
http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/02/bob-lutz-global.html

King Mob

Sofa_King Good wrote: »

In south Dublin over Christmas, (my girlfriend is asthmathic? so I smoke outside) I did notice especially that the skies were abnormal, there were planes in the sky with unusual flight patterns. The sky was like a large blue X's and O's board, and the trails were staying a lot longer,as were the planes.

I don't know what to make of it, but here is an example of a government secretly and harmfully testing on its people - http://www.gulfweb.org/bigdoc/rockrep.cfm.


This invention looks like it could facilitate it, perhaps for reduction of global warming? - http://www.iddd.de/umtsno/chemtrailswelsb.pdf

Huges Aircraft had been acquired by General Motors at that time.

Maybe not. Here is GM Vice Chairman on Global Warming
http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/02/bob-lutz-global.html

So if chemtrails are to fight global warming why is it a secret?
What do you mean by unusual flight patterns?

Sofa_King Good

King Mob wrote: »

So if chemtrails are to fight global warming why is it a secret?
What do you mean by unusual flight patterns?

Perhaps, they are good for the planet yet harmful to us. Or maybe there is something more sinister.

Why do you dismiss out of hand the improbable as impossible?

King Mob

Sofa_King Good wrote: »

Perhaps, they are good for the planet yet harmful to us. Or maybe there is something more sinister.

Why do you dismiss out of hand the improbable as impossible?

I didn't say impossible. Just there is no supporting evidence and the reasoning has many many holes.