Bray: New town centre

Alun

eoin_s wrote: »

I imagine they will come down Old Connaught from the Bray/Shankill exit?

Well, they could .. but anyone who isn't that familiar with Bray will probably come down the N11, see the Bray South exit sign and then end up going down the Killarney Road / Main St. route. Unless it's signposted to the contrary that is. But even if they used the Bray/Shankill exit and came down Old Connaught, they'd still get stuck at the lights by the Statoil garage trying to join the same stretch of the Dublin Road with the traffic that came from the north.

Tippex

from the looks of the masterplan http://www.braytowncentre.com/masterplan.htm they plan on building a road from the shankill roundabout just before windsor for access to the town centre.

Alun

Tippex wrote: »

from the looks of the masterplan http://www.braytowncentre.com/masterplan.htm they plan on building a road from the shankill roundabout just before windsor for access to the town centre.

If that's the road marked "8 Southern Access" you're talking about I think it looks as if that's going around from a new junction between the Statoil garage and the old Industrial Yarns building where the furniture store is, at least that's what the big rectangular building to the south of it looks like, and it looks like traffic will still have to make it from the Shankill roundabout to there first.

Take a look on the aerial photos on Google Earth or Google Maps and compare with that map and you'll see what I mean.

The Real B-man

This before or after the Florentine Center? i wouldnt hold my breath on this been done for a while it is Bray afterall! :rolleyes:

johnny_ultimate

Lulz at the Bray people article on the objector today. Their phonecall to 'George' was investigative journalism at its finest.

Tippex

Alun wrote: »

If that's the road marked "8 Southern Access" you're talking about I think it looks as if that's going around from a new junction between the Statoil garage and the old Industrial Yarns building where the furniture store is, at least that's what the big rectangular building to the south of it looks like, and it looks like traffic will still have to make it from the Shankill roundabout to there first.

Take a look on the aerial photos on Google Earth or Google Maps and compare with that map and you'll see what I mean.

Yep your right that access road is to the north of industrial yarns.
And the one marked 9(harbour link) is through ravenswell. will cause problems alright.

and76

There is supposed to be a ring road and then the seapoint rd was going to be made one way or something. I dont know if they can do anything about the entry in through the Dublin road unless the link road could link up with the first roundabout there. Still i think the development has to go ahead over these troubles, bray needs the lift and the employment!

Tippex

yep totally agree that it has to go ahead as the town has died a death.

One thing that gets me is the fact that the objector is from sutton. How can they justify objecting to something that does not affect them or is there other factors at work? I could understand it if it was residents objecting but overall the development will be of benefit to Bray

worded

and76 wrote: »

Does anyone know if they resolved the problems concerning the flood plain? From that website all the shops are going to be right in it!!!!

If there is flooding in Bray will a lot of places get hit?

and76

There is plans for more flood work to be done I thought it was to start soon but havent heard anymore. Originally this was a main concern to all as I'm from the dargle and also for the houses they build in the area too.
We'll have to wait and see and hope the councellors make it a priority the area will be safe and the dargle area in general.
Its such a pity the town centre hasnt worked out but we have to have something in the town again its crazy to have so little for such a big populated town.

Eoin

I really hope they have thought through the implications to the traffic.

Driving home yesterday, the traffic at the Shankill roundabout was backed up to the end of the slip road from the M11. This was at 7:30 in the evening, and it can be worse again at the weekends. If it's even a fraction as bad as it was during the festival a couple of weeks ago, it could be an absolute nightmare.

Alun

eoin_s wrote: »

I really hope they have thought through the implications to the traffic.

So do I, but I seriously doubt it, at least not taking in the big picture. OK, they're putting in new access roads, but there seems to be nothing else being done. That's the problem when you let private developers dictate what should be long-term planning policy, combined with the pathetically amateurish attempt at local government we have here..

I lived in the Netherlands before coming here, and the way it would be done there would be a) define a need for a development, e.g. shopping centre, housing development, industrial estate, hospital, school etc., b) buy up / reserve land for said development, c) build necessary infrastructure (roads, sewage, utilities etc.) around it, and then finally d) put the development out to tender. In other words, the whole process is driven by actual needs decided by local government, not by property developers.

Eoin

Holland is just so much more organised than here, there's not even any point making a comparison!

Alun

eoin_s wrote: »

Holland is just so much more organised than here, there's not even any point making a comparison!

Yeah, I know, I love this place but sometimes I just wish they'd outsource the running of it to someone who knows what they're doing

Calibos

Alun wrote: »

Yeah, I know, I love this place but sometimes I just wish they'd outsource the running of it to someone who knows what they're doing

Which way did you vote on Lisbon Alun

As for the lone Objector, She's on someones payroll. I mean she's not wrong in a lot of her objections to the current plan but it still rubs me the wrong way, someone 50km away objecting to something in my town.

Maybe she's the significant other of a Dundrum Town Centre developer

Could even be a proxy for the Greens. Talkin to a Green Councilor the other day and although they have been the ones objecting so far, they are not in principle opposed to the scheme. They were however against the original first draft plan that was the developers dictating what they were going to do and had the approval of all the other parties in the council. If FF and FG had their way back then, we'd be getting a lot less from the developers. It was the greens that got the plans altered with the flood defence schemes and amenity areas and access roads etc. Gotta give them props for that even though I think most of them are insufferable eejits.

Maybe the greens didn't want to appear anti Bray development by objecting yet again, even though they are only doing it to get more for Bray from the greedy developers, the public might not see it that way. So they finance a proxy objector from Sutton instead??? Something to think about.

Alun

Calibos wrote: »

Which way did you vote on Lisbon Alun

I didn't, or rather I wasn't allowed to seeing as I'm a feelthy johnny foreigner:D But if I could have, I'd have voted a resounding yes, as it happens.

One major difference between here and the Netherlands in regard to this subject is that there they have proper, effective local government. Mind you, one of the reasons for this is that they don't have the system we have here of having MP's with their own constituencies, you just vote for a party and the MP's are then picked off a list in descending order according to their % of the vote. That way, MP's do what they're actually supposed to do, i.e. look after national affairs, and you don't get them meddling in what are essentially local matters like what happens here. As a result, local government is more effective, has real power, and real budgets, and therefore also attracts a more professional and motivated type of person to the job.

Eoin

Let that be the end of the Lisbon discussion here please

and76

Wonder with all the news about flooding at the moment will they rethink the development - at least its highlighted how important that flood relief work is.
Back in 86 hurricane charlie flood,most of the lower dargle was completely submerged with waters rising up to mantelpiece level in most houses

boggerboy

and76 wrote: »

Wonder with all the news about flooding at the moment will they rethink the development - at least its highlighted how important that flood relief work is.
Back in 86 hurricane charlie flood,most of the lower dargle was completely submerged with waters rising up to mantelpiece level in most houses

Mr Gormley recently announced (in the last week) that he wanted to put an end to building on flood plains. I wonder does this include developments such as this that have already received planning permission???
I lived in a house that was flooded in hurricane Charlie (approx 4 feet of water) and still live in the same area-It looked very bad at one point last sat until thankfully the rain stopped. Building further down the river on a floodplain would have negative consequences in future times.
I am not suggesting stopping the development, just restriciting it to the higher parts of the golf course which are not part of the flood plain- I am sure there is plenty of room. after all, they are hardly going to build the original amount of apartments in the current climate, are they?

worded

Does Bray have a decent swimming pool (not a members small gym one) for such a "huge" population? Opportunity lost not to place one in the development me thinks.

Will this ever get off the ground in the current economic climate?

Calibos

Hmmmm. Bray resident Alun originally from the Netherlands. Do you like black Lockets?? If the answer is WTF! then don't worry...I was thinking of someone else

boggerboy

worded wrote: »

Does Bray have a decent swimming pool (not a members small gym one) for such a "huge" population? Opportunity lost not to place one in the development me thinks.

Will this ever get off the ground in the current economic climate?

worded hi, bray's new "public" swimming pool is opening in two weeks time at a cost of €9 million and is still €10 charge for pay as you go... think there may be another thread about this already

mikedragon32

boggerboy wrote: »

worded hi, bray's new "public" swimming pool is opening in two weeks time at a cost of €9 million and is still €10 charge for pay as you go... think there may be another thread about this already

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055301230

Alun

Calibos wrote: »

Hmmmm. Bray resident Alun originally from the Netherlands. Do you like black Lockets?? If the answer is WTF! then don't worry...I was thinking of someone else

WTF?

Eoin

If the weather keeps up, then all of Bray may be a public swimming pool.

boggerboy

eoin_s wrote: »

If the weather keeps up, then all of Bray may be a public swimming pool.

only good thing is eoin, we won't have to pay cash for it

Splendour

boggerboy wrote: »

Mr Gormley recently announced (in the last week) that he wanted to put an end to building on flood plains. I wonder does this include developments such as this that have already received planning permission???
I lived in a house that was flooded in hurricane Charlie (approx 4 feet of water) and still live in the same area-It looked very bad at one point last sat until thankfully the rain stopped. Building further down the river on a floodplain would have negative consequences in future times.
I am not suggesting stopping the development, just restriciting it to the higher parts of the golf course which are not part of the flood plain- I am sure there is plenty of room. after all, they are hardly going to build the original amount of apartments in the current climate, are they?

Well I heard the reason they're building on the flood plain is because this is on the 'Bray' side of the development wheras is they build on the 'Shankill' side Dun Laoghaire/Rathdown council will receive the income on the rates instead of Bray CoCo.

The Dargle river runs behind my back garden and last year I had a couple of representatives from Pizzario call to ask how I felt about the wall being built along the Dargle to help alleviate flooding. This was the first I'd heard about any wall being built. I look out onto the river/trees/wildlife and they wondered why I would object to this?!!
They asked if I'd rather have a wall built or risk being flooded-I chose the latter. I bought the darn house for the view. Am here 7 years and so far so good, and after last weeks rain and we're still dry, I reckon we'll survive!

Will be interesting to see if Mr. Gormley's announcment will affect the development...

The Chessplayer

That Bray town shopping centre project is a white elephant

mikedragon32

The Chessplayer wrote: »

That Bray town shopping centre project is a white elephant

And that's your considered opinion?

Care to elaborate or is this just an appalling attempt at trolling?

The Chessplayer

mikedragon32 wrote: »

And that's your considered opinion?

Care to elaborate or is this just an appalling attempt at trolling?

I think it's a white elephant Michael. I would be surprised if they could secure the finance for such a large scale project. A paired down version may be on the cards in a year or two, but until then f all will happen. Having planning permission doesn't mean it will go ahead.

What we will end up with is 2 scaled down crappy shopping centres - as the "town centre" has already served only to force ballymore to scale back its plans.