A Discussion of the Rules (July 14th 2008)

Thanx 4 The Fish

Why not run with this for the moment eh ? We have had a lot of feedback from the users of this forum and we have taken a lot of this into account. This approach may or may not be a silver bullet but at least if it is not it is a step in the right direction.

Change for changes sake ? Do you really think that we would go to the trouble of writing new rules, putting a new banning mechanism in place and actually listening to feedback just for something to do ? I know that each of the mods on this forum wants this to be a good place to post and I am also fully aware that we cannot please all of the people but for crying out loud, at least try something before you have a whinge about how bad it is. Reminds me of my kids telling me they do not like broccoli despite never having tasted it.

Oh and have fun

Villain

NO MATCH DISCUSSION WILL BE TOLERATED IN SUPERTHREADS

Is this serious? I mean I can't discuss a Villa match in a Villa thread?

If you only have one thread a week for matches it will get far too messy, seriously whatever about the rest of the rules that one is a joke imo.

Oh and are there going to be more mods or are the mods just going to be around more? Because one or the other is needed and I also think a LOT of room has to be given to posters over the next week or so until people get used to these changes

Villain

Oh and one request can we have a sub forum for all the super team threads, there is so many now nothing else shows up on the main page?

Mitch Connor

Villain wrote: »

Oh and one request can we have a sub forum for all the super team threads, there is so many now nothing else shows up on the main page?

that is only cause they are new and nothing else is really being commented on. They won't get anymore traffic then they did before the changes (less in fact once the season starts) so they will move off the top page or remain (as the United and Liverpool threads generally do) as they have done before.

Mr Alan

there is the same amount that has always been there, they are just all bumped at the same time when updated with the new rules.

and the subforum idea is a non runner, the vast majority of users of this forum have already voted against them

Aquos76

As I was saying, where can I discuss Man Utd's next pre season friendly?

GuanYin

non-competitive matches are viewed much the same as reserve games. Go to the team talk threads.

Villain

But all competitive games can to have to be discussed in the match, so does that include Villa's inter toto match next week.

If you want to discuss players performance etc after the matches end is that in the match thread only too?

What about tatics subs made etc after the match is over is that only in the match thread too or is just while the match in ongoing?

--amadeus--

Hmmm, it'll be interesting to see how things pan out with this. Potentially there is the risk for more trolling, flaming and baiting rather than less.

For example all discussion on the Barry transfer should now go into a thread on the Barry transfer. The trouble with that is that a lot of the discussion on the Barry transfer has been around the quality of GB, is he an upgrade and does he provide value at x amount of money.

In the confines of a team-specific thread that's fine and teh Villa fans who drop in contribute. But in a general transfer thread the "Hmmm at 18million Alonso sgould stay and we should back out" could become a raging debate on the quality of GB, with Villa fans arguing for his quality. And what about discussion of alternate targets, where does that go?

Likewise sheer weight of numbers means that matchweek and matchday threads will be LFC / CFC / MUFC (maybe even Arsenal ) dominated, with everyone else drowned out. And god knows we're all sick of those...

Lots of blurry lines around this that will take some getting used to.

Aquos76

GuanYin wrote: »

non-competitive matches are viewed much the same as reserve games. Go to the team talk threads.

No hassles, during last saturdays game, I posted up a link to watch the game online and also gave goal updates, if the same happens next Saturday, will I be in danger of been banned. I just want to be sure.

I can just as easily start a matchday thread if you prefer.

GuanYin

Villain wrote: »

But all competitive games can to have to be discussed in the match, so does that include Villa's inter toto match next week.

If you want to discuss players performance etc after the matches end is that in the match thread only too?

What about tatics subs made etc after the match is over is that only in the match thread too or is just while the match in ongoing?

The intertoto is competitive?

I think that will depend on how seriously the villa fans take the game. A match thread can be started for that.

Lets see how it works before we slate it. If it worse, we can change.

Villain

GuanYin wrote: »

The intertoto is competitive?

I think that will depend on how seriously the villa fans take the game. A match thread can be started for that.

Lets see how it works before we slate it. If it worse, we can change.

Its very competitive, if we win we go into the 2nd qualifying round of the Uefa cup.

What about the rest of my post i.e.:

If you want to discuss players performance etc after the matches end is that in the match thread only too?

What about tatics subs made etc after the match is over is that only in the match thread too or is just while the match in ongoing?

--amadeus--

I've re-read the charter and I think I have some serious reservations about the superthread changes.

I understand teh drive behind it - flush general conversation onto teh main board and have more interaction among the different sets of fans. In principle the new ideas look like they should work.

My concern is with the level and ferocity of moderation. The superthreads have always been a sort of clubhouse for specific teams. Anyone can pop in and any club related topic is up for discussion. Now they are strict demarcation lined and "don't discuss this here" warnings. Are we throwing babies out with bathwater - is there really that much harm in having parallell discussions - one general and one club specific?

That said the new banning system looks good, that on it's own may have solved a lot of the issues that the thread policing has been designed to deal with, IMO

GuanYin

Villain wrote: »

Its very competitive, if we win we go into the 2nd qualifying round of the Uefa cup.

What about the rest of my post i.e.:

If you're talking about player performances, you tend to be talking about players and not specific incidents within a match.

Sometimes the area will be hazy, I suggest (<insert deity> help me) you guys use common sense. Noone is going to get banned for making a mistake, worst case scenario we clear things up at the time and we learn as we go along and a post gets moved. Oh noes!!!! :rolleyes:. Match scores, and discussion of match incidents in match threads, player form is a club thing.

I think what we're trying to avoid is the kind of friction we've seen in threads where team A fan says that team B's player clearly fouled someone in a team B super-thread and team B fans hit the report post button 60,000 times because someone is saying something bad in "their" thread.

Villain

GuanYin wrote: »

If you're talking about player performances, you tend to be talking about players and not specific incidents within a match.

Sometimes the area will be hazy, I suggest (<insert deity> help me) you guys use common sense. Noone is going to get banned for making a mistake, worst case scenario we clear things up at the time and we learn as we go along and a post gets moved. Oh noes!!!! :rolleyes:. Match scores, and discussion of match incidents in match threads, player form is a club thing.

I think what we're trying to avoid is the kind of friction we've seen in threads where team A fan says that team B's player clearly fouled someone in a team B super-thread and team B fans hit the report post button 60,000 times because someone is saying something bad in "their" thread.

I can see what your trying to do but its too restrictive imo, I think while the match is ongoing it might work ok but if you can't discuss match performances (not general form) and incidents after the match in the clubs super thread its very restrictive and this rule favours the big clubs imo. I know that unless Villa are playing a top 4 side my comment on a villa game will lost between all the posts from Utd, Pool and Arsenal fans making it very hard to get any get of discussion going on a Villa game.

E.g. say Villa are playing Hull and we go 1 down If I'm watching the game and post my opinion on how we'r playing badly or how the tactics are wrong or we need to make sub etc and a Villa fan comes in 10 minutes later there could be 20 posts after mine and my post would get lost and while other fans may want to discuss incidents of the match I doubt they want to talk about Villa tactics when they are playing Hull, where as Villa fans would?

GuanYin

We can separate the "big club" match threads out. It will mean 2-3 threads extra a week and then nothing gets drowned.

You're really complaining about something you've never seen in action. Reserve judgement.

Villain

I'm not complaining so much as tryng to tease out the finer details. If the top 4 are all playing other teams i.e. not each other does that mean we will have 4 threads for each of the top 4 and then a seperate thread for the otehr teams?

I can see what your trying to do and I think if the modding went easy on people for getting it wrong it wouldn't be so bad I just have a fear that people will get banned easily for not knowing what thread to post in, plus the work load is going to increase for you guys.

Lets see how it goes but I just think the rules are lacking in detail and clarity and we are going to have a lot more threads, I think a little duplication is better than a lot of extra threads and I can see people starting match threads all over the place

GuanYin

Villain wrote: »

I'm not complaining so much as tryng to tease out the finer details. If the top 4 are all playing other teams i.e. not each other does that mean we will have 4 threads for each of the top 4 and then a seperate thread for the otehr teams?

I can see what your trying to do and I think if the modding went easy on people for getting it wrong it wouldn't be so bad I just have a fear that people will get banned easily for not knowing what thread to post in, plus the work load is going to increase for you guys.

Lets see how it goes but I just think the rules are lacking in detail and clarity and we are going to have a lot more threads, I think a little duplication is better than a lot of extra threads and I can see people starting match threads all over the place

The rules are lacking in detail and clarity so we can see what suits the forum best.

If we'd laid out strict rigid rules everyone would be up in arms about that. We set out hazy general rules so we could tease out what suits the forum, now people are just making stuff up and claiming we're out to ban anyone who talks about matches (did I say that anywhere?).

Sometimes I wonder.

Mr Alan

there was already always one PL matches thread all weekend, where the vast majority of the match discussions went on.

so you could just have two threads instead of the usual one:

1:weekend of xx/xx/xx-pl matches (big 4)
2:weekend of xx/xx/xx-rest of the matches

i think this will work out well if people give it a chance.

Aquos76

Mr Alan wrote: »

there was already always one PL matches thread all weekend, where the vast majority of the match discussions went on.

so you could just have two threads instead of the usual one:

1:weekend of xx/xx/xx-pl matches (big 4)
2:weekend of xx/xx/xx-rest of the matches

i think this will work out well if people give it a chance.

But then we would have Villa and spurs fans claiming that they should be part of the big four ahead of Liverpool;)

GuanYin

Aquos76 wrote: »

But then we would have Villa and spurs fans claiming that they should be part of the big four ahead of Liverpool;)

If you hadn't have used a smiley, I might have gone for the very rarely used "kill user" button, located just under the "ban user" button.

Villain

GuanYin wrote: »

The rules are lacking in detail and clarity so we can see what suits the forum best.

If we'd laid out strict rigid rules everyone would be up in arms about that. We set out hazy general rules so we could tease out what suits the forum, now people are just making stuff up and claiming we're out to ban anyone who talks about matches (did I say that anywhere?).

Sometimes I wonder.

Well if thats the way it is then thats fair enough, but I think you could have made that clearer, the post above should be included in the new rules thread. If the rules are lacking detail to see what works and people won't get banned for posts about matches (not including big incidents) after the matches in super threads thats fair enough, it just the line "NO MATCH DISCUSSION WILL BE TOLERATED IN SUPERTHREADS." is very restrictive and I can see people not knowing what is and what isn't allowed.

Mr Alan

Aquos76 wrote: »

But then we would have Villa and spurs fans claiming that they should be part of the big four ahead of Liverpool;)

excellent point, you're on a roll tonight :rolleyes:

(i said big four, not top 4 intentionally, to avoid stupid comments like yours)

GuanYin

Villain wrote: »

it just the line "NO MATCH DISCUSSION WILL BE TOLERATED IN SUPERTHREADS." is very restrictive and I can see people not knowing what is and what isn't allowed.

point taken, edited.

Skud

so it begins... I think the sub forum for the teams' threads is a very good idea. You can easily access the team thread you want without having to shift through all the other threads and vice-versa. Everything else seems a bit strange - different... but if it works, great

leninbenjamin

pffft. everyone knows that Arsenal are going to be the team to crash and burn this year. in fact they wont even qualify for Europe at all, Cesc will probably get a chest infection that develops into pneumonia and die, Arsene will die in a car crash en route to the funeral and the sky will fall on our heads.

just like last year.

oh and i think this should be added to the charter.

Villain

GuanYin wrote: »

point taken, edited.

Cool. I think that will help

PS. while I have you any chance of letting me post again on a certain forum that you also mod

Aquos76

leninbenjamin wrote: »

pffft. everyone knows that Arsenal are going to be the team to crash and burn this year. in fact they wont even qualify for Europe at all, Cesc will probably get a chest infection that develops into pneumonia and die, Arsene will die in a car crash en route to the funeral and the sky will fall on our heads.

just like last year.

oh and i think this should be added to the charter.

shouldn't this be in the arsenal forum

Mr Alan

http://www.videojug.com/film/how-to-behave-on-an-internet-forum

hahahaha that is quality

oobydooby

leninbenjamin wrote: »

pffft. everyone knows that Arsenal are going to be the team to crash and burn this year. in fact they wont even qualify for Europe at all, Cesc will probably get a chest infection that develops into pneumonia and die, Arsene will die in a car crash en route to the funeral and the sky will fall on our heads.

just like last year.

oh and i think this should be added to the charter.

Thumbs up for that (except for the Arsenal bit). Maybe one of the keywords on the soccer access requests could come from that clip?