M8 motorway (general thread)

Amtmann

They were incinerating the lining oddly enough. The traffic management isn't what I expected...the Fermoy off-slip is blocked off. But this is obviously temporary. I'll probably take another one over the weekend from the 14 overbridge.

BluntGuy

Ah... so what I was thinking was correct.

It looks to me like the hatchings have been burned off because that'll become a running lane once all the work is completed.

Also please tell me they had the cop-on to take down the signage, because it'll only lead to confusion if it's left up.

Amtmann

Signage is gone!

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

Signage is gone!

Three cheers for common sense!

I'm geniunely happy to find that out because I feared they'd simply leave the "use both lanes" signage up until they got round to putting up the new ADS signage etc.

Out of interest, are Direct Route obliged to provide the traffic management or is it RoadBridge? Surely it's part of DR's 30 year contract to do so. These things are important, especially if PPP is to be considered "value for money" as the NRA so often state.

I would e-mail them, but they're seemingly not interested in answering real questions (or any from me at least ).

Amtmann

I don't know the answer to that question I'm afraid. There was no indication that it was one company or the other.

Here's the clip. It's quite interesting if I do say so myself, and it demonstrates how quickly asphalt can be laid. It's a quicker process than the CBM.

The High Quality viewing option will be available here: http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=I3Zd7pt1nJA underneath the volume tab.

I hope to get a video of median construction, lining and studding before the road opens, but it'll all depend on circumstance.

The annoying thing is that they built the Cashel to Mitchelstown scheme right outside my home in Tipperary in 2006/2007 and I didn't have the interest or foresight to take any pictures or videos. I'm a bit annoyed about that now. Still, it'll be cool to have all these images and videos of M-F and C-C stored for posterity. They might be considered interesting in fifty years time!

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

The annoying thing is that they built the Cashel to Mitchelstown scheme right outside my home in Tipperary in 2006/2007 and I didn't have the interest or foresight to take any pictures or videos. I'm a bit annoyed about that now. Still, it'll be cool to have all these images and videos of M-F and C-C stored for posterity. They might be considered interesting in fifty years time!

I know that feeling...

I do actually have a few pictures of C-M under construction. I also stumbled upon the 9th C-M newsletter today which I held onto for some reason.

What's annoying me most at the moment though is the N24 roundabout near Cahir still doesn't have appropiate M8 signage. I'm aware signage in the whole Tipperary area isn't up-to-date, but that particular one annoys me because it more-or-less funnels you straight into a motorway. If they could even just replace THAT I'd be happy for the time being.

I will make sure to get a picture of it at some stage or another and send it to the council because I want it REPLACED! :mad:

I am almost certain that it's contributing to the number of tractors, slow vehicles and learners who are under the misguided notion that they are entitled to use the M8 motorway just because "it's a road".

KevR

BluntGuy wrote: »

Out of interest, are Direct Route obliged to provide the traffic management or is it RoadBridge? Surely it's part of DR's 30 year contract to do so. These things are important, especially if PPP is to be considered "value for money" as the NRA so often state.

I don't know if this would help to answer your question at all but N6 Construction LTD (ie - the company building the road) seem to be looking after traffic management on roads near the M6 scheme that are affected by construction. Although, that's not necessarily the same as the M8 where a section had been handed over to the operator and opened to traffic. Also, it's traffic management on the actual M8 itself rather than other roads near the scheme so it's probably not the same thing at all.

Furet wrote: »

Still, it'll be cool to have all these images and videos of M-F and C-C stored for posterity. They might be considered interesting in fifty years time!

Indeed!

Thanks for the pictures and videos by the way. Amazing stuff!

serfboard

Furet wrote: »

Still, it'll be cool to have all these images and videos ... stored for posterity. They might be considered interesting in fifty years time!

Indeed - I've made this point before. Thanks to everyone who takes the time to take and upload them. I'd say you won't have to wait fifty years to have them appreciated. If we keep going as we are currently, in even five years time we'll be saying "remember when we used to build roads?":D

After all, the Yanks are still talking about all the road building they did in the 1930's.;)

BluntGuy

Apparently this rubbish is being presented as the M8's first motorway service area:

http://www.tipperarystar.ie/cashel/Ireland39s-first-motorway-services-will.4815292.jp


Anyway, here's a little bit on the REAL Cashel MSA:

http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/show/search_view.aspx?ID=JAN111651

It is part of the NRA's Tranche 2 (more on this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58822554#post58822554 )

Amtmann

I'm sorely tempted to put pen to paper and fire a letter off to the Tipperary Star, but what would be the point? It's not a newspaper - more a parish pump pamphlet really.

Still, I'm glad to hear the MSA is 8km north of Cashel. I don't care what the AADTs say - the M8 between Cashel and Junction 6 is probably the busiest section of the entire route outside of the M7 interchange and Watergrasshill. Any idea when the EIS will be available on the NRA site, Blunt?

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

I'm sorely tempted to put pen to paper and fire a letter off to the Tipperary Star, but what would be the point? It's not a newspaper - more a parish pump pamphlet really.

Still, I'm glad to hear the MSA is 8km north of Cashel. I don't care what the AADTs say - the M8 between Cashel and Junction 6 is probably the busiest section of the entire route outside of the M7 interchange and Watergrasshill. Any idea when the EIS will be available on the NRA site, Blunt?

Sadly, I haven't a clue. No new EIS plans appeared on the website this month which was surprising. Bare in mind the NRA has six more to publish before the end of March. I'm beginning to think the EIS plans have already been drawn up and they've simply been too lazy to upload them.

I was also glad to find that it's moved 8km north. Building it between Cahir and Cashel would've been ridiculous especially given its proximity to the Topaz silliness, and its relative proximity to Kilworth MSA. I still, however, think that the Topaz/McDonalds development is going to have a detrimental effect on the M8 MSA, but we'll wait and see...

Btw I'm sure you saw their other Tranche 2 choices... :mad:

Between Tranche 1 and Tranche 2 the network won't be adequately covered. The M9 and M6 will be without meaningful service areas and the M7 will be lacking one for a distance of 170 km or so.

Amtmann

Amtmann

First, the Exit 8 Topaz/McDonalds "service area" under construction, 7 February 2009:

***

The Cashel Bypass (northbound) video (watch in high quality):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9Mv9gBDFCU

***

The Cashel to Mitchelstown videos:

These are each c. 4 minutes long. The first one starts at the Carrigane junction. Annotations have been added. Again, watch in high quality!

1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tk8MGULy9ss
2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmWvRrIAeVs
3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZ_wyZqc18
4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpGwYsLp4_s

BluntGuy

Thanks for the videos Furet.

One thing to point out. Quite a rare occurence on the new stretches of M.

Go to 2:23 in Part 3 to see a refreshing bit of lovely wide median motorway near Cahir.

Wait, let me re-phrase that. Because "lovely" isn't the word you'll be thinking when you see how rotten the landscaping is. It's so dissappointing because the stretch would look fantastic if it wasn't for this.

Amtmann

Big time. No landscaping whatsoever. Not even a bare minimum done.

Amtmann

Oops, I almost forgot: the EIS for the Cashel NRA Service Area should be published next Tuesday. Presumably it'll be up on the website then too. Apparently there'll be an ad in the Irish Independent and Clonmel Nationalist about it next week.

BluntGuy

Okay then. I'll make sure to check out the NRA website then.

Btw, and I know this a little off-topic, but I can't be bothered to find the motorway redesignation thread. Do you know what is going on with the motorway redesignations? I want to see the Watergrasshill-Dunkettle one done before the M-F scheme opens.

I wish we'd at least get an update at least. They seem to announce things at random, which is really quite annoying.

Amtmann

BluntGuy wrote: »

Okay then. I'll make sure to check out the NRA website then.

Btw, and I know this a little off-topic, but I can't be bothered to find the motorway redesignation thread. Do you know what is going on with the motorway redesignations? I want to see the Watergrasshill-Dunkettle one done before the M-F scheme opens.

I wish we'd at least get an update at least. They seem to announce things at random, which is really quite annoying.

I'll give the DOT a call next Thursday to try for an update. I'd like to see a move here too. I'd imagine the later it's left, the less likely it is to ever happen.

BluntGuy

Well, if I don't see some kind of action within the next two weeks I'll know something is up.

In all fairness, the documents were prepared in December for the minister to examine. If several schemes clearly merit redesignation and have little objection, why hold them back? He can sign the S.I for them and spend further time weighing out the pros and cons of the others.

I was seriously expecting mid-January. Not hurrying up with these redesignations will have other implications. When new road maps are published, the redesignated stretches will not be present, leading - of course - to unecessary confusion (especially when most motorways will still be in "patches" for the two-three years).

Chris_533976

Great vids again

Part 2 at 3m50. That sign lasted a long time

Geogregor

Furet wrote: »

First, the Exit 8 Topaz/McDonalds "service area" under construction, 7 February 2009:

What is this "service area"?
I guess it is not one of the MSA which NRA trying to build around Ireland.
Is this some private initiative?
Is it going to be accessible directly from the motorways are you have to go off at the junction?

BTW
Congratulation with the rugby win

Amtmann

It's a privately built development, and has nothing to do with the NRA. A new Exit 8 ramp will be built to cater for it, at the developer's expense.


A photo of the M-F scheme northern terminus at Kilbehenny/Carrigane on 08/02/2009.

Meanwhile, further north at the M7/M8 PPP scheme...

The M8 seen from the R434 west of Durrow looking north.


The M8 looking south from the same position.


The M8 looking south, seen from a local road west of Cullahill village about 3km west of the present N8. Quality is poor, but if you look closely at the upper left hand side of the photo you can see the route for several kilometres.


The M8 looking north from the same position. This must be the "hard rock" section at Cullahill the last newsletter referred to. Not much sign of progress.

Not a jot of progress has been made at the first overbridge immediately north of the C-C scheme terminus. The bridge looks just as it did last November.

BluntGuy

This is so dissappointing.

So you mean the bridge near Cullahill is exactly the same as when I drove past it in December?

Thanks for the photographs as usual Furet. Just wish there were some visible signs of progress.

Amtmann

I almost forgot: they've started laying the median on some sections of the northern end of the Mitchelstown to Fermoy scheme.

That is all.

Amtmann

BluntGuy wrote: »

This is so dissappointing.

So you mean the bridge near Cullahill is exactly the same as when I drove past it in December.

It is extremely disappointing. No difference what so ever. Something must be up. This can't be good.

BluntGuy

I'm beginning to worry about the P-C/C scheme. It really does not appear to be making the progress it should.

Of course Q3 2010 is still achievable, but we may be looking at 2011 if things don't pick up.

Good news about C-M. The rate of progress never ceases to amaze me. I imagine not much has been done on the Fermoy Bypass tie-in due to the awful weather we had this week, but that doesn't concern me at all. I still believe they'll have it done within three months, possibly two depending on weather conditions.

CRG are building P-C/C, are they not? It's incredibly dissappointing that they're moving so slow, because their work-rate on the Waterford Bypass has been phenomenal.

Amtmann

BluntGuy wrote: »

Good news about F-M. The rate of progress never ceases to amaze me. I imagine not much has been done on the Fermoy Bypass tie-in due to the awful weather we had this week, but that doesn't concern me at all. I still believe they'll have it done within three months, possibly two depending on weather conditions.

They did make some progress actually, but it was too busy at the time for me to get out to take a photo. The final traffic management plan is now operating, and they removed some of the concrete median from the FB.

CRG are building P-C/C, are they not? It's incredibly dissappointing that they're moving so slow, because their work-rate on the Waterford Bypass has been phenomenal.

Perhaps once they've finished the WB they will transfer more resources to the M7/M8?

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

They did make some progress actually, but it was too busy at the time for me to get out to take a photo. The final traffic management plan is now operating, and they removed some of the concrete median from the FB.

How do they have traffic moving now? I imagine it's one lane on and one lane off. The concrete step barrier? I wonder how it was removed. Those things are pretty tough.

Furet wrote: »

Perhaps once they've finished the WB they will transfer more resources to the M7/M8?

I really don't know. I'd hope so, but I'm not so sure about it.

Still, CRG going slow gives them plenty of time to reck the old roads as much as possible to encourage drivers to use the toll.

Amtmann

BluntGuy wrote: »

How do they have traffic moving now? I imagine it's one lane on and one lane off.

Correct. The median has been removed in chunks at various stages, though mostly on the mainline from what I could see, though I didn't get much of a chance to slow down and have a look.

Will the M7/M8 scheme (if it ever gets done) actually add to the Dublin-Cork journey length, assuming there's no traffic jam in Abbeyleix? I mean, geographically it's much further west than the current N8, and so it looks like it'll make the driver cover more kilometres.

Then there's the issue of how much through traffic on both the M7 and M8 will dodge the toll. One solution might be to make Abbeyleix, Durrow (and Fermoy even) through traffic HGV-free zones, though this might well be impossible to implement (as well as unlawful)! The R639 south of Fermoy isn't too bad, but around Abbeyleix it's a boreen, so maybe toll dodging won't be an attractive option after all.

Another issue I suppose will be the nature of the toll plaza: I'd imagine 25,000 vehicles per day will use it; will there be jams if they opt for standard barriers?

BluntGuy

Furet wrote: »

Correct. The median has been removed in chunks at various stages, though mostly on the mainline from what I could see, though I didn't get much of a chance to slow down and have a look.

Hmm... they may try to re-align the mainline first then.

What are they going to do about the on-slip. It's far too wide right up until the roundabout. Are they going to remove the pavement and simply put grass in its place?

Will the M7/M8 scheme (if it ever gets done) actually add to the Dublin-Cork journey length, assuming there's no traffic jam in Abbeyleix? I mean, geographically it's much further west than the current N8, and so it looks like it'll make the driver cover more kilometres.

I think any distance added on here is negated by the more direct route from Fermoy to Mitchelstown. The old N8 was 155 km, this new M8 will only be 143 km. I'm not exactly sure how far the new M7/M8 junction will be from the the existing N8/M7 junction.

Then there's the issue of how much through traffic on both the M7 and M8 will dodge the toll. One solution might be to make Abbeyleix, Durrow (and Fermoy even) through traffic HGV-free zones, though this might well be impossible to implement (as well as unlawful)! The R639 south of Fermoy isn't too bad, but around Abbeyleix it's a boreen, so maybe toll dodging won't be an attractive option after all.

Toll dodging will be very unappealing, especially if Junction 3 is tolled. You'll have to leave at junction 4, which gives you 30 - 35 km worth of troublesome R639 to use before you rejoin a motorway.

I wonder what the price of the toll will be. What with the the existing Fermoy Bypass toll, I'd imagine it'll be relatively low.

Another issue I suppose will be the nature of the toll plaza: I'd imagine 25,000 vehicles per day will use it; will there be jams if they opt for standard barriers?

I don't think there'll be any issue here as long as the appropiate number of staff is available at all times. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if there are delays here due to under-staffing.