Horrific Cruelty Case *Graphic pic warning*

lightening

I know a guy who got his hand degloved in a printers between two rollers. No laughing matter, its a huge injury.

arybvtcw0eolkf

BryanL wrote: »

what may also shock people is that injuries like that are not unkonown in people,often from sporting injuries, car accidents or even after radical surgery.

:eek:

I'm 41 and have fought martial arts for most of my adult life and have never seen someone have their face torn apart like the dog in this post.

I also raced motorbikes for a few season's in the late 80s and early 90s and never seen this either!.

You post reads like the rantings of a mad man.

TKD SC

lightening wrote: »

...I should just tell you, this is my fault.

I PM'd BryanL about this link as he didn't really believe this type of thing happened and that some people who are involved in animal rescue are in for the massive profit gains. :rolleyes:

.

I dont think anyone in animal rescue / or any type of animal work makes massive profit gains! If they did, I'd change career
And if they did, what's so bad about that anyway? Everyone has to make money and what better way than by doing it through something you love?

Re Brian L's comparison to "sporting injuries, car accidents or radical surgery". I think a better comparison of this injury to the poor dog is maybe the recent news story of the person in the finglas pub the other day who got his hand chopped off by a samurai sword. Anyway, tbh, the "comparison" point is irrelevant and stupid.

BryanL

the reference was to say that an injury like that can happen for many reasons in people, but and don't miss the point folks

it can be treated with great success and little scarring after.

I have treated a person who had a similar injury from coming off a motorbike with an open helmet

the refernce also described treatment which maybe helpful to Egar or anyone else faced with something like this, again i'll quote

Ideally this injury should be treated as soon as possible by repositioning the displaced tissue and closure. Immediate assistance was not sought until superimposed infection caused pain and swelling. Because the wound was infected, treatment was aimed at obtaining healing by secondary intention

BryanL

daily walks with a muzzle are not that distressing and may even be protective with an injury like that?


anybody like to comment on that?
Bryan

lightening

BryanL wrote: »

I have treated a person who had a similar injury from coming off a motorbike with an open helmet

This has to be a joke.

TKD SC

Great if it can be treated with great success and little scarring. EGAR - please again keep us posted on the news of the patient.

Daily walks - are good!
Muzzle - not that distressing and protective with injury - yes, most likely.
Also, for certain dogs its the law to wear muzzles anyway.

I think daily walks are a while away yet for this particular dog, and hopefully he will be going for walks soon.

Annika30

How do you know it's not distressing to wear a muzzle have you tried it yourself?:D:D:D

BryanL

very far from a joke lightening, very very far from a joke.That man also had more serious ( hard as that may be to believe) injuries
I did notice that you, yourself made some great jokes on Boards.ie about that guy having his arm cut off in Dublin, even opening a topic on it.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055216718
So please don't feel the need to apologise for my presence here.
What happened that dog is terrible, but i'm sure she will manage herself better than most people and once the infection is quickly controlled and swelling (as this can compromise the local blood supply) She will certainly be able to lead a full and happy life.
I would still caution on her level of inate agression and see a muzzle as a sensible option
Bryan

TKD SC

Annika30 wrote: »

How do you know it's not distressing to wear a muzzle have you tried it yourself?:D:D:D

A little birdie told me

(i was quoting someone else by the way, and then adding my view - prob wasnt very clear!)

lightening

BryanL wrote: »

I did notice that you, yourself made some great jokes on Boards.ie about that guy having his arm cut off in Dublin, even opening a topic on it.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055216718/

How observant of you. They were good gags though! The other people in the thread though so too, anyway, your way off topic here.

Are you a doctor or a vet?

BryanL wrote: »

So please don't feel the need to apologise for my presence here.

You don't mind if I do though...

sebastianv

I'm more interested in the fact bryanl may or may not have stated that rescues are making money out of animals..Any comment bryanl or was Lightening pulling your plonker.
Are rescues ripping he faces of dogs or abandoning cats to gain money and sympathy ??? GET REAL!!!!!!!!!

It does not take away from the fact THIS DOG AND EGAR NEEDS AND DESERVES HELP. As does any rescue or animal faced with such horrific injuries to deal with.
Can we not keep this thread about the dog?
Any good new on the poor dog today?
Seb

lightening

Bryan, do you mind if I post up the pm I sent you and the one you sent me?

AckwelFoley

People in animal rescur making money from it?



... besides, if they did make money from helping animals they'd probably deserve it.

Leeby

BryanL wrote: »

Egar,
have you considered that the dog might have gotten itself into a fight that caused the injury and might fight again in the future? It may be that walking outside with a muzzle on could be a sensible option for the dog itself and other dogs.

EGAR works in animal rescue and says herself that it took her two days to get to the dog, so I trust that she knows what she's talking about when she says the injuries are from dog fighting.

sebastianv wrote:

I PM'd BryanL about this link as he didn't really believe this type of thing happened and that some people who are involved in animal rescue are in for the massive profit gains.

I know the quote above was said about you, and not directly by you, but if it is true that you think animal rescue is about earning good money why don't you try it yourself for a while and see.
Actually, I wouldn't advise you to do that as your previous comments lead me to believe that you're so oblivious of the cruelty that goes on you'd probably die of shock if you had to spend a day in EGARs shoes.

EGAR

Egar,
have you considered that the dog might have gotten itself into a fight that caused the injury and might fight again in the future? It may be that walking outside with a muzzle on could be a sensible option for the dog itself and other dogs. daily walks with a muzzle are not that distressing and may even be protective with an injury like that?
what may also shock people is that injuries like that are not unkonown in people,often from sporting injuries, car accidents or even after radical surgery

.

Sigh, there is always one who knows better.. If you read my OP then you will find that I have stated that she has also OTHER injuries, and yes, I know my job (and I know the backround of this case which you do not and I will not divulge on a public board like this for the time being). I have worked with Bull Breeds all my adult life and have taken in many injured dogs, I (and more importantly: my vets!) can tell an RTA from a fighting injury.

As she is a Staffie, she is legally required to be muzzled, however, I cannot see how she CAN wear a muzzle when her whole lower lip is peeled away from her lower jaw and is heavily infected. However, luckily I have access to enough private land to walk her on without having to enter public places.

As to the little scarring etc, maybe you should have a chat wit Aidan Miller at ARK in Galway, because he told me different this morning and he should know.

I would still caution on her level of inate agression and see a muzzle as a sensible option

Do you mean innate ie an unconditioned reflex as in hereditary? If so then you know precious little about Staffies.

I dont think anyone in animal rescue / or any type of animal work makes massive profit gains! If they did, I'd change career

Feel free to walk a mile in my boots. 24/7 at all times regardless of whether it is pissing rain or your mired in mud. I have had no hols in years, can't even go for a pint, drive a 10 yro banger (which I wouldn't have without a kind lady in the UK) and every penny I got goes *to the dogs*. No, I am not moaning as it is what I chose to do. I gave up a well paid job to move to Ireland and help the animals here.



Last time I raised funds was for a Wobbler's OP for a GD pup called Parcival. I had money left over from the fundraising when his treatment was completed and guess what? I gave it to Dogs in Distress for a heart OP for a sick GSD. I didn't even take petrol money or anything like that - it came out of my own pocket. Yes, I am angry!

I take great offence but I am not surprised, there is always one..

BryanL

just to go over a few things
1) what i pasted is called an abstract,
i pasted it in full,(hence the reference to it being a know sports injury)the injury the dog has is called degloving, the abstract gave the contact information of the people involved in managing that case and they could provide Egar with an electronic copy. I would be very confident that it would be helpful to her and the dog to have a copy of it.
surgical techniques are very similar in all fields,fact.
2)i only posted it to be helpful,some people seem to have a huge issue with that,why??????

i think profit in rescue should be a separate topic if people wish,
but will say that the DSPCA were on RTE radio 1, today saying they are going to cease operating as a charity because they feel it'd be easier to operate as a profitable company.why don't you all tell them they are lying!!!!!!!!

i spoke of urban myths with regard to an older,closed thread, last week, which still seems to be annoying some?. Egar had to put a few people right on this thread with regard to urban myths??? fighting french bulldogs etc.

Bryan

BryanL

Egar i have 10 years of surgical training so i'm very sorry to have caused you distress by discussing this with you.

again i would say that you might find the link i posted very helpful, i was not suggesting that the injury was caused by an RTA, but that this type of injury is seen more commonly in people than in animals and that it's managment in people would be worth investigating on your part.

i would not leave the lip hang unsupported because this will compromise blood supply and ability to fight the infection, but you know that.I would very humbly suggest that you support the lip with a tube bandage(elastic) changing this everytime you rinse the area with saline.

Also ,Granulex V, a Pfizer product(available from www.alivet.com, in aerosol is best, would be very helpful in removing necrotic tissue without damaging the underlying healthy tissue

"Do you mean innate ie an unconditioned reflex as in hereditary? If so then you know precious little about Staffies" no i didn't mean a reflex,possibly ingrained might put it across better

EGAR

The dog isn't with me, she is in the care of a specialist vet at the ARK Vet Clinic and before that she was in the care of my usual vet in Portumna who was convinced that it was beyond her field of expertise hence the move to the ARK this morning (btw, Aidan told me that this kind of injury is quite common in dogfights, he has seen it before). The skin will need debriding (sp) and Aidan will try to stitch it back on. The corners of the mouth have already been stitched as can be seen in this pic taken this morning at the ARK:



And seeing that you are so interested in money, here is the deposit I made this morning as I was required to. No one seems to know how much it will come to in the end. I will just have to sit and wait.



I appreciate your advise, perhaps you should give Aidan a call I am more than happy to PM you his phone number.

EGAR

think profit in rescue should be a separate topic if people wish,
but will say that the DSPCA were on RTE radio 1, today saying they are going to cease operating as a charity because they feel it'd be easier to operate as a profitable company.why don't you all tell them they are lying!!!!!!!!

They are being paid - I am not.

Take a guess who is calling out to cruelty cases on the weekend or on holidays because the ISPCA and the likes can't be reached? The likes of me! I am even crossing county boarder because I don't give a monkye's if an animal is in need and I can help.

Have a look:









I rescued this dog on a Sunday afternoon in a different county because the local SPCA couldn't be arsed to work on weekends.

Our man in Havana

Egar hun no one thinks you are out to scam money! I have seen the micracle you worked on Parci & know you put all your love & time into looking after the bullies who other rescues seem to ignore

I would just advice members who wish to give to a rescue to make its a genuine rescue or a registered charity - as there are less than honest people out there.

Animal rescue is HARD WORK! Egar & others do more than they physically & mentally should to help animals. Egar has worked mainly with bull breeds & understands all about the scum that use these dogs for fighting. If she feels this dog does not need a muzzle then I am sure she knows best! You can look into a dogs eyes & know what they are like!

Pheonix Ski

aww poor thing,is that a little glen of immal,how is he/she doing? and hows berni doing?

sillymoo

EGAR I know the great work you do as I am originally from your area and I personnally know how hard it is to contact and get help from the GSPCA-having been told before to bring a dog to the pound! I know Aidan in the ARK as my sister brings her dogs to him and you are lucky to be under his care as he is a wonderful guy and a fantastic vet.

Personnally I am shocked by the level of emotional name calling and chastising that goes on in the Animal and Pet section of this website. It is intimidating as an animal owner looking for help here to post for the fear of being ridiculed and shunned. I was just reading another thread where name calling was rampent and it really turns me off coming to this forum for help.

Bryan was trying to help by posting about surgical injuries be it human or not! As a medic myself there is an large overlap between vet med and human med so we can help, we will. I understand where bryan was coming from posting up the journal abstract, the ridicule he recieved was not nice.

So could the name calling stop please????? In the fear of being ridiculed myself........

EGAR

Update:

Berni is here.

I picked her up Wednesday at 3 pm at the ARK. From what I can see he did a smashing job, she has lots of stitches in her mouth and he managed to get it quite even. The ear (her left) also has been stitched and is quite swollen but so far so good. She didn't travel very well in the car but settled after half an hour. She is to get three different meds and needs to keep the buster collar on for a few days. All depends now on whether or not the stitches hold. I try to keep her out of mischief re her stitches and have her crated, she also need to get a special diet (her blood tests have shown her to be slightly anaemic) for the first few days and is not allowed to eat anything hard. So I got her lots of food at the vets. She also got a new crate and a brandnew donut bed . They have her age down as 6 years and 6 months although Aidan thinks she is closer to 8 (receptionist put in 6 as I told her at check-in yesterday I estimated her age at 6-8). The stitches are disolveable and I have another appointment at the ARK for next Thursday 2pm for a checkup with Aidan Miller.

Today:

Berni is doing very well!! So far the stitching held and every day is a bonus! She is eating very well and loves her place by the radiator! She is getting a bit perkier and calls when she needs to go for a wee. The weather is atrocious here so we nip out between the showers . I couldn't manage better pics but I think this one shows her chin better:



So far the bills came to 881.18 Euro. If you want to see them PM me and I'll forward you copies.

Thank you all for your support, I will keep you updated on her progress!

EGAR

Pheonix Ski wrote: »

aww poor thing,is that a little glen of immal,how is he/she doing? and hows berni doing?

He's a Wheaten (x) and he is doing fine, he has a new home with an elderly couple in the UK waiting for him and he will go over in mid-February with a friend of mine .

the dee

EGAR wrote: »

Update:

Berni is here.

I picked her up Wednesday at 3 pm at the ARK. From what I can see he did a smashing job, she has lots of stitches in her mouth and he managed to get it quite even. The ear (her left) also has been stitched and is quite swollen but so far so good. She didn't travel very well in the car but settled after half an hour. She is to get three different meds and needs to keep the buster collar on for a few days. All depends now on whether or not the stitches hold. I try to keep her out of mischief re her stitches and have her crated, she also need to get a special diet (her blood tests have shown her to be slightly anaemic) for the first few days and is not allowed to eat anything hard. So I got her lots of food at the vets. She also got a new crate and a brandnew donut bed . They have her age down as 6 years and 6 months although Aidan thinks she is closer to 8 (receptionist put in 6 as I told her at check-in yesterday I estimated her age at 6-8). The stitches are disolveable and I have another appointment at the ARK for next Thursday 2pm for a checkup with Aidan Miller.

Today:

Berni is doing very well!! So far the stitching held and every day is a bonus! She is eating very well and loves her place by the radiator! She is getting a bit perkier and calls when she needs to go for a wee. The weather is atrocious here so we nip out between the showers . I couldn't manage better pics but I think this one shows her chin better:



So far the bills came to 881.18 Euro. If you want to see them PM me and I'll forward you copies.

Thank you all for your support, I will keep you updated on her progress!

It's great to hear that Berni's doing better. You do some great work there EGAR.

Dublingirl23

Well done Egar. You have a heart of gold and I admire what you are doing. I myself, would love to be more involved in animal welfare however, I don't have a car anymore and I wont be back up in Dublin until August.

MsFifers

Delighted that Bernie is on the mend and perking up. Hope you did ok on the donations to cover the medical expenses. I might be able to contribute again next month if necessary.

Best of luck with the nursing.

arybvtcw0eolkf

MsFifers wrote: »

Delighted that Bernie is on the mend and perking up. Hope you did ok on the donations to cover the medical expenses. I might be able to contribute again next month if necessary.

Best of luck with the nursing.

I was only thinking about this last night and how the expenses are going?.

houndsoflove

Well done Egar, berni looks well on the mend. Thank god for people like you who are willing to go out of their way to help animals. I am a dog groomer and see dogs come in in a horrific condition, it breaks my heart to see their coat full of dirt, fleas and huge tight knots that pull the skin and cause it to swell red and sore. When will people learn