The begrudger attitude towards charity / charitable work

vorbis

I encounter this in real life as well as on After hours

People who have a problem with other people either doing charitable work or donating to charity.

Firstly giving to charity. There is apparently a right and a wrong way to give to charity. If you give to charity as it makes you feel good, well thats just not right. I've no idea why. The begrudger attitude is that you should feel downright miserable after donating.

Calling someone a "do gooder". This is an ingenious insult. People call Bono a do gooder. It literally means "do good things" yet is meant as an insult! Is anyone else amazed by this?? Imagine if you insulted a soccer player by saying "Oh he just scores goals" or a businessman by saying "He just makes lots of money".

People who don't give to charity or do charity work seem obsessed with the "motive" of people who do. Adi Roche has done some fabulous work with Chernobyl kids yet the focus is on whether its just to make herself look good. It might be but what difference does it make?

I'm curious, do "do gooders" make people feel guilty? Is the begrudgery an attempt to allay that guilt?

Dave!

Well I'm sure the begrudgers' only problem would be that someone might be using sick children (for example) as pawns to help further their career.

But if they're giving lots of money to a charity, I don't really give a sh*t what their motive is TBH...... It's the same end-product.

Rob_l

This thread will do no good!

I have no problem with people who give to charity do charitable work I do find it objectionable when they feel the need to continously remind others of all the good things they do.

*Page*

I hate the ad's on tv and the people on the street...
I give to charity my own way i do not need to be hassled on the street or made feel bad for the fact i have dinner on my plate.

But i feel the same way towards a lot of things people try to push on me, its not solely towards charity

faceman

unfortunately if the charities dont get out there and hit the streets they dont get the donations.

H.O.T.A.S.

I'm just sick of the emotional blackmailing they use on tv. That and the chuggers asking for your bank account details in the middle of a crowded street.

SUNGOD

i think the phrase " do gooder " is mainly used if someone is trying to do good in what people think is a bad or unjust way .EG someone campaigning for the rights of a mass murderer/rapist to have soft towels in his prision cell.ok that may sound extreme but i have heard it used in my area lately where travellers are parked in a buisness park causing trouble and demanding money to leave and the "do gooders " are against their eviction as it infringes on their civil rights .what about the rights of the people paying rent on the buisness park ?

Degsy

I hate chuggers and do-gooders.I hate Bono,Bob Geldof and Sting.I also hate Heather Mills and anybody else who uses their so-called charitable work to further their own standing,massage thier ego or make a few bob.Its ironic really that the larger charities have boards of directors paid hundreds of grand a year and the celebrity crusaders are usually multi-millionaires.If i want to help i'll do so in my own way but i wont be bullied into handing over money to hypocrites.

*Page*

H.O.T.A.S. wrote: »

I'm just sick of the emotional blackmailing they use on tv. That and the chuggers asking for your bank account details in the middle of a crowded street.

could they not use the €13 an hour they pay the fe€kers to feed hungry children?

Muff_Daddy

I agree with the OP actually, it seems no-one in this country can do a good deed without a certain few people questioning whether there is an alteriar motive for doing so.

Taking the Bono example, sometimes I really don't get the hate for the guy, and people are just jumping on the bandwagon because it's 'cool to hate Bono'. He does good things, and whether or not he's in the public eye when he's dong is irrevelant. He's the lead singer in the biggest band in the world for god sake, of course he's going to be in the public eye. Bill Gates and Oprah Winphry do charatible work, and are praised for doing so, hell Bono is a demi-god in America, which really shows the Irish anti-goodwill attitude. Maybe he is a d!ckhead, and deserves the stick he gets, but he really shouldn't be slagged off for charity.

Oh, I did bump into him once in his hotel around 3 years ago, and all I can say is, shades in a lounge......what a sap

H.O.T.A.S.

*Page* wrote: »

could they not use the €13 an hour they pay the fe€kers to feed hungry children?

I know it's disgusting! If you are being paid €13 an hour the least you could do is wash!

Degsy

Muff_Daddy wrote: »

I agree with the OP actually, it seems no-one in this country can do a good deed without a certain few people questioning whether there is an alteriar motive for doing so.

Taking the Bono example, sometimes I really don't get the hate for the guy, and people are just jumping on the bandwagon because it's 'cool to hate Bono'. He does good things, and whether or not he's in the public eye when he's dong is irrevelant. He's the lead singer in the biggest band in the world for god sake, of course he's going to be in the public eye. Bill Gates and Oprah Winphry do charatible work, and are praised for doing so, hell Bono is a demi-god in America, which really shows the Irish anti-goodwill attitude. Maybe he is a d!ckhead, and deserves the stick he gets, but he really shouldn't be slagged off for charity.

Oh, I did bump into him once in his hotel around 3 years ago, and all I can say is, shades in a lounge......what a sap

One reasonis because he's so scabby he took a woman to court over a cowboy hat and a pair of jocks.On one hand he's urging leaders to let the third world off the hook finacially and on the other he's trying to bankrupt somebody who hasnt got much money because he's a scabby wanker.The only work i'm positive that Bono does is work extremely hard to avoid paying a penny in tax in this country,"drop the debt" is a wooly concept anyway,the third world arent poor because we wont give them money but because of the corruption of third world governments.

Muff_Daddy

Degsy wrote: »

One reasonis because he's so scabby he took a woman to court over a cowboy hat and a pair of jocks.On one hand he's urging leaders to let the third world off the hook finacially and on the other he's trying to bankrupt somebody who hasnt got much money because he's a scabby wanker.The only work i'm positive that Bono does is work extremely hard to avoid paying a penny in tax in this country,"drop the debt" is a wooly concept anyway,the third world arent poor because we wont give them money but because of the corruption of third world governments.

He may be a wanker, I'm not disputing that, but the whole 'who does he think he is giving to charity when he's bleeden loaded' attitude annoys me. It's like he has no right to do so. And yes, he has done a good deal for charity, but re: Third World Debt, he's fighting a battle he can't win there.

Spook_ie

Degsy wrote: »

One reasonis because he's so scabby he took a woman to court over a cowboy hat and a pair of jocks.On one hand he's urging leaders to let the third world off the hook finacially and on the other he's trying to bankrupt somebody who hasnt got much money because he's a scabby wanker.The only work i'm positive that Bono does is work extremely hard to avoid paying a penny in tax in this country,"drop the debt" is a wooly concept anyway,the third world arent poor because we wont give them money but because of the corruption of third world governments.

So why not support local charities like SVDP or Simon Community?

*Page*

H.O.T.A.S. wrote: »

I know it's disgusting! If you are being paid €13 an hour the least you could do is wash!

i dont care about that side of itifs a charty based thing why not get voulenteers to do it!

Maybe there is an inferance that you think your better than the other person, if you advertise to them what you do for charity.
Because people who broadcast that they go to mass, with a smug I deserve a medal head annoy me.

phasers

fair play to someone for helping others
I just hate when people brag about it


such as Bono
self riteous tw*t

Jesus Wept

phasers wrote: »

fair play to someone for helping others
I just hate when people brag about it


such as Bono
self riteous tw*t

Bono gets some abuse around these parts.

He is attempting to move things along on a bigger scale than him just making personal donations.

Getting countries to commit to writing off debt. He can hardly put pressure on them quietly: 'ah go on, go on, ya will ya will ya will.'

He must involve the media to put any pressure on Governments.

Ciaran500

Degsy wrote: »

One reasonis because he's so scabby he took a woman to court over a cowboy hat and a pair of jocks.On one hand he's urging leaders to let the third world off the hook finacially and on the other he's trying to bankrupt somebody who hasnt got much money because he's a scabby wanker

They took her to court over something stolen from them and they didn't try to claim the legal charges off her. What a wanker :rolleyes:

Trojan911

I've always maintained that if I won big on the lottery I would not give cash to charities. Instead I would call a meeting of the directors of my chosen charities and ask them what they need and then buy it for them.

To me giving money to charities is a no no. Not all of the money given is put towards the charity.

At the moment, apart from chucking the odd cent into the ISPCC or Mary Mount Hospice (Cancer) box, I do volunteer work, Irish Red Cross etc. That's my contribution at the moment.

So, to answer the question, it doesn't bother me who gives what to whom. It's their money & if they want to crow about it let them.


TJ911...

Gekko

don't let the begrudgers grind you down!

Fair play to anyone who does stuff for charity.

I'm doing a bit of fundraising at the moment and admittedly I've annoyed some contacts of mine by asking for their support.

But I've tried to do it in a laid-back slightly self-deprecating way.

Then again I'm sure some of them think I'm a smug do-gooding wánker...!

pretty-in-pink

Do nice stuff, why not? It's nice to be nice. It's when it's used as a "look at me, I'm great" thing that people get annoyed. Real charity is it's own reward, not basking in the glow of people sayig "fair play to you".

Jay D

I believe that there is too much corruption in charities to bother.

Also I am fed up with people standing outside shops and **** in your face.

I used to donate to Concern and also Amnesty but tbh Concern cannot be giving all money to charity.

Amnesty I don't always agree with.

invincibleirish

i work with a volunteer group in my locale one day a week and to be honest,as a lazy student, im doing it as much to balance my karma out as much as helping out!

its quite boring though,mainly just office work,tis i who have to send off letters and reply to annoying local politicians with enormous egos

me: "hi there please if you could help us with our project"

local pol. #1: "yes i support your cause,let me mention it in my literature and have a photo of me and the kids in the literature i send out"

me: "why thank you,seeing as you are on this local council ctte./have access to this minister/play golf with the county manager could you help us out as we promote cause x and apply for funding?"

local pol. #1: "yes let me get back to you on that..."

6 months later (some money secured through sheer graft and very, very little help from any local pol. just hard graft from the full time project manager)

local pol. #1 to #12 to local press and anyone who'll listen "we are responsible for this glorious success for our great town".........b@stards.....

thefinalstage

Gekko wrote: »

don't let the begrudgers grind you down!

Fair play to anyone who does stuff for charity.

I'm doing a bit of fundraising at the moment and admittedly I've annoyed some contacts of mine by asking for their support.

But I've tried to do it in a laid-back slightly self-deprecating way.

Then again I'm sure some of them think I'm a smug do-gooding wánker...!

A prime example! Why did you have to tell us that you are doing charity work?

vorbis

thelastangryman, you are a prime example of what I'm on about!!

What about Gekko's fundrasing annoys you so much?
As far as I can see, he's raising money for a good cause. Fair play to him, leave him at it.
Is he making you feel guilty about not giving much money to charity?

thefinalstage

vorbis wrote: »

thelastangryman, you are a prime example of what I'm on about!!

What about Gekko's fundrasing annoys you so much?
As far as I can see, he's raising money for a good cause. Fair play to him, leave him at it.
Is he making you feel guilty about not giving much money to charity?

Guilty? No, I just don't give a crap about charities. He felt the need to point out his charity work. I just pointed out that that is what annoys me. His "need" for reassurance.

pretty-in-pink

thelastangryman wrote: »

Guilty? No, I just don't give a crap about charities. He felt the need to point out his charity work. I just pointed out that that is what annoys me. His "need" for reassurance.

Agreed- if its truly being done for a good cause (aside from cases where you are selling ribbons etc, when you need peoples attention), then why do you need to tell people? Its hypocritical, to say you are doing good for the world etc, and then tell everyone about it for the praise. Just do your thing.

vorbis

pretty-in-pink wrote: »

Agreed- if its truly being done for a good cause (aside from cases where you are selling ribbons etc, when you need peoples attention), then why do you need to tell people? ITs hypocritical

This ties back to my second point about "motive". Why do YOU care what his motive for doing it is? As I mentioned in the first post, you imply the people selling ribbons are collecting for charity in the "wrong" fashion (they gain attention).

Why does it matter to you? This is exactly the begrudgery I am talking about. The end result is the same, money collected for a good cause. What difference does their motive have????

AlmightyCushion

vorbis wrote: »

This ties back to my second point about "motive". Why do YOU care what his motive for doing it is? As I mentioned in the first post, you imply the people selling ribbons are collecting for charity in the "wrong" fashion (they gain attention).

Why does it matter to you? This is exactly the begrudgery I am talking about. The end result is the same, money collected for a good cause. What difference does their motive have????

I don't think she is saying that people selling ribbons are collecting for charity in the "wrong" fashion. It's just the way she phrased the sentence.

I think she is saying that you shouldn't need to tell people unless you are selling ribbons because you have to get peoples attention.

Del2005

The-Rigger wrote: »

Bono gets some abuse around these parts.

He is attempting to move things along on a bigger scale than him just making personal donations.

Getting countries to commit to writing off debt. He can hardly put pressure on them quietly: 'ah go on, go on, ya will ya will ya will.'

He must involve the media to put any pressure on Governments.

What p!sses me off about Bono is that he wants us to write off third world debt. Fair enough, but that debt is part of our countires balance sheet and that twat doesn't even pay tax here. So he wants us to write off debt which may lead to tax hikes, everything still needs paying for, and he moved all his money out of the country to avoid paying tax. It's the cheek of him.

As for others giving to charity or doing charity work, fair enough. But I've read too much about how charities only give a small % of what they collect out, the rest goes on pay and expensises.

In my work they adpoted a village in Kenya and built a school and hospital. I've no problem with this I even gave some money, but then the organising committee went over to look at what we built and take pictures to show us all. All well and good, they even paid for it themselves. What would have been much better would have been for then to send over the money for their plane tickets and a digital camera for the pictures, no need for 10 white people to go over and act like gods cause we built a school

pretty-in-pink

Nope ribbon selling needs to be done in public-

Let people do what they want, yes the charity benefits regardless. ITs annoying to have people toot their own hornsa bout it though. Which is what puts people off- not the fact good is being done, but the fact people are going on and on about it

Krieg

Charity is good and fair play to those who do it

But there are some who deserve to be told to f*** off!
Im referring to the following, which has already been mentioned- Walking down a pedestrian street and have some c*** walk in front of you with a clip board with a big smile 'Hi! would you like to support 'X' charity". Even worse, some wear normal clothes and attempt to strike up a conversation before asking for a donation. Even WORSE (well sort of..) 3 girls in swim wear were doing it last summer on shop street in galway
I say to you people F*** OFF








... damn that felt good

AlmightyCushion

Del2005 wrote: »

What p!sses me off about Bono is that he wants us to write off third world debt. Fair enough, but that debt is part of our countires balance sheet and that twat doesn't even pay tax here. So he wants us to write off debt which may lead to tax hikes, everything still needs paying for, and he moved all his money out of the country to avoid paying tax. It's the cheek of him.

We actually owe the world bank quite a substantial amount of money so they aren't taking any money off us by cancelling the debt. The world bank have probably made more money on interest payments than they have given out.

the_syco

I think people who collect for charities are good. I just hate the **** who not only get paid to do it, but then brag to others of the great work they're being (paid) to do, as if they were doing it for free.

As for Bono, the f**ker is saying we should give all our money away, but I never hear of him giving much to said charities...

Steyr

vorbis wrote: »

I'm curious, do "do gooders" make people feel guilty? Is the begrudgery an attempt to allay that guilt?

Some "do gooders" annoy people as they think they are doing the right thing for EVERYBODY but as we all know NOT everybody may feel like they do.

Del2005

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

We actually owe the world bank quite a substantial amount of money so they aren't taking any money off us by cancelling the debt.

We don't owe the world bank all that much, AFAIK we have one of the lowest debts in the EU.
The money Bono wants us to cancell is debt to third world countries that is on our books. He also wants all counties to do this and again it's tax money he is talking about, but won't pay any himself.

The world bank have probably made more money on interest payments than they have given out.

Thats how all banks work. When does a bank give money away to loose money. When I finish paying my mortgage in the distant futhure I'll have paid twice what I borrowed, thats how loans with interest work. The money in the third world may have been wasted, but whats to stop the rulers of these countries not wasting the money they save on interest payments?

AlmightyCushion

Del2005 wrote: »

We don't owe the world bank all that much, AFAIK we have one of the lowest debts in the EU.
The money Bono wants us to cancell is debt to third world countries that is on our books. He also wants all counties to do this and again it's tax money he is talking about, but won't pay any himself.

Link

€36 billion is quiet a lot of money. I don't know what it's like compared to other EU countries though.

Del2005 wrote: »

Thats how all banks work. When does a bank give money away to loose money. When I finish paying my mortgage in the distant futhure I'll have paid twice what I borrowed, thats how loans with interest work. The money in the third world may have been wasted, but whats to stop the rulers of these countries not wasting the money they save on interest payments?

I know and I agree, I was just pointing it out. Personally I think that restrictions should be put in place for countries borrowing money to ensure that it is spend appropriately.

Jesus Wept

Del2005 wrote: »

W Fair enough, but that debt is part of our countires balance sheet and that twat doesn't even pay tax here. So he

We all avoid tax, avoiding tax is perfectly legal, logical and a normal thing to do.

Give him a break ffs, if there was a legal easy way for you to avoid tax you would, you should anyhow.

So he doesn't pay taxes, it's not his fault that the taxs laws are setup in such a manner.

He has likely helped the country financially in other ways.
U2/Bono have likely brought tourists to Ireland because they are Irish, and hence plenty of money into the economy.

I'm not saying Bono should get sainthood, but give him a break ffs.
The tax thing is a mute point IMO.

unreggd

I dont see the people on the street lookin for donations doing any good

In fact, they're probably at a loss

One group is usually about 5 people, for 5 hours, say 10 an hour

Thats €250

X that by the amount of days they're out, im sure its more than what they earn


I dont think/know of anyone who has a problem with someone else actually doin a good deed, but if they gloat and seek praise, or do it for some stupid reason, then that can p;ss people off

*Page*

unreggd wrote: »

I dont see the people on the street lookin for donations doing any good

In fact, they're probably at a loss

One group is usually about 5 people, for 5 hours, say 10 an hour

Thats €250

X that by the amount of days they're out, im sure its more than what they earn


I dont think/know of anyone who has a problem with someone else actually doin a good deed, but if they gloat and seek praise, or do it for some stupid reason, then that can p;ss people off

€13 an hour for concern workers!!! they get they lunches pained for also

spudster101

Iv absoultely no problem with people doing stuff for charity but what p**ses me off is a person mentioning that they do at every oppurtune moment to people. Passing themselves off as mother theresa or some such.:mad:. And yes i know you have to mention it to get more people involved.

Stephen

The only problems I have with charities are these:

1. Chuggers. **** you.

2. Somebody-please-think-of-the-children-guilt-trip ads.

walshb

Muff_Daddy wrote: »

I agree with the OP actually, it seems no-one in this country can do a good deed without a certain few people questioning whether there is an alteriar motive for doing so.

Taking the Bono example, sometimes I really don't get the hate for the guy, and people are just jumping on the bandwagon because it's 'cool to hate Bono'. He does good things, and whether or not he's in the public eye when he's dong is irrevelant. He's the lead singer in the biggest band in the world for god sake, of course he's going to be in the public eye. Bill Gates and Oprah Winphry do charatible work, and are praised for doing so, hell Bono is a demi-god in America, which really shows the Irish anti-goodwill attitude. Maybe he is a d!ckhead, and deserves the stick he gets, but he really shouldn't be slagged off for charity.

Oh, I did bump into him once in his hotel around 3 years ago, and all I can say is, shades in a lounge......what a sap

Hate is a very strong word and I certainly do not hate Bono.
But let me ask you this?
What has Bono ever done here in Ireland I ask?
I have never heard of a single charitable act for an Irish
person?

Is Bono genuine....that's what I feel needs
to be asked?

I firmly believe he is not because if he was, then maybe
to prove his genuinity, he himself would donate a percentage
of his vast vast millions to these so called good causes.

The man like may others is on a serious ego
trip and once they get the buzz, they just can't STOP.

This guy has the audacity to lecture governments on
how muchh they should be giving to charity. He's basically
taking money off people to give to others.

Why doesn't he and all his cronies simply donate their
vast wealth and STOP robbing money from people
here in Ireland who are earning peanuts in comparison to him...

And to date, Bono has as far as I know, never came out and told
the public that he himself has donated a chunk of his wealth to
help the poor. And don't give me the crap that that's his own
business. If so, then shut up and keep your nose
out of my business Bono and stop telling me that I should
contibute more and more...

walshb

By the way I have no problem whatsoever with charity workers and think the work they do is invaluable. But I believe charity begins at home and you need first to start with your own neighbor. It's the likes of these people who are out
begging us for Africa and Asia and India day in and day out. The very people who would begrudge their own neighbour a crust of bread....This is what bugs me and there are plenty like them around...

You want to be a credible and genuine charity worker, then start at home and do your bit for those who are blatantly in front of your eyes.

Who needs to go thousands of miles away to find a hungry child or a handicapped person or a lonely person etc etc....They are here in Ireland
too.....

Jesus Wept

walshb wrote: »

Hate is a very strong word and I certainly do not hate Bono.
But let me ask you this?
What has Bono ever done here in Ireland I ask?
I have never heard of a single charitable act for an Irish
person?

Is Bono genuine....that's what I feel needs
to be asked?

I firmly believe he is not because if he was, then maybe
to prove his genuinity, he himself would donate a percentage
of his vast vast millions to these so called good causes.

The man like may others is on a serious ego
trip and once they get the buzz, they just can't STOP.

This guy has the audacity to lecture governments on
how muchh they should be giving to charity. He's basically
taking money off people to give to others.

Why doesn't he and all his cronies simply donate their
vast wealth and STOP robbing money from people
here in Ireland who are earning peanuts in comparison to him...

And to date, Bono has as far as I know, never came out and told
the public that he himself has donated a chunk of his wealth to
help the poor. And don't give me the crap that that's his own
business. If so, then shut up and keep your nose
out of my business Bono and stop telling me that I should
contibute more and more...

lol is all I can say.

I am fully *confident* that he does donate to charity, privately.

I'll put this to you, if he said publicly 'I'm going to donate €10 million/€50 million/20% of my earnings', you'd say 'what a d1ckhead, can't you just donate it without looking for praise and thinking your a big shot,
huge fúcking egotistical wanker! etc.

Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.


*edit*

walshb

Oh so you are Bono's spokesperson...
Well that answers that then.
I'm sorry, it's official, Bono donates to charity....

And for the record, if Bono came out publicly and said
he himself is donating a percentage of his wealth, then I for
one would afford him more credibility.

So no, I wouldn't criticise him.....

Jesus Wept

walshb wrote: »

Oh so you are Bono's spokesperson...
Well that answers that then.
I'm sorry, it's official, Bono donates to charity....

And for the record, if Bono came out publicly and said
he himself is donating a percentage of his wealth, then I for
one would afford him more credibility.

So no, I wouldn't criticise him.....

Yes I am his spokesperson, didn't you know?

You say that now, but most of the people here who criticise him have gone on about ego, so he would clearly be damned if he did come out and publicly announce he was giving €x to charity.

As I said, he can't win, he can't even break even.

thefinalstage

The-Rigger wrote: »

Yes I am his spokesperson, didn't you know?

You say that now, but most of the people here who criticise him have gone on about ego, so he would clearly be damned if he did come out and publicly announce he was giving €x to charity.

As I said, he can't win, he can't even break even.

Look its simple. He lectures governments to use our taxes to help other countries even though by definition taxes are to keep a country working and not to donate at all. Than he skips out and pays as little tax as he can. Which means he is basically saying that the ordinary folk should pay. He doesn't even have to give directly to charity just pay his taxes like the rest of us!

Jesus Wept

Ah look, you are talking nonsense, I've made my feelings known on the tax bullsh1t, so if you want to know what I think, read up.


How much tax do you pay that you are not due?
Not a fúcking red cent, nor should you, nor should he.

thelastangryman wrote: »

He doesn't even have to give directly to charity just pay his taxes like the rest of us!

He pays every single cent he is due. He didn't write the tax laws.

thelastangryman wrote: »

Look its simple. He lectures governments to use our taxes to help other countries even though by definition taxes are to keep a country working and not to donate at all.

WoW! How quickly we forget? Where would we be without the massive leg up we have gotten over the past decade from the European Union?
We'd wouldn't be near where we are.
Every Tom, Dick and Harry wouldn't be driving new/ish cars and pondering what investment property to spend their SSIA on.

But we got lots of funding and help, and now we are prosperous, so let's shut up shop, whatever we do let's not try and help anyone else out, that would cost us our money.

Since when we were donating all our tax revenue anyhow? I must of missed the most recent budget.

smirkingmaurice

be great if bono could do a bit for the old and sick in this country besides dodging taxes and treating the ordinary irish people like the monkeys we are