Paul Tibbits dies

ruskin

Paul Tibbits, the man who dropped the first a-bomb on Hiroshima in 1945, has died at the age of 92. Isnt it just wrong that that monster lived a long healthy life after what he took part in? He dropped a bomb that completly disintegrated human life, and caused countless cancers and suffering for years to come

P_1

Que 'he was just following orders ala the nazis' responses

connundrum

What would you have preferred happen to him?

jhegarty

You do know more people would have died (on both sides) if the US had the invade japan ?

AlmightyCushion

ruskin wrote: »

Paul Tibbits, the man who dropped the first a-bomb on Hiroshima in 1945, has died at the age of 92. Isnt it just wrong that that monster lived a long healthy life after what he took part in? He dropped a bomb that completly disintegrated human life, and caused countless cancers and suffering for years to come

In fairness if he didn't do it someone else would. Should the person who made the nuts and bolts for the bomb deserve to die at a young age too.

Mossy Monk

ruskin wrote: »

Isnt it just wrong that that monster lived a long healthy life after what he took part in?

Shut up.

csm

he was following orders. just like the nazis. what of it?

people do crazy things when under situations like that (e.g. stanford prison experiment) and to be fair, the full extent of destruction wasn't fully known back then.

*Kol*

ruskin wrote: »

Paul Tibbits, the man who dropped the first a-bomb on Hiroshima in 1945, has died at the age of 92. Isnt it just wrong that that monster lived a long healthy life after what he took part in? He dropped a bomb that completly disintegrated human life, and caused countless cancers and suffering for years to come

:rolleyes: Jeez.

wyndham

That bomb saved millions of lives.

mike65

Some peeps should not have teh interweb. Anyway if anyone is to blame its Oppenheimer of course!

Mike.

ircoha

ruskin wrote: »

Paul Tibbits, the man who dropped the first a-bomb on Hiroshima in 1945, has died at the age of 92. Isnt it just wrong that that monster lived a long healthy life after what he took part in? He dropped a bomb that completly disintegrated human life, and caused countless cancers and suffering for years to come

He was the pilot.

re

disintegrated human life, and caused countless cancers and suffering for years to come

The HSE is pretty much doing that now

ruskin

It is a useless argument to say that the bomb saved millions of lives. By the time it was dropped, the war was all but over in continental Europe and in the Pacific the Americans were obviously winning. There was no need for the bombs to be dropped on Japan, and those involved in their deployment made a serious mistake

jhegarty

ruskin wrote: »

It is a useless argument to say that the bomb saved millions of lives. By the time it was dropped, the war was all but over in continental Europe and in the Pacific the Americans were obviously winning. There was no need for the bombs to be dropped on Japan, and those involved in their deployment made a serious mistake

Except that Japan was going to fight until the last man , woman and child had died....

Sinfonia

.

biko

wyndham wrote: »

That bomb saved millions of lives.

Thanks for your input.

Now from wiki:

The atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were nuclear attacks during World War II against the Empire of Japan by the United States of America under US President Harry S. Truman. After six months of intense firebombing of 67 other Japanese cities, on August 6, 1945, the nuclear weapon "Little Boy" was dropped on the city of Hiroshima, followed on August 9, 1945 by the detonation of the "Fat Man" nuclear bomb over Nagasaki. These are the only uses of nuclear weapons in warfare.

As many as 140,000 people in Hiroshima and 80,000 in Nagasaki may have died from the bombings by the end of 1945, roughly half on the days of the bombings. Since then, thousands more have died from injuries or illness due to radiation. In both cities, the overwhelming majority of the dead were civilians.

Couldn't have done more damage if they've flown the bomb planes into a building.

Why did the yanks drop the second bomb? They've already killed more than 100.000 people. It seems survivors from the Hiroshima bombing made their way to Nagasaki and were actually bombed again.

ircoha

ruskin wrote: »

It is a useless argument to say that the bomb saved millions of lives. By the time it was dropped, the war was all but over in continental Europe and in the Pacific the Americans were obviously winning. There was no need for the bombs to be dropped on Japan, and those involved in their deployment made a serious mistake

History is a person's opinion of what happened.:)

speaktofrank

exactly. If i had been president I would have dropped a third just to spite them.
I know a lot of veterans feel the same. remember the death march, the horrors of Japanese prisoner of war camps? The Japanese invasion of modern day China etc Pearl Harbor. The list goes on. They got what was coming to them.

Mr.Micro

Only the good die young .

jhegarty

So ruskin, what would you have done ? if you were the US President...

biko

speaktofrank wrote: »

exactly. If i had been president I would have dropped a third just to spite them.
I know a lot of veterans feel the same. remember the death march, the horrors of Japanese prisoner of war camps? The Japanese invasion of modern day China etc Pearl Harbor. The list goes on. They got what was coming to them.

I can't believe how aggressive Americans are.

Orange69

This thread is teh ghey!

leninbenjamin

jhegarty wrote: »

Except that Japan was going to fight until the last man , woman and child had died....

were they? i read somewhere recently that they were already going to surrender by the time the bombs dropped.

ejmaztec

I understood that the nuclear attacks weren't that necessary, but the Americans wanted to send a signal to the Russians to show them what they had to offer. The Russian army was getting close to Japan and the Americans didn't like the idea of them moving in.

Poxyshamrock

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Only the good die young .

but that doesn't mean only the evil die old! :mad:

Binomate

jhegarty wrote: »

You do know more people would have died (on both sides) if the US had the invade japan ?

This is not true. The Japs days were numbered when the bomb was dropped. Japan had very little fight left in her. The decision to drop the bomb was completely wrong. In fact, it was more of an experiment than it was a quick end to the war.

monkeyfudge

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

In fairness if he didn't do it someone else would. Should the person who made the nuts and bolts for the bomb deserve to die at a young age too.

Believe it or not one of the Marx brothers designed the clamps for the bomb release mechanism.

justfortherecor

Binomate wrote: »

This is not true. The Japs days were numbered when the bomb was dropped. Japan had very little fight left in her. The decision to drop the bomb was completely wrong. In fact, it was more of an experiment than it was a quick end to the war.

The Japanese (not "Japs") days had been numbered since the Battle of Midway. It didn't stop their manic fighting at Iwo Jima (216 surrendered, other 20,700 perished or commited suicide) and in Okinawa where over 200,000 died and many again commited seppaku. Invading Honshu would have been an absolute bloodbath for both sides.

Remember, it didnt matter a damn about military capabilities and strength to the ordinary Japanese at that time. As long as they still thought they were fighting a religious war, they would have fought to the very end.

It was only after Hiroshima and Nagasaki that Emperor Hirohito saw what awaited his country and ordered the surrender (first time he was ever heard by the Japanese people btw); they quickly laid down their arms after that and one of the most successful occupations of a defeated state ensued. Hiroshima was a tragic event but it was, unfortunately, necessary. It changed the course of Japanese history and without doubt a better Japan emerged from the whole experience.

Look where Japan is today.

bushy...

justfortherecor wrote: »

Look where Japan is today.

Compared to where they were
(Note date is 1933-45)
If it helped end that .....





don't click link if delicate etc.

Binomate

justfortherecor wrote: »

The Japanese (not "Japs") days had been numbered since the Battle of Midway. It didn't stop their manic fighting at Iwo Jima (216 surrendered, other 20,700 perished or commited suicide) and in Okinawa where over 200,000 died and many again commited seppaku. Invading Honshu would have been an absolute bloodbath for both sides.

Remember, it didnt matter a damn about military capabilities and strength to the ordinary Japanese at that time. As long as they still thought they were fighting a religious war, they would have fought to the very end.

It was only after Hiroshima and Nagasaki that Emperor Hirohito saw what awaited his country and ordered the surrender (first time he was ever heard by the Japanese people btw); they quickly laid down their arms after that and one of the most successful occupations of a defeated state ensued. Hiroshima was a tragic event but it was, unfortunately, necessary. It changed the course of Japanese history and without doubt a better Japan emerged from the whole experience.

Look where Japan is today.

Yes, clearly by the way they gave up once the bombs had been dropped, they would not go out with out a fight...

bushy... wrote: »

Compared to where they were

Note date is 1933-45





don't click link if delicate etc.

Bah ha ha. I hope you're not trying to use the fact that they carried out inhumane tests on human subjects as a justification for dropping a nuclear weapon on a city full of civilians. If you want to use that method of justification, I can retort with the fact that America was segregated at that time. Maybe if the Russians had dropped a Nuke in Manhattan the deep south would have suddenly cleaned up their act.

jhegarty

Binomate wrote: »

Yes, clearly by the way they gave up once the bombs had been dropped, they would not go out with out a fight...

They didn't give up when the bomb was dropped , they waited until the second was ....

they had flight left in them , but was something they couldn't fight...

justfortherecor

They had fight left in them as long as the Emperor still wished them to.

Genghiz Cohen

Poxyshamrock wrote: »

but that doesn't mean only the evil die old! :mad:

You have completely missed the meaning of that quote, and I'm not going to explain it to you.

To the OP, do you actually think there was a day in that mans life that he didn't look back and think about all the people he killed, and then you come along and say something so unbelievably ignorant that the bile is touching the top of my throat. The people that dropped the bombs can actually be quoted as saying "Oh my God, what have we done." It wasn't their decision, and it wasn't their fault, show some God dammed respect to the man and his family.
Now I have no love for such a vulgar display of power, but when someone comes along and says crap like this is make me sick, to my stomach. Maybe you should try living with something of that magnitude on your mind, every day for 40 odd years, gimp.

nyarlothothep

best described as a fcked up course of action in a fcked up situation.

patto_chan

The tired old 'Americans = bad' argument again. Yawn.
It is easy to make flippant comments from a safe vantage point 60 years later. The Pacific war end game was complex.
Richards Rhodes wrote an excellent book on the development and use of the atomic bombs at the end of WW2. Check it out.

It is argued that more people died in a firebombing raid in Tokyo in March 1945 than in the immediate aftermath of both A-bomb attacks. Yet very few people have heard of that raid.

Dont be at yourself

Whatever about the need to drop the bomb, there was certainly no need to drop the bomb on a populated city, and certainly no need to drop two bombs. And for Tibbits, considering he not once expressed remorse - and indeed re-inacted the bombing, complete with mushroom cloud, at an airshow in Texas - he'll go down as ignorant and inhumane in my book.

Steyr

OP you are an Idiot, if it wasnt for the likes of The Americans and The British Operation Grun could well and truly happened on Irish soil and we could have been speaking Deutsch now or Russian, get a grip the world was at War and the Japanese were just as blood thirsty as the rest, Pearl Harbour anybody?

If you were there then would you have let the bomb go and end a World war or would you just let it continue? Show some respect for the many who made the ultimate sacrifice for the few.

Binomate

I heard the Emperor tried to phone the president of America to tell him that he was giving up, but the line was engaged because the president was on the phone to the bomber pilots telling them to nuke Japan.

Steyr

May I recommend the book

Ruin from the Air - Gordon Thomas and Max Morgan Witts
ISBN-10: 0812885090
ISBN-13: 978-0812885095

Very readable account of the politics, operation and personalities.

Steyr

Binomate wrote: »

I heard the Emperor tried to phone the president of America to tell him that he was giving up, but the line was engaged because the president was on the phone to the bomber pilots telling them to nuke Japan.

You mean a RADIO.......... First ive heard of that or of Mobile Phones on WW2 Aircraft.

Steyr

This man was a true aviation professional.

He did something for the first time, something incredibly risky, with an awesome bottom line, without question, and brought the crew and the aeroplane home.

And changed the course of history.

The argument will never be won, because there are as many bleeding heart liberals as there are pragmatists in this world. There can be little doubt that the taking of the Home Islands and the ultimate invasion of Japan would have slaughtered perhaps millions of souls for the same outcome.


ALSO

I remember seeing him on the 'The World About Us - Colonel Culpeppers Flying Circus' documentary - he was still flying FIFI (the CAF B-29) aged 65 !!! - and when questioned about his thoughts he was adamant that given the same set of circumstances he would do the same thing again.


Tibbets had requested no funeral and no headstone, fearing it would provide his detractors with a place to protest.

Gen Tibbets did his duty. RIP Sir.

bushy...

I wouldn't be sure about the phone , how long would it take & they would have had more than one surely ?

Binomate wrote: »

The Japs days were numbered when the bomb was dropped. Japan had very little fight left in her.The decision to drop the bomb was completely wrong. In fact, it was more of an experiment than it was a quick end to the war.

For sure it was part-experiment , wasn't the original worry that Germany was developing a nuke too when they stopped selling uranium from Czech ?

Manic Moran

To give an idea as to just how many casualties the US was expecting in a conventional attack on Japan, no Purple Hearts have been minted since 1945. Okinawa made it plain that an assault would have been a huge bloodletting: Troops who wouldn't surrender, or who would routinely kill themselves in order to kill the Americans, and civilians who would prefer to kill themselves rather than surrender to Americans.

NTM

deadprez

jesus i wouldn't call him a monster,what I would call him was a pilot. they didn't really know what they were dealing with in them days. Times have changed and it wont happen again. Human history isn't all sweetness and pie ya know.

bizmark

ruskin wrote: »

Paul Tibbits, the man who dropped the first a-bomb on Hiroshima in 1945, has died at the age of 92. Isnt it just wrong that that monster lived a long healthy life after what he took part in? He dropped a bomb that completly disintegrated human life, and caused countless cancers and suffering for years to come

Asshole :rolleyes:

R.I.P paul tibbit your actions that no doubt haunted your long life saved possible millions of people and helped keep the peace for many year's

BIG-SLICK-POKER

If i was following orders i drop it . Part of War and direct orders . No questiosn asked . Blame the goverment not the Pilot

R.I.P

orestes

He was a pilot following orders while his country was at war. Nasty sh1t is gonna happen when the world is split in half and each half is trying to conquer the other, and the atom bomb wasn't necessarily the worst of them. Should we be happy about the death of every pilot who took part in leveling Dresden? It was war, Queensbury rules don't exactly apply

Dont be at yourself

And what of his attitude and actions after the war? After it was known to everyone the absolute horror that dropping the bomb led to? It seems he was completely without remorse, and even re-enacted the bombing run at an American airshow, complete with a staged mushroom cloud? How utterly crass and disgusting is that?

It's one thing to push the button under orders, not knowing the extent of the consequences or believing there are no alternatives. That's understandable, if not entirely forgivable. But, knowing what we know now, his actions after the event were just as repulsive.

ian_m

There are bad crimes going on right now under our noses but its called democracy by some leaders.

I guess he wasn't fully aware of the consequences of his actions. I doubt a day went by when he didn't think about it.

Adyx

Maybe I'm wrong but isn't the title of this thread "Paul Tibbits dies". Not "was what he did right or wrong"? At the end of the day none of us knows what he was really like or how he lived his life. I find the idea of any nuclear weapons abhorrent. But I wasn't there and neither were any of you so who are ye to judge.

Pherekydes

Will someone tell me, who the fcuk is Paul Tibbits?

OP? Anyone?

Orange69

Slow coach wrote: »

Will someone tell me, who the fcuk is Paul Tibbits?

OP? Anyone?

http://www.google.com:rolleyes: