imigrants driving tourists away

Karl Hungus

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Ah once again too many people on Boards are falling over themselves to be PC as ever lest someone pull out the racism card. :rolleyes:

Firstly, let me say that I fully welcome those people who come here to work and
contribute productively to the economy and society in general.

However, I do agree that people working in customer facing roles (be it a burger joint, bank, pub or callcentre) should be able to speak the language to a sufficent degree as to be able to interact smoothly with the general public.

There's nothing racist about that.. if you go to France, or Germany you'd be expected to learn the local language as well. It's called meeting the needs of your job/customers... not to mention your own as a resident in that country!

Certainly, people working in places where they deal with the public should have a good grasp of the language, and I've certainly gotten more than enough bother from incompetant staff, but that's hardly got anything to do with this situation.

The fact of the matter is, that reguardless of whether the staff were Irish or eastern European, that the tourists that the OP was on about would've been dissapointed either way.

The issue lies with an unrealistic view of Ireland on their part.

rediguana wrote:

(don't make me tell my Ipswich substitutes joke)

Now you've got me curious. Go on.

Terry

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Ah once again too many people on Boards are falling over themselves to be PC as ever lest someone pull out the racism card. :rolleyes:

very true. However, please note that calling someone a racist will earn you a ban.

Firstly, let me say that I fully welcome those people who come here to work and
contribute productively to the economy and society in general.

However, I do agree that people working in customer facing roles (be it a burger joint, bank, pub or callcentre) should be able to speak the language to a sufficent degree as to be able to interact smoothly with the general public.

There's nothing racist about that.. if you go to France, or Germany you'd be expected to learn the local language as well. It's called meeting the needs of your job/customers... not to mention your own as a resident in that country!

i'm with you, buddy.
come on over. get yourself a job. make some money out of our economy while the going is good. just learn the damn language first.
Personally, I think it's good that we can finally pay back those who accomodated us through the hard time. not directly, but we are no longer the immigrants. we are now the hosts. it's a good position to be in.

as for immigrants driving tourists away, well i don't think we really need dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns.

Karl Hungus

julep wrote:

karl hungus not banned from AH because this isn't politics and i got the joke.

Why thanks.

I think Gandalf was acting a complete Jew altogether.

I know, I'm pushing it. But jesus, you should've seen the PM I sent him.

senordingdong

julep wrote:

as for immigrants driving tourists away, well i don't think we really need dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns.

Too true...if that's the type of discriminatory attitude the tourists have, then we can do without their tourism.

Karl Hungus

julep wrote:

as for immigrants driving tourists away, well i don't think we really need dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns.

Sorry, but I disagree completely there. If you think the economic boom is going to last forever, you could be mistaken, and it's an economy largely driven by construction.

Somewhere down the line we're going to need tourism more than we do now, you dig? We don't want to drive away potential customers, and Ireland gets a bad enough reputation as it is.

Pigman II

If you can't speak decent English then you shouldn't be working in most of the service oriented jobs in this country.

I couldn't give a damn if Wang or Ivan can't spin a yarn about Leprechauns or the High Kings of Ireland to some tourist, but when ones lack of English is interfering with them being able to carry out their job effectively then they shouldn't be working there.

The fast-food places seem to be suffering the worst. Hiring idiots seemed to always be their policy but at least the idiots used to speak English. Not so anymore. Not even "SuperSize Me" could convince me to stop making the occasional visit to BK and Maccers but their staff these days has meant I never go there anymore. The weight is dropping off me , so thanks for that I guess!

Those concerned should learn English, or find a job that doesn't involve much language skill or fúck-off back home to whereever they came from.

gandalf

Karl Hungus wrote:

Why thanks.

I think Gandalf was acting a complete Jew altogether.

I know, I'm pushing it. But jesus, you should've seen the PM I sent him.

Thats it you're on double secret probation !!!

Karl Hungus

gandalf wrote:

Thats it you're on double secret probation !!!

Carefull now, or you'll find a horse in your office come morning!

senordingdong

Karl Hungus wrote:

Sorry, but I disagree completely there. If you think the economic boom is going to last forever, you could be mistaken, and it's an economy largely driven by construction.

Maybe, but how many of these foreign nationals are working in the contruction industry? At the moment we need them more then the 'yanks'.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

Maybe, but how many of these foreign nationals are working in the contruction industry? At the moment we need them more then the 'yanks'.

What's your point? I'm not denying there are loads of foreign nationals working in the construction industry. I'm suggesting that it mightn't last, and we might need to have a little foresight with reguards to tourism, because down the road we might need it.

Besides, more people than just 'yanks' come to Ireland.

ferdi

look, pretty much nothing in ireland is like waht the yank tourists are expecting.

should we turn into toothless hut dwellers, kicking sh1t all day and playing the fiddle all night for their amusment?

senordingdong

Karl Hungus wrote:

What's your point? I'm not denying there are loads of foreign nationals working in the construction industry. I'm suggesting that it mightn't last, and we might need to have a little foresight with reguards to tourism, because down the road we might need it.

I never said that was your point. I'm just saying that without the current sitaution, we would never make it to the point that you're talking about.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

I'm just saying that without the current sitaution, we would never make it to the point that you're talking about.

I'm actually puzzled as to what it is you're trying to say here.

Yes, without the economy booming, it can't go down again. That's obvious. What's your point?

senordingdong

My point is that the 'foresight' you're talking about wouldn't mean jack today if we didn't have all these foreign nationals driving the economy.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

My point is that the 'foresight' you're talking about wouldn't mean jack today if we didn't have all these foreign nationals driving the economy.

I'm still at a loss. Let me put it another way; Why are you telling me this? I'm not deny the influence of foreign nationals in reguards to the economy. I'm not speaking out against them... So I fail to see why you feel the need to remind me of their importance. I just don't see the relevance.

Besides, the foresight I'm talking about would still be relevant even if there was no economic boom during the 90's. Money still has to come into the country somehow, you realise? So even if all the magic didn't happen when the Celtic Tiger jumped on the scene, we still would've had to look at avenues as to how money could come into the country, and tourism still would've been a top idea, and in that instance we wouldn't be able to afford to call tourists (as julpe kindly put it) dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns and stating how we don't need 'em.

should we turn into toothless hut dwellers, kicking sh1t all day and playing the fiddle all night for their amusment?

LOL, you're totally right. The OP's post really irked me. Tough shyte if you don't like all the immigrants in Dublin - that's the way it is, and nobody is going to change it to suit a few yank tourists who want it to be a quaint, backwards place to chill out and enjoy before they go back to their real lives. Maybe they should consider going somewhere other than Dublin - I often go to small villages in the country, and they're full of Irish people and probably closer to what they're expecting.

I've never met more non-English speakers than in the United States, anyway. I've been to shops in New York and been stared at blankly by the shopkeeper when I asked for something in English. I met loads of people who only knew Spanish. So? My experience wasn't ruined just because the majority of people weren't the stereotypical Brooklyn accented New Yawkers like in the movies. I could still enjoy the place perfectly well.

Tha Gopher

rediguana wrote:

I'm one of the least PC people I know (don't make me tell my Ipswich substitutes joke), I just think it's stretching things to blame immigrants for the woes of the tourist industry.

Ill swap you 3 Padraig Nally jokes for it via PM

Anyway, if its keepin cocky, boring you guys drink too much yanks out here here I say.

rediguana

Tha Gopher wrote:

Ill swap you 3 Padraig Nally jokes for it via PM

Anyway, if its keepin cocky, boring you guys drink too much yanks out here here I say.

Done.

Remember now, no laughing!

Victor

gary9112 wrote:

i mean why would tourists come to ireland if all they find is eastern europeans working everywhere if they wanted that they would of went to eastern europe. they came to meet irish people.

You mean they don't come for the Blarney Stone, the Ring of Kerry and the Book of Kells?

daiixi

Victor wrote:

You mean they don't come for the Blarney Stone, the Ring of Kerry and the Book of Kells?

I'd say so. If I wanted to meet Irish people I could have met thousands of them back in Australia.

Half the problem with the foreigners coming to Ireland to work is that they're prepared to do types of work which a lot of Irish people aren't prepared to do or to a quality which can't be obtained from local work forces. A generalisation, sure, but at least it's keeping with the trend of the thread.

senordingdong

Karl Hungus wrote:

I'm still at a loss. Let me put it another way; Why are you telling me this?

Well let's see, firstly, you said;

Karl Hungus wrote:

Sorry, but I disagree completely there. If you think the economic boom is going to last forever, you could be mistaken, and it's an economy largely driven by construction.

Somewhere down the line we're going to need tourism more than we do now, you dig? We don't want to drive away potential customers, and Ireland gets a bad enough reputation as it is.

To which I said...

senordingdong wrote:

Maybe, but how many of these foreign nationals are working in the contruction industry? At the moment we need them more then the 'yanks'.

See, you said we don't want to drive away the yanks because we may need the money they deliever at some point down the line.
I'm saying that what the foreign workforce is delievering is far more important, and is at the moment, being prioritised. Rightly so I say.

Terry

don't we get most of our tourist from across the water anyway?
let's hear it for the brits throwing some tourist money our way. ok, lots of them are over for stag weekends in temple bar, but i wouldn't say they are the majority or even close to it. even if they are, they are still pumping lots of money into the economy (what with the price of a pint in temple bar and all that).

senordingdong

Let's not forget the mainland europeans coming over in droves aswell.

I recall reading that Irelans is simply becoming too expensive a destination for most Americans these days and as such, there are signifigantly less of them visiting anymore.

Terry

senordingdong wrote:

Let's not forget the mainland europeans coming over in droves aswell.

I recall reading that Irelans is simply becoming too expensive a destination for most Americans these days and as such, there are signifigantly less of them visiting anymore.

that's probably the most sensible thing anyone has said in this thread.
banned.

Pherekydes

Tristrame wrote:

I don't think so...

http://www.cso.ie/statistics/vistoirenumoseasvisits.htm

Total visits are going up, while trans-Atlantic visits are going down. All good and down to Ivan (and Tatyana).

RasTa

We don't need tourism to fund the economy any more. Well we are not as reliant as we where 10 years ago. I don't care what any yank said about there expectations on Ireland

senordingdong

julep wrote:

that's probably the most sensible thing anyone has said in this thread.
banned.

?

Terry

senordingdong wrote:

?

that was a joke.
you see, this is after hours and sensible posts are few and far between and blah blah ****ity blah.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

Well let's see, firstly, you said;

To which I said...


See, you said we don't want to drive away the yanks because we may need the money they deliever at some point down the line.
I'm saying that what the foreign workforce is delievering is far more important, and is at the moment, being prioritised. Rightly so I say.

I was about to reitterate that not driving away potential customers (Not just yanks, but everyone who comes here) has nothing to do with the importance of the current workforce, that they are unrelated... But I think I've found your logical strand.

(Stop me if I'm wrong now) You're assuming that I agree with the OP's assertion that it is eastern europeans that are turning away tourists. Correct? That the current workforce should be sacrificed in trade-off with potential tourism money.

Anyway, if that's what you think, you're completely wrong. Infact, if you had read my first posts on this issue, here and here, you would realise my take on the issue of immigrants driving away tourism was that the Americans the OP spoke of had an unrealistic view of Ireland, and would've been dissapointed either way.

With that firmly in mind, let us backtrack then to this post, and my concurrent reply. I can understand where lines may have been crossed, but in my reply I mean to say that it's a sad attitude to have that "We don't need 'em" and calling them "Dumb fvcks" when it's people like that who want to come to visit us in good will and spend their money here, money we may well need some day.

So, in summary, my reply to julep's comment about not needing dumb fvcks spending their money is not in agreance with the OP's assertion about immigrants turning away tourism.

SimpleSam06

senordingdong wrote:

I'm saying that what the foreign workforce is delievering is far more important, and is at the moment, being prioritised. Rightly so I say.

Would you mind telling us what, exactly, this foreign workforce is delivering? They aren't driving the economy, they are living off it. Right now the economy is driven by one single sector, construction, and that's played out its time. 16% of the houses built around the country now are standing empty.

The construction industry was driven by one main fact, and that was low interest rates which lead to easy loans. Lots of cash floating around. Those interest rates are on the way back up.

Immigrants achieved one thing, and that was to depress wages for low skilled and semi skilled jobs in the private sector. And the little wages they do get they send back home to build their own houses. Frankly we really don't need them. Its not that Irish people don't want to work in those jobs, they just won't do it for the shit wages being offered by employers; their living conditions for those wages mean they would be almost as well off on the dole.

Tourism on the other hand, accounts for 20 to 25% of this country's income. To say that we can afford to kick out the second of three legs from our economy when one is wobbling badly is ludicrous in the extreme. If it was a choice between the immigrants and the tourists, drop the immigrants without blinking.