imigrants driving tourists away

gary9112

was talking to some american tourists the other day and they could not believe the amount of non irish in the country they were in shock, first off the hotel they were staying in was full of polish who could not speak proper english, they also said the waiting staff could not even get there orders right cause they could not speak good english and finally when they went to a local pub they found foreign bartenders which they told me was not what they had expected, they had the idea of walking into a irish pub and a irish bartender welcoming them and talking in his irish accent and telling them some stories with the gift of the gap, but know that was not what they encountered what they did however was some guy who could bearly speak english unpolite and rude. So in conclusion im getting the idea that with all these immigrants in the tourism industry that tourism will fall because of it, i mean why would tourists come to ireland if all they find is eastern europeans working everywhere if they wanted that they would of went to eastern europe. they came to meet irish people.

silverharp

Although the observations are probably correct, the conclusion is not, Ireland should focus on European tourism anyway and Europeans are less interested in the blarney that the tourist board pump out.

gary9112

gary9112 wrote:

i mean why would tourists come to ireland if all they find is eastern europeans working everywhere if they wanted that they would of went to eastern europe. they came to meet irish people.

I don't think so...

http://www.cso.ie/statistics/vistoirenumoseasvisits.htm

Hagar

Statistics are notoriously unreliable, no offence.

I wonder how many of the immigrants put themselves down as "Holiday" or "Visiting Family"? We seem to count tourists coming into the country, but does anyone count them going back out?

Now that would be an interesting statistic.;)

Karl Hungus

gary9112 wrote:

they had the idea of walking into a irish pub and a irish bartender welcoming them and talking in his irish accent and telling them some stories with the gift of the gap

I would imagine that the people who expected that kind of thing would've been very dissapointed even if the bar staff were Irish.

Hagar

^ Sadly correct.

Karl Hungus

Hagar wrote:

^ Sadly correct.

Sadly is definetly the word for it.

Hell, I'd love if any pub you went into you'd have friendly barmen up for a chat, but they're few and far between. Infact, I can only think of one fellow offhand who'd regail you with a little story or a joke here and there. Infact, it's hard to find any barman who'd even be friendly enough to say hello, or even talk to you at all. Most barmen, no matter what their nationality are too busy on their toes filling as many pints as possible in the hustle and bustle, and probably working hard as they can just so he can keep his overpriced apartment.

Such is the rat-race society we live in, and the charming publician, who entertains his patrons with his charisma seems to have been phased out.

Gurgle

Hagar wrote:

I wonder how many of the immigrants put themselves down as "Holiday" or "Visiting Family"? We seem to count tourists coming into the country, but does anyone count them going back out?

So of the 6.9 million overseas visits last year, you think a significant proportion of them stayed here?

Just what I was going to say Gurgle...


As for pubs and chatting,I don't know where you drink Karl,But in ALL 14 pubs in Arklow, you would get a decent chat.

Most of them are largely staffed with Irish people.

As for country pubs,I havent been in one yet that hasnt had a friendly Barman/woman.

In one of the locals,the other night the pub owner said to me.. if you don't count that change a bit quicker, the price of this pint is going up!
He then launched into a chat about the price of cattle

gandalf

Not sure this is a politics thread and tbh if you are worried about low numbers of tourists from the US you should really be more concerned about the strenght of the Euro than the fact your barman might be called Ivan :rolleyes:

rediguana

Ireland isn't set up for the benefit of misty-eyed tourists. If they're thinking twice about coming again, I can think of lots of reasons why, and none of them involving the blameless Poles.

Hagar

Gurgle wrote:

So of the 6.9 million overseas visits last year, you think a significant proportion of them stayed here?

Did I say that? Always seek the extreme, that's Boards for ye.:rolleyes:


I would guess though that some put down "Holiday" when they had no intention of going back, much like many an Irishman did in the US.

/Edit I also never questioned their right to be here, just said that statistics can be misleading.

Karl Hungus

Tristrame wrote:

As for pubs and chatting,I don't know where you drink Karl,But in ALL 14 pubs in Arklow, you would get a decent chat.

Arklow? I don't even know where that is. I'm in Galway City though, so maybe that has something to do with it.

You know, thinking about it, one of the few bar staff in one of my favourite pubs who's generally friendly and up for a bit of a chat is a Polish girl. So I'd say that in my experience the real issue is nothing to do with immigrants.

Hagar wrote:

Did I say that? Always seek the extreme, that's Boards for ye.:rolleyes:


I would guess though that some put down "Holiday" when they had no intention of going back, much like many an Irishman did in the US.

/Edit I also never questioned their right to be here, just said that statistics can be misleading.

Oh give over Hagar, your thinly vieled racism is about as obvious as a Star of David on a concentration camp prisoner. Admit it, you think the ones who stay here longer than their holiday period should be rounded up and put in the giant ovens!

Hagar

Jeez Karl, that's bad calling me a racist. I most certainly am not.
FFS I'm an immigrant myself living in France, why would I want to promote any racist attitude to non-nationals? I'm dissapointed that you think that of me.

Gurgle

Hagar wrote:

Did I say that? Always seek the extreme, that's Boards for ye.:rolleyes:

Did I say you said that?
Always on the defensive, thats Boards for you;)

Hagar wrote:

I would guess though that some put down "Holiday" when they had no intention of going back, much like many an Irishman did in the US.

/Edit I also never questioned their right to be here, just said that statistics can be misleading.

Oh I've no doubt about that whatsoever. Easiest way to get into a country where you're not allowed to stay. But you're talking about a maximum of a few tens of thousands of people.

Of course statistics can be misleading, those 6.9 million will include Irish people who work in England and come home every weekend, people who drop over to Dublin from Paris for a meeting every tuesday afternoon, Immigrants/Asylum seekers who didn't leave and all kinds of other non-tourists. But all these would have also been included in previous years.

Point is, except for the 2001 terrorist hysteria, the number is going up, not down as inferred by the OP.

gandalf

Karl Hungus wrote:

Oh give over Hagar, your thinly vieled racism is about as obvious as a Star of David on a concentration camp prisoner. Admit it, you think the ones who stay here longer than their holiday period should be rounded up and put in the giant ovens!

While I am sure you meant that in jest Karl I have to ban you for it because it is a clear cut personal insult. 1 week to adjust your humour chip !!!

Hagar

Gurgle wrote:

Did I say you said that?
Always on the defensive, thats Boards for you;)

Touché.

I would agree that tourism going up and I would think more are coming from Europe now compared to dependance of US traffic a few years ago. In that respect the 2001 did us some long term good as the Yanks will probably come back here anyway as I think we are seen as a "safe" place to visit.

SeanW

rediguana wrote:

Ireland isn't set up for the benefit of misty-eyed tourists. If they're thinking twice about coming again, I can think of lots of reasons why, and none of them involving the blameless Poles.

I agree with this: Ireland has changed in many ways and the influx of Polish people working in shops pubs etc isn't really a huge part of it.

gandalf

gandalf wrote:

Not sure this is a politics thread and tbh if you are worried about low numbers of tourists from the US you should really be more concerned about the strenght of the Euro than the fact your barman might be called Ivan :rolleyes:

Agreed on all points.
Moved to Afterhours

Boston

Hagar wrote:

Statistics are notoriously unreliable, no offence.

I wonder how many of the immigrants put themselves down as "Holiday" or "Visiting Family"? We seem to count tourists coming into the country, but does anyone count them going back out?

I don't see why they would do that, sicne their legal.

Hagar

LiouVille wrote:

I don't see why they would do that, sicne their legal.

I imagine only visitors/immigrants from EU nations would automatically be legal, people from other countries might just tick the holiday to simplify travel.

I know I have done it many times in the past going to Britain, in the past. If you ticked the business box there were many more questions to be answered. Nature of the business, name of company being visited, address of company, company phone number, name of the business contact, ad infinitum. All in all it was quicker to tick "holiday" and not worry how messed up their tourism stats got.

Terry

imigrants driving tourists away...

in their taxis.

boom boom.


karl hungus not banned from AH because this isn't politics and i got the joke.

Hagar

julep wrote:

karl hungus not banned from AH because this isn't politics and i got the joke.

Glad to hear it. I'm embarassed to admit I didn't immediately realise it was a joke. But all is well, no harm no foul or whatever that trendy American saying is.

blorg

gary9112 wrote:

was talking to some american tourists the other day and they could not believe the amount of non irish in the country they were in shock, first off the hotel they were staying in was full of polish who could not speak proper english, they also said the waiting staff could not even get there orders right cause they could not speak good english and finally when they went to a local pub they found foreign bartenders which they told me was not what they had expected, they had the idea of walking into a irish pub and a irish bartender welcoming them and talking in his irish accent and telling them some stories with the gift of the gap, but know that was not what they encountered what they did however was some guy who could bearly speak english unpolite and rude. So in conclusion im getting the idea that with all these immigrants in the tourism industry that tourism will fall because of it, i mean why would tourists come to ireland if all they find is eastern Europeans working everywhere if they wanted that they would of went to eastern europe. they came to meet irish people.

Might want to work on your English yourself there (their) mate. And get your shift key fixed while you're (your) at it. As it is I could (teddy) bearly understand your post.

the_syco

TBH, down the country you'd get the "friendly chat", but not in Dublin, but some of the yanks except the entire country to be like that.

What I find funny, is that aside from the native Indians, everyone there (in America) is somehow from a different country, thus they can be classed as the children of immirgrants.

Meh. I'll wait till Paddy's day, when they come over in their droves, expecting to see sheep in the pubs, and everyone to be driving tractors... in Dublin:rolleyes:

faceman

gary9112 wrote:

....they came to meet irish people.

They must have came while we were all on holiday?

Catari Jaguar

Dem lousy immigents! *It's a landslide! YES on 24!*

MojoMaker

gary9112 wrote:

I could not believe the amount of non irish in the country I was in shock, first off the hotel I was staying in was full of polish who could not speak proper english, the waiting staff could not even get my order right cause they could not speak good english and finally when they went to a local pub I found foreign bartenders which was not what I had expected, I had the idea of walking into a irish pub and a irish bartender welcoming me and talking in his irish accent and telling me some stories with the gift of the gap, but know that was not what I encountered what I did however was some guy who could bearly speak english unpolite and rude. So in conclusion im getting the idea that with all these immigrants in the tourism industry that tourism will fall because of it, i mean why would tourists come to ireland if all they find is eastern europeans working everywhere if they wanted that they would of went to eastern europe. they came to meet irish people.

Reads much more truthfully this way...

_Kaiser_

Ah once again too many people on Boards are falling over themselves to be PC as ever lest someone pull out the racism card. :rolleyes:

Firstly, let me say that I fully welcome those people who come here to work and
contribute productively to the economy and society in general.

However, I do agree that people working in customer facing roles (be it a burger joint, bank, pub or callcentre) should be able to speak the language to a sufficent degree as to be able to interact smoothly with the general public.

There's nothing racist about that.. if you go to France, or Germany you'd be expected to learn the local language as well. It's called meeting the needs of your job/customers... not to mention your own as a resident in that country!

wow sierra

the_syco wrote:

TBH, down the country you'd get the "friendly chat", but not in Dublin, but some of the yanks except the entire country to be like that.

What I find funny, is that aside from the native Indians, everyone there (in America) is somehow from a different country, thus they can be classed as the children of immirgrants.

Meh. I'll wait till Paddy's day, when they come over in their droves, expecting to see sheep in the pubs, and everyone to be driving tractors... in Dublin:rolleyes:

Agree with all of that, and I think most of the immigrant workers are grand - considering the only language I can speak apart from English is Gaeilge, I think they are doing great. Some of the native Irish bar staff they replaced were unfriendly and inefficient. But I also feel its more of a Trendy Tourist pubs V ordinary pubs - lots of local/suburban pubs in Dublin would have the same atmosphere/ friendly chat as country pubs.

rediguana

I'm one of the least PC people I know (don't make me tell my Ipswich substitutes joke), I just think it's stretching things to blame immigrants for the woes of the tourist industry.

Karl Hungus

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Ah once again too many people on Boards are falling over themselves to be PC as ever lest someone pull out the racism card. :rolleyes:

Firstly, let me say that I fully welcome those people who come here to work and
contribute productively to the economy and society in general.

However, I do agree that people working in customer facing roles (be it a burger joint, bank, pub or callcentre) should be able to speak the language to a sufficent degree as to be able to interact smoothly with the general public.

There's nothing racist about that.. if you go to France, or Germany you'd be expected to learn the local language as well. It's called meeting the needs of your job/customers... not to mention your own as a resident in that country!

Certainly, people working in places where they deal with the public should have a good grasp of the language, and I've certainly gotten more than enough bother from incompetant staff, but that's hardly got anything to do with this situation.

The fact of the matter is, that reguardless of whether the staff were Irish or eastern European, that the tourists that the OP was on about would've been dissapointed either way.

The issue lies with an unrealistic view of Ireland on their part.

rediguana wrote:

(don't make me tell my Ipswich substitutes joke)

Now you've got me curious. Go on.

Terry

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Ah once again too many people on Boards are falling over themselves to be PC as ever lest someone pull out the racism card. :rolleyes:

very true. However, please note that calling someone a racist will earn you a ban.

Firstly, let me say that I fully welcome those people who come here to work and
contribute productively to the economy and society in general.

However, I do agree that people working in customer facing roles (be it a burger joint, bank, pub or callcentre) should be able to speak the language to a sufficent degree as to be able to interact smoothly with the general public.

There's nothing racist about that.. if you go to France, or Germany you'd be expected to learn the local language as well. It's called meeting the needs of your job/customers... not to mention your own as a resident in that country!

i'm with you, buddy.
come on over. get yourself a job. make some money out of our economy while the going is good. just learn the damn language first.
Personally, I think it's good that we can finally pay back those who accomodated us through the hard time. not directly, but we are no longer the immigrants. we are now the hosts. it's a good position to be in.

as for immigrants driving tourists away, well i don't think we really need dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns.

Karl Hungus

julep wrote:

karl hungus not banned from AH because this isn't politics and i got the joke.

Why thanks.

I think Gandalf was acting a complete Jew altogether.

I know, I'm pushing it. But jesus, you should've seen the PM I sent him.

senordingdong

julep wrote:

as for immigrants driving tourists away, well i don't think we really need dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns.

Too true...if that's the type of discriminatory attitude the tourists have, then we can do without their tourism.

Karl Hungus

julep wrote:

as for immigrants driving tourists away, well i don't think we really need dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns.

Sorry, but I disagree completely there. If you think the economic boom is going to last forever, you could be mistaken, and it's an economy largely driven by construction.

Somewhere down the line we're going to need tourism more than we do now, you dig? We don't want to drive away potential customers, and Ireland gets a bad enough reputation as it is.

Pigman II

If you can't speak decent English then you shouldn't be working in most of the service oriented jobs in this country.

I couldn't give a damn if Wang or Ivan can't spin a yarn about Leprechauns or the High Kings of Ireland to some tourist, but when ones lack of English is interfering with them being able to carry out their job effectively then they shouldn't be working there.

The fast-food places seem to be suffering the worst. Hiring idiots seemed to always be their policy but at least the idiots used to speak English. Not so anymore. Not even "SuperSize Me" could convince me to stop making the occasional visit to BK and Maccers but their staff these days has meant I never go there anymore. The weight is dropping off me , so thanks for that I guess!

Those concerned should learn English, or find a job that doesn't involve much language skill or fúck-off back home to whereever they came from.

gandalf

Karl Hungus wrote:

Why thanks.

I think Gandalf was acting a complete Jew altogether.

I know, I'm pushing it. But jesus, you should've seen the PM I sent him.

Thats it you're on double secret probation !!!

Karl Hungus

gandalf wrote:

Thats it you're on double secret probation !!!

Carefull now, or you'll find a horse in your office come morning!

senordingdong

Karl Hungus wrote:

Sorry, but I disagree completely there. If you think the economic boom is going to last forever, you could be mistaken, and it's an economy largely driven by construction.

Maybe, but how many of these foreign nationals are working in the contruction industry? At the moment we need them more then the 'yanks'.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

Maybe, but how many of these foreign nationals are working in the contruction industry? At the moment we need them more then the 'yanks'.

What's your point? I'm not denying there are loads of foreign nationals working in the construction industry. I'm suggesting that it mightn't last, and we might need to have a little foresight with reguards to tourism, because down the road we might need it.

Besides, more people than just 'yanks' come to Ireland.

ferdi

look, pretty much nothing in ireland is like waht the yank tourists are expecting.

should we turn into toothless hut dwellers, kicking sh1t all day and playing the fiddle all night for their amusment?

senordingdong

Karl Hungus wrote:

What's your point? I'm not denying there are loads of foreign nationals working in the construction industry. I'm suggesting that it mightn't last, and we might need to have a little foresight with reguards to tourism, because down the road we might need it.

I never said that was your point. I'm just saying that without the current sitaution, we would never make it to the point that you're talking about.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

I'm just saying that without the current sitaution, we would never make it to the point that you're talking about.

I'm actually puzzled as to what it is you're trying to say here.

Yes, without the economy booming, it can't go down again. That's obvious. What's your point?

senordingdong

My point is that the 'foresight' you're talking about wouldn't mean jack today if we didn't have all these foreign nationals driving the economy.

Karl Hungus

senordingdong wrote:

My point is that the 'foresight' you're talking about wouldn't mean jack today if we didn't have all these foreign nationals driving the economy.

I'm still at a loss. Let me put it another way; Why are you telling me this? I'm not deny the influence of foreign nationals in reguards to the economy. I'm not speaking out against them... So I fail to see why you feel the need to remind me of their importance. I just don't see the relevance.

Besides, the foresight I'm talking about would still be relevant even if there was no economic boom during the 90's. Money still has to come into the country somehow, you realise? So even if all the magic didn't happen when the Celtic Tiger jumped on the scene, we still would've had to look at avenues as to how money could come into the country, and tourism still would've been a top idea, and in that instance we wouldn't be able to afford to call tourists (as julpe kindly put it) dumb fvcks coming here looking for leprachauns and stating how we don't need 'em.

should we turn into toothless hut dwellers, kicking sh1t all day and playing the fiddle all night for their amusment?

LOL, you're totally right. The OP's post really irked me. Tough shyte if you don't like all the immigrants in Dublin - that's the way it is, and nobody is going to change it to suit a few yank tourists who want it to be a quaint, backwards place to chill out and enjoy before they go back to their real lives. Maybe they should consider going somewhere other than Dublin - I often go to small villages in the country, and they're full of Irish people and probably closer to what they're expecting.

I've never met more non-English speakers than in the United States, anyway. I've been to shops in New York and been stared at blankly by the shopkeeper when I asked for something in English. I met loads of people who only knew Spanish. So? My experience wasn't ruined just because the majority of people weren't the stereotypical Brooklyn accented New Yawkers like in the movies. I could still enjoy the place perfectly well.

Tha Gopher

rediguana wrote:

I'm one of the least PC people I know (don't make me tell my Ipswich substitutes joke), I just think it's stretching things to blame immigrants for the woes of the tourist industry.

Ill swap you 3 Padraig Nally jokes for it via PM

Anyway, if its keepin cocky, boring you guys drink too much yanks out here here I say.

rediguana

Tha Gopher wrote:

Ill swap you 3 Padraig Nally jokes for it via PM

Anyway, if its keepin cocky, boring you guys drink too much yanks out here here I say.

Done.

Remember now, no laughing!

Victor

gary9112 wrote:

i mean why would tourists come to ireland if all they find is eastern europeans working everywhere if they wanted that they would of went to eastern europe. they came to meet irish people.

You mean they don't come for the Blarney Stone, the Ring of Kerry and the Book of Kells?

daiixi

Victor wrote:

You mean they don't come for the Blarney Stone, the Ring of Kerry and the Book of Kells?

I'd say so. If I wanted to meet Irish people I could have met thousands of them back in Australia.

Half the problem with the foreigners coming to Ireland to work is that they're prepared to do types of work which a lot of Irish people aren't prepared to do or to a quality which can't be obtained from local work forces. A generalisation, sure, but at least it's keeping with the trend of the thread.