Are SUV's that bad?

Dades · 15-03-2006 3:31pm

JimmySmith wrote:

I drive a ford focus.
Why cant people just drive a car becuase they like it - just like in the old days.
If they want a jeep, a hiace or a merc and they are willing to pay what it costs then just leave them alone. Sounds like a lot of people here are jealous someone can afford a more expensive car than they can.
And as for that rubbish about typical SUV drivers being mothers who only drive to school - Everytime i ppass my local scholl there might be about 5 SUVs and the rest are Polos, micras, swifts and various other small cars.

Touché.

My take on Prospect's point - why are people going around letting the air out SUV tires, and not S-Class Mercs or 7-Series? Why are Bentley drivers not having mud sprayed on their cars?

Because the bandwagon has been chosen and it's four wheel drive.

Now just add one tablespoon of self-righteousness and a pinch of begrudgery.

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 3:35pm

The Atheist wrote:

Touché.

My take on Prospect's point - why are people going around letting the air out SUV tires, and not S-Class Mercs or 7-Series? Why are Bentley drivers not having mud sprayed on their cars?

Because the bandwagon has been chosen and it's four wheel drive.

Now just add one tablespoon of self-righteousness and a pinch of begrudgery.

I answered this in my last post:
"In terms of environmental damage, I would agree. But, and this is a big but, my view of the road ahead and therefore my safety will not be compromised by an S600 or a Ferrari."

dts · 15-03-2006 4:08pm

And I said that your view worse round a transit van or MPV.
Answer to your problem, simple buy a SUV.
Buy the way if you are woried about not being able to see what ahead try driving more than two feet away from my back bumper.:D

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 4:16pm

And I answered this one in my second last post (third last now):

"To answer your question, someone who drives an Espace does so out of necessity. My attitude to having my view blocked by a people carrier is much the same as if it were a bus, ie I wish I could see, but hey, other people need to get around too. SUV drivers, on the other hand, are imposing on others for no valid reason. They themselves, as well as other road users, would be safer & more comfortable had they chosen to drive an equivalent car."

dts · 15-03-2006 4:20pm

There are much bigger things to worry about when driving on Irish roads than the view round an SUV. Like I say back off abit from the back bumper and this wouldnt be such an issue.

Dades · 15-03-2006 4:24pm

dts wrote:

Buy the way if you are woried about not being able to see what ahead try driving more than two feet away from my back bumper.:D

To be fair - if you leave a gap while driving in traffic - someone will drive into it!

But I don't think you can vent at people just because they have a higher car. Unless of course it's being driven badly. Then anger should be directed at the driver rather than the class of vehicle.

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 4:27pm

dts wrote:

There are much bigger things to worry about when driving on Irish roads than the view round an SUV. Like I say back off abit from the back bumper and this wouldnt be such an issue.

I didn't address that point when you last made it as I thought you were joking! Are you genuinely unable to understand that having an SUV as opposed to a car in front of one, given safe distances, limits ones view of the road ahead?

dts · 15-03-2006 4:29pm

Yes it can limit your view so if this is the case then a safe distance is greater than stopping distance. I was joking but you get my point that an impaired view is hardly a reason to hate SUV's:D

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 4:29pm

The Atheist wrote:

But I don't think you can vent at people just because they have a higher car. Unless of course it's being driven badly. Then anger should be directed at the driver rather than the class of vehicle.

Driving an SUV on busy roads is somewhat akin to wearing a top hat to the theatre.

prospect · 15-03-2006 4:42pm

Anan1

Why does the impaired vision caused by an SUV bother you, but not when it is a MPV?

You are assuming that someone who drives an MPV needs it, and that someone who drives an SUV doesn't?

I know a couple that have a Grand Scenic. They have one kid, so don;t necessarily need a car that big. So why does this not bother you.

There seems to be a big assumption here that most SUV drivers do not need SUVs, and that all MPV drivers need MPVs??

hshortt · 15-03-2006 4:47pm

Hi guys,

I drive a 4x4 Kia Sorento, this is until I can afford the VW Toureg.

It comes down to choice. It's really that simple. Oh and cars don't kill people!

Cheerio
Howard

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 4:49pm

prospect wrote:

Anan1

Why does the impaired vision caused by an SUV bother you, but not when it is a MPV?

You are assuming that someone who drives an MPV needs it, and that someone who drives an SUV doesn't?

I know a couple that have a Grand Scenic. They have one kid, so don;t necessarily need a car that big. So why does this not bother you.

There seems to be a big assumption here that most SUV drivers do not need SUVs, and that all MPV drivers need MPVs??

That's about the size of it, really! I suppose it had never really occurred to me that anyone would drive an MPV unless they needed it. I accept your example, but I'd say that in the vast majority of cases my assumption is correct.

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 4:51pm

hshortt wrote:

Oh and cars don't kill people!

No, but the choices of car people make do. Which would you rather be hit by, at say, 20mph - a Range Rover or an S-Class?

prospect · 15-03-2006 4:55pm

Anan1 wrote:

That's about the size of it, really! I suppose it had never really occurred to me that anyone would drive an MPV unless they needed it. I accept your example, but I'd say that in the vast majority of cases my assumption is correct.

You are more than likely right, but there really does seem to be an awful lot of assumption regarding these vehicles and their drivers.

May give another example?
[assuming you guys said yes]
Some people have mentioned that they drive large 4x4's for work use, but then use cars for day to day stuff.
Is it not safe to assume that not everyone can afford to buy and run 2 vehicles. So someone with 1 or 2 kids may need good towing power and offroad ability once or twice a month, and also a daily driver. So a small SUV is really the only option (obviously second hand before someone goes on about expensive they are compared to cars).

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 4:59pm

Fair point. As I've said before, I have no problem with being inconvenienced where there's a genuine need.

hshortt · 15-03-2006 4:59pm

Anan1 wrote:

No, but the choices of car people make do. Which would you rather be hit by, at say, 20mph - a Range Rover or an S-Class?

Errm, isn't that a silly question? I stand by my statement, let me say it again.

Cars don't kill people.

Cheerio
Howard

prospect · 15-03-2006 5:01pm

So it would be a good idea if you had to prove your requirement for any particular type of car when buying it

That is a joke by the way.

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 5:03pm

hshortt wrote:

Errm, isn't that a silly question? I stand by my statement, let me say it again.

Cars don't kill people.

Cheerio
Howard

Read my post again. If you still don't understand what I'm saying then feel free to get back to me. Although, to be honest, I'm not sure how much clearer I can make it.

Prospect -

We don't need proof, I can smell it off 'em! ;-)

hshortt · 15-03-2006 5:29pm

Sorry Anan1, your question asks which car I'd prefer to be hit by. This is a silly question because, clearly I'd rather not be hit at all.

What car you drive is your choice, the same choice is granted to all road users. Without choice we'd all be driving black Ford cars.

I drive my 4x4 because I think it's a cool car. Do I have to have justified reasons?

Cheerio
Howard

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 5:39pm

hshortt wrote:

Sorry Anan1, your question asks which car I'd prefer to be hit by. This is a silly question because, clearly I'd rather not be hit at all.

What car you drive is your choice, the same choice is granted to all road users. Without choice we'd all be driving black Ford cars.

I drive my 4x4 because I think it's a cool car. Do I have to have justified reasons?

Cheerio
Howard

OK, Howard, I'll spell it out for you. A pedestrian who is hit by a Range Rover stands a far higher chance of dying than had he been hit at the same speed by, say, an S-Class Mercedes. Should the pedestrian die in such circumstances, then his death can be directly attributed to the decision of the driver to own a Range Rover rather than an S-Class. Do you understand now?

dts · 15-03-2006 5:52pm

Anan1 wrote:

OK, Howard, I'll spell it out for you. A pedestrian who is hit by a Range Rover stands a far higher chance of dying than had he been hit at the same speed by, say, an S-Class Mercedes. Should the pedestrian die in such circumstances, then his death can be directly attributed to the decision of the driver to own a Range Rover rather than an S-Class. Do you understand now?

But it’s ok if you needed the vehicle for work.

Witch would you rather be hit by a bike or a bus? Same argument?

hshortt · 15-03-2006 5:55pm

Anan1

As you say, an unfortunate person hit by a 4x4 or large, higher than average car will more than likely sustain greater injuries at any speed, but so much is dependant on the angle of impact, the position of the unfortunate person in relation to the centre of the car etc etc etc.

The fear of hitting a pedestrian did not cross my mind when purcashing my car, I say this in honesty. Likewise the fear of getting hit by a 4x4 does not cross my mind when I'm crossing the road, but then I do tend to follow the basic rules.

The thread started asking a simple question, 'are SUVs that bad?' the answer depends on your point of view, and in mine the answer is no.

And once again, just for the record, Cars don't kill people.

cheerio
Howard

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 5:58pm

"As you say, an unfortunate person hit by a 4x4 or large, higher than average car will more than likely sustain greater injuries at any speed..."

"I drive my 4x4 because I think it's a cool car. Do I have to have justified reasons?"

I rest my case, Howard.

Dades · 15-03-2006 6:09pm

dts wrote:

Witch would you rather be hit by a bike or a bus? Same argument?

Anan1, you're picking on some posts and ignoring others. You are afar more likely to kill somebody on the way to the shops in your car than you are on a bike. Does not always cycling everywhere make you irresponsible?

Anan1 wrote:

Driving an SUV on busy roads is somewhat akin to wearing a top hat to the theatre.

I drive a classic, a roadster that is very close to the ground. When I am behind your Ford Focus my view is impaired. Should I insist everybody drives a car as low as mine? Or should I live with my lifestyle choice and let others do the same...?

JohnBoy · 15-03-2006 6:49pm

Anan1 wrote:

OK, Howard, I'll spell it out for you. A pedestrian who is hit by a Range Rover stands a far higher chance of dying than had he been hit at the same speed by, say, an S-Class Mercedes. Should the pedestrian die in such circumstances, then his death can be directly attributed to the decision of the driver to own a Range Rover rather than an S-Class. Do you understand now?

thats not spelling it out.

why is the range rover more likely to kill than the s class?

is it the weight, the height of the bonnet, what?

spell it out for me there anan

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 6:52pm

"Quote:
Originally Posted by dts
Witch would you rather be hit by a bike or a bus? Same argument?

Anan1, you're picking on some posts and ignoring others. You are afar more likely to kill somebody on the way to the shops in your car than you are on a bike. Does not always cycling everywhere make you irresponsible?"

I know it's a long thread, but I have answered this point (twice!)

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Anan1
Driving an SUV on busy roads is somewhat akin to wearing a top hat to the theatre.

I drive a classic, a roadster that is very close to the ground. When I am behind your Ford Focus my view is impaired. Should I insist everybody drives a car as low as mine? Or should I live with my lifestyle choice and let others do the same...?"

I'll expand on my analogy, if I may. There is, to my mind, a difference between wearing a top hat to the theatre and being a person of normal stature seated in a theatre full of little people.;)

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 6:55pm

JohnBoy wrote:

thats not spelling it out.

why is the range rover more likely to kill than the s class?

is it the weight, the height of the bonnet, what?

spell it out for me there anan

Hi JohnBoy, it's the height of the bonnet. Whereas a pedestrian will tend to be thrown up onto the bonnet of a car, the Range Rover is more likely to smack them down onto the road.

Zaph0d · 15-03-2006 7:11pm

Anan1 wrote:

Hi JohnBoy, it's the height of the bonnet. Whereas a pedestrian will tend to be thrown up onto the bonnet of a car, the Range Rover is more likely to smack them down onto the road.

Euro NCAP gives the Range Rover and the Mercedes E-class the same dismal rating for pedestrian safety. they haven't tested an S-class so maybe they're really nice to be run over by.

hshortt · 15-03-2006 7:25pm

Anan1 wrote:

"As you say, an unfortunate person hit by a 4x4 or large, higher than average car will more than likely sustain greater injuries at any speed..."

"I drive my 4x4 because I think it's a cool car. Do I have to have justified reasons?"

I rest my case, Howard.

That's nice Anon1, thanks for making me sound like I drive my car to cause injury to people. :rolleyes:

Cheerio,
Howard

Anan1 · 15-03-2006 7:56pm

Zaph0d wrote:

Euro NCAP gives the Range Rover and the Mercedes E-class the same dismal rating for pedestrian safety. they haven't tested an S-class so maybe they're really nice to be run over by.

Not quite. The E-class did score only 11%, the Range Rover scored 6%. Not only that, but only one large off-roader, the Volvo XC managed to get above one star. It's a good site.

Are SUV's that bad?

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