Tips for the fitzwilliam on thursday.

mewso

I just thought I'd lay out some things I've learned from playing there a few times because there are alot of questions asked. This is a collection of stuff I posted before.

Tournament structure
Free entry with €10 rebuys allowed in the first 75 minutes. You can also join the game for the first hour I think. At the end of the 75 minutes you can rebuy (if necessary) and top-up for another €10
Rebuy - during the rebuy period you can buy more chips if you bust out (lose all your chips) and as above if necessary you can rebuy again at the very end of the rebuy period if you have lost your chips in the last hand dealt. For each subsequent rebuy you get a larger amount of chips. This is based on the concept that chip value decreases as time goes on in a tournament. i.e. you get more chips for your tenner. So you might be asked how many times you have rebought but they do take note of it. The dealer will wait for you to rebuy if that is your intention. If not make it clear that you are out of the game.
Top-Up - you can buy a top-up of chips whether you have chips or not at the end of the rebuy period. Highly advisable to do so going into the freeze-out period as almost all of your opponents will.
Freeze-Out - this period if you bust out you are out of the tournament.

Starting Chips
If memory serves you start with 750 chips and the blinds start at 25-50.
Antes Up/Level Up - the blinds go up after a certain amount of time on a constant rate. The casino has a projected display of the current blinds and the time left at that level. At certain points of the tournament there will be no need forllower value chips because the blinds are gone much higher, then the manager will call for these chips to be handed in. You can swap yours now with say 4 25 chips for a 100 chip. Any odd numbers of chips place them in front of you and you will be dealt a card for each one to decide who gets them.

Etiquette
General stuff thats taken for granted are things like keeping your chip stack visible to the other players, leave your two cards on the table in front of you. Place a chip on them to be doubly sure the dealer doesn't mistakenly take them (one of Roy "the boy" Brindley's favorite tips). Don't get in the habit of only putting a chip on them when you have a good hand etc. That could become a giveaway. Be aware of any habits like that and make them consistent.
You can leave the table at any time but if you are not there to call a blind it will be put in for you. It is not frowned on for someone to take the blind from your stack if this happens. Likewise you will be folded if you are not there to decide on a bet. During breaks if you feel the urge to watch the Omaha cash players losing their mortgages then make sure you're not bothering them by standing behind them or just remain at a distance. Most don't really seem to mind though.

Breaks
There is normally a 10 minute break at the end of the rebuy period and a shorter break just before the final table. Both serve addicts like me so I can get a ciggie in.

Times
It's supposed to start at 8.30 p.m. but I have yet to see it start earlier than 9.30 p.m. Both times I played this tournament I finished 6th and it was about 1.30 a.m. If you plan to win then plan to be there until 3 a.m. or so. That my guess.

Players
Very mixed. Some good, some bad, some loud, some a mixture of all 3. Almost all will habitually go all-in many times during the rebuy period because they don't give a sod about a tenner a go for rebuys. You might but most of them dont. The reason is that this strategy (very loose) increases their chances of having a sizable stack going into the freez-out period. Many won't but they are willing to try because they dont mind paying. When the freeze-out period begins most of the good players will change their game dramatically and tighten up (play less hands) or regardless of skill lets just say you'll be seeing their real game. At this stage my one tip would be to also play your game and avoid large stacks unless you have a monster hand because these are the guys who can knock you out of the tournament.
The loud/talkative ones might seem a bit intimidating but at the end of the day they don't know you and consequently they don't know you're game. They will probably be watching to see if you can play so try and not look stupid.

How Much Are You Willing to Spend?
You need to give youself some chance so plan one rebuy and the top-up at the very least so you can play as loose as the others at least once, €20 total. If you can afford more then all the better.

I will be there tomorrow probably and most thursdays so look out for a short tubby guy with glasses and a sad goatee and thats probably yours truly, Brian O'C.
My experiences overall have been very good. The casino regulars are becoming familiar faces and they are all friendly. But they do want to win just as you should. Well I love the buzz too. Can't beat it.

Lafortezza

Thanks for the tips, I'm looking forward to it tonight.

Is there much chat or banter at the tables?
What kind of ages of people go along? I've a couple of friends going tonight that would only be 19/20, and would only have experience of €10-20 cash games at mates houses.

Davey Devil

There's a fair bit of chat, some players are chatier than others. All of the regulars know each other well so it's just like poker at a mates house for them. Seems to me like there is gonna be alot of newbie's tonight so I'd advise them to act respectful i.e don't walk in there thinking you are the boss. Also no swearing at the table, also there is no smoking at the tables. When i was there for the first time everyone was very nice and one older guy in particular gave me loads of tips on the other regulars. The age is anything from 20-65 but there is definatly more old players than young.

mewso

Should point out re. starting chips and blinds. It's actually 700 in chips with blinds starting at 15-25

accensi0n

I played the €40 buy-in tournament thats held on Sundays a couple of months ago. It was the first time I played in a proper club and it was pretty cool.

Spiritus

And can I add to your tips,Musician:

'Stormin' Norman can have anything when he reraises you down to and including 7-5 off (which is his favorite hand) :cool:

krattapopov

i thought 5,6 was

no matter, however he hates it if you re raise him

PHB

So can I just show up on thursday with no money, and play in the tourament?
Do I have to be a member?

amp

You have to be a member (just bring photo id) but you don't have to pay to enter. You do have to pay to get buy-ins (€10) and you'll be either very good or very lucky to make it to the final table without one.

PHB

Ok, and just to check this is fitzwilliam tennis club right?

Is it worth the tenner buy-in?

(I'm a poor student )

Krusty_Clown

Ehhh, no..

Blackjack, Roulette, Omaha, Hold'em, and other variants of poker, but no tennis..

Have a look at their website: http://www.fitzwilliamcardclub.com/.

Their address:
The Fitzwilliam Card Club
Clifton Hall
Lower Fitzwilliam Street,
Dublin 2,
Ireland

PHB

I must say it was quite good, just got home now.

Lost an all in just before the top up time and decided luck wasn't going my way tonight.

Is very cool, I intend to become a regular on thursday

Marq

Thought I'd give a few extra tips for the fitz on a thursday (or indeed, any other night). There are a few mistakes one can make that aren't that obvious but that some regulars might make a big deal out of.

Betting: Be sure that you announce clearly what you are doing when the action comes around to you - Betting, Raising, Calling, Checking (a clear tap on the table will signify this aswell) and Folding (just throw your cards in).

A common mistake is this: the blinds are at 50 and 100, and you want to raise to 500, so you put in one 500 chip and don't say anything, expecting that your scary pink chip will do the talking. However, unless you have announced "raise", this is treated as a call. If you had put in five 100 chips, then your intention would be clear and this would not be an issue, but even then, it's advisable to clearly announce that you are raising and how much you are raising. Many times you will have people who aren't that focused on the game and won't notice your raise unless you say it.

Another possible pitfall is Underbetting. The minimum raise for any round of betting is twice the last bet. So if you are raising when the blinds are 25-50, the minimum raise you can make is to bring it up to 100. Similarly, if somebody bets 200, and you wish to raise, the minimum that you can raise is up to 400, as in another 200 on top of the original raise. The next player's minimum raise is to 800 and so on. The problem can arise if you forget this, and raise less than the minimum. This is an underbet, and the raise is disallowed and treated as a call. Be aware of how much the bet is at all times, so that you don't fall into this trap. The exception to this rule is when a player is going All-In, in which case they are allowed to underbet as they have nothing else. However, a person acting after the All-In who wishes to raise must still raise in accordance with the same rules.

For example: player one bets 200, player 2 raises 350 all-in. Some people would insist that Player 3 cannot in this case raise to 400, he must raise to 600, which is twice what would have been raised had the person going all-in been able to raise the minimum amount. Many people will allow the raise in this situation to bring it up to 500, twice 150 which is the amount of the all-in raise.
If a player is all-in for an amount less than an original bet, say 150 when the bet is 200, the player after must bet to a minimum of 400.

On the turn and the river, the minimum opening bet is the big blind, although some people don't adhere to this and most people just don't care.
Obviously with the game being No-Limit, you can raise anything above the minimum.

Another thing that can get you on trouble is String-Betting, ie, putting your chips into the pot one by one. In this case, only the first chip that hits the green is counted as a bet, and all others are disregarded. If you are putting in your chips one by one and the first one is a 100, and the bet is 75, you are deemed to have just called. If you announce clearly exactly how much you intend to raise before you put the money into the pot, then you may put them in one-by-one, as you have already made your intention known to the table. The act of letting your chips drop from your hand onto the green is also considered a string bet, despite how impressive you might think it looks, so best to just stick all of the chips in with one movement.

Never ever say "Call and Raise", as this is just considered a call.

Acting out of turn: to deliberately act out of turn is strictly against the rules. Acting out of turn means calling, raising OR passing before it is your turn to act. The reason this is not allowed is becuase it gives information to people who are still to act before you, and this is unfair. Once in a while you will unwittingly do this when you genuinely think that it's your turn to act, and this will always be forgiven though should still be apologised for. You should always be aware of when it is and is not your time to act. This applies to passing your cards. Do not pass out of turn, despite the fact that you've just gotten 2-7 offsuit for the 9th time running, it's still poor ettiquete to do so.

If you call a bet out of turn, the bet stands, If you raise out of turn, the raise stands. For example. you're in sixth position and before anyone else acts, you raise to 300. Now, the person to your right, in fifth position, raises to 1500. You know he's an uber-rock who would only raise with aces, you want your money back, but you can't have it. Your original bet of 300 stands, and if you want to play, you're going to have to call the extra 1200, otherwise you just lose those chips. Same goes for if you are simply calling a blind out of turn and someone raises. that call stands, and unless you call the raise, you're out of the hand.

You are not allowed to talk about hands that are still in play. Despite the fact that you have passed, you may not announce to anyone at the table what cards you had as this can effect the betting of the remaining players in the hand. Even if you are all-in, but there is still betting on the side, you may not discuss what cards you have and you may not turn them over. You are not allowed to fold your cards up unless there will definitely not be any more betting after you do so (ie, a player is all-in and once you pass there can't be any more betting anyway, or you're one of the last two players in a pot and you're folding to a bet). When you're all-in and you have a caller, make sure that you know there are no other callers who might be betting against each other in the side pot before you triumphantly throw over your pair of cowboys, the guy representing them to your left will not be pleased.

Finally, just some advice on dealing. Often on a big thursday night you may have to deal for yourself as there are a limited number of dealers and lots of tables. Many people are intimidated by this as they see certain people flinging cards around with swiss precision. then you try it and the card goes off the table, or turns face up. the best way to deal at first, particularly if you are at the end of the table is simply to count how many players are there (including yourself) and then just deal them out in front of you - people will pass them down to the players. Nobody is bothered by this and it can lead to a lot less confusion in the long run.

Couple of other things to remember about dealing: If either of the first two cards are exposed, it's a bum deal, and must be reshuffled and redealt. If any card after that is exposed, continue dealing to the rest of the players. At the end of the deal there should be one player a card short, and you give him the top card from the deck, what would be the burn card, and replace the exposed card at the top of the deck to be used as the burn card. there's an explanation about burn cards and dealing stuff on the Noob FAQ. Also remember that if you're not confident about shuffling or dealing, someone at the table will be glad to do it for you, you only have to ask, and that you must pass the cards to the person on your RIGHT to be cut before you can deal.

Anyway, hope this helps any first-timers to the fitz (or the merrion, or a really hard-assed home game).
Good luck all,
Marq

Lafortezza

Originally posted by Marq
Another possible pitfall is Underbetting. The minimum raise for any round of betting is twice the last bet. So if you are raising when the blinds are 25-50, the minimum raise you can make is to bring it up to 100. Similarly, if somebody bets 200, and you wish to raise, the minimum that you can raise is up to 400, as in another 200 on top of the original raise. The next player can then raise it to 600 and so on.

I think preflop you have to double the previous bet, although I could be wrong. So if it went bet:200, raise to 400, the reraise has to be 800 (double the previous 400) not 600.

Originally posted by Marq
On the turn and the river, the minimum opening bet is twice the big blind, although some people don't adhere to this and most people just don't care.

IIRC the minimum bet is the big blind, so on blinds of 100-200 if you flop a poker you can milk people by betting 200 each time on turn and river.

Originally posted by Marq
You are not allowed to talk about hands that are still in play.
Marq

The freeroll table I was on last sunday didn't really adopt this rule too well..... I blame Hyzepher and DeV, troublemakers...

DapperGent

Originally posted by lafortezza
The freeroll table I was on last sunday didn't really adopt this rule too well.....

It wasn't our fault people were betting when clearly they had absolutely none of that!

DeVore

They were classic hands! Virtual coin flips sure!

Personally, I was thinking of the value....


DeV.

DapperGent

You always have to keep the value placed firmly at the forefront of your mind - especially when you're behind.

Marq

Originally posted by lafortezza
I think preflop you have to double the previous bet, although I could be wrong. So if it went bet:200, raise to 400, the reraise has to be 800 (double the previous 400) not 600.

Nah, just have to raise as much again, it's double the RAISE, not the total amount that has been bet.

DapperGent

Originally posted by Marq
Nah, just have to raise as much again, it's double the RAISE, not the total amount that has been bet.

Incorrect. I bet 200 someone else has to put 400 in to raise. If the next person wants to reraise then they must put in 800. It's still 600 more when it comes back to me (given no more raises - if so next one must push 1600) but the last raiser's total bet is 800.

Marq

Ok, I decided to check this - More because I think it's a bad idea to have incorrect or conflicting information on a thread that is for the benefit of those who are new to the game than because I simply want to defend my position. I've only checked this through some websites and then I played online to cross-check on actual tables, if anyone can find the definitive ruling on this then please post it and if I'm wrong I'll gladly edit the original post. Websites were vague, though double the raise not the total amount bet seems to be the concensus. Two online poker sites (ultimate bet and Pokerroom) allow minimum bet of twice the last raise. Hence in an actual example from the play money tables at UltimateBet: Minimum bet of 20, raised 90 to 110, my minimum bet option was to raise to 200, an extra 90, not an extra 110. this reflects the game's origins in limit play. so if you bet 200, and are raised to 400, you can raise to 600, not necessarily 800, though obviously any amount over 600 is an option in No-Limit Hold'Em.

funnily enough, when I sat down to check this online, I wasn't looking at my cards, just the betting limits, and inadvertantly bluffed someone of a queen high straight with a 3-5 offsuit. Ye would have been proud of me.

Lafortezza

Originally posted by Marq
Two online poker sites (ultimate bet and Pokerroom) allow minimum bet of twice the last raise. Hence in an actual example from the play money tables at UltimateBet: Minimum bet of 20, raised 90 to 110, my minimum bet option was to raise to 200, an extra 90, not an extra 110. this reflects the game's origins in limit play. so if you bet 200, and are raised to 400, you can raise to 600, not necessarily 800, though obviously any amount over 600 is an option in No-Limit Hold'Em.

Aren't we talking about the fitz though? NL hold'em can have slightly different rules, casino vs online.
AFAIR the explanations me and Dapper have given are correct regarding the Fitz and the raising rules.

Marq

Might be a good idea for someone to clarify this in the fitz so, I'll ask next time I'm in.

Marq

I stand embarrassingly corrected - checked it out with Luke and....

Minimum bet on all rounds of betting is the big blind

Raise double the amount of the raise. i.e. 200 - 400 - 800 - 1600.

Oh the shame.

Kimba

Couple of other things to remember about dealing: If either of the first two cards are exposed, it's a bum deal, and must be reshuffled and redealt. If any card after that is exposed, continue dealing to the rest of the players. At the end of the deal there should be one player a card short, and you give him the top card from the deck, what would be the burn card, and replace the exposed card at the top of the deck to be used as the burn card. there's an explanation about burn cards and dealing stuff on the Noob FAQ. Also remember that if you're not confident about shuffling or dealing, someone at the table will be glad to do it for you, you only have to ask, and that you must pass the cards to the person on your RIGHT to be cut before you can deal.

Anyway, hope this helps any first-timers to the fitz (or the merrion, or a really hard-assed home game).
Good luck all,
Marq[/QUOTE]
If a card is exposed on the first round of dealing, it is a misdeal. If the second card is exposed, you carry on dealing the second card to each person with the exposed card, turned face up for everyone at the table to see, in front of you. You then put the deck down and take the third card from the bottom, this becomes the second card of the person whose card was exposed. You then place the exposed card in the dirt in front of you. It does not go anywhere near the deck again and does not affect the discard or flop in anyway.

Davey Devil

Kimba, you are incorrect. The rules on a mis-deal which Marq stated is the way it is done at The Fitzwilliam.

Kimba

Davey Devil wrote:

Kimba, you are incorrect. The rules on a mis-deal which Marq stated is the way it is done at The Fitzwilliam.

No i am right ask marq yourself

Davey Devil

Your right - I was reading it the wrong way around, I thought what you said was what Marq said, I blame my backwards brain .

richie17

if I turn up thursday night will I be expected to deal every so often then? Don't like the sound of that... sure it's not hard, but a little nervous I guess.

careca

richie17 wrote:

if I turn up thursday night will I be expected to deal every so often then? Don't like the sound of that... sure it's not hard, but a little nervous I guess.

There normally aren't dealers provided on Thurs night but there is always someone at the table willing to deal if people don't feel comfortable with it. If you are all taking turns,just say you can't deal if it comes to your turn or if you see someone good at it ask them to deal your round. don't be a bit nervous and head on in, it really is a great starting point and you will enjoy it. If there are some loud or annoying players just ignore them and play your own game. Luke (the floor manager) looks after the new players well and before you know it he'll have you dealing for the entire night!!!

Marq

careca wrote:

before you know it he'll have you dealing for the entire night!!!

Surprisingly, this is entirely true. We do get paid for it though!

richie17

cool, thanks. Look forward to it... as with all these things, once you get over the initial nervousness it's all good I suspect.

thanks

nicryan

Marq wrote:

Surprisingly, this is entirely true. We do get paid for it though!

yes but noone else wants to deal on saturday....silly PLH/O tourney...




Nic

peeko

Lads thanks very much for this great read!

Havn't been to the Fitz yet, and didn't know about the thursday games at all. Had planned to bring my brother to a friday night game for his birthday. But might try get in for a thursday night game too!

Thanks for all the info, great post

Dub13

peeko wrote:

Lads thanks very much for this great read!

Havn't been to the Fitz yet, and didn't know about the thursday games at all. Had planned to bring my brother to a friday night game for his birthday. But might try get in for a thursday night game too!

Thanks for all the info, great post

You should pop in,I was like yourself saying I was going to pop in sometime and now that I have I look forward to every trip,you cant get me out of the place when I do go over...

peeko

My problem is that I live in Balbriggan and don't have a car! Hotels are expensive, but I'll get one coz I'm now dying to go in there!

Until then I'll make do with online poker and friday night with the lads!

Hey when I'm there, I'll shout out Dub13 and look out for ya!

Dub13

You should go to the freeroll on Saturdays...it starts around 4:30 and its normally over by 7:30/8:00 so then you can head home or into town...!!

kencleary

Hey peeko,

I live out in Balbriggan too. You can make it in for some games. Wednesday-Saturday theres a nightlink at 3am back to Balbriggan and well if you're playing past 3am then you can afford the 40 for a taxi back there!

oglaigh

Hiya, first time poster etc etc. Whats the deal with tomorrow night? Is there a tournament and if there is, how much is it?
Cheers.

Dub13

oglaigh wrote:

Hiya, first time poster etc etc. Whats the deal with tomorrow night? Is there a tournament and if there is, how much is it?
Cheers.

There should be one on tonight I cant think why not.Its free to enter and you can rebuy (for 10 euro) for the first hour and half.They also have a Freeroll on Saturday and another one on Sundays.

RasTa

Is there a dress code ?
Cant wear shoes whilst playin poker.

mewso

No dress code. Just wear some.

F Fiesta

Might head to this tonight, but not too keen on dealing etc...also bound to make some newbie mistakes

Dub13

Its grand the freeroll is very newbie friendly,its were most people start so you will be grand.

F Fiesta

F Fiesta wrote:

Might head to this tonight, but not too keen on dealing etc...also bound to make some newbie mistakes

Biggest newbie mistake is string betting. If you want to raise say "raise" before you bput a single chip in. I got stunned by that so many times on my first time. As for dealing, (I don't like doing it either) just ask the table to nominate a player/dealer or someone else to do it for you.

THE OTHER PLAYERS WILL NOT BITE (much)

F Fiesta

Ah, okay

So if the SB is 100 and the BB is 200 and it comes around to me...and I want to bet 600...


Do I say rasie to 600 or raise 600?

And the minimum raise in that case is 400 (twice the BB)??

mewso

If the BB is 200 you can raise it to 400 or more. Just say raise and the amount you are raising it to. Some people do say "raise, 200 on top" for example which is fine too. The very act of saying raise means that you must be putting in 400 at least anyway whether you say 400 or not.

F Fiesta

Cheers for that,

Finally

The SB is 200, BB is 400

Next Bets...800, 1600, 3200?

Or am I wrong?

Hitman Actual

A raise must, at the very least, double the previous bet/raise (excluding all-in situations). So if someone bets 800 on the flop, you can raise anything from 800 up to your stack size. As has been pointed out, the most important thing is to announce "raise" before you put any chips in the pot, and then you can do what you like.

Edit: I wouldn't worry too much about playing for the first time anyway, there will be plenty of more experienced players who will be happy to help you out. A lot of players probably started out in this freeroll as well, and I've never heard of any problems.

Dub13

Did you go in...?if so how did you get on...?

F Fiesta

Won a ticket

Couldn't believe it like, expected to be home by 10...cool atmosphere there etc

Culchie

Well Done,

I was going well last night, had a hefty stack at lost it pretty lively.
Was disappointed going home, but didn't think I did too much wrong, but what do you reckon?

Blinds 400/800, limper (4000) in early position, folded to me in small blind (13000), I raised it to 4000 putting him all in, he called with 10 J ... I had AK, he caught a 10, so that was that.

About 15 mins later, another limper in from early position (5000), I was in late position(8000) with 10 10, I raised him all in again (seeing a trend here? lol), he had JJ .... bye bye chips

Then I had to double up, and went with K9s as the next blinds were approaching and I would feel them bad, and ran into QK, i hit the 9, but it went on to fill a straight for him.

So hero to zero very fast .... Any comments?