Are Saorview ever going to add more channels?

STB. · 20-12-2017 12:42am

Sam Russell wrote: »

The reason for this is that ComReg and BAI have set up a schedule of charging that has tied 2RN's charging system to bandwidth used. Each channel gets charged for the bandwidth used, based on the total used. The total cost of running 2 muxes on Saorview is €12 m, which means if 40% of the bandwidth is wasted, it does not affect 2RN. What it does mean is that for a single channel to go HD means they take a larger share of the €12 m, which TV3/Virgin will not pay.

There are two possible solutions - either RTE move to mux 1, and let TV3 and TG4 pay the €6 m for mux 2 between them, or all channels have to go HD and share the €12 m between them. Either would have the result that all channels would go HD. At the moment, spare capacity is just burnt off.

Hope that explains the insanity that is tolerated on Saorview. Wasted bandwidth is just one problem.

The tariff system is based on average bit rate consumption. And why TV3 dont really care that their stations looks crap. They are not committed to the platform whatsoever, other than fulfill the basic terms of their licence. Be FTA.

Capt'n Midnight · 20-12-2017 1:19am

The wonderful thing is the bandwidth thing also affects SaorSat even though there aren't any commercial channels on it.

Or why else isn't TG4 in HD there ??? :mad::mad::mad:

https://www.lyngsat.com/Eutelsat-9B-and-Ka-Sat-9A.html

STB. · 20-12-2017 1:30am

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

The wonderful thing is the bandwidth thing also affects SaorSat even though there aren't any commercial channels on it.

Or why else isn't TG4 in HD there ??? :mad::mad::mad:

https://www.lyngsat.com/Eutelsat-9B-and-Ka-Sat-9A.html

Dont know what the ins and outs of the DTH agreement with eutelsat but it could be on the basis for payment is bit rate usage. More bit rate required for HD. TG4 dont have the cash.

20-12-2017 1:31am

Mickey Mike wrote: »

Does anybody know what's coming on Channel 27? Its a test card, Channel 15 has ceased. I read in some news article where TV3 will never go HD because of the high charge from RTE. I can't understand why 2rn run a HD test card now for 4 years.

This is on my TV's epg (27) and not just one of those hidden test card channels. First time there has been something added to the epg in quite a while. Anything happening I wonder?

Capt'n Midnight · 20-12-2017 1:53am

STB. wrote: »

Dont know what the ins and outs of the DTH agreement with eutelsat but it could be on the basis for payment is bit rate usage. More bit rate required for HD. TG4 dont have the cash.

I doubt that TG4 are dealing directly with TG4. also Saorsat has a full transponder to itself with all those test cards burning bandwidth.

At least I get to see some of the stuff in HD, when BBC NI show it on Freesat. :rolleyes:

Mickey Mike · 22-12-2017 12:10am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This is on my TV's epg (27) and not just one of those hidden test card channels. First time there has been something added to the epg in quite a while. Anything happening I wonder?

Ah now there we have it (ch27) another Saorview information channel! Is that the best they can do?

Harry Palmr · 22-12-2017 12:21am

Those are mad numbers, are the saorview transmitters made of gold?

Capt'n Midnight · 22-12-2017 1:46am

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Those are mad numbers, are the saorview transmitters made of gold?

No.

But they eat electricity.

Sam Russell · 22-12-2017 11:25am

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

No.

But they eat electricity.

They would only save electricity if they shut down one of the muxes. With two muxes there is plenty of free capacity, enough for TV3 and TG4 to go HD. It is only the charging regime that has them SD (plus the reluctance of TV3 to pay out for HD).

Mickey Mike · 27-08-2018 5:35pm

I understand RTE are removing RTE NewsNow from Saorview in early 2019 and replaced with RTE2+1 if they get approval from the BAI.
So no increase in channels, just a little step backwards.

STB. · 28-08-2018 5:49pm

Sam Russell wrote: »

They would only save electricity if they shut down one of the muxes. With two muxes there is plenty of free capacity, enough for TV3 and TG4 to go HD. It is only the charging regime that has them SD (plus the reluctance of TV3 to pay out for HD).

Sam TV3 have no interest whatsoever in the Saorview platform other than to garner access to sports rights and protected sports rights pitches. They are rebranding and you will shortly see the emergence of a dedicated virgin sports channel. There's all kinds of rights floating around some of which will be FTA some which won't be.

TV3 could have handed back their PSB licence and applied for a content licence but they possibly wouldn't qualify for FTA sports pitching etc.

It's not rtes fault that the commercial operator wants to do the bare minimum to fulfill their PSB requirements.

Sam Russell · 28-08-2018 7:51pm

STB. wrote: »

It's not rtes fault that the commercial operator wants to do the bare minimum to fulfill their PSB requirements.

But the fault lies with the Dept, the BAI and COMreg.

There is nothing to stop 2RN being allowed to up the spec for SD to be 720 by 576i, obviously with Ministerial approval.

If RTE were given the rights to bring on their proposed RTE 3, an archive based channel, then we might see some competition with TV3, after all, TV3 are only broadcasting archive ITV content at the moment.

Mickey Mike · 28-08-2018 8:26pm

I think its now its high time for channel shake up, the rebranding of the TV3 group is not adding much variety. The purposed RTE3HD is what's needed, with the pending closure of RTE News Now in 2019 and replacing it with RTE2+1. We could do with a little more choice.

STB. · 28-08-2018 8:54pm

Sam Russell wrote: »

STB. wrote: »

It's not rtes fault that the commercial operator wants to do the bare minimum to fulfill their PSB requirements.

But the fault lies with the Dept, the BAI and COMreg.

There is nothing to stop 2RN being allowed to up the spec for SD to be 720 by 576i, obviously with Ministerial approval.

.

Your joking right ?

Acceptable Image formats and bit rates are set by the European Broadcasting Union. There's an even lower one than 544x576.

Furthermore it's reiterated in the minimum requirements of Saorview receivers. TV3 and tg4 would have 2rn before the commission if they started dictating Minimum standards outside of these!

It's up to the broadcasters to pick how Shiite they wish to look.

Atlantic Dawn · 28-08-2018 8:56pm

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I understand RTE are removing RTE NewsNow from Saorview in early 2019 and replaced with RTE2+1 if they get approval from the BAI.
So no increase in channels, just a little step backwards.

In the world of PVR and in RTE's case the fact they repeat almost all of their own RTE2 shows about 2 days later what the hell is the point of RTE2+1 it will have zero audience.

Mickey Mike · 28-08-2018 11:00pm

I forgot to mention Saorview have added a new radio channel "Radio Maria Ireland" epg 210. Isn't this exciting! Hope its a start, I'd like to see many other stations joining as well ie. Newstalk, Spirit Radio, 4fm and even Today FM.

lertsnim · 29-08-2018 5:25pm

4FM would be nice to cover the parts of the country where it's not on FM.

Former Former · 30-08-2018 10:21pm

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I think its now its high time for channel shake up, the rebranding of the TV3 group is not adding much variety. The purposed RTE3HD is what's needed, with the pending closure of RTE News Now in 2019 and replacing it with RTE2+1. We could do with a little more choice.

RTE barely have enough content for two channels, what would RTE3 actually show?

Harry Palmr · 30-08-2018 10:26pm

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I forgot to mention Saorview have added a new radio channel "Radio Maria Ireland" epg 210. Isn't this exciting! Hope its a start, I'd like to see many other stations joining as well ie. Newstalk, Spirit Radio, 4fm and even Today FM.

DOB Radio should be on saorview no question but given his line of thinking he'd probably refuse to allow it!

Mickey Mike · 30-08-2018 10:41pm

Former Former wrote: »

RTE barely have enough content for two channels, what would RTE3 actually show?

My thinking is for RTE Junior to run as it is now and the new RTE3 to take over at 7pm (same channel shared).
RTE3 can be a film or an archive channel, I'm sure they have a big library of martial of old shows and so on.

Mickey Mike · 30-08-2018 10:48pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

DOB Radio should be on saorview no question but given his line of thinking he'd probably refuse to allow it!

Who are you talking about? The Minister! Radio channels must be encouraged to join the platform, especially when they are not available on FM.

jay0109 · 30-08-2018 10:53pm

I was talking to someone in TV3 recently and asked why it wasn't HD on Saorview and why there wasn't also wasn't a +1. Simple he said, RTE wanted a couple of million per annum for that so they walked away

Hotblack Desiato · 01-09-2018 2:50am

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I forgot to mention Saorview have added a new radio channel "Radio Maria Ireland" epg 210. Isn't this exciting! Hope its a start, I'd like to see many other stations joining as well ie. Newstalk, Spirit Radio, 4fm and even Today FM.

Will BAI apply the usual balance and standards requirements to this religious channel.....?

Don't hold your breath.

Johnboy1951 · 01-09-2018 9:07am

jay0109 wrote: »

I was talking to someone in TV3 recently and asked why it wasn't HD on Saorview and why ihere wasn't also wasn't a +1. Simple he said, RTE wanted a coupe of million per annum for that so they walked away

In essence TV3 did not want to pay the cost of going HD on Saorview.

Wanderer78 · 01-09-2018 9:15am

Johnboy1951 wrote:

In essence TV3 did not want to pay the cost of going HD on Saorview.

Ah there's probably a lot more to it, you d be surprised of the politics that's involved in such projects

Johnboy1951 · 01-09-2018 9:18am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Ah there's probably a lot more to it, you d be surprised of the politics that's involved in such projects

It does help Virgin Media to distinguish itself from Saorview by being on Saorview only in SD.

Wanderer78 · 01-09-2018 9:24am

Johnboy1951 wrote:

It does help Virgin Media to distinguish itself from Saorview by being on Saorview only in SD.

Makes sense, competitive advantage I guess, shur they're all at it to some degree

Elmo · 01-09-2018 9:26am

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Will BAI apply the usual balance and standards requirements to this religious channel.....?

Don't hold your breath.

I was think that was just for the popes visit.

Mickey Mike · 01-09-2018 9:54am

The old TV3 never joined Saorsat even, so VMtv are not going to make any advances or improvements to Saorview and we can see why. I won't like to see full HD for RTE 1&2 (1920by1080i) and 720by576i for SD.

Mickey Mike · 28-01-2019 1:32pm

RTE2+1 is launching on Saorview on the 13/02/19 RTE1+1 will also run 24 hours a day. Its not much of an addition but its something, first addition since Utv Ireland 01/01/15. Virgin Media have complained about it, don't know why.

JDxtra · 28-01-2019 1:34pm

If RTE do anything, Virgin will complain!

Elmo · 28-01-2019 2:16pm

Mickey Mike wrote: »

RTE2+1 is launching on Saorview on the 13/02/19 RTE1+1 will also run 24 hours a day. Its not much of an addition but its something, first addition since Utv Ireland Virgin Media Three 01/01/1517. Virgin Media have complained about it, don't know why.

FYP.

Harry Palmr · 29-01-2019 11:31am

Virgin should be kicked off saorview. Actually no, they might well welcome that - they should be legally mandated to provide HD on all channels.

Sam Russell · 29-01-2019 11:39am

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Virgin should be kicked off saorview. Actually no, they might well welcome that - they should be legally mandated to provide HD on all channels.

I've said this before. They should be required to broadcast in 720i (720 * 576i) which would give a very good picture - not quite HD but a lot better than smudgy vision. They should also be required to broadcast a minimum average bandwidth.

I think their content is much more grounds for complaint - repeats of repeats - with little to no original programmes. Who cares if the PQ is rubbish if the content is rubbish?

L1011 · 29-01-2019 11:47am

Elmo wrote: »

FYP.

Inaccurately.

Johnboy1951 · 29-01-2019 11:52am

I think it might be difficult to force any broadcaster to use a specific resolution, but ......

if the charges for all TV channels were adjusted to cover 720 and 1080, including those for RTÉ, then broadcasters might be more willing to use the bandwidth they already pay for.

A scheme could be arranged so that +1 channels would be allocated the lesser bandwidth, or even maybe a reducing cost depending on the number of channels broadcast by any one entity.

I believe there 'must' be ways to encourage broadcasters to use reasonable resolutions without specifying those resolutions and bit rates..

Elmo · 29-01-2019 12:39pm

L1011 wrote: »

Inaccurately.

Sarcastically

Suppose be3 does count either for Virgin Media Television!

Gerry Wicklow · 29-01-2019 1:47pm

Don't forget TG4 in all this too. Why should their HD service only be available on a foreign network.

lertsnim · 29-01-2019 6:31pm

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

Don't forget TG4 in all this too. Why should their HD service only be available on a foreign network.

Tax funded so their HD should be forced onto Saorview.

Tigerandahalf · 29-01-2019 6:36pm

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

Don't forget TG4 in all this too. Why should their HD service only be available on a foreign network.

What sort of cash would tg4 be getting for hd on pay tv? It is a damn shame it is not in hd in saorview, especially with the amount of sport they carry.

Saying that you see very few complaints from saorview viewers about it.

Former Former · 29-01-2019 9:40pm

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

What sort of cash would tg4 be getting for hd on pay tv? It is a damn shame it is not in hd in saorview, especially with the amount of sport they carry.

Saying that you see very few complaints from saorview viewers about it.

That's because no one really cares. Apart from sport, it's ignored by 95% of the population.

So there's no real need for it to be in HD. We have RTE in HD, that's all we really need on Saorview.

Elmo · 30-01-2019 11:04am

Former Former wrote: »

That's because no one really cares. Apart from sport, it's ignored by 95% of the population.

So there's no real need for it to be in HD. We have RTE in HD, that's all we really need on Saorview.

Not really the point. TG4 have been give a separate grant for HD from the government on several occasions, not once did the department think of Saorview when handing them the grant. Indeed AFAIK TG4 have push for HD productions across their service.

Surely if you are giving TG4 funidng for TG4 HD, you'd mention or go so far as to stipulate that TG4 put it up on Saorview in HD.

Spoke to the dept about this they don't give a ****.

Former Former · 30-01-2019 1:41pm

Elmo wrote: »

Not really the point. TG4 have been give a separate grant for HD from the government on several occasions, not once did the department think of Saorview when handing them the grant. Indeed AFAIK TG4 have push for HD productions across their service.

Surely if you are giving TG4 funidng for TG4 HD, you'd mention or go so far as to stipulate that TG4 put it up on Saorview in HD.

Spoke to the dept about this they don't give a ****.

A one-off grant would cover cameras and studio. Moving to HD transmission is an ongoing cost.

Presumably whatever deal tg4 have with Sky and Virgin makes it viable for them, great, they're private businesses and best of luck to them.

Throwing more government money away on something that no one really wants is not a good idea.

Elmo · 30-01-2019 1:53pm

Former Former wrote: »

A one-off grant would cover cameras and studio. Moving to HD transmission is an ongoing cost.

Presumably whatever deal tg4 have with Sky and Virgin makes it viable for them, great, they're private businesses and best of luck to them.

Throwing more government money away on something that no one really wants is not a good idea.

I think they applied over a few years TBH, vast majority of programmes are independently produced, TG4 only asks that shows are produced in HD, they don't fund their producers to upgrade. News Studio yes would have been upgraded, much along the lines of any upgrade require.

No one is asking that the government throw more money at TG4 we just expect that as a public service broadcaster that they provide that service to all not just Pay TV viewers, who end up footing the bill twice.

Much like Virgin Media Television the cost of SD Broadcast is much less than that of Analogue, TG4 HD wouldn't cost much more or less than analogue.

Can you imagine if RTÉ just kept their HD channels on Saorview.

FRIENDO · 30-01-2019 2:41pm

Former Former wrote: »

A one-off grant would cover cameras and studio. Moving to HD transmission is an ongoing cost.

Presumably whatever deal tg4 have with Sky and Virgin makes it viable for them, great, they're private businesses and best of luck to them.

Throwing more government money away on something that no one really wants is not a good idea.

I find it sad that a channel like TG4 supported by the tax payer, will only show it's TG4 HD channel on foreign owned platforms.

For the many tax payers with only Saorview who are denied the luxury of TG4 HD.

Former Former · 30-01-2019 5:33pm

FRIENDO wrote: »

I find it sad that a channel like TG4 supported by the tax payer, will only show it's TG4 HD channel on foreign owned platforms.

For the many tax payers with only Saorview who are denied the luxury of TG4 HD.

Luxury is exactly the word.

There are better things to spend our taxes on.

Again; this is not a service that anyone wants. The general principle that it "should" be available in HD is not a good reason to waste public money.

Hotblack Desiato · 30-01-2019 6:55pm

There is no actual cost to this, the space on the mux is just currently wasted, and any increase in fee goes to RTE. It's a (small) circular transaction from one public body to another.

FRIENDO · 30-01-2019 9:18pm

Former Former wrote: »

Luxury is exactly the word.

There are better things to spend our taxes on.

Again; this is not a service that anyone wants. The general principle that it "should" be available in HD is not a good reason to waste public money.

I think you are underestimating the value of TV.
In many homes its turned on, its company, an escape, entertainment, sport, enjoyment and even sadness along with the news and education, I don't mind my taxes funding TV, however it is annoying a State supported TV channel TG4 does not broadcast its TG4 HD Channel for all tax payers to watch.

lertsnim · 31-01-2019 4:59pm

Former Former wrote: »

There are better things to spend our taxes on.

Again; this is not a service that anyone wants. The general principle that it "should" be available in HD is not a good reason to waste public money.

Our taxes have already been spent on it. To say that nobody wants it in HD is plain wrong.

Former Former · 31-01-2019 6:30pm

lertsnim wrote: »

Our taxes have already been spent on it. To say that nobody wants it in HD is plain wrong.

My point is that people here only want it because they think we should have it. It's a point of principle.

No one actually wants the content (again, apart from sport).

I don't think that's a great use of additional taxpayer funding.

Are Saorview ever going to add more channels?

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