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Kildare farmer objects to €8bn Intel investment...

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    #272
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,397 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    Any normal person would sell

    In this situation a new bill should be introduced to stop the crazies holding up thousands of jobs for families

    Would you care to define normal?

    Maybe you could give an executive summary of the kind of Bill you have in mind?


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    #273
    Mike9832
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭Mike9832


    elperello wrote: »
    Would you care to define normal?

    Maybe you could give an executive summary of the kind of Bill you have in mind?

    Have a partner

    Have kids

    Have a holiday

    Enjoy life with millions in the bank

    Not hang onto your great great gran daddies inheritance land

    In the countries interest bill

    Any field that is jeopardising €100mill+ of investment should be automatically on this bill


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    #274
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Mike9832 wrote:
    Not hang onto your great great gran daddies inheritance land
    Constitution
    Mike9832 wrote:
    In the countries interest bill
    Consitution, caveat public good not the benefit of private enterprise.
    Mike9832 wrote:
    Any field that is jeopardising €100mill+ of investment should be automatically on this bill

    Consitution
    Have a read.


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    #275
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,397 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    Have a partner

    Have kids

    Have a holiday

    Enjoy life with millions in the bank

    Not hang onto your great great gran daddies inheritance land

    In the countries interest bill

    Any field that is jeopardising €100mill+ of investment should be automatically on this bill

    I see where you are coming from but that is just your idea of normal. Thomas Reid is just being true to his idea of normal ie. being left alone.

    Your Bill is interesting but probably unconstitutional. It would most likely mean that private property could be taken because somebody rich wanted it.

    We had a system like that in medieval times - no going back.


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    #276
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    Any normal person would sell

    In this situation a new bill should be introduced to stop the crazies holding up thousands of jobs for families

    I'd sell, no doubt about it, but that would be my choice, I'd take the money over the field every day of the week. He on the other hand, prefers the field. It's his choice, and so it should be.

    We're at full employment - he's not holding up any thousands of jobs!

    Intel have more resources than god, they can build somewhere else - it's just handier / cheaper for them to build on this mans land.

    They are a foreign corporate entity - they have no right to any irish citizens property (like the state would for metro north for example)

    In short - they can go fúck themselves!


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    #277
    stoneill
    Registered Users Posts: 3,610 ✭✭✭stoneill


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    I'd sell, no doubt about it, but that would be my choice, I'd take the money over the field every day of the week. He on the other hand, prefers the field. It's his choice, and so it should be.

    We're at full employment - he's not holding up any thousands of jobs!

    Intel have more resources than god, they can build somewhere else - it's just handier / cheaper for them to build on this mans land.

    They are a foreign corporate entity - they have no right to any irish citizens property (like the state would for metro north for example)

    In short - they can go fúck themselves!

    It's not his land. It across the road from his land.


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    #278
    Call me Al
    Registered Users Posts: 3,020 ✭✭✭Call me Al


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    I'd sell, no doubt about it, but that would be my choice, I'd take the money over the field every day of the week. He on the other hand, prefers the field. It's his choice, and so it should be.

    We're at full employment - he's not holding up any thousands of jobs!

    Intel have more resources than god, they can build somewhere else - it's just handier / cheaper for them to build on this mans land.

    They are a foreign corporate entity - they have no right to any irish citizens property (like the state would for metro north for example)

    In short - they can go fúck themselves!

    Building on his land is old news. He won his case and they lost, and they have moved on.

    They are now wanting to build somewhere else just as you suggested... their own land. Across a road from a field of his and the best part of a km from his farmhouse,if not more.
    And fwiw I agree with this man's right to not have his land CPO'd for any private corporation, and I'm glad he won his legal case.


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    #279
    ToddyDoody
    Registered Users Posts: 4,421 ✭✭✭ToddyDoody


    Farmer says 'Intel need to see the bigger picture'


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    #280
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    stoneill wrote: »
    It's not his land. It across the road from his land.

    Oh right, my mistake - I thought the new location was also on his land. That's a different kettle of fish so!


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    #281
    Jupiter Mulligan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 525 ✭✭✭Jupiter Mulligan


    Doofus strikes again.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/farmer-appeals-intel-planning-permission-1.3928451


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    #282
    Jupiter Mulligan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 525 ✭✭✭Jupiter Mulligan


    Squatter wrote: »
    Round One goes to Intel.

    No doubt Farmer Tom will be soon heading up to ABP on his turbo-charged 1957 Massey-Ferguson!


    https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/news/courts/council-gives-green-light-to-4bn-intel-plan-in-spite-of-farmers-objection-38129885.html

    Good call! :)


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    #283
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Farmers like him are just glorified social welfare recipients. Useless to society and funded by the taxpayer to hang on to "sentimental" land that is worth a fortune. Funded by the taxes of the young people working at Intel who will be out of a job because of him.

    No other sector of society gets paid to hold on to a valuable asset.

    A hateful horrible miserable old man. No sympathy whatsoever.


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    #284
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,972 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Farmers like him are just glorified social welfare recipients. Useless to society and funded by the taxpayer to hang on to "sentimental" land that is worth a fortune. Funded by the taxes of the young people working at Intel who will be out of a job because of him.

    No other sector of society gets paid to hold on to a valuable asset.

    A hateful horrible miserable old man. No sympathy whatsoever.
    How is he a glorified welfare recipient because he has a view on a particular development?
    How Is hwbfu set by the taxpayer in such a way that affects you.
    How will anyone be out of a job because of him?
    In reality, the issue is you, an opinionated who waffles and blames anyone who holds a different view to themselves.


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    #285
    fly_agaric
    Registered Users Posts: 4,810 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Jupiter Mulligan wrote: »
    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/farmer-appeals-intel-planning-permission-1.3928451

    Ah sure maybe Brexit will have happened by time the wise ones at ABP get around to it and project will be canned or diverted to Israel or Asia or whatever.
    We are all so rich we don't need the jobs/development any more!


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    #286
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,505 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    He is the only objector.

    Everything has to grind to a halt in the planning process due to one crank serial objector.

    We need reform of the planning system.


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    #287
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,991 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    He is the only objector.

    Everything has to grind to a halt in the planning process due to one crank serial objector.

    We need reform of the planning system.


    on the basis of cases like this? no we don't.
    the system is working as it should here. if his objections are valid they will be upheld. if not, they won't.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #288
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,505 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    end of the road wrote: »
    on the basis of cases like this? no we don't.
    the system is working as it should here. if his objections are valid they will be upheld. if not, they won't.

    Of course his objection will not stand up but this is NOT the point.

    The point is it gets dragged in to a time consuming sink hole no matter how ridiculous the objection is.

    If I write a stupid letter to An Bord Pleanala and pay the fee with ZERO basis for complaint it's the same thing.

    Reform is needed to stop serial objectors and to make them liable after a certain treshold.


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    #289
    Ha Long Bay
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭Ha Long Bay


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    Of course his objection will not stand up but this is NOT the point.

    The point is it gets dragged in to a time consuming sink hole no matter how ridiculous the objection is.

    If I write a stupid letter to An Bord Pleanala and pay the fee with ZERO basis for complaint it's the same thing.

    Reform is needed to stop serial objectors and to make them liable after a certain treshold.



    Its amazing how much damage a 2 page hand written letter and the €20 fee can do.



    From https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/kildare-farmer-appeals-e3-53-billion-development-to-an-bord-pleanala/

    "The appeals board confirmed today, Monday, June 17, that Kildare farmer Thomas Reid has lodged the only third party appeal concerning the new application by the US micro-chip giant for an extended and revised manufacturing fabrication facility, known as a “Fab”.

    Reid has long been ‘a thorn in the side’ of the US multinational in the planning arena and this is now the seventh Intel application he has brought before An Bord Pleanála since 2012.

    Intel has itself lodged a first party appeal against one condition attached to the planning permission granted by Kildare County Council last month.

    Decisions on the appeals are expected in October of this year.

    The 10 year permission to Intel will provide a windfall of €9.7 million in development contributions for Kildare County Council – if work on the project proceeds.
    The planning permission follows three years on after Intel secured planning permission for the first phase of the ‘fab’ facility, valued at $4 billion (€3.6 million).

    In total, the two planning permissions represent an $8 billion (€7 billion) investment which will employ 6,000 construction workers at its peak, and 1,600 full time jobs on completion.

    The projects represent the largest single private investment in the history of the State on one project if given the go-ahead by Intel globally."


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    #290
    tupenny
    Registered Users Posts: 1,439 ✭✭✭tupenny


    I applaud the man. Area has been manipulated enough


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    #291
    branie2
    Registered Users Posts: 10,295 ✭✭✭✭branie2


    People will try to stand in the way of progress


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    #292
    Topgear on Dave
    Registered Users Posts: 4,529 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    I may not agree with him but he seems to be perfectly within his rights to appeal.


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    #293
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,505 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    tupenny wrote: »
    I applaud the man. Area has been manipulated enough

    How has the area been manipulated?


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    #294
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    How is he a glorified welfare recipient because he has a view on a particular development?
    How Is hwbfu set by the taxpayer in such a way that affects you.
    How will anyone be out of a job because of him?
    In reality, the issue is you, an opinionated who waffles and blames anyone who holds a different view to themselves.

    If Intel don't build the new fab then LOTS of people will be out of a job. He'll still get his farmers dole. He'll still pay no property tax on his land worth a fortune. The rest of us have to earn our money and if we are fortunate to have a huge mortgage on a modest house, pay tax on it.

    But sure fcuk them. Of course he's entitled to object - but we should throw out these obviously ridiculous objections immediately. A big rubber stamp with REJECTED on it should do the job.


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    #295
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    john4321 wrote: »

    In total, the two planning permissions represent an $8 billion (€7 billion) investment which will employ 6,000 construction workers at its peak, and 1,600 full time jobs on completion.

    The projects represent the largest single private investment in the history of the State on one project if given the go-ahead by Intel globally."

    But sure no one will lose a job. FFS.


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    #296
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Just reading the Times of Israel this morning and they're discussing Israel's battle for Intel investment, with the article noting:
    When asked about investment in the plant, Intel CEO Bob Swan, who is on a visit to Israel, said on Sunday that the firm had made a decision to increase its production capacity in Israel, the US and Ireland to meet growing demand.... Intel submitted a business plan to Israel’s regulators in January, the text said, “and since then has not issued an update on the new projects.” The statement added that “every investment is carried out in stages, and there may always be changes, according to business, economic and other needs.”

    Calcalist said that Intel has decided to proceed first with its Ireland plant, and at a slower pace with the Israeli one.

    'Intel reportedly delaying massive new chip plant in Israel' (18 June 2019)

    The superrich are only going to get richer in this competition between sovereign states.


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    #297
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,323 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    Someone has to stand up for the rights of future generations to clean water and for the protection of the environment. Fair dues to him for having it addressed.

    As for what they forced that man to endure just to keep his home and way of life it was absolutely horrific and if it were any other country such as Korea or China, Amnesty would be out in force protesting about abuse of power and facist means. No such chance that they support a hardworking honest Irish man against their own friends in government.


    First They Came

    First they came for the Communists,
    - but I was not a communist so I did not speak out.
    Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists,
    - but I was neither, so I did not speak out.
    Then they came for the Jews,
    - but I was not a Jew so I did not speak out.
    And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me.

    This poem is ascribed to the German pastor Martin Niemoeller who was arrested and imprisoned in the death camp Dachau.


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    #298
    Topgear on Dave
    Registered Users Posts: 4,529 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    JustAThought wrote: »
    Someone has to stand up for the rights of future generations to clean water and for the protecrion of the environment. Fair dues to him for having it addressed.

    Have you seen the state of his farm?


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    #299
    amadangomor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭amadangomor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Just reading the Times of Israel this morning and they're discussing Israel's battle for Intel investment, with the article noting:



    'Intel reportedly delaying massive new chip plant in Israel' (18 June 2019)

    The superrich are only going to get richer in this competition between sovereign states.

    Cop on will you, I work there and I am far from superrich.


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    #300
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Was listening to something on the radio yesterday about how in other countries the good of the nation and people trumps the worry of a few individuals when it comes to things like this.

    Basically most countries just tell the people this is happening and you can do nothing about it.

    It’s for the greater good.

    These numpties are always complaining about something.

    Nimbyisn at its finest and also a huge factor in the housing situation.

    Is this some sort of communism you are advocating where the state should control everything and ignore the individual?


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    #301
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,991 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    Of course his objection will not stand up but this is NOT the point.

    The point is it gets dragged in to a time consuming sink hole no matter how ridiculous the objection is.

    If I write a stupid letter to An Bord Pleanala and pay the fee with ZERO basis for complaint it's the same thing.

    Reform is needed to stop serial objectors and to make them liable after a certain treshold.

    the only issue here is the length of time the process takes. that may be solved with more staff, iff the agency is short staffed.
    Deleted User wrote: »
    If Intel don't build the new fab then LOTS of people will be out of a job. He'll still get his farmers dole. He'll still pay no property tax on his land worth a fortune. The rest of us have to earn our money and if we are fortunate to have a huge mortgage on a modest house, pay tax on it.

    But sure fcuk them. Of course he's entitled to object - but we should throw out these obviously ridiculous objections immediately. A big rubber stamp with REJECTED on it should do the job.

    objections that are invalid are thrown out.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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