The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

FileNotFound wrote: »

The reality is that Dublin will most likely be there or there abouts year on year. And will win more than others due to the undeniable facts that they have so many to choose from and its hugely popular.

As a Mayo supporter I have loved journeys over the last few years and truly hated the ends.

I guess that them not winning one is a start and then go from there. There is no fix that won't take years.

But knockout football with more competition along the route is at least a start - Dublin get into the latter stages by default in leinster.

Football is in the doldrums at a time when dublin are ascendant. Think back a few years (pre dublin) and you had Cork, Kerry, Armagh, Donegal, Meath, Kildare, Mayo, Galway all with actual quality. I hate to say it but Kerry might be the only competition this year - and given what happened last year they are far from infallible.

Major investment in counties around the country and back to knockout and maybe even kill the provincial game is the only thing i can see. Open draw where dublin could have to beat 3 big teams on path to a final.

I'll be honest I am at a loss as to a fix, decided to enjoy the journey more instead. Lets face it mayo give fans heart attacks multiple times on a campaign, get your blood pumping and give us endless debate. How sad it must be never to feel any of this for your team?

I get what you say but objectively speaking, should a team that was in the top 2-3 teams for the entireity of the last decade be looking to gain their wins from philosophical approachs such as you have described? Like is that the future of football, be it mayo or kerry or anyone? Surely there is an issue there? If that is a reality then the setup of the game isnt delivering. At the end of the day, it isnt about dublin really, it is about the state of the game and how that bodes for the future. Truth be told, mayo wont build teams that good every few years. Ditto for donegal and tyrone. So in the future, when they have fallen back into the pack, what then? Dublin v kerry 90% or the time, with dublin winning in 90% of those meetings? An odd fruitless burst from someone else every so often? Im not sure there is much anyone can be philosophical about in that scenario

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

This is rearing its head again:
Twenty counties to debate 'Dublin GAA’s unfair funding advantage' https://the42.ie/5447574

Its hard to justify giving so much financial support to a county that can comfortably earn a surplus of €2.7m

Great to see some people who actually care about the gaa as a whole trying to help it.

You hear this spiel about the money all going into grass roots and not the intercounty team, but that is painfully short-sighted, and deliberately so in many cases from what I can see.
Surely the high levels of coaching that the likes of ocallaghan have recieved throughout his youth has improved him as a player? Isnt he now a better player than the ocallaghan we would have seen without coaching? Wasnt that the whole point of it? Ditto for bugler, kilkenny and pretty much any player under 30.
If it hasnt then it that means the whole investment in grassroots policy was a complete waste of money by dublin.

You cant have it every way.

gourcuff wrote: »

isn't it about time the home advantage issue is tackled?

i cant think of any tournament in the world where one team plays every game at home.

Its demonstrably unfair, regardless of the mental gymnastics some people go through to justify it.

I am sure Kerry would love an entire championship run played in Killarney every year.

Capacity arguments are nonsense, there is no sport where a bigger capacity gives one team home advantage in every game.

Leinster counties keep voting/moving games to CP though. Leinster have tried to play quarter at least outside of Dublin and when you get to the latter stages of the competition then how many games do you move and at what stage do you move games?

In Fairness this would be the year of all years to run a championship that utilises stadiums other than croker.

Especially with fan limitations. Many of the alternative grounds would surely be cheaper to open and run.



I don't expect the change any time (now or in the future) as I always understood the official line was Dublin GAA's home is not croker, but they essentially rent or book the stadium when free which is allowed.

Lost Ormond wrote: »

Dubs get crowds for most games above capacity of any other stadium so very hard to justify most games at latter stage of competition being moved but earlier games should be moved.
The problem is with Kildare, Meath stadiums not good enough/big enough

How exactly are you defining fairness anyway?

The ease of being local gives a basic advantage, the continuous use of Croker where other teams may see it only once in a blue mean gives a basic advantage.

Your argument about fan numbers is valid and at the moment Dublin have no competition in Leinster no matter where the games are played to be fair.

From a fans view, every other county has to come to Dublin on any big day - easy to see how that might be seen as unfair.

Lost Ormond wrote: »

Except countys keep voting to keep Dublin in CP. County coaches, players want to play in Croke Park.
It doesnt make sense to move Dublin for latter games in the competition

Financially you are right.

I guess in an amateur game do finances mean more than Fairness?

Personally I believe that an equal playing field in the GAA will be found after 10 yrs + investment around the country. The GAA had great success in growing tha game in Dublin, this however has coincided with the death of it elsewhere - that needs correcting more than anything else.

Lost Ormond wrote: »

The counties themselves keep voting to keep games in Croke Park. They see it as fair as its playing in the national stadium etc
You will never have an equal playing field regardless of investment

Fair is always relative.

Population will ensure a divide always exists, that doesn't excuse the lack of investment around the country.

When you compare the likes of Ballyboden/St Endas setup to any large town around the country the differences are somewhat shocking.

Maintaining buy in at club level across the nation is an issue. Can't say I have the fix, but helping to keep and get more people interested is a start.


When i say this I don't even mean Dublin and Kerry etc, Kildare now has a larger population than before but cannot field an even half decent team, we look at wicklow as a small county but as more people live there are the clubs seeing the same increase?


I always imagine that Knockout football with some actual competition in leinster might actually help solve the issue.


Galway hurling in connaught had more competition than Football in Leinster has right now...

FileNotFound wrote: »

Fair is always relative.

Population will ensure a divide always exists, that doesn't excuse the lack of investment around the country.

When you compare the likes of Ballyboden/St Endas setup to any large town around the country the differences are somewhat shocking.

Maintaining buy in at club level across the nation is an issue. Can't say I have the fix, but helping to keep and get more people interested is a start.

Lack of investment from where though.
Brady Ham invest heavily in Kildare...
Ballyboden St Endas are one of the largest clubs in the country are they really comparable to clubs in large towns across the country. And there is several other clubs comparable to Boden across dublin
How will buy in at club level be affected here?

When i say this I don't even mean Dublin and Kerry etc, Kildare now has a larger population than before but cannot field an even half decent team, we look at wicklow as a small county but as more people live there are the clubs seeing the same increase?

I always imagine that Knockout football with some actual competition in leinster might actually help solve the issue.

Wicklow are a small county though or at least always been a very weak gaelic county. Population increase doesnt always mean you will be stronger.

Galway hurling in connaught had more competition than Football in Leinster has right now...

well thats just nonsense and completely false.

ArielAtom wrote: »

You have quoted Boden as an example, would you like to list their setup? I’d be very interested in what they have.

The glib answer is they have huge numbers which means it’s run like a machine as they can afford proper administration. It’s a major factor in running such a big organisation. Their pitches are spread over several miles some council, some private. It takes a lot to organise numbers spread out and getting the money in from people who may not be in the clubhouse from one end of the year to the other.

[QUOTE=Boom__Boom;117448330

Also in terms of home advantage - since the championship began Kerry have only lost 10 championship matches in Kerry. The last year Kerry lost a championship match played in Kerry was 1995.[/QUOTE]


This is a bit like the fuss made about Kilkenny not having lost in championship at Nowlan Park in 60 years or so when Wexford beat them a few years ago. It was quickly followed up by a Galway win at the same venue. The reality was that they very rarely played a championship match there which was a real danger anyway. When they did under the round robin losses followed.

Back in the day there was a fuss made about Páirc Uí Chaoimh for the Cork hurlers as if they couldn't be beaten there. But it was because Cork were good and weren't easily beaten anywhere. They have since been beaten there several times in the Munster championship so it looks like it wasn't the venue which was the key ingredient.

On the other hand we heard little about Dublin footballers' home advantage in Croke Park until they started winning habitually. It only became an advantage then it appears.

Kerry have played a few qualifiers in Killarney but in reality the only regular championship game that might threaten them in Killarney is Cork. Cork have drawn 5 out of the 13 times they have played there since 1995 so Kerry have lived on the edge at times.

In fact Kerry have a better record against Cork in Croke Park (won 6, drew 1) in championship which makes you wonder about home advantage.

My point is not that Kerry have not lost in Killarney since 1995 but when you drill down it's not such an impressive record of performance that the drawing of conclusions about home advantage is automatic.

They really have not been tested regularly enough there by top class (potential All Ireland winning, at Kerry's own level) opposition and when Cork have been good (which has been less so in the last decade) they have done well in Killarney. It seems to me that Kerry have achieved little in Killarney they wouldn't have achieved at any other ground given their opposition.

FileNotFound wrote: »

I think you are misunderstanding me a bit.

I am not having a go at the Dublin club (clubs based on what you say) or the county it's actually the opposite. Ballyboden has a catchment population equivalent to most large towns so why are they so much bigger than other clubs? I think its because its a nice setup, multiple pitches, separate ladies and gents facilities, all weather setup, having the bar and gym.
Its a great facility which helps get kids in and keep them in, the more of this the better the county will be in years to come.

Oddly I’m not really sure the kids get much benefit of the actual facilities. Some of the underage girls teams use public pitches in a park near my house, the pitches aren’t great but not terrible, they are I’d say 2.5 miles from the clubhouse. They turn up in their gear and straight off afterwards. It seems to be mainly younger girls that use those pitches and I assume in bad weather they do get to use the Astro a bit but being so spread out must make it difficult to make everyone feel part of the club.

Dublin getting a big win over Galway today in the hurling and are now back in the final. Like their 2019 win over Galway it was at home. Last time in Parnell Park this time in croker. Home advantage helps but Dublin are a solid hurling team home or away. The funding is working.

ArielAtom wrote: »

Absolute garbage. Every Galway fan was rubbing their hands a getting Dublin in Croker.

I used to rub my hands as a meath man at the thought of playing Dublin in croker.. Doesn't mean Dublin didn't have the home town advantage that would have been the difference on a few occasions.

RoyalCelt wrote: »

I used to rub my hands as a meath man at the thought of playing Dublin in croker.. Doesn't mean Dublin didn't have the home town advantage that would have been the difference on a few occasions.

A long time ago in fairness.

RoyalCelt wrote: »

Dublin getting a big win over Galway today in the hurling and are now back in the final. Like their 2019 win over Galway it was at home. Last time in Parnell Park this time in croker. Home advantage helps but Dublin are a solid hurling team home or away. The funding is working.

The recent Leinster title Dublin won was their 5th Leinster U21/U20 in 14 years.
In the previous 43 years of the competition, Dublin had won 2 Leinster U21s.

In terms of where Dublin hurling was compared to where Dublin football was, I think the number of Leinster titles in both codes gives a good insight of how far behind the hurlers were compared to the footballers.

The last Leinster Senior Hurling title won was 2013.
Prior to that, Dublin last won a Leinster Senior Hurling title in 1961.
Over the same time period Dublin won 26 Leinster Senior Football titles.

There might be setbacks along the way but it's very hard not to see Dublin winning Liam down the road.