Dole claimants who refuse offers of work will have payments cut

caseyann · 24-04-2011 5:03pm #1

WELFARE CLAIMANTS WHO are unwilling to take up education or training for new jobs will have their dole payments cut under new measures revealed by the minister for social protection Joan Burton.

Burton will become the first minister to impose benefit cuts on those who refuse to take up offers of work as she vowed to get Ireland back to work and cut down on workers who are paid cash-in-hand but still claim welfare, reports the Irish Mail on Sunday.
The minister has told the paper that if people out of work were not engaging in the process of seeking employment, they would lose some of their benefits.

While it is an interesting and plausible welcome way to stop people from living on welfare and weed out the wasters.
I do fear though might cause some workers to be forced into jobs that will be poorly paid and end up in worse poverty.But they wont car because they are working.
Especially families.
They need to work on getting the childminding fees back down also car tax and food prices and petrol, public transport etc..
http://www.thejournal.ie/dole-claimants-who-refuse-offers-of-work-will-have-payments-cut-126003-Apr2011/

jpfahy · 24-04-2011 6:50pm

She's only doing it because the ECB is making her do it.
I'll bet she won't cut it by much (Sadly).

Turner · 24-04-2011 6:51pm

How the flying fcuk has this not always been the case??

maynooth_rules · 24-04-2011 7:54pm

Chief--- wrote: »

How the flying fcuk has this not always been the case??

This. I am tired of hearing this but nothing been done about it. There are plenty of examples in my town and towns all over the country of local drunks who have never worked a day in their life still getting the dole week in week out. Then if I were to lose my job tomorrow I get the exact same benefits as these toerags, if not less.
Rewarding single mothers needs to be an issue that is changed also

later12 · 24-04-2011 8:01pm

Excluding training, in certain circumstances, this is an entirely logical step. How it has not been the case already is beyond me.

I mention the possible exclusion of training because I've heard far too many instances of highly able university graduates beeing offered rudimentary Fas courses like ECDL or its equivalent, which reduces the whole thing to a bit of a joke, quite frankly.

Drumpot · 24-04-2011 8:16pm

the first people that should be shoved off welfare and into any kind of jobs is the people who were able to work, but unwilling during the boom (or full employment).

voter1983 · 25-04-2011 1:27am

It's about time this was done. There have been people in society who have been scrounging off the state for too long. How could people justify not having jobs at the height of the boom when we were actively seeking people to work at jobs in this country.

Dont get me wrong i feel genuinely sorry for people actively seeking work and throught no fault of their own cant find any but there are other people who have been taking the piss with years!

Shea O'Meara · 25-04-2011 2:07am

They should really try a case by case policy.
You can't put the same restrictions on somebody who worked their entire adult life, paying tax and find themselves on the dole with those who seem to make a career out of signing on.
Basically if you are qualified in a certain area or educated to a certain level you should be given a period for seeking employment at that level, if pretty new to the dole. That's regarding courses and state subsidised jobs. Long term people should take anything offered really.
This may sound harsh, but what about capping childrens allowance on the number of kids, You can have as many as you like but the state won't finance a football team?
We all must know or have known working couples holding off on kid/s until they can afford it.

Sparks43 · 25-04-2011 2:20am

Why not take time to find out what the unemployed scroats/drunks/junkies/wasters are actually able to offer or can be trained to do, rather then pushing people into a situation that would be no use to them or there employer

Sorry that would make too much sense in this ****hole of a Country we live in.:mad:

14% unemployment last time i checked!

Do we really have that many layabouts?

I am unemployed

I am not a drunk/scroat/junkie/waster

If i was asked to work a certain amount of hours per week in a productive scheme i would jump at it

This is where we should look at people on benefits

Get them back into a routine

Help them with skills

Protect them from shark employers

And most important give them confidence

Shag all of that around at the moment

mikemac · 25-04-2011 9:53am

Sparks43 wrote: »

This is where we should look at people on benefits

Get them back into a routine

Help them with skills

Protect them from shark employers

And most important give them confidence

Shag all of that around at the moment

All that is available in Ireland. I don't know much about FÁS but you can do some computer courses and other courses too. Fork lift driving would be a good one.
Obair have offices, not very many now but they do good work and would give confidence.

CERT does training for tourism industry. I did a course with them in Limerick and loved it. Great experienced people working for them and you get lots of skills, I got a few jobs out of it.

I think CERT got taken over by Tourism Ireland these days.

However, some people are just damn unemployable. On that CERT course were several long term unemployed who were ordered to get on a course, any course. Maybe they're in a rut but they sat around moaning about everything and the world was against them. I wouldn't give them a job, no employer would. This was 2002 btw, and unemployment wasn't so high back then

Clareboy · 25-04-2011 11:29am

Drumpot wrote: »

the first people that should be shoved off welfare and into any kind of jobs is the people who were able to work, but unwilling during the boom (or full employment).

Full Employment! What a Joke! There were over 160,000 Irish people who could not get a job in their own country during the so called boom!

Jonny7 · 25-04-2011 11:46am

Clareboy wrote: »

Full Employment! What a Joke! There were over 160,000 Irish people who could not get a job in their own country during the so called boom!

Theres always a portion who would prefer to be sitting on their ass getting the dole than out working.. oh sounds shocking I know. Some even university educated. Various people who did a lot of drugs in college, low self-esteem, social anxiety, etc, etc. Able to work, but the dole was easier.

Its a system very open for abuse.

Leave it there, but cut the ways it can be abused, e.g. the topic - cut payments of those not willing to work/take a course

"Full employment" is an economic term, it doesn't mean that every single person has a job. If you have social welfare, a certain portion of the population will rather
take that welfare than ever work, regardless of how many jobs are available - you could probably put that figure at 160,000

bradlente · 25-04-2011 12:01pm

As long as it dosn't include forcing ****ty courses that are of no interest upon the person involved its fair enough.

They're really backed into a corner now.The dole is relatively high whilst the lowest end type of job is not.Why would someone go out and do a full-time job that they don't like for maybe 50 euro more in the week?Unless its a job worth doing thats semi-enjoyable or helps people in distress of course people are going to reject doing it.
Does this mean if I'm offered a job cleaning toilets or having to take abuse from drunkards whilst serving them I have to take it?No offence to people that do those types of things,Fair dues in fact(I've done 1 of them),they're hard working jobs.But forcing people to work under certain conditions and circumstances that their not content with in jobs they will outright hate,Just because of their locality to said job,Is a fairly silly idea imo.

Having a bitter unhappy lower class workforce is perhaps as detrimental to society as a couple of dole sponges.But if its good for this cluster**** of an economy then what the hey,eh?

Sierra Oscar · 25-04-2011 1:32pm

This should always have been the case.

Unfortunately those who wish to continue to get their welfare payments and never consider working will quite easily get around this. All they have to do is attend their GP and tell them a cock and bull story and they will be put on a disability allowance. I even know of certain elected TD's who advise people how they can get around the system and even continue claim welfare whilst they are doing work behind the scenes.

The system needs reforming from top to bottom in order to ensure it is used in a legitimate manner.

COYW · 25-04-2011 1:48pm

Drumpot wrote: »

the first people that should be shoved off welfare and into any kind of jobs is the people who were able to work, but unwilling during the boom (or full employment).

Absolutely. I can think of a fair few off hand who fit perfectly into this bracket. Cutting the benefits of these people, along with the promise of a clamp down in dole cheats would be a great start to tackling the abuse of the welfare system.

COYW · 25-04-2011 1:52pm

Clareboy wrote: »

Full Employment! What a Joke! There were over 160,000 Irish people who could not get a job in their own country during the so called boom!

No, there were people who were unfit to work, which is perfectly acceptable but there were also people who preferred to stay on the dole and live off benefits. Cafe's, bar, restaurants, ... were begging people to come and work for them during the boom years. Many who stayed on the dole by choice considered themselves to be above those jobs.

later12 · 25-04-2011 2:12pm

Clareboy wrote: »

Full Employment! What a Joke! There were over 160,000 Irish people who could not get a job in their own country during the so called boom!

I think the lowest it went to was about 70,000 actually. Where did you get that figure?

Note; not all of the 70,000 I mentioned would have been claiming benefits, nor entitled to benefits.

Lockstep · 25-04-2011 9:33pm

link

Dole claimants who refuse offers of work will have payments cut

WELFARE CLAIMANTS WHO are unwilling to take up education or training for new jobs will have their dole payments cut under new measures revealed by the minister for social protection Joan Burton.

Burton will become the first minister to impose benefit cuts on those who refuse to take up offers of work as she vowed to get Ireland back to work and cut down on workers who are paid cash-in-hand but still claim welfare, reports the Irish Mail on Sunday.

The minister has told the paper that if people out of work were not engaging in the process of seeking employment, they would lose some of their benefits.

She added that whilst is not looking to leave people “destitute” she has made a commitment to the International Monetary Fund that she will cut the current unemployment rate of 14.7 per cent.

Doesn't seem to be anything too controversial here: refuse to work and get payments cut.

Thoughts on this?

25-04-2011 9:35pm

Is this going to be based on the current system of:
"are you looking for work"
"yes"
"okay then, off you go"

?

end a eknny · 25-04-2011 9:37pm

funny when there was work they didnt bother now when there is none they bring this forward

gavmcg92 · 25-04-2011 9:39pm

This is something that has to be done. I have had several interactions with peers that feel as if the dole is purely money for booze or a night out. It must also be recognized that the benefit system in this country is not structurally sound and needs a huge readjustment.
Coming back to this topic, I think it is fantastic that it is being implemented. However it needs to be done in such a way that people who physically can't work because of health problems are forced to take payment cuts because of this development.

Lockstep · 25-04-2011 9:40pm

bluewolf wrote: »

Is this going to be based on the current system of:
"are you looking for work"
"yes"
"okay then, off you go"

?

Presumably it'll operate like Clintoin's system: based on if a person is offered work and refuses without a valid reason, then their payments are cut.

end a eknny wrote: »

funny when there was work they didnt bother now when there is none they bring this forward

Probably as now it's more important than ever to entice people off the dole.

EarlERizer · 25-04-2011 9:46pm

This is going to turn into a drive to force people into minimum wage positions......a modern day form of slave labour!

Lockstep · 25-04-2011 9:49pm

EarlERizer wrote: »

This is going to turn into a drive to force people into minimum wage positions......a modern day form of slave labour!

How is this slave labour? If someone doesn't want to work, noone can force them. However, neither can they expect to receive the same social welfare payouts as someone who is genuinely seeking employment.

I'm a firm believer in the welfare state but I can't understand the notion that those who refuse to work should be entitled to the same payouts as others.

Brussels Sprout · 25-04-2011 9:54pm

Jonny7 wrote: »

Theres always a portion who would prefer to be sitting on their ass getting the dole than out working.. oh sounds shocking I know. Some even university educated. Various people who did a lot of drugs in college, low self-esteem, social anxiety, etc, etc. Able to work, but the dole was easier.

This makes me think that you've never seen a drug in your life (and possibly read the Daily Mail)

EarlERizer · 25-04-2011 10:00pm

Lockstep wrote: »

How is this slave labour? If someone doesn't want to work, noone can force them. However, neither can they expect to receive the same social welfare payouts as someone who is genuinely seeking employment.

I'm a firm believer in the welfare state but I can't understand the notion that those who refuse to work should be entitled to the same payouts as others.

Agreed,however expecting people to work for a wage that's not in line with the current cost of living, in my opinion,constitutes modern day slave labour.

PeterIanStaker · 25-04-2011 10:03pm

There's plenty of people who are qualified to work in certain areas, but are unable to find work in their areas in Ireland.

There must be incentives aimed at maintaining existing skill levels and not just giving people mickey mouse courses because it looks good on paper, otherwise people will continue to emigrate.

Lockstep · 25-04-2011 10:07pm

EarlERizer wrote: »

Agreed,however expecting people to work for a wage that's not in line with the current cost of living, in my opinion,constitutes modern day slave labour.

The minimum wage isn't slave labour, likewise, persons aren't forced to work for it. However, neither can they expect to receive €200 a week when they can't be bothered working.

jamesbrond · 25-04-2011 10:10pm

caseyann wrote: »

WELFARE CLAIMANTS WHO are unwilling to take up education or training for new jobs will have their dole payments cut under new measures revealed by the minister for social protection Joan Burton.

Burton will become the first minister to impose benefit cuts on those who refuse to take up offers of work as she vowed to get Ireland back to work and cut down on workers who are paid cash-in-hand but still claim welfare, reports the Irish Mail on Sunday.
The minister has told the paper that if people out of work were not engaging in the process of seeking employment, they would lose some of their benefits.

While it is an interesting and plausible welcome way to stop people from living on welfare and weed out the wasters.
I do fear though might cause some workers to be forced into jobs that will be poorly paid and end up in worse poverty.But they wont car because they are working.
Especially families.
They need to work on getting the childminding fees back down also car tax and food prices and petrol, public transport etc..
http://www.thejournal.ie/dole-claimants-who-refuse-offers-of-work-will-have-payments-cut-126003-Apr2011/

If you ask me, i think thats the sole intention of this.

EarlERizer · 25-04-2011 10:16pm

Lockstep wrote: »

The minimum wage isn't slave labour, likewise, persons aren't forced to work for it. However, neither can they expect to receive €200 a week when they can't be bothered working.

Sorry,where is it that i'm saying give people money for nothing? like i said,I AGREE with your point! ....... now here's the line your missing "In my opinion minimum wage is modern day slave labour" it's just my opinion based on the current cost of living vs minimum wage.

p.s. my opinion is based on experience.

end a eknny · 25-04-2011 10:21pm

at the minute there is a severe lack of jobs and its worse it is going to get. the goverment alone intends make tens of thousands unemployed. this leads to 2 points the first being the goverment will have no way to enforce this and secondly the govermant would give some organisation like fas about 20,000 to take somebody whos claiming 10,000 of the dole the usual economic disaster followed by irish goverments

tommy21 · 25-04-2011 10:26pm

I think they should work it out on a length basis. E.g. what percentage have been on the dole

30 years
25 years
20 years

etc.

And work downwards. If someone has been on it from 1 day up to 2 years, you can understand, but thereafter more stringent measures are required. Anyone who has been on it for years and years should be ashamed of themselves.

Savage93 · 25-04-2011 10:38pm

Clareboy wrote: »

Full Employment! What a Joke! There were over 160,000 Irish people who could not get a job in their own country during the so called boom!

I put it to you that the bulk of that figure were either (a) unemployable or (b) had no interest whatsoever in getting work, the system encourages people NOT to work or seek work!!:mad:

Lockstep · 25-04-2011 11:45pm

EarlERizer wrote: »

Sorry,where is it that i'm saying give people money for nothing? like i said,I AGREE with your point! ....... now here's the line your missing "In my opinion minimum wage is modern day slave labour" it's just my opinion based on the current cost of living vs minimum wage.

p.s. my opinion is based on experience.

Yes, I also have a lot of experience on the minimum wage. Granted i dont have a mortgage or kids but it was liveable as long as you budget. To compare this to slave labour is an awful lot of hyperbole.

Boskowski · 26-04-2011 12:08am

end a eknny wrote: »

funny when there was work they didnt bother now when there is none they bring this forward

Well I imagine it goes hand in hand with there being no money in the state coffers either while we all know what the last government was best at; throw our money at anything that may get complicated.

Also the np jobs argument goes out the window when they are actually offering one. I't doesn't say go and find yourself a job or else it says 'who refuses'.

jank · 26-04-2011 3:49am

Lockstep wrote: »

Yes, I also have a lot of experience on the minimum wage. Granted i dont have a mortgage or kids but it was very liveable as long as you budget. To compare this to slave labour is an awful lot of hyperbole.

Agree, getting "paid" for slave labour is just a none sense argument.

loldog · 26-04-2011 8:07am

Getting people mad at the unemployed is a great way to divert the taxpayer's attention away from how severely they are being shafted by the billionaire oligarchy.

This policy would make some sense in an economy with near to full employment, but makes no sense now. The same thing is going on in the UK, the Tories are attacking people on incapacity benefits, aided by the right wing and Murdoch press.

It's the shock doctrine in action - making use of a fake, synthetic recession to roll back the progress made in the 20th century until we're in a state of neofeudalism.

.

Mawbish · 26-04-2011 8:19am

As person who's been searching high and low for work for almost two years now I'm delighted with this move!

I finally got a job on the CE Scheme 19.5hours per week for E208.00 but nada towards travelling expenses at 35k each way I'd actually be better off on the dole! But the thing is....I like to work and I'm using the scheme as a way to source a full time job (fingers crossed)

I see plenty of layabouts in the town, who quite frankly have never worked a day in their lives and they sit in the pub or the bookies all day long. They get housing, disability, ESB, childrens allowance etc etc and they don't deserve it & it drives me up the flipping wall.

If they refuse reasonable offers of work or training they're allowances SHOULD be withheld not just cut

26-04-2011 8:37am

I have to agree it might be a problem if there are excessive travel expenses- would there be a childcare issue here or am I missing something?
That is to say, someone with young children at home would really have to be earning over a certain mark to afford childcare + everything else

tallus · 26-04-2011 8:44am

Sparks43 wrote: »

Why not take time to find out what the unemployed scroats/drunks/junkies/wasters are actually able to offer or can be trained to do, rather then pushing people into a situation that would be no use to them or there employer

Sorry that would make too much sense in this ****hole of a Country we live in.:mad:

14% unemployment last time i checked!

Do we really have that many layabouts?

I am unemployed

I am not a drunk/scroat/junkie/waster

If i was asked to work a certain amount of hours per week in a productive scheme i would jump at it

This is where we should look at people on benefits

Get them back into a routine

Help them with skills

Protect them from shark employers

And most important give them confidence

Shag all of that around at the moment

I think we have that at the moment, it's called Community Employment.
You work 20 hours per week in a community centre, and go on as many FAS training courses as you can while on the scheme. I was on it for almost two years after losing my job, and it enabled me to find full time work.

tallus · 26-04-2011 8:46am

Mawbish wrote: »

As person who's been searching high and low for work for almost two years now I'm delighted with this move!

I finally got a job on the CE Scheme 19.5hours per week for E208.00 but nada towards travelling expenses at 35k each way I'd actually be better off on the dole! But the thing is....I like to work and I'm using the scheme as a way to source a full time job (fingers crossed)

I see plenty of layabouts in the town, who quite frankly have never worked a day in their lives and they sit in the pub or the bookies all day long. They get housing, disability, ESB, childrens allowance etc etc and they don't deserve it & it drives me up the flipping wall.

If they refuse reasonable offers of work or training they're allowances SHOULD be withheld not just cut

Same here Mawbish, tho I came off the CE about three years back when I got a full time job.

NIMAN · 26-04-2011 8:46am

Although I live here I work in NI and I was just thinking the other day as I drove to work at 6am on a beautiful morning about how my 14hr days are helping keep some unemployed in the style they are accustomed to.

I know of quite a few folk personally in NI who are milking the system for all its worth. One such family have a mum in her 40s who hasn't worked in 20+yrs. She has nothing wrong with her, but she spends her day swanning around, shopping, watching TV, enjoying the sunshine!! etc. I don;t think she will ever work from what I have seen of her.

Her daughter of 20 has recently had a child with her long term boyfriend. They were trying for a couple of years. She claims to be single and was recently given a house for her and the child. But her relationship is stable. By the way, this boyfriend, in his mid 20s, has never officially worked (may have done the double?), and I would bet that he never will.

There is also a son involved, in his early 20s. Also never worked. And if he aspires to the rest of the family, never will. The problem is now that there is a culture developing of people who think they simply don't have to work, as they will get looked after.

For me, getting up at 5:45am in the morning to work shifts/weekends, knowing people who have this attitude is a real pain. Its because of folk like this that I pay so much tax (probably glad I don't work in RoI or I'd probably be paying more). I appreciate that there are many folk who need social welfare, but there are also many who are taking the p1ss. I can guarantee if all these folk were offered a job in the morning they wouldn't want it.

For me, someone working should never be worse off than someone on the dole, but unfortunately thats common now.

later12 · 26-04-2011 10:50am

NIMAN wrote: »

I appreciate that there are many folk who need social welfare, but there are also many who are taking the p1ss.

At the height of the boom in Ireland there was almost full employment, having gone to 22,000 long term unemployed at one stage during the boom. That figure is now about 154,000 for long term unemployed.

The overall unemployment figure according to the QNHS was about 70,000 during one stage of the boom, the lowest rate in Europe, compared with about 300,000 unemployed today, one of the highest rates in Europe.

This tells us that unless a sudden bout of laziness has come upon the state, the ability and the desire to work does exist, the problem is one of job availability.
There is of course the danger that long term welfare dependency could become ingrained, but I'm not quite convinced that this is the case just yet. Hopefully the upcoming jobs budget will prevent the benefits culture from materialising as seriously as it has materialised in the mainland UK, for example.

donutheadhomer · 26-04-2011 2:25pm

tommy21 wrote: »

I think they should work it out on a length basis. E.g. what percentage have been on the dole

30 years
25 years
20 years

etc.

And work downwards. If someone has been on it from 1 day up to 2 years, you can understand, but thereafter more stringent measures are required. Anyone who has been on it for years and years should be ashamed of themselves.

are there really people 20/25/30 years on the dole?

Also are prople who are long term disabled/unsuitable for work and single parents included in the live register figures? I'm guessing there would be nearly 1000000 people in receipt of welfare weekly

InigoMontoya · 26-04-2011 3:38pm

loldog wrote: »

Getting people mad at the unemployed is a great way to divert the taxpayer's attention away from how severely they are being shafted by the billionaire oligarchy.

This policy would make some sense in an economy with near to full employment, but makes no sense now. The same thing is going on in the UK, the Tories are attacking people on incapacity benefits, aided by the right wing and Murdoch press.

The policy, properly implemented, makes sense at any time.

Overheal · 26-04-2011 7:34pm

EarlERizer wrote: »

This is going to turn into a drive to force people into minimum wage positions......a modern day form of slave labour!

Just to beat this point with a stick again, that's ridiculous. If you actually research Slave Labor you will see that slaves did/don't get any wage, and are/were commonly abused for their trouble. Pickin' cotton fields, gettin' whipped, and being denied basic education. Probably getting molested a lot too. Among other things I'm probably not thinking of right off the top of my head. Nevermind the fact that you're actually someone's property. Choosing to be reliant on the State is a choice. You can always leave.

I fail to understand how the Minimum Wage is considered dirty, as well. If you think it needs to be higher, petition to have it raised. But it's not impossible to live on the minimum wage. It just seems that between all the allowances the Dole offers people are accustomed to living by the means which are provided by the State, not living by means which you can sustain Independently. When you think about it that way what's the 'slavery'; working and living on your own feet or being chronically attached to a government nipple?

poppylady · 26-04-2011 7:59pm

Its a great idea but there are two major problems:

its the civil servants who will be making the decisions who in my experience don't live in the real world

and two

the dole cheats won't be long about finding a way around the new rules so its the ordinary joe soap who will suffer

as was said before "if these people couldn't or wouldn't get a job in the boom time then why would they want one now"

STIG83 · 26-04-2011 8:04pm

I got a letter last week about this, i have to go in to FAS next week.

caseyann · 26-04-2011 10:14pm

Mawbish wrote: »

As person who's been searching high and low for work for almost two years now I'm delighted with this move!

I finally got a job on the CE Scheme 19.5hours per week for E208.00 but nada towards travelling expenses at 35k each way I'd actually be better off on the dole! But the thing is....I like to work and I'm using the scheme as a way to source a full time job (fingers crossed)

I see plenty of layabouts in the town, who quite frankly have never worked a day in their lives and they sit in the pub or the bookies all day long. They get housing, disability, ESB, childrens allowance etc etc and they don't deserve it & it drives me up the flipping wall.

If they refuse reasonable offers of work or training they're allowances SHOULD be withheld not just cut

First congratulations on your new job

Secondly rubbish they dont get ESB paid or any other bills paid for them so please stop loading the bullets in the guns.And they do not all sit in bookies or drink all day long.Again that is a minority.
Stop the stereo typing.;)

The girls i know with kids who want to work,as i said find it hard because backed into corner with child care.
People who may live out alone when backed into corner of low pay might drag them lower in to poverty circle.
In order for this to work.First health needs to be sorted out,then the rent section.Then something needs to be done about education and the prices of school books.
Just three of the many factors that are barrier from people being able to work properly with kids.And rent and health for single people living out alone.

http://www.cpa.ie/povertyinireland/oneparentfamilies.htm

Insufficient access to affordable childcare to allow them to avail of the education and training opportunities that would improve their chances of securing better-paid jobs
The financial cost of the transition from social welfare dependency into employment, particularly the loss of secondary benefits such as the medical card and rent supplement
Lack of family-friendly work arrangements

Lockstep · 26-04-2011 10:40pm

Lockstep wrote: »

Yes, I also have a lot of experience on the minimum wage. Granted i dont have a mortgage or kids but it was very liveable as long as you budget. To compare this to slave labour is an awful lot of hyperbole.

Should also point out that living on the minimum wage isn't something I'd view as extremely easy to live on, especially for those who would have mortgages, families and so on. However, it's not exactly slave labour levels either.

end a eknny · 26-04-2011 10:42pm

this is just lipservice from the goverment they will not be able to implement it nor will they try. a more realistic option would be to cut the welfare payments across the board including the pension so that it isnt viable for people to stay at home if they can get a job

Dole claimants who refuse offers of work will have payments cut

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