What's gone wrong with signalling in Heuston this morning?

BattlingCheese · 28-05-2019 1:33pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

I take it from this that Annual Pass holders will be entitled to feck all compensation as the price they actually paid for the delayed service would be very little.

About €6/7

Pissartist · 28-05-2019 1:39pm

Littlefinger wrote: »

You are wrong. I have requested refunds from Irish rail for various issues over the years I have been commuting be it strike days or snow days or delays and I have gotten money vouchers to turn into cash at the stations.

There will be no compensation for annual ticket holders for todays delay.
It's a fact. Prove me wrong if you disagree.

Marty Bird · 28-05-2019 1:47pm

Emme wrote: »

I bet that those responsible for the "signalling problem" :rolleyes: at Irish Rail this morning will get a light rap on the knuckles at most. Then they will go back to laughing at passengers.

On the other hand many of us late for work this morning will be reprimanded or even get an official warning. We will be told that late trains are no excuse for not getting to work on time

I really don’t think they are laughing at the customers that’s taken it a bit too far. You must have a horrible employer if they would even consider any type of warning to their employees when it was widely reported by the media the delay to thousands of people.

Jem72 · 28-05-2019 1:48pm

I used to have an annual pass and always got compensation for delays. It's something like 1/480th of the face value of the pass for a 2 hour delay based on the average 5 day commuter taking 240 return journeys a year. It's half that for a 1 hour delay. I've never had any arguments from Irish Rail about getting it but it always a voucher that you can redeem at the station.

It's actually kind of generous as you get the full value of the refund rather than just the tax free portion. That being said, if you have to travel by alternate means, it doesn't come close to covering it.

fxotoole · 28-05-2019 1:57pm

Pissartist wrote: »

There will be no compensation for annual ticket holders for todays delay.
It's a fact. Prove me wrong if you disagree.

It’s not a fact. It’s misinformation that you’re spreading.

I’ve personally been refunded based on trains not showing up when there’s been floods/snow that have impacted services on the Sligo line.

Pete_Cavan · 28-05-2019 2:45pm

Xterminator wrote: »

Do you think they should pay for everyone's taxi fare and throw in a cinema ticket?

A refund pro rata and a genuine apology. That's reasonable.

I was pointing out that the people complaining about their Annual Pass costing them a fortune and wanting compensation will only be entitled to a few euro. Nice hysterical overreaction though.

end of the road · 28-05-2019 2:58pm

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Typical

Is that a Barry Kenny special I wonder

Barry will be out chewing on sausages or something gimmicky like that for a photo op once the fuss dies down.

in fairness it's not possible to get the required amount of busses together at such short notice, especially on a week day. there aren't busses just sitting around waiting to jump in when irish rail has a signal or other failure. they can do it for works as works are planned well in advance.
irish rail does generally have an issue with communication however sometimes they just do not know what is causing the issue until they investigate, and they may not know exactly when it will be fixed again until they investigate. they should tell what they do know, if anything, as soon as possible though.

Alf Veedersane · 28-05-2019 3:04pm

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Irish rail don’t do real time updates

They barely do updates at all

Their Twitter account is pretty good at real-time updates.

ffocused · 28-05-2019 3:10pm

The signal fault announcement was on the home page of irish rail website in a big orange box at the top of the page when i checked it at 6.30 this morning. The people saying they only found out on twitter obviously never checked it.

The guy in ticket office told me a software update crashed the signalling system this morning.

BattlingCheese · 28-05-2019 3:31pm

ffocused wrote: »

The signal fault announcement was on the home page of irish rail website in a big orange box at the top of the page when i checked it at 6.30 this morning. The people saying they only found out on twitter obviously never checked it.

To be fair, for daily commuters there is no obvious reason to check the website. Nearly all will use the official App to check for delays. Both the app and the "live" station pages were showing no problems, with all trains running on time.

https://twitter.com/dpowert2/status/1133285998106939394

ffocused · 28-05-2019 3:34pm

BattlingCheese wrote: »

To be fair, for daily commuters there is no obvious reason to check the website. Nearly all will use the official App to check for delays. Both the app and the "live" station pages were showing no problems, with all trains running on time.

I am a daily commuter

BattlingCheese · 28-05-2019 3:35pm

for the majority of daily commuters

ffocused · 28-05-2019 3:42pm

BattlingCheese wrote: »

for the majority of daily commuters

I only checked it because there were a few people at the station on phones hastily trying to arrange lifts from station which prompted me to check the website.

Alf Veedersane · 28-05-2019 3:47pm

BattlingCheese wrote: »

To be fair, for daily commuters there is no obvious reason to check the website. Nearly all will use the official App to check for delays. Both the app and the "live" station pages were showing no problems, with all trains running on time.

I never used the app or the website. Rightly or wrongly, I always used their Twitter account, if there was an issue, and found updates to be relatively timely. I kinda assumed most were the same as it's faster to give an update via Twitter.

k99_64 · 28-05-2019 4:39pm

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

Then jump on with beechwood and get on the compo bus .... they forced you to get alternative transport due to their malfunction, they never offered alternative transport.

.....k

Pete_Cavan · 28-05-2019 5:05pm

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I never used the app or the website. Rightly or wrongly, I always used their Twitter account, if there was an issue, and found updates to be relatively timely. I kinda assumed most were the same as it's faster to give an update via Twitter.

Regardless of the number of people who use Twitter, people shouldn't be expected to use it in order to get information (not saying that you are suggesting that they should, just making a general point). The IE app should provide notifications and be the most reliable source of information. Why it doesn't and isn't is beyond me.

Odyssey 2005 · 28-05-2019 5:22pm

Why it doesn't and isn't is beyond me.[/quote]

Maybe the app is maintained by the same ppl who update the signals.;)

Alf Veedersane · 28-05-2019 6:07pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

Regardless of the number of people who use Twitter, people shouldn't be expected to use it in order to get information (not saying that you are suggesting that they should, just making a general point). The IE app should provide notifications and be the most reliable source of information. Why it doesn't and isn't is beyond me.

It's likely quicker to provide updates on Twitter.

The app should provide notifications but it will be slower to update the app. It's built as a fairly static app. I take your point but if people have the app, they have access to Twitter so it shouldn't be an issue which online platform they use for updates once it's updated by IR.

Odyssey 2005 · 28-05-2019 6:58pm

Kenny wheeled out to talk about electric/battery train upgrades in IR.

. Was on with Mary Wilson. . He was missing from his post when it counted. Maybe get the infrastructure that's in place working first.

devnull · 28-05-2019 8:13pm

BattlingCheese wrote: »

To be fair, for daily commuters there is no obvious reason to check the website. Nearly all will use the official App to check for delays. Both the app and the "live" station pages were showing no problems, with all trains running on time.

https://twitter.com/dpowert2/status/1133285998106939394

That often happens during disruption, if there is no real time information it can get hold of it just refers to timetable information and it shows you the train progressing throughout it's journey even though there is no actual train running.

I've complained about this before on a number of occasions and I have got nowhere. Once I was told I missed a train 5 minutes previous citing their live information despite the fact I'd saw no train in the 15 minutes I was waiting.

Twitter is the only real way of getting information, but it should not be a substitute for keeping their app up to date and providing announcements at stations, which they rarely ever do. Staff will watch people go past them to the platform when no trains running and not say a word, you'll wait 20 minutes, walk back through the barriers when you realise no train is coming despite the real time counting it down, and ask the guy in the ticket office why he didn't make an announcement to be told it's not his job.

Pete_Cavan · 28-05-2019 8:26pm

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

It's likely quicker to provide updates on Twitter.

The app should provide notifications but it will be slower to update the app. It's built as a fairly static app. I take your point but if people have the app, they have access to Twitter so it shouldn't be an issue which online platform they use for updates once it's updated by IR.

You shouldn't be required to have a Twitter account to get up to date info on train services. Provide the information there by all means but that information should be readily available outside private company social media platforms. They should just update their app to provide notifications, it isn't difficult.

Jamie2k9 · 28-05-2019 8:29pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

You shouldn't be required to have a Twitter account to get up to date info on train services. Provide the information there by all means but that information should be readily available outside private company social media platforms. They should just update their app to provide notifications, it isn't difficult.

So you shouldn't have to have twitter but you should have an app?

The info this morning was on website, social media and general media. You do not even need a twitter account to view info.

Pete_Cavan · 28-05-2019 8:52pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

So you shouldn't have to have twitter but you should have an app?

The info this morning was on website, social media and general media. You do not even need a twitter account to view info.

A majority of regular rail users would have the app anyway. Nobody is sitting there constantly refresh the website home page. A notification from the app would provide the information directly to a significant number of their customers instantly. Why would you not do it?

Jamie2k9 · 28-05-2019 8:55pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

A majority of regular rail users would have the app anyway. Nobody is sitting there constantly refresh the website home page. A notification from the app would provide the information directly to a significant number of their customers instantly. Why would you not do it?

Just like the majority have a twitter or FB account?

I prefer the website than there app but twitter is usually my first point of call. Its a fast and effective way of getting info out.

The point I am making is you cannot please everybody. The app was updated this morning, not immediately.

Alf Veedersane · 28-05-2019 9:13pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

You shouldn't be required to have a Twitter account to get up to date info on train services. Provide the information there by all means but that information should be readily available outside private company social media platforms. They should just update their app to provide notifications, it isn't difficult.

Updating an app isn't straightforward if the app isn't built for service updates like that. An IT head could probably shed some light on that but have had some experience with an app where I had to get the developer to make text updates and it was a pain in the hole and slow.

Not sure why it's such a big issue to check theor official Twitter account. Both it and the app would be on the same device. Maybe they could develop an app that could mean the Twitter account wouldn't be any better but there will always be people who will give out about a lack of updates on Twitter.

Addle · 28-05-2019 9:15pm

When I book a seat online, I have to provide my phone number.
Is it difficult to text customers?

devnull · 28-05-2019 9:17pm

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Updating an app isn't straightforward if the app isn't built for service updates like that. An IT head could probably shed some light on that but have had some experience with an app where I had to get the developer to make text updates and it was a pain in the hole and slow.

JourneyCheck has done that in the UK both via an App and via SMS for the last decade for pretty much every single train operator. Irish Rail would never implement a system like that though because the levels of transparency such a system has would show them up big time.

Twitter shouldn't be a replacement for proper on train and on platform information, it should be in addition to those but in Irish Rail communication has always been poor and they clearly have always believed that they should not inform passengers and instead the passengers should inform themselves.

Blanco100 · 28-05-2019 9:18pm

is the service up and running again?

Alf Veedersane · 28-05-2019 9:24pm

devnull wrote: »

JourneyCheck has done that in the UK both via an App and via SMS for the last decade for pretty much every single train operator. Irish Rail would never implement a system like that though because the levels of transparency such a system has would show them up big time.

Twitter shouldn't be a replacement for proper on train and on platform information, it should be in addition to those but in Irish Rail communication has always been poor and they clearly have always believed that they should not inform passengers and instead the passengers should inform themselves.

Fair enough. I've just never been bothered by the lack of info on the app because it was available elsewhere. I'm not saying they shouldn't have to. Just that there were text updates available from IR sources.

That's not in any way defending IR's generally poor effort at comms

devnull · 28-05-2019 9:31pm

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Fair enough. I've just never been bothered by the lack of info on the app because it was available elsewhere. I'm not saying they shouldn't have to. Just that there were text updates available from IR sources.

Even the twitter service is not perfect though when it comes to information. It works fairly well during the time the twitter service is staffed, but for trains around 6.30am to 7.30am literally it can be impossible to get any information if there is a problem which occurred overnight or that morning

I've been waiting for the first DART from Portmarnock and seen the time count down on the displays and no trains appear, No information is provided and you can stand there for 20-30 minutes with nothing coming or going, no information on twitter, nothing on the app and the app showing trains are moving based on timetable information. Station staff say it's not their job to give information so you can be stuck till twitter is staffed.

Really Twitter needs to be staffed for the full duration that the train service is running. Most of the operators in the UK operate it 24 hours a day, we don't need to go to that extreme but certainly whilst trains are running if they are going to say Twitter is the way to get information quickly, they need to give it round the clock when services operate.

Pete_Cavan · 28-05-2019 9:36pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Just like the majority have a twitter or FB account?

I prefer the website than there app but twitter is usually my first point of call. Its a fast and effective way of getting info out.

The point I am making is you cannot please everybody. The app was updated this morning, not immediately.

It's not about pleasing everyone. The point of the IR app is to provide their customers with information on their services. Why should IR customers have to sign up for a Twitter account to get notifications? Many customers will have a Twitter account but that is beside the point.

If you can improve your customer service by directly targeting your customers with information about disruption on your services, using a platform you created to provide information to your customers, why would you not do it? It's pretty basic stuff tbh.

Grandeeod · 28-05-2019 10:11pm

Leaving all the tech stuff aside, IE do have the ability to make announcements at stations from a central location/on site no?

I use the service twice a week and my last drama was a suicide. No information unless you asked station staff. I didn't expect them to announce it, but there was nothing but hushed whispers if you asked. A basic communication strategy would be helpful. In February last there was a signal failure between Portlaoise and Portarlington. Local services were cancelled/delayed. The Dublin bound Cork service stood at Portlaoise platform 2 for 20 mins while we were told it was not in service for those wanting the local train. Station staff then announced that the Cork train would serve Portarlington, Monasterevan and Kildare. Doors open and on we get. It crawls to Portarlington due the signal failure, but on board announcements (from a human being) said it was running direct to Dublin Heuston. More confusion and panic. But obviously the plan prevailed and it served all stations to Kildare. However, it came across very poorly in terms of communication/information.

Yes, stuff happens, but when it does IE are absolutely shabby when it comes to informing customers on their platforms. These days there is no excuse for that.

L1011 · 29-05-2019 9:01am

CTC can make announcements to any controlled station. They can also see the platform CCTV including all the equipped NIR stations to Belfast but not sure if they're allowed make platform announcements there!

29-05-2019 12:57pm

Pissartist wrote: »

There will be no compensation for annual ticket holders for todays delay.
It's a fact. Prove me wrong if you disagree.

I intend to

wench · 29-05-2019 1:08pm

I had an online booking for yesterday, and just got the following email from Irish Rail.
All sorted without me even needing to contact them or fill in any forms, which I appreciate.

Iarnród Éireann Irish Rail would like to apologise for the delay of your service on Tuesday 28th May due to a major signalling fault.

As you have been effected by this incident we will automatically refund you.

This refund process will begin today, however please allow 3 to 5 working days for your financial institution to process your refund.

Iarnród Éireann apologies for any inconvenience caused.

esposito · 29-05-2019 1:16pm

wench wrote: »

I had an online booking for yesterday, and just got the following email from Irish Rail.
All sorted without me even needing to contact them or fill in any forms, which I appreciate.

Bring back the mechanical semaphore signalling. Then we wouldn’t have had yesterday’s farce!!!!!

BattlingCheese · 29-05-2019 1:20pm

wench wrote: »

I had an online booking for yesterday, and just got the following email from Irish Rail.
All sorted without me even needing to contact them or fill in any forms, which I appreciate.

Just keep an eye on your bank account. From past experience, it takes quite a bit longer than that and usually requires me to give them a little reminder also.
They will begrudgingly pay it back eventually though.

29-05-2019 2:45pm

Pissartist wrote: »

There will be no compensation for annual ticket holders for todays delay.
It's a fact. Prove me wrong if you disagree.

Iarnrireann Irish Rail would like to apologise for the delay of your service on Tuesday 28th May due to a major signalling fault.

As you have been effected by this incident we will automatically refund you.

This refund process will begin today, however please allow 3 to 5 working days for your financial institution to process your refund.

Iarnrireann apologies for any inconvenience caused.

Where's that Christian Bale gif gone.......

A Dub in Glasgo · 29-05-2019 8:41pm

Without knowing the specifics of the signalling at Heuston, any outage that takes the signalling down in a wide area like that is either power related, interlocking related or the communications to the control system relatred (at Connolly?)

Hilly Bill · 31-05-2019 12:49am

Emme wrote: »

I bet that those responsible for the "signalling problem" :rolleyes: at Irish Rail this morning will get a light rap on the knuckles at most. Then they will go back to laughing at passengers.

On the other hand many of us late for work this morning will be reprimanded or even get an official warning. We will be told that late trains are no excuse for not getting to work on time

Blame God, and his mischievous ways with lightning.

Hilly Bill · 31-05-2019 12:54am

Addle wrote: »

When I book a seat online, I have to provide my phone number.
Is it difficult to text customers?

Yes,

Del.Monte · 31-05-2019 8:12am

esposito wrote: »

Bring back the mechanical semaphore signalling. Then we wouldn’t have had yesterday’s farce!!!!!

Or perhaps "time interval working" could be reintroduced, sure what could go wrong?

Armagh 1889.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armagh_rail_disaster

goingnowhere · 31-05-2019 9:10am

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Yes,

Really simple, lots of companies manage this and Irish Rail had previously set something like this about 10 years ago

wench · 31-05-2019 7:04pm

BattlingCheese wrote: »

Just keep an eye on your bank account. From past experience, it takes quite a bit longer than that and usually requires me to give them a little reminder also.
They will begrudgingly pay it back eventually though.

Refund arrived today, not bad going!

Heffoman · 13-06-2019 3:43pm

Out of interest did anyone get a refund for their annual travel pass with this incident.

What's gone wrong with signalling in Heuston this morning?

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