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Fine Gael TD sues Dublin Hotel after falling off swing

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Comments

  • #502
    Yurt2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    jmayo wrote: »



    Kenny was underrated.
    Yes he was shyte in media and I do hold him to account for not moving sooner on Callinan - whole Garda thing, Irish water setup debacle and ethnic status for another bunch of chancers, but he wasn't all about the spin like the current gobshyte.

    Kenny was totally on the ropes when most of the cabinet and front bench moved against him.
    The same ones that are now at the top of the party.
    And he handed them their ar**es.
    That says something about the calibre of people we are talking about.

    Leo made pronouncements about looking after the early risers, the ordinary workers and what has he gone and done since.
    He is more interested in photo ops, playing at being a mini me of that Canadian spanner than actually doing anything meaningful.
    Every time there is major wastage of money, huge cost overruns, he just glosses if off and boldy states that they will find the money no problem.

    Yeah sure he comes across a lot better on TV, but it is image over substance.



    Kenny will never be rated as an all-time-great Taoiseach, but apparently, he was an extremely tough customer. From what I've heard from people who have worked in proximity to him throughout the years, if you crossed him - be it 20 minutes or 20 years ago - he'd never forget it. He'd keep you close if you were useful, but your card was marked from then on. I guess you pick up a few tricks being in Leinster House for 40+ years.

    Not his biggest fan, and I don't think he had any grand ideas to address some fundamental problems we have in the country, but he obviously knew how to marshall a cabinet.


  • #503
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    The electoral quota was taught in CSPE when I was in school, I hope it's still taught today.

    I think most schools do mock elections, where they learn how to calculate the quota, and how to apply it to a count.

    Wow, I'm fairly certain we never went into that kind of detail - we learned it on the more vague "you rank the candidates in the order of who you like the most to the least", but the actual mathematics of what comes afterwards wasn't really gone into as far as I can remember. Of course, it may simply have been that I was dossing at the time. :D As a political junkie since the age of 7 or 8, I'm pretty sure I would remember this as I'd have feckin' loved doing a mock election in school! I did miss a large swathe of both 4th and 5th year due to medical issues, so maybe we did it in one of those years.

    Among people I know, and many of these would be extremely well educated folks with a huge interest in current affairs and politics, people seem to understand the American Electoral College system more thoroughly than they understand our own PR-STV system. This has led to repeated media debates in recent years as to whether we should simplify it, which in my view would be a real shame - it's a beautiful system of electing candidates, it just needs a bit of extra instruction in order to understand it.


  • #504
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    .

    Among people I know, and many of these would be extremely well educated folks with a huge interest in current affairs and politics, people seem to understand the American Electoral College system more thoroughly than they understand our own PR-STV system. This has led to repeated media debates in recent years as to whether we should simplify it, which in my view would be a real shame - it's a beautiful system of electing candidates, it just needs a bit of extra instruction in order to understand it.
    I think I only remember it because I fancied the civics teacher. But it is indeed a beautiful system. I knew the Brits were losing their marbles when they rejected preferential voting in 2011.

    Even if some people don't know how the quota is calculated, the main thing, as you say, is to enter all preferences right until the end.

    And vote!


  • #505
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    I
    And vote!

    Correctly!

    And no self indulgent cutting off your nose to spite you face protest voting. That just delivers the dregs to power.


  • #506
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Correctly!

    And no self indulgent cutting off your nose to spite you face protest voting. That just delivers the dregs to power.

    So, Workers' Party?

    Got it.


  • #507
    Yurt2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Correctly!

    And no self indulgent cutting off your nose to spite you face protest voting. That just delivers the dregs to power.


    There's an argument to be made we're dealing with the dregs as it stands. I rate two members of the cabinet as capable at handling their brief - the rest are no-hopers and chancers, led around by the nose by senior civil servants and their media advisors, reading from speeches written by others put under their nose. There's also very little talent in the FG parliamentary party waiting in the wings. We'd be getting an extremely poor return from our political system voting as you suggest.


  • #508
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    Yurt! wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, is it actually legal to vote in two different wards in local elections?

    If you pick up two referendum ballots and use them, you'd almost certainly be voting unlawfully.

    I don’t know why I get two voting cards. One is in Dublin and the other is down the sticks. I suppose I’ve just gotten used to voting twice at this stage. Pay enough fricking tax anyway to deserve a 2nd.


  • #509
    padd b1975
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,784 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

    Even if some people don't know how the quota is calculated, the main thing, as you say, is to enter all preferences right until the end.

    I don't agree with this at all.

    If you don't like the candidate, don't give them any preference whatsoever.
    Because if they manage to avoid elimination, that #7 or #8 becomes the same value as a #1.


  • #510
    Yurt2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    I don’t know why I get two voting cards. One is in Dublin and the other is down the sticks. I suppose I’ve just gotten used to voting twice at this stage. Pay enough fricking tax anyway to deserve a 2nd.


    No you don't. One man one vote. That's democracy.


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  • #511
    kenmc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,277 ✭✭✭kenmc


    So the next question is when will we know the results. Eu can't be announced til Sunday I think I read, so all other countries can get theirs done too. Referendum first I guess, as it's a binary choice so easiest to do? Then we see how much damage the tennements2.0 policy and the swing state has done to fine gale. Plenty, hopefully.


  • #512
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    kenmc wrote: »
    So the next question is when will we know the results. Eu can't be announced til Sunday I think I read, so all other countries can get theirs done too. Referendum first I guess, as it's a binary choice so easiest to do? Then we see how much damage the tennements2.0 policy and the swing state has done to fine gale. Plenty, hopefully.

    But they already have poor representation at council level, SF have the most seats since 2014.

    So another poor show doesn’t really prove anything.

    A general election is the best indication.


  • #513
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    FG was hoping to increase their CC representative count by 20/30. Wonder will Bailey have an affect. She may have swung several voters away with her antics.


  • #514
    vicwatson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,404 ✭✭✭✭vicwatson


    Yurt! wrote: »
    No you don't. One man one vote. That's democracy.


    Will someone please think of the wimmin


  • #515
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    FG was hoping to increase their CC representative count by 20/30. Wonder will Bailey have an affect. She may have swung several voters away with her antics.

    Of course she did.

    That’s pretty obvious.


  • #516
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    I don't agree with this at all.

    If you don't like the candidate, don't give them any preference whatsoever.
    Because if they manage to avoid elimination, that #7 or #8 becomes the same value as a #1.
    Then don't give them a no. 7 or a no. 8. Give that preference to a less-awful candidate instead.

    At that stage, someone is going to get elected anyway; you might as well have a say in it.

    Obviously, there's no need to state a preference for your least-preferred candidate. There's always one FGer I can't bear to leave a mark beside.


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  • #517
    Scoundrel
    Registered Users Posts: 1,435 ✭✭✭Scoundrel


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    I don’t know why I get two voting cards. One is in Dublin and the other is down the sticks. I suppose I’ve just gotten used to voting twice at this stage. Pay enough fricking tax anyway to deserve a 2nd.

    It's very common in Ireland it will only change when its cross checked with PPSN which I believe is coming down the track.


  • #518
    abbir
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 770 ✭✭✭abbir


    Ten Pin wrote: »

    AIUI the quota is the (total valid poll divided by number of seats) +1

    For a constituency of 5 seats with a poll of 100,000 the quota is 20,001

    That's slightly wrong. The quota is (total valid divided by one plus the number of seats)+1. In your example of constituency of 5 seats with a valid poll of 100000 the quota is 16,667


  • #519
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    Scoundrel wrote: »
    It's very common in Ireland it will only change when its cross checked with PPSN which I believe is coming down the track.

    I use the rural one as an excuse to head down to visit the mother and to drink a gallon of pints after heading to the polling station. I suppose the one in Dublin is used to counteract the vote of some malcontent who votes for SF or one of the loony left. And then the rural one is where I vote for parties and politicians who can actually run the country.


  • #520
    jmreire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,580 ✭✭✭jmreire


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    I don't agree with this at all.

    If you don't like the candidate, don't give them any preference whatsoever.
    Because if they manage to avoid elimination, that #7 or #8 becomes the same value as a #1.

    After Alan Kelly got elected on the 7th count. :mad: ??? No thanks !!! If I like a candidate, I will vote for him / her, otherwise, no.


  • #521
    Yurt2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    I use the rural one as an excuse to head down to visit the mother and to drink a gallon of pints after heading to the polling station. I suppose the one in Dublin is used to counteract the vote of some malcontent who votes for SF or one of the loony left. And then the rural one is where I vote for parties and politicians who can actually run the country.

    That's subverting a basic principle of modern democracy. You think it's cute when you do it, but I don't think you'd take the same tack if your 'looney left' class enemies did it en-masse.

    This is fairly black and white, you believe in one man one vote or you're anti-democratic.


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  • #522
    nuac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,769 ✭✭✭nuac


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    I don’t know why I get two voting cards. One is in Dublin and the other is down the sticks. I suppose I’ve just gotten used to voting twice at this stage. Pay enough fricking tax anyway to deserve a 2nd.

    M0D
    Are you suggesting duplication of polling cards allows you to vote twice? Not so. that would be a criminal offence.


  • #523
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Wheeliebin30 wrote:
    That’s pretty obvious.


    I'd be fuming if I were an FG candidate.


  • #524
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Closing on the day of the election but open all the way up until.


  • #525
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I'd be fuming if I were an FG candidate.

    Im sure they are.


  • #526
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Wheeliebin30 wrote:
    Closing on the day of the election but open all the way up until.


    Why should the thread be closed?


  • #527
    dusty bin
    Registered Users Posts: 149 ✭✭dusty bin


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    I don’t know why I get two voting cards. One is in Dublin and the other is down the sticks. I suppose I’ve just gotten used to voting twice at this stage. Pay enough fricking tax anyway to deserve a 2nd.

    Hope your trolling. Everybody has one vote and one vote only. Voting in multiple wards during the same election is illegal. If your not trolling, then you are clearly admitting to breaking the law and appear happy to do so.


  • #528
    i71jskz5xu42pb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,806 ✭✭✭i71jskz5xu42pb


    jmreire wrote: »
    After Alan Kelly got elected on the 7th count. :mad: ??? No thanks !!! If I like a candidate, I will vote for him / her, otherwise, no.

    What you're saying here is that, if your vote happens to be transferred past the the candidates you've selected, you are happy for your vote to be ignored and for other people to decide for you. That's your choice I guess.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/why-it-pays-to-vote-all-the-way-down-the-ballot-paper-1.2548241
    Individually, it is true, failing to vote right down through the list has only a marginal effect. But if this sin of omission is repeated on a widespread basis by fellow voters it can actually assist a candidate who you would prefer to see defeated by lowering the effective quota, and making it easier for him/her to reach it. As an election proceeds and the number of non-transferable votes accumulates, the number required to be elected – the effective quota – falls.


  • #529
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Why should the thread be closed?

    Sorry thought a mod was closing it in previous page.


  • #530
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Sorry thought a mod was closing it in previous page.

    In fairness, interesting and lively threads being closed for absolutely no reason would be far from the strangest thing to happen around here :D


  • #531
    golfball37
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,718 ✭✭✭golfball37


    She returned a cheque for 600e the hotel gave her for medical expenses. Some neck.


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  • #532
    Hoboo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,591 ✭✭✭Hoboo


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    Common misconception - if you do this, then every candidate after your top 3 or 4 (assuming all of your top choices don't get in, which requires a lot of luck but does happen) has a reduced quota to get elected on whichever count your vote runs out of numbers on. So if there are one or two people you truly despise, it really is better to vote all the way down and give them the last numbers. If you despise everyone equally after a certain point, you're absolutely right. But in this particular case, I want to see John Bailey getting his f*cking ass kicked, and if someone from FG is going to get in, I'd rather it be either of the other two candidates.

    The quota is calculated based on the total number of valid ballots on each count. If you're on the sixth count and you only put down six numbers, then assuming none of your six are still in contention (either already elected or already eliminated), your vote stops being counted as a "valid ballot" once you get to the seventh count.

    Not a huge issue on an individual basis, but definitely a huge issue if enough people do it, which unfortunately seems to be the case. I've always thought that the quota system we use should be taught as part of CSPE or something, I only know about it because my dad used to cover the elections for RTE back in the '90s and thus he's something of a political encyclopedia for this kind of stuff :D



    I despise all of them from 1-4 never mind the rest! But seriously, after 4 I really don't have a preference, all as bad as each other, so wouldn't give any of them the extra help in round 5 onwards, especially as I know little to nothing about the most recent teacher, retired Garda or local activist to join the list.


  • #533
    gmisk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,318 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    You think with all the crap on his wikipedia John Bailey wouldnt have any chance?
    But he clearly has.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Bailey_(Irish_politician)


  • #534
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    golfball37 wrote:
    She returned a cheque for 600e the hotel gave her for medical expenses. Some neck.

    Obviously not enough.


  • #535
    ILoveYourVibes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,202 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    gmisk wrote: »
    You think with all the crap on his wikipedia John Bailey wouldnt have any chance?
    But he clearly has.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Bailey_(Irish_politician)

    :pac:


  • #536
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,854 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Varadkar is some joke. The welfare warriors received more than workers earning up to 55,000 a year! The housing crisis is a scandal. This is coming from an ex fg voter. He makes my skin crawl. He has to be removed from power come the next election!!!


  • #537
    jmreire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,580 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Crosby Brave Bartender wrote: »
    What you're saying here is that, if your vote happens to be transferred past the the candidates you've selected, you are happy for your vote to be ignored and for other people to decide for you. That's your choice I guess.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/why-it-pays-to-vote-all-the-way-down-the-ballot-paper-1.2548241

    What I'm actually saying is, I will vote for the candidates of my choice. Now if I only like 3, that's all I will vote for. On the other hand, if I like all the candidates, then I will vote for all of them, in my order of choice. I'm not going to vote for all the candidates, just to use all my vote's. If I think that you deserve a vote, I'll give you one, but not just to "use up" my remaining vote's. But if you and everyone else want to use all your vote's, that's fine too.


  • #538
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Varadkar is some joke. The welfare warriors received more than workers earning up to 55,000 a year! The housing crisis is a scandal. This is coming from an ex fg voter. He makes my skin crawl. He has to be removed from power come the next election!!!

    Still voting Renua?


  • #539
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,854 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Still voting Renua?
    Yeah. Probably do the inconceivable and give ff a vote, before I’d do my bit in helping that rat back into power!


  • #540
    c68zapdsm5i1ru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,709 ✭✭✭c68zapdsm5i1ru


    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/appalling-waste-of-time-man-who-claimed-he-was-humiliated-when-friends-bag-checked-in-shop-has-75k-damages-claim-dismissed-38144591.html

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/td-bailey-rejected-600-from-hotel-to-pay-her-medical-bill-after-swing-fall-38143356.html

    Is there no end to the ridiculous and stupid claims people are prepared to take? A grown woman falls off a swing and claims someone should have been supervising/giving instructions on how to use it; and a guy who was with a friend who was brought back into a shop because the security tag was still on an item he purchased claims defamation.


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  • #541
    McMurphy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    First I heard of this.


  • #542
    c68zapdsm5i1ru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,709 ✭✭✭c68zapdsm5i1ru


    They're both in the papers today, and the TD one was in the papers yesterday as well.


  • #543
    ILoveYourVibes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,202 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    Well yeah it is taking the piss.


  • #544
    El Weirdo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,647 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    BellaBella wrote: »
    They're both in the papers today, and the TD one was in the papers yesterday as well.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057982304


  • #545
    Suckit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,211 ✭✭✭✭Suckit


    golfball37 wrote: »
    She returned a cheque for 600e the hotel gave her for medical expenses. Some neck.


    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/td-bailey-rejected-600-from-hotel-to-pay-her-medical-bill-after-swing-fall-38143356.html
    In her action, Ms Bailey's lawyers say she was at the hotel with friends on July 13, 2015...

    ....She was brought to the Beacon Hospital and was described as being "in severe pain"...
    ....Ms Bailey was also described as being sick and sore and having a severe headache.
    https://www.independent.ie/life/health-wellbeing/health-features/migraine-warrior-maria-bailey-there-are-times-when-that-throbbing-shrieking-pain-is-so-awful-31282538.html
    June 15 2015 2:30 AM
    Councillor Maria Bailey (39) runs like the wind - to lessen the effects of excruciating headaches.
    "When I was 16, I began to feel chronically tired and I had a pounding headache," she recalls.
    When the situation continued unabated for another two months, Maria's GP came to the conclusion that she was suffering from migraine headaches..
    So are the headaches from falling off the swing different to the headaches she was getting for years before?


  • #546
    gmisk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,318 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    Callie Flat Rambler wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/appalling-waste-of-time-man-who-claimed-he-was-humiliated-when-friends-bag-checked-in-shop-has-75k-damages-claim-dismissed-38144591.html

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/td-bailey-rejected-600-from-hotel-to-pay-her-medical-bill-after-swing-fall-38143356.html

    Is there no end to the ridiculous and stupid claims people are prepared to take? A grown woman falls off a swing and claims someone should have been supervising/giving instructions on how to use it; and a guy who was with a friend who was brought back into a shop because the security tag was still on an item he purchased claims defamation.
    You forgot about the cosmos one....
    And they got a settlement!
    https://www.thesun.ie/news/4123369/kinahan-kingpin-liam-byrnes-son-undisclosed-sum-defamation-case/


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  • #547
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    gmisk wrote: »
    You forgot about the cosmos one....
    And they got a settlement!
    https://www.thesun.ie/news/4123369/kinahan-kingpin-liam-byrnes-son-undisclosed-sum-defamation-case/


    and the way It's playing out, why shouldn't joe scumbag try his luck if the establishment de jour are every bit as brazen!!!


  • #548
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Varadkar is some joke. The welfare warriors received more than workers earning up to 55,000 a year!
    who??


  • #549
    Scoundrel
    Registered Users Posts: 1,435 ✭✭✭Scoundrel


    I wouldn't be surprised if she was pulled in by HQ and told to drop the claim


  • #550
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Scoundrel wrote: »
    I wouldn't be surprised if she was pulled in by HQ and told to drop the claim

    I would be more surprised if she was!


  • #551
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,306 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Scoundrel wrote: »
    I wouldn't be surprised if she was pulled in by HQ and told to drop the claim


    Nah she will just be relegated to the backbenches after the next reshuffle or election if FG get back in and wont see sight nor sound of a real ministerial office for a long time


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