Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

bilston · 30-03-2020 7:01pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

He had some decent games alright but I just think everything went for him prior to the Leinster game, it all came crashing down and he has not reached those heights again....

Hopefully this break will give him the time to get his head back into it, it really has been non stop rugby since he burst onto the stage

It's easy to say it "went for him" because of the intercepts, but he was devastating for Ulster and Ireland as well. It was more than just luck.

He has had an average season, but he's still a class act and will prove so again soon.

Shefwedfan · 30-03-2020 7:06pm

bilston wrote: »

It's easy to say it "went for him" because of the intercepts, but he was devastating for Ulster and Ireland as well. It was more than just luck.

He has had an average season, but he's still a class act and will prove so again soon.

I didn’t mean he was just lucky....he was class!!! But he didn’t really have any knock back, till the Leinster game,

Of course he is class act, as you said he had some good games this season as well, just has struggled at time’s

The sooner he is back in top form then it will be excellent for Ulster and Ireland

Not every post is a criticism, I love stockdale, love how he plays as well

bilston · 30-03-2020 7:15pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I didn’t mean he was just lucky....he was class!!! But he didn’t really have any knock back, till the Leinster game,

Of course he is class act, as you said he had some good games this season as well, just has struggled at time’s

The sooner he is back in top form then it will be excellent for Ulster and Ireland

Not every post is a criticism, I love stockdale, love how he plays as well

Fair enough.

I want to see more of Stockdale, Balacoune and Addison as a back three for Ulster, injuries, suspensions and now a bloody pandemic have restricted it.

Interestingly Addison hasn't actually signed a new contract (apparently). But it has so much potential.

It will be interesting to see how Balacoune fares in an Ireland context over the next 12 months. Hopefully he gets capped, but Lowe coming on board there is a lot of competition. However Balacoune is a class act. I actually he would have been a favourite of Joe's if he was still about, because his basics are really good and he has a nose for the try line. Still a bit of work to do under the high ball though.

Shefwedfan · 30-03-2020 7:53pm

bilston wrote: »

Fair enough.

I want to see more of Stockdale, Balacoune and Addison as a back three for Ulster, injuries, suspensions and now a bloody pandemic have restricted it.

Interestingly Addison hasn't actually signed a new contract (apparently). But it has so much potential.

It will be interesting to see how Balacoune fares in an Ireland context over the next 12 months. Hopefully he gets capped, but Lowe coming on board there is a lot of competition. However Balacoune is a class act. I actually he would have been a favourite of Joe's if he was still about, because his basics are really good and he has a nose for the try line. Still a bit of work to do under the high ball though.

My concern with Addison goes to his injury record, I thought he just had a run of bad luck at Ulster but then you heard Fez on a podcast saying that someone at Sale said to him that Addison was incredible player, if he was ever fit....that would suggest recurring issues, but Ulster signed him knowing this so I would expect them to resign

Balacoune is one for future, really like him since I seen him last season.

With him, Stockdale, Addison, Madigan, Burns, Conway, Marshall etc you start to see Ulster now have a squad, and a good squad. It’s great to see them investing in those young players, hopefully they do the same with the U20 9....

At the moment is seems after years of ruling the air a lot of players don’t seem to have the edge, maybe they just took it for granted...a lot of wings are struggling compared to the other international teams

bilston · 30-03-2020 8:26pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

My concern with Addison goes to his injury record, I thought he just had a run of bad luck at Ulster but then you heard Fez on a podcast saying that someone at Sale said to him that Addison was incredible player, if he was ever fit....that would suggest recurring issues, but Ulster signed him knowing this so I would expect them to resign

Balacoune is one for future, really like him since I seen him last season.

With him, Stockdale, Addison, Madigan, Burns, Conway, Marshall etc you start to see Ulster now have a squad, and a good squad. It’s great to see them investing in those young players, hopefully they do the same with the U20 9....

At the moment is seems after years of ruling the air a lot of players don’t seem to have the edge, maybe they just took it for granted...a lot of wings are struggling compared to the other international teams

I suspect it's the GAA background. Stockdale doesn't have that, I don't think Balacoune does either. Bowe and Kearney did and were (still is in Kearney's case) great aerially. I'm assuming Conway has played a bit of GAA and he is good under the high ball.

Stockdale has his moments but isn't consistent enough.

Locke_Lamora · 30-03-2020 10:29pm

bilston wrote: »

I suspect it's the GAA background. Stockdale doesn't have that, I don't think Balacoune does either. Bowe and Kearney did and were (still is in Kearney's case) great aerially. I'm assuming Conway has played a bit of GAA and he is good under the high ball.

Stockdale has his moments but isn't consistent enough.

Don't really buy that tbh, if a player has the talent and is properly coached then playing rugby should be enough to develop rugby skillsets. Other countries somehow manage fine without GAA backgrounds.

Shefwedfan · 30-03-2020 10:33pm

bilston wrote: »

I suspect it's the GAA background. Stockdale doesn't have that, I don't think Balacoune does either. Bowe and Kearney did and were (still is in Kearney's case) great aerially. I'm assuming Conway has played a bit of GAA and he is good under the high ball.

Stockdale has his moments but isn't consistent enough.

Fla mentioned it on podcast how Conway just spent a huge amount of time practising and became the best at Munster in air, was always saying how he added a good chuck onto his wages because of it

The point was all young player should do the same,

Not much GAA around Blackrock :-) for Conway

The Lost Sheep · 31-03-2020 10:07am

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Don't really buy that tbh, if a player has the talent and is properly coached then playing rugby should be enough to develop rugby skillsets. Other countries somehow manage fine without GAA backgrounds.

crossover/transferable skills does play a part and something IMO limits us to an extent in that so many of our players havent much/any real experience of playing other sports(team sports anyway) especially in quite a lot of the rugby schools at least.

Locke_Lamora · 31-03-2020 10:31am

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

crossover/transferable skills does play a part and something IMO limits us to an extent in that so many of our players havent much/any real experience of playing other sports(team sports anyway) especially in quite a lot of the rugby schools at least.

The transferable skills would only give those kids an advantage if other kids aren't being properly coached with regards to certain skills. South Africa is head and shoulders above everyone else in schools rugby with New Zealand behind them and they aren't commonly playing other sports. Some players play cricket, but they would never contribute how good their rugby skillset is to it or consider it an 'advantage.'

I like the idea of incorporating other sports for variation in training - judo, basketball etc - but if playing a different sport growing up is considered an 'advantage' I think that is perhaps more telling about the standard of rugby coaching.

salmocab · 31-03-2020 10:38am

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

crossover/transferable skills does play a part and something IMO limits us to an extent in that so many of our players havent much/any real experience of playing other sports(team sports anyway) especially in quite a lot of the rugby schools at least.

Didn’t either Schmidt or Cullen talk about Larmour playing lots of hockey and the movement and Center of gravity from hockey transferred across. Skills are definitely transferable and things like catching from GAA helps to make players more comfortable with it.

The Lost Sheep · 31-03-2020 10:44am

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

The transferable skills would only give those kids an advantage if other kids aren't being properly coached with regards to certain skills. South Africa is head and shoulders above everyone else in schools rugby with New Zealand behind them and they aren't commonly playing other sports. Some players play cricket, but they would never contribute how good their rugby skillset is to it or consider it an 'advantage.'

I like the idea of incorporating other sports for variation in training - judo, basketball etc - but if playing a different sport growing up is considered an 'advantage' I think that is perhaps more telling about the standard of rugby coaching.

I dont think it is at all. Early specialization is great but you can build a wider skills range and develop in areas that will aid your principal sport considerably with playing multiple sports and all too often our rugby players havent played wide range of sports especially compared to many other rugby countries.

jacothelad · 31-03-2020 11:01am

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Don't really buy that tbh, if a player has the talent and is properly coached then playing rugby should be enough to develop rugby skillsets. Other countries somehow manage fine without GAA backgrounds.

Yes, I agree. This GAA stuff is a overdone. Catching a ball is catching a ball. Some do it well and some don't. It's as simple as that.

salmocab · 31-03-2020 11:05am

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes, I agree. This GAA stuff is a overdone. Catching a ball is catching a ball. Some do it well and some don't. It's as simple as that.

In fairness a full back might practice it for a bit at training but a GAA player will be doing it at every session and match he plays, that helps to get your eye in.

jacothelad · 31-03-2020 11:22am

salmocab wrote: »

In fairness a full back might practice it for a bit at training but a GAA player will be doing it at every session and match he plays, that helps to get your eye in.

Well it's a lot more difficult to catch a cricket ball going at over 100 mph. It would be the same in hurling. It's more about hand eye co-ordination and of course practice does help. Stockdale is essentially just a clumsy player. Sometimes he catches well and at others it looks like he couldn't catch a cold in a cold virus factory.

salmocab · 31-03-2020 11:34am

jacothelad wrote: »

Well it's a lot more difficult to catch a cricket ball going at over 100 mph. It would be the same in hurling. It's more about hand eye co-ordination and of course practice does help. Stockdale is essentially just a clumsy player. Sometimes he catches well and at others it looks like he couldn't catch a cold in a cold virus factory.

I agree, playing other sports certainly nearly always will bring something to the table and that cuts both ways. Practice is the key not just at training as that’s limited for one skill set whereas GAA lads would be doing it over and over. I don’t think it’s a failing of rugby and some players will naturally just be very good at it without ever playing another game. In my own personal experience the lads I played with that were very good were very often good at multiple sports.

jacothelad · 31-03-2020 12:47pm

salmocab wrote: »

I agree, playing other sports certainly nearly always will bring something to the table and that cuts both ways. Practice is the key not just at training as that’s limited for one skill set whereas GAA lads would be doing it over and over. I don’t think it’s a failing of rugby and some players will naturally just be very good at it without ever playing another game. In my own personal experience the lads I played with that were very good were very often good at multiple sports.

Yes. One of the key factors in sports skills is balance. The Kearneys have it, Larmour, Addison, Lyttle, Conway all have it. It is one of the factors in their attcking abilities and also applies to their defensive aerial skills. Balance and timing. Stockdale can catch a ball just as well as the others. His problem is in timing his arrival at the point of the catch and timing his jump. He is just shyte at it. I don't think he will get much better. Lyttle is brilliant at it and it seems that Baloucoune is too.

Yeah_Right · 31-03-2020 2:00pm

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

The transferable skills would only give those kids an advantage if other kids aren't being properly coached with regards to certain skills. South Africa is head and shoulders above everyone else in schools rugby with New Zealand behind them and they aren't commonly playing other sports. Some players play cricket, but they would never contribute how good their rugby skillset is to it or consider it an 'advantage.'

I don't think that's true. Most kiwi and safar kids I knew played multiple sports growing up and in high school. I know guys who became pro rugby players but represented NZ in age groups in other sports. I don't think kids should focus on one sport till after they finish school.

Locke_Lamora · 31-03-2020 2:08pm

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I don't think that's true. Most kiwi and safar kids I knew played multiple sports growing up and in high school. I know guys who became pro rugby players but represented NZ in age groups in other sports. I don't think kids should focus on one sport till after they finish school.

Neither do I, but I wouldn't contribute success in one to another. If Stockdale played cricket I'd wager he'd be a clumsy cricketer rather than a better rugby player.

The Lost Sheep · 31-03-2020 3:07pm

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes, I agree. This GAA stuff is a overdone. Catching a ball is catching a ball. Some do it well and some don't. It's as simple as that.

I dont think thr playing GAA is overdone. Their is a great skills crossover that rugby doesnt use enough IMO.

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I don't think that's true. Most kiwi and safar kids I knew played multiple sports growing up and in high school. I know guys who became pro rugby players but represented NZ in age groups in other sports. I don't think kids should focus on one sport till after they finish school.

which isnt the case for plenty of Irish. Specialisation occurs far too early for many.

bilston · 31-03-2020 6:53pm

jacothelad wrote: »

Well it's a lot more difficult to catch a cricket ball going at over 100 mph. It would be the same in hurling. It's more about hand eye co-ordination and of course practice does help. Stockdale is essentially just a clumsy player. Sometimes he catches well and at others it looks like he couldn't catch a cold in a cold virus factory.

Is that factory in Wuhan?

jacothelad · 31-03-2020 9:57pm

bilston wrote: »

Is that factory in Wuhan?

Funnily enough there is a bio-weapons establishment in Wuhan.

Yeah_Right · 01-04-2020 11:52am

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Neither do I, but I wouldn't contribute success in one to another. If Stockdale played cricket I'd wager he'd be a clumsy cricketer rather than a better rugby player.

There wouldn't be a lot of crossover in skills between rugby and cricket. The only ones I can think of is hand/eye co-ordination and mental skills (patience, focus etc.) and social/team skills. However if Stockdale had grown up playing other sports such as GAA, basketball, soccer, handball or water polo as well as rugby, I believe it would have helped make him a better rugby player.

Paul Smeenus · 01-04-2020 4:45pm

What, did he grow up in some sort of weird IRFU rugby gulag?

jacothelad · 01-04-2020 6:10pm

Yeah_Right wrote: »

There wouldn't be a lot of crossover in skills between rugby and cricket. The only ones I can think of is hand/eye co-ordination and mental skills (patience, focus etc.) and social/team skills. However if Stockdale had grown up playing other sports such as GAA, basketball, soccer, handball or water polo as well as rugby, I believe it would have helped make him a better rugby player.

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

What, did he grow up in some sort of weird IRFU rugby gulag?

I'm pretty sure he would have played most of those. One of the differences between him and Conway for example, in his aerial defence, seems to me to also indicate a lack of confidence on his part. Conway, Kearney, Lyttle et al all seem to go for it with assurance and belief and a certain kamikaze attitude. Jacob doesn't seem to do so except on rare occasions when he looks good enough and then next time he tries to catch the ball with his back:D.