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"Non book readers" - Season 8 Episode 5 "The bells" - Spoilers post 2 forward

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,258 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    leggo wrote: »
    The move that Dany did is the same move that won the Battle of Harrenhal. You fly directly downward towards the enemy so that they're looking into the sun and have no time to get orientated enough to fire off a shot. That's why they did it that way: it's established within the canon that this is a really effective dragon-riding battle technique. The Iron Fleet and Lannister army posted on the walls with scorpions were anticipating she fly in from the sea (which is all they could really anticipate). Whereas if you're not expecting someone, it's obviously easier to fire a successful shot, which is what happened to Rhaegal.

    That works for the initial strike on the ships, but not for the huge length of time following that where all the other scorpions barely even moved even though Dany was riding at a normal height above them and flying horizontally. When the dragon is torching 10 scorpions in a line, scorpions 7-10 should be able to get a shot in.

    Plus, did Harrenhal have dragon-killing weapons, as I thought Qyburn basically invented them?


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,611 ✭✭✭✭ERG89


    Varys, Euron (I think), Jaime, Cersei all die & Cleganebowl takes 2 victims but when all of that happens in an hour it loses its impact.
    I'm not sure are the actors phoning it in or if it's the script but something about this season has felt off from episode 1. Now they've just replaced drinking around a fire in a dimly lit room to walking around in smoke not knowing where to go; a bit like the writers did when they wrote this. Character swerves to get to the end goal & the likes of Jon Snow almost doing a 180 of his past character.
    Next week is the last episode and I'm glad tbh. :(


  • Registered Users Posts: 476 ✭✭flugel


    Good overal.

    Nobody else disappointment Ayra just gave up on trying to kill Cersei after a quick conversation?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,061 ✭✭✭leggo


    Penn wrote: »
    That works for the initial strike on the ships, but not for the huge length of time following that where all the other scorpions barely even moved even though Dany was riding at a normal height above them and flying horizontally. When the dragon is torching 10 scorpions in a line, scorpions 7-10 should be able to get a shot in.

    Plus, did Harrenhal have dragon-killing weapons, as I thought Qyburn basically invented them?

    Dragons have been killed by scorpions before, it's the non book thread so I won't get into it but if you're interested look up how the Dornish got their 'Unbowed, unbent, unbroken' mantra.

    Also when have we seen scorpions fire off a successful shot at an expecting dragon to reach that assumption? Bronn hit Drogon before Dany knew scorpions were invented, Euron hit Rhaegal when she wasn't expecting them. When Dany flew right at Euron, the arrows missed (although there were so many of them within a short range that she had to change direction). It's a different kettle of fish aiming at something not expecting you and at something flying, at pace, directly at you with the provision that if you miss, you die.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,292 ✭✭✭Adamocovic


    It's interesting all the comments about rushing the story. I agree with them. I'm sure most know that HBO offered a bigger budget and longer season but D&D declined it, more than likely to move on to Star Wars. Just makes you more annoyed.

    Episode was so-so. Wouldn't go as far as some calling it worst episode of TV but with the drop in quality it's sad.

    Was most disappointed with Jaime Lannister's end. Built up his redemption style character arc and the whole idea of him actually being a good man who cares for people, just to throw it out the window in the end. Also the running back to Cersei's arms after she had put a price on his head, refused to help against the walkers, and been shacking up with Euron (don't get me starter on his pop up attack!). His death didn't do his character justice in my eyes and it annoyed me.

    I think Varys was hard done by too. Went out with a whimper and not even some good dialogue this season for us to remember him by.

    Also found myself disengaged a bit like many said here. Felt like going through the motions. Wasn't captivated or on the end of my seat like so many moments that make us love the show.

    It's a shame how it will finish. Feels like so much will be left unanswered and so many possibilities unexplored. Only one more anyway so better buckle up.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    Sorry to see the hound go probarbly the most honourable Knight that never was.

    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQJckcRPdMfstbhgWs34saMg3km_cA-88RrL8SvOyV_jalCd9xeSw


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭lawlolawl




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,133 ✭✭✭Sandor Clegane


    It was no surprise Danny went mad like she did, it's been building for a while.

    An interesting final episode, how will Jon react to what she did and what will he do? He will still have the North behind him and id assume Tyrion's allegiance will now shift if he survives long enough.

    Her state of mind and what she did can't be ignored now, it was a massacre!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭lawlolawl


    All of Danys advisors: "We should wait a while to march on Kings landing because we're still depleted from our battle with the Army Of the Dead™"


    Dany: "Nah."


    /singlehandedly destroys the entire Iron Fleet, melts all of the elite mercenaries and blows up the walls of Kings Landing within the space of 5 minutes


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It went full on 80s B-movie at times..

    Pile of sh1te..

    I'm actually considering not watching the last episode..


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,248 ✭✭✭✭BoJack Horseman


    Well....... that was sh*t.

    The only sliver of poetic satisfaction was Sandor's end.

    The rest was just poor....
    The inconsistencies are excruciating.

    At least next week it will be all over, and so will end what could (should) have been the greatest TV show ever made.
    Instead consigned to the 'it's alright' pile of TV history


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 157 ✭✭EarlyStorms


    I enjoyed it as spectacle, great entertainment some amazing shots you wont see the likes of again anytime soon. They've been building the Dany change for a while, the only problem I have is this season is too short, we needed more episodes for this story to finish in more satisfactory manner. The showrunners should have passed the show onto somebody if they wanted out. When even the casual fans care more about the show then the people running it, something isn't right there.

    Anyway we are where we are and I'll make the most of it. Looking forward to seeing how it all plays out in the last episode.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭lawlolawl


    It went full on 80s B-movie at times..

    Pile of sh1te..

    I'm actually considering not watching the last episode..


    You don't want to see Jon Snow go off to be a lumberjack after he kills Dany?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,248 ✭✭✭✭BoJack Horseman


    some amazing shots you wont see the likes of again anytime soon.

    There was indeed... that can't be denied.

    But after 5 mins of stumbling around a burning city with Arya I checked the clock and figured she must be going to do something.
    No... we'll instead stumble around a burning city with Arya for 5 more minutes for no reason..... and then the show ends.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,607 ✭✭✭pah


    Hugely unsatisfied


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,033 ✭✭✭✭Richard Hillman


    Is there even an iron throne to sit on anymore?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,221 ✭✭✭✭J. Marston


    It went full on 80s B-movie at times..

    Pile of sh1te..

    I'm actually considering not watching the last episode..

    No you're not. See you next week.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,292 ✭✭✭Adamocovic


    It was no surprise Danny went mad like she did, it's been building for a while.

    An interesting final episode, how will Jon react to what she did and what will he do? He will still have the North behind him and id assume Tyrion's allegiance will now shift if he survives long enough.

    Her state of mind and what she did can't be ignored now, it was a massacre!

    No surprise but so rushed. It's something many predicted in the past but it's been sped along way too much in the dying moments in my eyes.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,228 ✭✭✭podgemonster


    flugel wrote: »
    Good overal.

    Nobody else disappointment Ayra just gave up on trying to kill Cersei after a quick conversation?

    I actually think it was a very important moment. The path of vengeance is a dark road that eventual ends in Death. The Hound is motivated only by hate, he was going into the red keep to kill his brother, his own life was after that point had nothing left to live for.

    Arya in the map room turned from the path of hate and revenge and chose life, she saw in a flash the futility of killing an already defeated queen. Her new motivation was not to take life but to protect life as she urges the cowering woman and children to flee from the city.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators Posts: 24,006 Mod ✭✭✭✭Clareman


    What a great episode, for me 1 of the best things about the episode was the greying of the lines again, it was too "black and white" for ages as to who was good and who was bad.

    Grey worm killing yerman in the back shows how mad he is now.
    Jon killing people when he didn't want to be there.
    Ayra running through the place was a good way to show the impact of the battle on the locals.
    The Mountain and the Hound, it couldn't have been anything else.
    Cersai and Jamie, they went together, she died in the hands of her brother, that'll do.
    Tyrion is the last Lanister, he can't survive, can he?

    In a weird way I'd nearly be happy if they finished there, there's going to be 90 minutes of tieing up of lose ends, leave it there that you know Dany has gone mad and there's others who don't like what she's doing but leave it there, no need to spell out out on the screen for us.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,078 ✭✭✭IAMAMORON


    It went full on 80s B-movie at times..

    Pile of sh1te..

    I'm actually considering not watching the last episode..

    You shouldn't, it is evident from your posts for the past 2 years that you haven't being enjoying it.

    Stop wasting your time, have you been keeping up with Corro lately? It sounds like you could do with some serious Gail Tilsley downtime. Treat yourself you deserve it.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    J. Marston wrote: »
    No you're not. See you next week.

    No I actually am..

    As a protest at the pile of sh1te they made of it..

    And tbh I don't care what happens really now...


  • Registered Users Posts: 761 ✭✭✭youreadthat


    NuMarvel wrote: »
    There have been 22 Marvel Studios films at this point, and numerous other adaptations by other studios. Can you be a bit more specific about how GoT has become like these movies in their totality, because I'm not seeing it.

    Beige fan service with expensive visuals to trick you into thinking there’s any value in the money and time you’ve spent following it.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    IAMAMORON wrote: »
    You shouldn't, it is evident from your posts for the past 2 years that you haven't being enjoying it.

    Stop wasting your time, have you been keeping up with Corro lately? It sounds like you could do with some serious Gail Tilsley downtime. Treat yourself you deserve it.

    Well, if you're recommending it..Is it all who wants to shag who and sentimental banter, like GOT minus the violence and dragons and sh.t?..


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,688 ✭✭✭storker


    Very sorry to see Varys go. It was nice to see him and Tyrion affirm their friendship just before the end. I was reminded of their chat during the preparations for the Battle of the Blackwater...
    Tyrion; "I wish we could converse as two honest and intelligent men."
    Varys: "I wish we could too."
    The irony being that effectively, they always did.

    Jaime and Tyrion's farewell was done well too. Of all the characters in the show, Jaime must surely be the most complex.
    J. Marston wrote: »
    Well, Dany is full tyrant now. Disappointed.

    The Mad King had a sex change. :)
    soap1978 wrote: »
    Hate when Jamie said he didn't care about the people

    It's consistent with his character, though. I would have found it less than credible had he responded to a plea in the name of the sweaty masses.
    Deco99 wrote: »
    So Jamie not there to kill cersei? I'm gripped what could possibly be left next week

    My prediction: Arya, who seems to have been very affected by the fates of the innocents, will confront Danaerys and call her out as the monster she has become, or just try to assassinate her. Jon will stick up for Arya, but the Mad Queen will try to set her dragon on Arya anyway, at which point Jon will either order the dragon to stop, or will interpose himself between the dragon and Arya, and the dragon will hold its fire (literally), Jon being a Targaryen. After that, it's game over for the Mad Queen. King Jon first of his name will take the throne, keeping the name Ned Stark gave him in honour of his adoptive father.
    Necro wrote: »
    I'm not actually. Kinda hoped they wouldn't pull punches, it's the reality of war tbh.

    That struck me too. The scenes in the streets of King's Landing seem to tally with historical accounts of the sackings of cities, even Badajoz as recently as 1812 - without the carpet-bombing dragon of course.
    NDWC wrote: »
    Disappointed by
    Cersei's (presumable) death, was hoping it'd be more brutal

    I was half-expecting Arya to appear and do the pair of them.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭lawlolawl




  • Registered Users Posts: 169 ✭✭bigslice


    No I actually am..

    As a protest at the pile of sh1te they made of it..

    And tbh I don't care what happens really now...

    A powerful statement to HBO...right up there with The Peoples front of Judea Suicide squad.

    That will show them.

    Stand firm brother.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,688 ✭✭✭storker


    kowloon wrote: »
    Always disliked Dani's sense of entitlement, so I'm liking the direction it's taking.

    A sense of entitlement born from her knowledge that she was the rightful heir to the throne, and undiminished by learning that the actually isn't. She was supposed to be "breaking the wheel", now she's just breaking innocent people on it.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    bigslice wrote: »
    A powerful statement to HBO...right up there with The Peoples front of Judea Suicide squad.

    That will show them.

    Stand firm brother.

    Splitters!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 505 ✭✭✭md23040


    I’m disappointed that Cersei with all her planning had relied on a couple of catapults to protect her from defeat. It would have been more fitting when Dany went rogue and flew towards the red keep that Cersei would have exploded a heap wildfire and napalmed Drogon.

    She spent the whole episode taking punch after punch without fighting back which is so out of character.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,221 ✭✭✭✭J. Marston


    md23040 wrote: »
    I’m disappointed that Cersei with all her planning had relied on a couple of catapults to protect her from defeat. It would have been more fitting when Dany went rogue and flew towards the red keep that Cersei would have exploded a heap wildfire and napalmed Drogon.

    She spent the whole episode taking punch after punch without fighting back which is so out of character.

    There is no fighting back after Drogon has wiped out the city defences. She was in a state of shock.


  • Posts: 21,679 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    55 minutes in and I'm not able :(


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,680 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sad Professor


    Great episode with a very satisfying and GRRM-esque climax to Dany's story. I'd rank this up there with the best of the series.

    Despite being a critic of the show for most of its run, I've been extremely pleased with the last two seasons. Really haven't a clue what all the complaining is about.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,351 ✭✭✭✭Liam O


    Great episode with a very satisfying and GRRM-esque climax to Dany's story. I'd rank this up there with the best of the series.

    Despite being a critic of the show for most of its run, I've been extremely pleased with the last two seasons. Really haven't a clue what all the complaining is about.

    The fact that nothing makes any sense is probably a good place to start :p

    Inconsistencies galore with regards time passing, locations, character motivations etc.

    Dany literally saves humanity and 2 episodes later is destroying it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,405 ✭✭✭Airyfairy12


    storker wrote: »



    She's a Targaryen and nuts like her dad. Their DNA is like a bad Scrabble hand.

    Ayras not a Targaryen ...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,688 ✭✭✭storker


    J. Marston wrote: »
    There is no fighting back after Drogon has wiped out the city defences. She was in a state of shock.

    Qyburn: "Your grace, we should evacuate."
    Cersei: "Don't panic, we just need a good shot."
    Qyburn: "All the scorpions have been destroyed."
    Cersei: "Don't panic, there's still the Iron Fleet."
    Qyburn: "The Iron Fleet is burning in the bay."
    Cersei: "Don't panic, we're safe in the Red Keep."
    Qyburn: "They'll have no problem breaking in."
    Cersei: "OK, let's panic."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,610 ✭✭✭muddypaws


    I thought it was a great episode of television. I didn't even consider staying up until 2am last night as I wasn't excited by what may be in it, but I will be next week.

    Probably reading too much into it, but I loved Arya at the end, her clothes, and the way she moved reminded me of the NK, with the ash and fire surrounding and behind her, as opposed to snow and ice, and the grey horse continued that. There is also the possibility of it being one of the 4 horses of the apocalypse, white or maybe pale - "Come.” I looked, and behold, an ashen horse; and he who sat on it had the name Death;


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,688 ✭✭✭storker


    Ayras not a Targaryen ...

    Silly mistake, I thought it was Danaerys being discussed at that point. Original post edited.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,663 ✭✭✭JoeyJJ


    Drogon must have had a lot of weetabix, he certainly deserves to chill out with his mates for a while, oh wait they are dead.

    Dany gone all mad queen on us surely she won't let herself be isolated with people who will danger claim to the throne.

    I wonder how many scrolls Varys got out before his demise? Possibly none, even if he did who is gonna go against her after that flex of muscles.

    Has Sansa any part in the final episode? Lord Gendry? Ah heck I may as well watch the preview.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,690 ✭✭✭✭Skylinehead


    storker wrote: »
    Qyburn: "Your grace, we should evacuate."
    Cersei: "Don't panic, we just need a good shot."
    Qyburn: "All the scorpions have been destroyed."
    Cersei: "Don't panic, there's still the Iron Fleet."
    Qyburn: "The Iron Fleet is burning in the bay."
    Cersei: "Don't panic, we're safe in the Red Keep."
    Qyburn: "They'll have no problem breaking in."
    Cersei: "OK, let's panic."

    Qyburn: *splat*


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,405 ✭✭✭Airyfairy12


    I wish cersei had a better death, would have liked to see her captured and beheaded like she did to missandei


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭SureYWouldntYa


    You have to feel so bad for Brienne now

    I was sure Jaime going back to Cersei was a ploy, and that he would kill her as it was what needed to be done, and he’d get a happily every after ending with Brienne too

    Nobody is going to get a happy ending at all are they, except for the hound i suppose


  • Posts: 21,679 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I need to lie down.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators Posts: 24,006 Mod ✭✭✭✭Clareman


    I'm loving the way a lot of the stuff that's playing out now was referenced years ago, even in the first series. Cersai thought that power was power and with the scorpions she had the power, Dany going high and low brought the end of that advantage. Speaking of dragons, Dany had 3 and has lost 1 due to each of the major battles she has fought in the 7 kingdoms, now she has 1 left I assume there isn't a hope of more dragons being produced.


  • Registered Users Posts: 395 ✭✭barneyrub


    Was Varys trying to poison Danerys in the beginning of the episode?


  • Administrators Posts: 54,098 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    barneyrub wrote: »
    Was Varys trying to poison Danerys in the beginning of the episode?

    I think so. The girl he spoke to worked in the kitchen, and they said Dany was refusing food. My take is he was trying to off her.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,734 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    Hard not to have 'opinions' about that episode.

    It's arguably the best made - in a technical and spectacle sense - episode of the series. The way it transitions from the ominous, shadowy build-up of the opening 15 minutes to the brutal chaos that follows is satisfying. The action feels like a riposte to the Battle of Winterfell - no tactical darkness to hide the violence and death. Miguel Sapochnik is one of the show's best directors, and he brings his a-game here.

    In the moment, the episode is largely enjoyable, a few raised eyebrows aside. But like much of this season so far, as soon as I started to digest it a bit that sheen wore off. The major problem I have is that I really just don't give a **** about any of the characters at this stage. I feel the writers are forcing them to make weird decisions just to set up certain scenes or payoffs, regardless of whether it makes any sense or not. Jamie's perhaps the foremost example: I simply do not think the show remotely sold his decision to go back Cersei, and that whole business rang hollow as a result. I can see how it makes sense on paper, but the writers have rushed through necessary development to get him and Cersei back together. Feel they've been just buying time when it comes to Tyrion as well all season - without question he'll have some key role in the finale (Davos' favour) but they've relegated him to bumbling witness for too long here.

    But what of the big character shift, the arrival of the Mad Queen? There's no doubt that's been bubbling as a possibility since very early on in the series, and a few inciting incidents in the last few to push her over the edge. Why does it still ring a bit false? Again there's just an inconsistency in the writing: from scene to scene in the last couple of episodes you simply don't know if Dany will be an empathetic, decent leader or psychopath-in-waiting. The path towards this destination had been paved for sure, but it comes across as unstable and clumsy in the execution. Ditto how those spiked arrows were such a devastating, insurmountable threat last week and destroyed with barely a sweat broken this week. The show's internal rules come across as made up as they go along.

    As a piece of action television, there's plenty to like here - the sheer horrid scale of the thing, and the sense of chaos as Jon futilely yelled at his troops to stop. It was at its weakest, though, when it tried to be a last generation action video game. The Arya sequences were the worst offenders - while an admirable attempt to give the audience a POV of the grim scenes on the ground, her constant stumbling from one explosion or collapsing building to another gave the impression of a bad action sequence from an Uncharted game. It really felt like they forced a fan-favourite character into that situation so she'd have something to do this episode. And the show's worst habit this season has been to treat every character death as a big, dramatic showcase or event: every major death here is an emotionally-loaded reunion or long-anticipated confrontation, and that traps GoT in the sort of generic blockbuster storytelling mould that the show at its brutal best avoided.

    There's a sense this episode works in the moment because of the efforts of many of the creative players: whether that's Sapochnik's visceral direction, or largely accomplished work from almost all the major cast members. The fall of King's Landing was, crucially, as catastrophic as one could have imagined. In that sense, the episode was a success. But I'm basically tuned out of the broader narrative at this stage: I don't really care about anyone's fate, or whether the impossibly bland Jon Snow and the 'good guys' triumph over the genocidal queen. Game of Thrones is something I enjoy watching on a Monday morning, but even as events barrel forward it leaves surprisingly little impression once those credits have rolled.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36 the sword


    Disappointing few episodes so far this season. Condensing it into 6 episodes has really taken away what the show was about, and characters aren’t getting the time like they should be.

    Cersei’s and Jamie’s ending wasn’t fitting of characters that had been in the show from day 1, Cersei being under used the entire season tbh.

    As pointed out, the impact of the scorpions on the walls and the Iron Fleet seemed to be a major hinderance to any plans of using Drogon, and I was expecting something a bit more cunning to alleviate this.

    The golden company had no impact whatsoever, and not true to what game of thrones is about, once the scorpions were destroyed the obvious happened.

    The Hound character went full circle, and as a fan favourite it was good to see him getting a decent ending.

    With a show this big, and that much floating about the internet in terms of what could happen next, no one is every going to be really satisfied with how it all ends.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭touts


    I was critical of the Battle of Winterfell because I felt the writers chickened out. I feel the opposite about this one. I think this was a cracking episode. There were some scenes where lesser writers would have gone the obvious way. I was convinced Jamie was going to a bell tower and would save the city from slaughter. Then we would have a trial and some politics and a couple of executions and someone would sit on the throne. That's what most show writers would do. But they didn't and he didn't. He was just fixated on getting to Cersie before the inevitable end. The bells rang but it wasn't him. There was no great soppy hero moment for a man who outwardly was a hero but inwardly didn't want to be one.

    What came to mind watching it was this must have been what it was like when big cities fell to a vengeful opponent. Constantinople and Berlin were the two that came to mind. The horrifying reality of the fall and sack of a city for both the main characters and the ordinary people was shown in all its brutality.

    Cersie dying in the collapse of the Red Keep. Sure that was dispointing because Arya didn't get to kill her but yet it lent an element of reality to it. History shows you don't always get a big epic showdown and they don't always find the body.

    Dany going nuts. Thinking back there were always signs of it across the seasons. She had a habit of burning her enemies and seemed to relish it at times (e.g. at the Dokrati capital or crucifying the masters). Her banishment of Ser Jorah for being a spy years before always felt overly cruel considering it was clear he had been utterly converted to her cause. Or even back to the first season when she watched her brother being killed and refused to turn away. I think the signs were always there that she was prone to the most irrational of reactions its just we invested in her being one of the good guys. It is as if the coin was flipping in the air giving us glimpses of her good and evil sides and we hoped that it would eventually land on the good side.

    Cleganebowl was a bit overly CGIed at times. I would have preferred to see the two of them going at it on the ground. I can see why they did it up the tower as they needed the fall and the fire below to kill the Mountain but if he can survive being skewered with a sword and then a dagger through the brain could he survive the fall?

    The letter Varys was writing at the start was interesting. I wonder who that went to. Then he was writing another when he was arrested a few days later so he clearly was sending more than one. I wonder was he writing to the surviving Lords of the Realm and the Grand Maester etc to spread the word about Jon being the true heir. Given his service under so many Kings over the years he might be one of the few that the realm would believe if he told them about Jon.

    Overall I have to say I think that was a superb episode. I'll watch it again tonight but don't think my first opinion will change much.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,163 Mod ✭✭✭✭Necro


    touts wrote: »

    What came to mind watching it was this must have been what it was like when big cities fell to a vengeful opponent. Constantinople and Berlin were the two that came to mind. The horrifying reality of the fall and sack of a city for both the main characters and the ordinary people was shown in all its brutality.

    Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the jungles and towns of Vietnam being napalmed by the US troops. That's more in the line of what I was thinking of was behind the way it was shot.


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