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Slave Trader Edward Colston's statue torn down in Bristol

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    #122
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,283 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    BlitzKrieg wrote: »
    I think the most confusing part of this whole affair is Piers Morgan actually being in favour of pulling down the statue.

    That's just weird

    not really, he usually has wrong opinions.


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    #123
    JL555
    Registered Users Posts: 288 ✭✭JL555


    listermint wrote: »
    These statues were erected just over hundred years ago. And in the states many of them within living memory
    .they'd one purpose and it wasn't history.

    I know, just like many other statues and monuments around the world.


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    #124
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,283 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    Deleted User wrote: »
    When does it become acceptable for me to destroy something I find offensive?

    when the politically left arm of twitter agrees with you.


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    #125
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users Posts: 13,060 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    English people's knowledge of their history is shocking. They have such fascinating breadth and depth of history and cultures, it's a real shame.

    Same here. Ask an average Irish person about historical figures like Parnell or O'Connell and they wouldn't have much detail on them.

    Irish love to slag off Brits about their lack of historical knowledge.


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    #126
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,666 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    By "it", I mean the culture war and not the removal of the statue.

    I don't see anything good in grown men spewing poisonous nonsense on the internet. That's why the culture war is BS IMO.

    You might call it a culture war but I'd call it libertarians playground.

    All of this messing around is being cultivated by very very wealthy individuals and organisations. Money to be made in mayhem.


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    #127
    Calhoun
    Registered Users Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    By "it", I mean the culture war and not the removal of the statue.

    I don't see anything good in grown men spewing poisonous nonsense on the internet. That's why the culture war is BS IMO.

    Its a vicious circle and helps drive allot of the bile. Look at what is done in America and how things have gone.

    It wasn't the only factor but its helped contribute to the polarization over there.


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    #128
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,326 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Well more British people probably learnt more about the dark parts of their empire by this simple act than they did in school.

    I doubt it. Anybody interested this sort of thing is probably well aware of Britain's slavery-exploiting past already.

    If it does spur on some sort of conversation on the subject then that can only be a good thing.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #129
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 19,980 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    By "it", I mean the culture war and not the removal of the statue.

    I don't see anything good in grown men spewing poisonous nonsense on the internet. That's why the culture war is BS IMO.

    But the protests generally and removing the statue are surely part of the culture war.


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    #130
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,666 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Same here. Ask an average Irish person about historical figures like Parnell or O'Connell and they wouldn't have much detail on them.

    Irish love to slag off Brits about their lack of historical knowledge.

    I'd completely disagree with this statement tbh.


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    #131
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users Posts: 13,060 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Its a vicious circle and helps drive allot of the bile. Look at what is done in America and how things have gone.

    It wasn't the only factor but its helped contribute to the polarization over there.

    We've imported this polarised nonsense here, largely driven by the media and social media.

    Americans and Brits do not care what Irish think about them.


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    #132
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,299 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Saw over on twitter they defaced a statue of Churchill as well, tbh I'm not too bothered about it as Churchill hated us Irish and this other guy was a slave trader but at the same time there are better ways of getting things done rather than mob rule taking over.


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    #133
    completedit
    Registered Users Posts: 2,639 ✭✭✭completedit


    I wonder will Leopold's statues comes down in Brussels.


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    #134
    Lefty Bicek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,625 ✭✭✭Lefty Bicek


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    History is found in books and museums, not statues. Statues are for veneration.

    Originally they might have been.

    Doesn't mean that veneration is what they elicit today.

    If I walk past that statue, I think of the abomination that is slavery. Not the great chap that Colston was.

    It's all just more vacant BS by the perpetually offended, perpetually attention-seeking, perpetual virtue-signallers.


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    #135
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,326 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    listermint wrote: »
    Actually follow up this. You actually posted a few posts back

    "I didn't know that"


    Irony fulfilled...

    If you're waiting for an apology from me for not knowing the name of every slave owner who's ever lived, their monuments and the progress of efforts to remove them you can keep waiting. Your snide as hominema are of no interest to me.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #136
    Calhoun
    Registered Users Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    We've imported this polarised nonsense here, largely driven by the media and social media.

    Americans and Brits do not care what Irish think about them.

    I don't think its as bad yet, not like you see over there but some of the actions this weekend has driven us a bit closer.


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    #137
    FVP3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    Yeah I've been chatting with a mate from Bristol today to get his insights.

    A lot of Bristol will have to change if they really want to disavow the slave trade. Not just the statues. It was the major centre. And once again I wonder about the private intergenerational slave wealth.

    The excellent BBC "a house through time" tells the history of the house that was built by a slave owner on Guinea street, which is named after the slave trade ( from Guinea).


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    #138
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users Posts: 13,060 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    listermint wrote: »
    I'd completely disagree with this statement tbh.

    Geography is the same. Ask a Dubliner where Bandon is or Dungarvan. Most wouldn't have a clue.

    We love to see ourselves as a cut above the rest. It's a bit mad.


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    #139
    c.p.w.g.w
    Registered Users Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    History is found in books and museums, not statues. Statues are for veneration.

    So your happy for statue's of minorities being removed?

    There is a serious issue with History being hidden or distorted. As many people don't do sufficient reason and use the internet for their information...At least with Statues it can generate questions and discussions


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    #140
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,576 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    Saw over on twitter they defaced a statue of Churchill as well, tbh I'm not too bothered about it as Churchill hated us Irish and this other guy was a slave trader but at the same time there are better ways of getting things done rather than mob rule taking over.

    Well as pointed out earlier there is some evidence he didnt not hate Irish, eitherway he wasnt defaced because of his views on Irish people, its because of his misattributed role in the Bengal famine. If a mob is going to deface or tear down, You'd hope at least they'd get their history straight.


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    #141
    FVP3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Same here. Ask an average Irish person about historical figures like Parnell or O'Connell and they wouldn't have much detail on them.

    Irish love to slag off Brits about their lack of historical knowledge.

    Sure, nobody has ever heard of Parnell or O'Connell.
    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Geography is the same. Ask a Dubliner where Bandon is or Dungarvan. Most wouldn't have a clue.

    We love to see ourselves as a cut above the rest. It's a bit mad.

    More nonsense.


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    #142
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,326 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    But the protests generally and removing the statue are surely part of the culture war.

    Possibly. I was thinking about the sorts of people who just moan to be honest.

    I'd prefer to think of the efforts to remove the statue as a signal that the next generation of Britons want to reckon with their past in a way that previous generations have not.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #143
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,326 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    So your happy for statue's of minorities being removed?

    There is a serious issue with History being hidden or distorted. As many people don't do sufficient reason and use the internet for their information...At least with Statues it can generate questions and discussions

    Serious issue? You have a source for this?

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #144
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,576 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    FVP3 wrote: »
    A lot of Bristol will have to change if they really want to disavow the slave trade. Not just the statues. It was the major centre. And once again I wonder about the private intergenerational slave wealth.

    The excellent BBC "a house through time" tells the history of the house that was built by a slave owner on Guinea street, which is named after the slave trade ( from Guinea).

    I dont buy this argument. Such vast wealth has been created from nothing since there.


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    #145
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users Posts: 13,060 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    FVP3 wrote: »
    Sure, nobody has ever heard of Parnell or O'Connell.



    More nonsense.

    Easy isn't to say the Brits don't have a clue. When it's said about us, it's "nonsense". No discussion at all. It's just "nonsense".


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    #146
    Calhoun
    Registered Users Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    FVP3 wrote: »
    A lot of Bristol will have to change if they really want to disavow the slave trade. Not just the statues. It was the major centre. And once again I wonder about the private intergenerational slave wealth.

    The excellent BBC "a house through time" tells the history of the house that was built by a slave owner on Guinea street, which is named after the slave trade ( from Guinea).

    I think the problem they have is that if you start peeling back the layers on any of the old colonial powers its not pretty. How do you get to a situation that acknowledges the atrocities and also the benefits that were brought about because of it.

    Its not easy to say the least and is the reason its a great opportunity for those who dont like whats going on to use it as a weapon against them. The reality is had the council taken the request on this statue seriously the acts today might not have happened and could have had a mature conversation about it but that part wont really get out.


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    #147
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users Posts: 13,060 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Wait til people here about Daniel O'Connell's anti-semitic comments.


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    #148
    c.p.w.g.w
    Registered Users Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    Serious issue? You have a source for this?

    Just Google "halocaust fake"... plenty of websites that can confuse folks into believing the it never happened...now that's a major historical event... plenty of other bullsh!t online about other historical events...


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    #149
    FVP3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Easy isn't to say the Brits don't have a clue. When it's said about us, it's "nonsense". No discussion at all. It's just "nonsense".

    I didn't say anything about the Brit not knowing their history, however. I am saying the claim that the Irish dont know Parnell of O'Connell is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard on the internet. And I've been around the block.


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    #150
    Rubberchikken
    Registered Users Posts: 5,083 ✭✭✭Rubberchikken


    Removing this statue is just distraction for the sake of it.
    Most of these nimrods don't know their history and have little respect for public property or history, for that matter.

    Black, white or whatever going around attempting to write off the past as though it never existed, vandalise things that aren't theirs to destroy and generally pi*s me off getno support from me.

    This will all blow over. Life will continue. And the people with time on their hands for this crap would be better off changing the world by contributing positively instead of running off after every sad little social media 'thing' that occurs.


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    #151
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,299 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Yellow_Fern wrote: »
    Well as pointed out earlier there is some evidence he didnt not hate Irish, eitherway he wasnt defaced because of his views on Irish people, its because of his misattributed role in the Bengal famine. If a mob is going to deface or tear down, You'd hope at least they'd get their history straight.

    He sent the Black and Tans and Auxiliaries to Ireland in 1920 and we all know what they did.

    Just to be clear I don't support tearing down or damaging statues but lets call out Churchill for what he was.


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