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Mass sexual assaults covered up for 4 days by German media - READ OP BEFORE POSTING

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭screamer


    If they find their accommodation not to their liking they could always go back to where they came from other perhaps countries like Saudi or UAE should take care of there Islamic brothers and sisters.
    Bigger question is why did they not flee to those places....... we all know why and if they were caught raping drinking and molesting there they'd be sorted out fairly lively.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    screamer wrote: »
    Bigger question is why did they not flee to those places....... we all know why and if they were caught raping drinking and molesting there they'd be sorted out fairly lively.

    Bigger question is why is Turkey where most of them are from such a hellhole that they need to leave, and yet we want to let Turkey into the EU?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,744 ✭✭✭kleefarr


    If this continues to carry on I can see people taking things into their own hands and I would not blame them.
    Scum like this need disposing of!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,197 ✭✭✭Eutow


    Stheno wrote: »
    Take in less, assimilate them properly

    How do you do this? What if they don't want to assimilate?
    Stheno wrote: »

    NOt at all, I'm advocating taking in an amount we can cope with, not what the Germans have done.

    There are Irish people on the waiting list for housing. If Ireland takes in immigrants where do they go? Do they get ahead of Irish people in the waiting list? If the country can't house their own people, how do they house thousands of immigrants?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭screamer


    Stheno wrote: »
    Bigger question is why is Turkey where most of them are from such a hellhole that they need to leave, and yet we want to let Turkey into the EU?
    WESTERN EU = free everything.
    Eastern EU= nothing for nothing.
    TURKEY = nothing for nothing
    So they kept marching. It's not a case of not wanting to be in Turkey its a case of wanting to be in one of the top welfare states of Europe. Every migrant wanted germany Sweden Denmark as their destination of choice. Yes choice.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,227 ✭✭✭The Highwayman




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,554 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    donvito99 wrote: »
    Is it just me or weren't the Germans up the ole mass sexual crimes not 70 years ago?

    Among others.

    Jesus fucking Christ. :rolleyes:

    Go away lad...and take a real, long, hard look at yourself.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 754 ✭✭✭mynameis905


    Stheno wrote: »
    A lot of the refugees in Germany are being housed in gyms, community centres, and unused industrial spaces.

    There have been numerous articles online about the difficulties in those centres and conflicts with locals.

    You can't just herd people into sub standard accomodation with hundreds sleeping in halls and expect everything to be fine.

    They should never have been allowed inside the border in the first place.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 255 ✭✭SellingJuan


    Merkel's search for cheap labor....
    You will have people on this forum making excuses for this kind of behavior which is sick in itself.
    As a poster mentioned above, if it was to happen to them or their family they'd be humming a different tune.

    As for the repercussions it is clear they cannot function within a civilized society, so they should be sent home. This would not be seen as special treatment, just look at any Irish who go on visa to the States, one offense and boom your sent home.

    There should never be any tolerance for rape ever...


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  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    They should never have been allowed inside the border in the first place.

    No they should not.


  • Registered Users Posts: 218 ✭✭LincolnsBeard


    Jesus wept when is madness going to stop?

    When you stop the mass migration of 'refugees'/migrants from the third world into Europe.

    So never.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    kstand wrote: »
    The idiocy of western liberals is astounding. I've heard the line "well the Irish were immigrants were centuries". How many Irish went and emigrated en masse to countries like Syria or any Islamic country for that matter?

    The Irish went to places like New York to live in ghettos and work their arses off in menial jobs to try and make a better life for themselves and families. If things went belly up, they'd be out on the streets.

    There was no sense of entitlement, they knew it was going to be rough going from the get go.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 820 ✭✭✭BunkMoreland


    emo72 wrote: »
    20 sexual assaults at the one time and place is not uncommon? where?

    Raqqa


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 146 ✭✭VickieVexed1


    Loving this thread, finally folk get to voice their opinions (whether others agree or not).
    Sadly I would bet my last €, by the time I log on tomorrow, this thread will be locked.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,248 ✭✭✭kstand


    The Irish went to places like New York to live in ghettos and work their arses off in menial jobs to try and make a better life for themselves and families. If things went belly up, they'd be out on the streets.

    There was no sense of entitlement, they knew it was going to be rough going from the get go.

    My point is that we emigrated to Anerica, England, Canada, Australia and a few to Argentina one time. This moronic mantra that we just emigrated with overtones that it was every country in the world is complete rubbish. And then using that to defend and support the mass migration of people from Islamic countries into Europe, it's wrong on every level. The cultures in my opinion are far too diametrically opposed and different.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    BeerWolf wrote: »
    Find it beyond PATHETIC that you get officials and media covering it up because of the "racial tensions"... it is what it ****ing is, why protect these filth !?
    They are protecting Mental Merkel from scandal lest she lose her saintly status.
    Letree wrote: »
    Why? who gave them that idea. Did they think they were going to come to Europe and get nice houses, jobs etc etc. They were fools if they thought that.
    Irish Holy Catholic NGOs singing them Percy French songs in the camps,

    Oh, Mohammed, this Hamburg's a wonderful sight,
    With people all working by day and by night.
    Sure, they don't sow potatoes, nor barley, nor wheat,
    But there's gangs of them digging dipping for gold in the street.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 820 ✭✭✭BunkMoreland


    Why anyone would think bringing thousands of poor, uneducated, culturally incompatible peoples into a country is a good thing is beyond me.

    What contribution can they make? For the small few that genuinely want to integrate the cost of educating them would be enormous. And even then what can they do, work ****ty jobs and generate **** all taxes. Such drain a country and on the existing citizens who have to fund the whole exercise.

    And that's before taking into account the crime and raping and disorder and such.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    I worked with American broadcaster for 18 months back in 2006-7.mentioned this before in other posts. 2-3 posters can back it up, but that's another matter.

    I'm not saying I know more then anyone, I just know that what Europe is doing is a good thing, just not the right way.

    I have the deepest sympathy for refugees, but I know for pretty much fact that they're High enough minority that are there for more dangerous reasons

    Go to Malmo in Sweden or Brussels walk around some of those streets and then people will know why some are concerned.

    I just don't want to see women get raped, I don't Want see children get raped. I don't want Gays getting hanged, I don't want people to murder or blow themselves up over religion(we don't want The North on bigger scale), I don't want division and hate in people.

    But we are making a right **** up of this crisis and if it's not sorted we be living in extremely dangerous society within 10-15 years in Western World, make no bones about it.

    It's bed time :)

    No, I trust you. As long as it wasn't Fox ;-)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭nokia69


    Why anyone would think bringing thousands of poor, uneducated, culturally incompatible peoples into a country is a good thing is beyond me.

    In general the left like it because they want to call anyone who points out the many downsides a racist, which of course would make them the anti-racists

    its virtue signalling nothing more, it would actually be funny if the downsides weren't so serious


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    Why anyone would think bringing thousands of poor, uneducated, culturally incompatible peoples into a country is a good thing is beyond me.

    What contribution can they make? For the small few that genuinely want to integrate the cost of educating them would be enormous. And even then what can they do, work ****ty jobs and generate **** all taxes. Such drain a country and on the existing citizens who have to fund the whole exercise.

    And that's before taking into account the crime and raping and disorder and such.

    because they are fleeing war and terror.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    Eutow wrote: »
    How do you do this? What if they don't want to assimilate?



    There are Irish people on the waiting list for housing. If Ireland takes in immigrants where do they go? Do they get ahead of Irish people in the waiting list? If the country can't house their own people, how do they house thousands of immigrants?

    The answer to your question is Yes they do get priority over Irish citizens as shown below...

    @RTE

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/1215/753774-refugee-council/
    So far this year 129 refugees have arrived in the country from camps in Jordan and Lebanon and have participated in language training and orientation programmes.

    48 of them have now completed the programmes and have been moved to permanent accommodation in local authority housing in Thurles, Portlaoise, Killarney and Tralee.

    Basically after 3 months they get housed by the council while folk have been waiting 15 years or more.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 820 ✭✭✭BunkMoreland


    mansize wrote: »
    because they are fleeing war and terror.

    All the way to Germany / Western Europe? They were safe much closer to home.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    All the way to Germany / Western Europe? They were safe much closer to home.

    They all can't stay in Turkey.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭nokia69


    mansize wrote: »
    because they are fleeing war and terror.

    And bringing war and terror


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    nokia69 wrote: »
    And bringing war and terror

    not hyperbole


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    mansize wrote: »
    because they are fleeing war and terror.

    that's the sad part, many many are fleeing , and many that have come with them are the perpertrators of this sort of stuff :


    but this is a step up
    Friday 5 July 2013

    Among the masses dancing, singing and honking horns, more than 80 women were subjected to mob sexual assaults, harassment or rape. In Tahrir Square since Sunday, when protests against Morsi first began, there have been at least 169 counts of sexual mob crime.

    "Egypt is full of sexual harassment and people have become desensitised to it – but this is a step up," said Soraya Bahgat, a women's rights advocate and co-founder of Tahrir Bodyguard, a group that rescues women from assault. "We're talking about mob sexual assaults, from stripping women naked and dragging them on the floor – to rape."
    Since Sunday, campaigners say at least one woman has been raped with a sharp object.
    Such crimes have been endemic at protests since at least the 2011 revolution, but they have never been documented in such high numbers.
    "It's been underreported because a lot of people are unwilling to come forward," said Bahgat


    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/05/egypt-women-rape-sexual-assault-tahrir-square


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭nokia69


    mansize wrote: »
    They all can't stay in Turkey.

    as if Turkey is the only other muslim country in the world

    A while back I heard Ban Ki Moon saying that Europe and Germany need to do more to help Syrian and other refugees, this made me wonder how many his own country would be taking in, not many I would wager

    the people of Europe are the biggest mugs in the world


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 820 ✭✭✭BunkMoreland


    mansize wrote: »
    They all can't stay in Turkey.

    They all didn't have to leave in the first place either. Plenty of cities / regions in Syria are safe / untouched.

    Perhaps they should try stay and fight for their country, improve it, make it a better place to live. I guess it's much easier move to a country where you get everything for free.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭nokia69


    mansize wrote: »
    not hyperbole

    Just the facts

    It must be pretty terrifying for a German woman to be gang rapped by a mob of Syrians, the same will happen here soon enough

    And so too will the bombs and the war


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,227 ✭✭✭The Highwayman


    mansize wrote: »
    because they are fleeing war and terror.



    They past though a lot of countries before they got to Germany


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,360 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    gctest50 wrote: »
    that's the sad part, many many are fleeing , and many that have come with them are the perpertrators of this sort of stuff :


    but this is a step up

    This quote from that article sounds like the same MO as the incidents in Cologne if witness accounts are to be believed. One woman there reported having her tights and skirt ripped off. Sounds terrifying, but just another night in a large city and not uncommon according to one poster.

    In a typical attack, lines of men push their way through the packed square, surround lone women, and start ripping at their clothes until they are naked. Some women have been violated by men using their hands.

    "Suddenly, I was in the middle, surrounded by hundreds of men in a circle that was getting smaller and smaller around me," one woman has written of the experience. "At the same time, they were touching and groping me everywhere and there were so many hands under my shirt and inside my pants."


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    I seriously think the folks on-high in Brussels and Germany are all mentally insane/psychotic. Why force-flood every EU member state with uneducated 3rd world peoples with the thinking of ownership over women and the belief system that they can do what they want, when they want, to women. Is there some other agenda going on here from up-on-high that we just don't know about yet ?

    Why destroy modern EU member countries and put your own modern thinking citizens at such risk and in such barbarity from these migrants/foreigners ? is someone trying to destabilise the EU member states ? I wonder what the bigger agenda is for all of this, and who is telling Merkel what to do.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,571 ✭✭✭0byme75341jo28


    We need to keep these absolute scumbags out of our country. Honestly, fúck the refugees and their disgusting backwards religion. Let us live our lives in peace, and let them do what they want in their own dump back in the middle East.

    How anyone can defend that scum is beyond me.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    nokia69 wrote: »
    Just the facts

    It must be pretty terrifying for a German woman to be gang rapped by a mob of Syrians, the same will happen here soon enough

    And so too will the bombs and the war

    I think the guilty ones see it as a war already

    this kinda thing :

    The wave of robberies the city of Malmö has witnessed during this past year is part of a “war against the Swedes.” This is the explanation given by young robbers from immigrant backgrounds when questioned about why they only rob native Swedes, in interviews with Petra Åkesson for her thesis in sociology. “I read a report about young robbers in Stockholm and Malmö and wanted to know why they rob other youths. It usually does not involve a lot of money,” she says. She interviewed boys between 15 and 17 years old, both individually and in groups.

    Almost 90% of all robberies reported to the police were committed by gangs, not individuals. “When we are in the city and robbing we are waging a war, waging a war against the Swedes.” This argument was repeated several times. “Power for me means that the Swedes shall look at me, lie down on the ground and kiss my feet.” The boys explain, laughingly, that “there is a thrilling sensation in your body when you’re robbing, you feel satisfied and happy, it feels as if you’ve succeeded, it simply feels good.”


  • Registered Users Posts: 7 Pluflk


    I'd probably find the hypocrisy & number of times pro-immigration supporters have been proven wrong on this issue funny. If it wasn't for it being real & causing such harm & severity to individuals and communities.


    Just off the top of my head some bullsh*t that was heard during summer 2015 & leading up to the Paris attacks.

    - the immigrants are highly skilled. Not only was this quickly shown to be false, but has estimations that will cost a fortune to train

    - They are needed to support the aging workforce. In light of the costs to integrate and educate, it raises serious questions on why local EU nations experiencing unemployment such as Greece/Spain weren't utilised for the workforce as would be expected under the eu objectives.

    - As per usual any objections to pro immigration on the grounds of terrorism (some racist, some legitimate concerns) was met with name calling and character judging. This was heard from Merkel a number of times in regards to Ireland not doing enough & Poland/hungarys nationalistic response as sovereign nations to act in the interest of their own people first and foremost.

    - The death of a young boy from drowning is blood on the EUs hands for not doing enough to help. So the response is to support illegal trafficking, import thousands of immigrants who will have no want to return to their homelands over the EU when the region is stabilised, and disregard policies left right and centre.


    Pro immigration supporters seem unable to answer how many murders, rapes, assaults, general violence etc are acceptable before they admit their might be a problem they did not foresee in their support of importing mass numbers of immigrants from a different culture; a culture, history & religion they quite frankly from my experiences don't understand yet seem determined to protect at the cost of their own. These supporters are often the type who supported all the inane social justice campaigns of last year like gamer gate, New York woman getting harassed for 10hrs etc.
    Yet have their heads in the sands over both reported and anecdotal scenarios claiming no true Scotsman/Muslim when a Muslim-derived terrorist group shoot up France, when native European women & female children are raped by immigrants such as in Finland and Sweden, when native women in Germany are recommended to dress more modestly so as not to incite assault around these camp areas, when mass assaults occur in camps over simply religious denominations, when anti-rape courses are provided to immigrant men, when immigrants camp out on the remains of others in a cemetery & leave it thrashed.

    It's honestly mind boggling that these are the type of people pro immigration supporters want in Ireland and other eu countries, or see as "minor" collateral effects of their open door policy. I've tried to understand it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    There are genuine refugees fleeing their country, but it is impossible to distinguish between them and the crazy ones. I'm sure the genuine refugees are still stuck in their own land of war not being able to get out because they have feck-all money to do so, while the migrants have the money and of which are the ones flooding us like a rain that never stops.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,564 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    Stheno wrote: »
    A lot of the refugees in Germany are being housed in gyms, community centres, and unused industrial spaces.

    There have been numerous articles online about the difficulties in those centres and conflicts with locals.

    You can't just herd people into sub standard accomodation with hundreds sleeping in halls and expect everything to be fine.

    Stheno you cannot expect or excuse rape as a symptom of sub standard accommodation. That's madness.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,498 ✭✭✭Dick phelan


    Reading this thread it is actually disgusting the depths some people will go to defend these actions, Basically making out like it's our fault this happened, if we didn't house them in such poor conditions ect, Listen you could put these animals in mansions and they would still behave like that, absolutely zero to do with living conditions, it's their ideology and belief's, they view women like cattle to be used by them however they wish, The leaders of Saudi Arabia live in some amazing conditions but that hasn't stopped them from holding such backward views on women, How dare anyone try and find any justification for these monsters or to say in anyway it's Europe's fault for not integrating them right or some other BS, these people come to Europe be given refuge and be looked after while showing zero respect for our values or citizens, time to tell them to F Off.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭purplepanda


    nokia69 wrote: »
    as if Turkey is the only other muslim country in the world

    A while back I heard Ban Ki Moon saying that Europe and Germany need to do more to help Syrian and other refugees, this made me wonder how many his own country would be taking in, not many I would wager

    the people of Europe are the biggest mugs in the world

    South Korea & nearby Japan don't do mass immigration, in fact there are more asylum seekers / economic migrants from nearby SE asian nations in western european countries.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 368 ✭✭xband


    I'm a bit confused about the expectation of immediate housing.

    No country has that number of freely available houses / apartments just sitting ready to handover to anyone moving there. Most cities are at best in a state of equilibrium with their housing markets.

    Germany and other countries have taken in very large numbers of asylum seekers in a huge wave of relatively chaotic immigration. They literally cannot accommodate them any other way than in emergency centres like this.

    Where exactly do commentators think they would have a few hundred thousand empty houses on standby at short notice?

    Yes, the conditions aren't ideal but if you're fleeing a war zone surely you'd have some sense that at least you're safe and somewhere there is a possibility of leading a normal, happy life.

    I'm getting the impression that many people have some notion the streets are paved with gold and then are getting disillusioned by the fact that they're actually seeking asylum, not just arriving and instantly achieving middle class lifestyles - If you arrive in a country with a large number of others, without high demand skills and with no / limited grasp of the local language, it's going to take time to integrate and do anything really.

    Seems the mythology about Germany vs the reality of life as a refugee or asylum seeker aren't in line at all.

    As for using conditions to excuse violent behaviour - that just doesn't make sense. Yeah, people are traumatised, but it doesn't give anyone a right to behave like what's being reported in Cologne.

    All they're doing is providing the German far right and other European far right groups the excuse to tar everyone with the same brush.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,039 ✭✭✭force eleven


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    I always find it funny when people use the term "liberal" in a pejorative way, as if being liberal is a bad thing.

    There is virtually 100% liberal bias in the Irish mainstream media today. Holding a conservative or 'traditional' view is immediately attacked these days. Being 'liberal' is not a bad thing but being liberal and intolerant of other viewpoints is.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭dissed doc


    xband wrote: »
    I'm a bit confused about the expectation of immediate housing.

    .....

    All they're doing is providing the German far right and other European far right groups the excuse to tar everyone with the same brush.

    NGOs and social media, encouraged by Merkel created the expectation. It is like a Facebook house party where hundreds show up and trash the house. Rumours spread quickly and easily. You are seeing young violent men from places that by custom rape women to own them.

    Now they are here they are enriching European life with this aggressive behaviour, sexually assaulting women - maybe even your mother or sister or girlfriend could get lucky and be chosen - to bring this temperament to Europe.

    This is what Angela "Migrant" Merkel wants from her secure Berlin office. This is what Peter "Sneering" Sutherland wants from his London mansion.

    "wir schaffen das". "we can do it". We can turn your safe European life into an Islamic fundamentalist sh1thole. It is just easier to come down to their level rather than bring theirs up to ours.

    Group rapes in Syria but not in Europe? wir schaffen das!

    Violent attacks on non-Muslims on a regular basis? Wir schaffen das!

    Ghettoisation and poverty in the middle east but not yet so bad in Europe? Wir schaffen das!

    For everything else there is Mastercard...


  • Registered Users Posts: 7 Fr. Jemima Racktouey


    A lot of good points made so far on here. I fully agree with the poster who said when the Irish emigrated to USA, Canada, Australia etc they had nothing but the shirt on their backs. They had to work hard and got no state help from their host country. You either made it or you were on the street. I feel in Europe we are expected to provide migrants with things over and above what they'd get in most countries of the world.


    I've always maintained from early on in the Middle East crisis that it's common sense that most refugees should be hosted in the surrounding Arab and Gulf countries. Culturally and socially there are much closer links than states in Europe. Some of these Gulf countries have vast petrodollar fuelled resources that could easily provide accommodation and services to refugees. Furthermore when the conflict eventually subsides refugees would be more likely to return to Syria/Iraq if they are located on the Arabian peninsula rather than based in Europe. I feel no pressure was exerted on these countries to pitch in. They are all well able to fund the conflict and keep it going but don't want to deal with the fallout. This piece illustrates why refugees are choosing Europe. Basically they have more rights and benefits plus a lot of Gulf countries aren't party to the U.N.refugee charter and don't offer citizenship to foreigners.


    It seems as if ordinary Germans are copping on to the open arms policy of Merkel.
    (Not allowed to post the survey but it's available online in December 2015. Basically it says Germans are becoming sceptical of economic benefits accruing from migrants)

    Germany have taken in upwards of 1.1m refugees last year which is a noble undertaking. However what if another million or probably more arrive this year? Then what? What if another million arrive in 2017? The unrestricted entry of so many people is naive at best. I can't find the article but I remember hearing recently on the radio that by German government figures they estimate that only 6-10% are able to participate in the workforce straight away. This isn't really surprising but was airbrushed when we were encouraged to take masses of unskilled, with no host country language, 3rd world people. What do you expect? How much will it cost to educate/train the remainder? Will the females be "allowed" to work by their patriarchal families?
    If there was a labour shortage or worrying future demographics why didn't they entice unemployed people from Spain or Greece who generally would be skilled and would just need to become proficient in German.


    I am personally for immigration but it must be tightly controlled. Many of the nationalities are not countries currently embroiled in war e.g. Pakistan, most of Africa, Balkans etc so should be given short shrift. Also another query I have re refugees is I'd imagine most countries they're leaving wouldn't have a good civil administration or are unorganized at best. Hence they could have no documents or bogus ones. They could lie about country of origin and say they've no papers. What is the response to that? A small few could be criminals (both petty and serious) in their native states but because of poor record keeping there's no way of verifying their status. For instance if I want to go live in Australia, Canada, USA, Gulf and there's even a whiff of a criminal incident on my record I'll be denied entry (and rightly so). I just imagine that with such a surge of people coming at once (plus pressure from the PC brigade) it's impossible to have proper checks and verification on all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 368 ✭✭xband


    I think though the migrant crisis is showing some very serious fundemental problems with the structure of the EU.

    Like the Eurozone crisis, we are seeing a situation where a messy compromise of trying to create some aspects of a federation without the necessary instruments of government and democratic oversight.

    The Schengen members have created a total freedom of movement bloc and a common visa system without an equivalent to a Department of Foreign Affairs, without really harmonising immigration policies, without having a federal borders agency or any kind of federal police force and with relatively rudimentary levels of coordination between police forces that aren't really much deeper than Interpol.

    We constantly try to have it both ways : federal systems and rights without any of the structures necessary to support them because politically it's a hot potato that nobody will discuss.

    I personally don't see anything wrong with having federal bodies in Europe on a narrow range of areas doing things right, with proper democratic oversight.

    What we're ending up with instead is a central civil service without any of that and decisions and structures are being dreamt up through knee jerk panic responses to crisis.

    The Eurozone issues were all similar - jump to merge everything. Bubbles happened. Everyone rushed to blame everyone else and we put ourselves into unnecessarily precarious fiscal and banking messes for absolutely no reason other than lack of cooperation.

    The EU needs to really decide : is it a federation or is it just an international cooperative body. It's a unique and potentially very liberating and great thing, but it's being led by people with no vision and being allowed to lurch from crisis to crisis.

    A few more of these messes and it'll just fall apart and that won't benefit anyone.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,104 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    steddyeddy wrote: »
    Stheno you cannot expect or excuse rape as a symptom of sub standard accommodation. That's madness.

    Where did she do that?

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Next they'll be coming into our country, stealing our sex abuse and cover ups...


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 chillybilly


    Most countries in the Balkans are already given short shrift and many are refused visas and residence permits even if they emigrate legally. For years my wife was treated like a leper because she came from a wartorn country (for work, not as a refugee) and endured racist slurs by people who don't even know where her country is and/or assume it to be some backwards shtiehole where everyone marries their cousin. Don't drag them into this, and don't tar them with the same brush. I know it's now kosher to harass Eastern Europeans because they're white but they're not the ones raping women on the streets of Berlin and never have been.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,104 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    There is virtually 100% liberal bias in the Irish mainstream media today. Holding a conservative or 'traditional' view is immediately attacked these days. Being 'liberal' is not a bad thing but being liberal and intolerant of other viewpoints is.

    Well thats not true at all. George Hook. Kevin Myers. David Quinn. Breda O'Brien. Brenda Power. Ian O'Doherty. Eamon Delaney. Mary Ellen Synon. Eoghan Harris. Stephen Collins. Richard Waghorne. Ruth Dudley Edwards. John Waters. None of them are liberals at all.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    The answer to your question is Yes they do get priority over Irish citizens as shown below...

    @RTE

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/1215/753774-refugee-council/



    Basically after 3 months they get housed by the council while folk have been waiting 15 years or more.

    Probably into houses that have been refused by people offered them. Which is a whole other problem!

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Most countries in the Balkans are already given short shrift and many are refused visas and residence permits even if they emigrate legally...I know it's now kosher to harass Eastern Europeans because they're white but they're not the ones raping women on the streets of Berlin and never have been.

    According to the link in the OP, one woman. Cologne.

    As for rape in other countries and by other European people, we saw it on a mass scale during the Bosnian conflict. Where Muslims were very much the victims.


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