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Writing a letter 37 years later

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    #32
    qwerty13
    Registered Users Posts: 1,272 ✭✭✭qwerty13


    Did your therapist ask you to think about what it would mean for you to write the letter, or to do the exercise of writing it, or to actually write and send it? I think you should clarify this. And talk through how you might feel if you get no response, or if this person badmouths you to others - I’d see both as likely outcomes.


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    #33
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,323 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    johnmck wrote: »
    No chance of him hurting me again. He has one son. They are not the dangerous kind. Upstanding citizens of society they'd be seen as. If I go ahead with this, as I said, I'll not be typing me name. It's more an exercise for me to clear my head of it.

    I done something similar last year with somebody who stole a lot of personal belongings off me and it really helped me to leave it behind and shut the door on it once and for all.

    Anyway, I'll give it some more thought

    Physical hurt is not the only kind.

    There is also psyscological, legal and financial kind.

    But good luck with it. I hope you find peace and some positive outcome. Thanks for reply.


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    #34
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    How so? Its a private letter between two adults.

    Provided it's not threatening or blackmail, I see no issue

    Because its accusatory in nature and as far as the law is concerned is completely unfounded. (op I'm not saying your memory is right or wrong just stating a fact)
    People react poorly to accusations especially one of a criminal nature.


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    #35
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    The legal angle is speeding and leaving the scene.

    "Sort of wrong"? He left s child injured on the street after hitting him!

    Not strictly true based on what the person you replied to said it seems they may be thinking in line of civil liability and:
    A. The child contributorily negligent
    B. Is the child's parents contributorily negligent.
    In which case there's case law to cover that.

    I'm terms of a criminal aspect we all know 100% how a hit and run of a child is treated.


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    #36
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,218 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    johnmck wrote: »
    My memory is solid on it, it's something he said about the toy he would give me, because he would be the only person who had access to them. I remember going to his house in my cast , knocking on the door and asking for it.

    As for the other people saying I need counselling , this is something that has come up in counselling.
    I'd feel writing the letter would get it off my chest once and for all

    Discuss it with your counsellor and follow that track if you are both in agreement. There are laws against harassment but that requires a level of persistence in the level of contact. You could speak with a solicitor but I suspect that a once off letter as part of a therapeutical regimen would not breach any laws. Did he ever give you the toy? If yes, did your parents know?


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    #37
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,218 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    nibtrix wrote: »
    Well it’s in the UK rather than Ireland, but here’s a recent example where a private letter has been recorded by the police as a hate “incident”:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showthread.php?t=2058181815

    Something being recorded as a "hate incident" is not a record of a crime.


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    #38
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Because its accusatory in nature and as far as the law is concerned is completely unfounded. (op I'm not saying your memory is right or wrong just stating a fact)
    People react poorly to accusations especially one of a criminal nature.

    I can accuse you off whatever I want in private.

    The law has no bearing in the regard.
    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Not strictly true based on what the person you replied to said it seems they may be thinking in line of civil liability and:
    A. The child contributorily negligent
    B. Is the child's parents contributorily negligent.
    In which case there's case law to cover that.

    I'm terms of a criminal aspect we all know 100% how a hit and run of a child is treated.

    A 4 year old has contributory negligence? Balderdash.

    B, morally maybe but I doubt a judge would reduce a payment to a 4 year old because his parents showed him to play outside.


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    #39
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    A 4 year old has contributory negligence? Balderdash.

    B, morally maybe but I doubt a judge would reduce a payment to a 4 year old because his parents showed him to play outside.

    Where did I say they did? I said that was what the person you were quoting may have been getting at please read the post first before jumping to conclusions.

    Morals wouldn't play a factor it would be reasonableness not morality which would be judged.

    The test is the reasonable man not moral man.


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    #40
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    I can accuse you off whatever I want in private.

    The law has no bearing in the regard.



    A 4 year old has contributory negligence? Balderdash.

    B, morally maybe but I doubt a judge would reduce a payment to a 4 year old because his parents showed him to play outside.

    You can indeed and I can react in any manner at the time. That has no bearing on what I said.

    The fact that it's an accusation not backed by solid irrefutable evidence does indeed have a bearing should the recipient or their family react emotionally and lash out


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    #41
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Darc19 wrote: »
    The basic English Bobby can be as thick as two planks. This is shown time and time again and one of the reasons is the low education standards to get in.

    Here you need a far higher standard.

    Doesn't mean all English cops are stupid, but they have more than their fair share of stupidity in the force.

    No, they don't. They are highly regarded globally.

    Here, you need a leaving cert or equivalent. Not much higher really

    Your just throwing mud here and I don't really see why considering your evidence is a stupid decision which was as result of a procedural demand made by outsiders with college degrees.

    It's like calling rank and file Gardai stupid because they implement a system demanded by the inspectorate and minister.


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    #42
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Op you seem to want to write the anonymous letter, ultimately it can't hurt and may prove to be cathartic.

    If you feel its for the best for you, why not the likelihood of anything coming of it is miniscule.


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    #43
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    You can indeed and I can react in any manner at the time. That has no bearing on what I said.

    The fact that it's an accusation not backed by solid irrefutable evidence does indeed have a bearing should the recipient or their family react emotionally and lash out

    I love it when people disregard the area we are in. This is the legal forum. Not the emotional forum.

    Op is asking legality.


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    #44
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Where did I say they did? I said that was what the person you were quoting may have been getting at please read the post first before jumping to conclusions.

    Morals wouldn't play a factor it would be reasonableness not morality which would be judged.

    The test is the reasonable man not moral man.

    Yes and it's balderdash. Plain and simple rubbish.

    You were the one that brought it up. To are the one that claimed I was incorrect on that basis. Not the other user, not the op. You


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    #45
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    I love it when people disregard the area we are in. This is the legal forum. Not the emotional forum.

    Op is asking legality.

    Jesus it appears you love being obtuse for the sake of provoking argument take a minute to read my answers there. Your attitude to posters who disagree with you is a tad off its a discussion of possibilities.

    I've answered mostly from a legal point of view.
    If you can't understand how someone reacting emotionally and lashing out as a result of an unfounded accusatory letter could lead to legal termoil, I honestly can't help you. Guess what the letter could be deemed to have been provocitory in nature.


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    #46
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    Yes and it's balderdash. Plain and simple rubbish.

    You were the one that brought it up. To are the one that claimed I was incorrect on that basis. Not the other user, not the op. You

    Yes I did because you clearly took it from a criminal point of view not the possibility they were looking for an aspect of civil liability.

    It's not balderdash it's covered in first year tort, simply repeating balderdash will not make you correct.


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    #47
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Yes I did because you clearly took it from a criminal point of view not the possibility they were looking for an aspect of civil liability.

    It's not balderdash it's covered in first year tort, simply repeating balderdash will not make you correct.

    So it was you. Well glad we cleared that up.

    Surprised civil liability of a 4 year old in a rta wasn't year one as well


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    #48
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    So it was you. Well glad we cleared that up.

    Surprised civil liability of a 4 year old in a rta wasn't year one as well

    It is, its tort, like I just said. It's a first year subject.

    Never denied it, I stated a fact, you took it as the poster was talking from only a criminal law aspect when they could have been talking about a civil law aspect which their post would hint towards. I also never claimed you were wrong, I stated not strictly true, which it wasn't.
    You then proceeded to try argue, shout balderdash and talk about morality while claiming I forgot we are in a legal discussion forum when my posts were indeed based in law.

    Not everyone understands how contributory negligence works with minors or parents of minors or how it has evolved and changed over time.

    If you'd actually care to civilly discuss the relevant legal possibilities I'm more than happy to. If you'd like to derail further or attempt to attack or question me or my knowledge rather than my post or the topic at hand feel free.

    If someone asks what are the possible legal ramifications of a typed letter with no personal details in it then the answer is zero.
    If you wish to discuss the possible ramifications of posting said letter with all your details in it (the question you asked, that when answered you took exception to) then let's.

    If not let's call it a day and prevent further derailment, from what I can gather the op doesn't want to confront the man in question rather to let him know what the consequences of the actions the op has accused him of are.
    To allow the op to get it off his chest, without consequences or further correspondence.


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    #49
    johnmck
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 415 ✭✭johnmck


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Not strictly true based on what the person you replied to said it seems they may be thinking in line of civil liability and:
    A. The child contributorily negligent
    B. Is the child's parents contributorily negligent.
    In which case there's case law to cover that.

    I'm terms of a criminal aspect we all know 100% how a hit and run of a child is treated.

    I was outside my parents house , in a housing estate, in a country town , on my little tricycle . My parents knew where I was , it was the 80s. In the 80s we didn't come home from dawn til dusk . We weren't watched every second of the day. Wonderful time of my life. No phones, no computers, if I was building huts in the summer , we were collecting conkers in the autumn, or wood for bonfires around Halloween.
    How dare you accuse my parents of being negligent. I had loving, caring parents and a wonderful childhood


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    #50
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,218 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Niner leprauchan wrote: »
    No, they don't. They are highly regarded globally.

    Here, you need a leaving cert or equivalent. Not much higher really

    Your just throwing mud here and I don't really see why considering your evidence is a stupid decision which was as result of a procedural demand made by outsiders with college degrees.

    It's like calling rank and file Gardai stupid because they implement a system demanded by the inspectorate and minister.

    Jus to agree with you, the U.K. minimum educational standard is A-levels which are equivalent to leaving cert. the exceptions are for certain people who are special constables or PCSOs, police community support officers, and then only when they have demonstrated ability.


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    #51
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,876 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    Definitely therapy, maybe some form of ptsd or something, best of luck with it


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    #52
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Because its accusatory in nature and as far as the law is concerned is completely unfounded. (op I'm not saying your memory is right or wrong just stating a fact)
    People react poorly to accusations especially one of a criminal nature.

    There would be a medical record of the injuries ,it would then be up to the accused to disprove the accusation, its not " unfounded "

    There is zero chance of the OP facing sanction for writing a letter , the accused could threaten ramifications but no court would rule in their favour and the accused is not going to want to go public with this ,the OP is not shouting this in a public space, a private letter expressing how this had a profound lasting effect is something many victims of bullying have done and is not defamatory

    Sounds like the OP needs closure and his gut tells him this is what must be done


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    #53
    ztoical
    Registered Users Posts: 4,788 ✭✭✭ztoical


    johnmck wrote: »
    I was outside my parents house , in a housing estate, in a country town , on my little tricycle . My parents knew where I was , it was the 80s. In the 80s we didn't come home from dawn til dusk . We weren't watched every second of the day. Wonderful time of my life. No phones, no computers, if I was building huts in the summer , we were collecting conkers in the autumn, or wood for bonfires around Halloween.
    How dare you accuse my parents of being negligent. I had loving, caring parents and a wonderful childhood

    Wonderful childhood that resulted in you losing a leg? OP if you know the person who hit you then chances are they know who you are, unless they took out a load of children in the area. If you send the letter without signing it, its likely they won't need much help figuring out who sent it and may approach you in person or their family might. Is that something you want? Is that something you are ready for mentally or emotionally? What if they tell you are wrong, that your memory of the event is incorrect? How is that going to impact on your mental health?

    I'm asking what the end goal is. Are you writing the letter for your own well being, as a forum of therapy or are you writing it to achieve something and if so what? Do you want money, justice, an apology? Is the letter closure for you or the start of something?

    I think you should write a letter but like many others have replied I don't think you should send it. I think it would be good to get everything down on paper then really think what it is you want to get from sending it and consider the other things that could happen from sending it that will be out of your control like how he or his family react to the letter.


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    #54
    Mjolnir
    Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    There would be a medical record of the injuries ,it would then be up to the accused to disprove the accusation, its not " unfounded "

    There is zero chance of the OP facing sanction for writing a letter , the accused could threaten ramifications but no court would rule in their favour and the accused is not going to want to go public with this ,the OP is not shouting this in a public space, a private letter expressing how this had a profound lasting effect is something many victims of bullying have done and is not defamatory

    Sounds like the OP needs closure and his gut tells him this is what must be done

    Firstly well done on quoting something completely out of context.

    Second, the accusation that the man in question hit the op is unfounded based on the memory of someone who was at the time four and decades have since passed.
    No one mentioned the actual accident was unfounded or in refute.

    It is not the accused responsibility to prove the did or did not do something, it is to defend their innocence. I think you'll find it is up to the plaintiff/ prosecution to prove a defendant guilty.

    Again taking a post completely out of context, if youd care to read back that post was in a chain of back and forth to a user who asked why the op would do it anonymously and not stick their details in.
    I never mentioned defamation, however more than one communication with an accusation could be deemed to be harassment, even if the accused wrote back asking the op not to contact them again and the op doubled down.
    No one mentioned shouting out in a public sphere, you also can't speak for the accused.

    I've bloody advised the op to do it if it will help him.

    There's little to be gained from trying to refute a point that's been taken completely out of context and adding your own interpretation to it.


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    #55
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Firstly well done on quoting something completely out of context.

    Second, the accusation that the man in question hit the op is unfounded based on the memory of someone who was at the time four and decades have since passed.
    No one mentioned the actual accident was unfounded or in refute.

    It is not the accused responsibility to prove the did or did not do something, it is to defend their innocence. I think you'll find it is up to the plaintiff/ prosecution to prove a defendant guilty.

    Again taking a post completely out of context, if youd care to read back that post was in a chain of back and forth to a user who asked why the op would do it anonymously and not stick their details in.
    I never mentioned defamation, however more than one communication with an accusation could be deemed to be harassment, even if the accused wrote back asking the op not to contact them again and the op doubled down.
    No one mentioned shouting out in a public sphere, you also can't speak for the accused.

    I've bloody advised the op to do it if it will help him.

    There's little to be gained from trying to refute a point that's been taken completely out of context and adding your own interpretation to it.


    i think i read your posts just fine and do not believe i took you out of context

    its a big step for the OP to follow through and send this letter , I seriously doubt they are mistaken about who did this however which is something that has been suggested .

    The only way this could erupt into a legal situation is if the person who the OP believes hit him with their car , were to launch a case , this would then expose what happened to the public , if the person is indeed guilty of doing what the OP claims , This would be a big risk on the part of the person driving the car , if they did it but want to hurt the OP , they need to go through the details of what happened and those details make the individual look like a monster , even the OP lost in court which seems highly unlikely as a private correspondence is not defamation , the reputational damage to the driver of the car would be immense.

    if the OP is correct in assuming who did this to them , i doubt the other individual will report the OP to anyone

    if there is even a tiny chance however that the OP is mistaken and unsure of themselves regarding who did this to them when they were a child , they should of course refrain from sending it

    I once wrote a letter to a workplace bully who caused lasting harm to me over twenty years ago , they replied to me via email , i deleted the attached letter as i had no interest in their response which would likely be justification for their foul deeds , i sent them back an email telling them i would be binning the attached letter

    it felt good getting it off my chest and the need to do so was burning inside me for a long time , it does not however make everything ok again and will not completely deliver justice , you still have to move on afterwards as a small percentage of people out there are just irredeemably bad people


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    #56
    Andrea B.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,920 ✭✭✭Andrea B.


    johnmck wrote: »
    I'm thinking of writing a letter to a man who ran me down as a 4 year old. He smashed my leg and never told my parents. I almost lost my leg because of infection. My parents never knew exactly what happened to me , they just found me lying in the street crying. The only reason I remember who did it is because it came back to me after I had another injury on the same leg. Like a suppressed memory. He asked me to not say a word to my parents and if I did he would give me a toy. I've no doubt it was him as he used to speed on the road we lived in. There's more details, I won't go into that 100 percent makes him the perpetrator after I told my father. Anyway, my leg has never been right since. It has slight muscle wastage and starting to get arthritis in it. I want to let him know after all of this time , without revealing who I am, that what he done was wrong. He will put two and two together and know who has wrote to him, but I'm wondering if in any way me sending the letter would get me into any bother

    Would you be ok with every possible outcome?
    Are there outcomes you could regret?
    If (as a wild example), the letter was straw that broke a camel's back and they were found dead clutching letter? You would be still ok?
    Just saying, as your likely preferred outcome of sending letter is to make someone (justifiably,) feel ****e.


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    #57
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Andrea B. wrote: »
    Would you be ok with every possible outcome?
    Are there outcomes you could regret?
    If (as a wild example), the letter was straw that broke a camel's back and they were found dead clutching letter? You would be still ok?
    Just saying, as your likely preferred outcome of sending letter is to make someone (justifiably,) feel ****e.

    People like the driver in the OP,s story don't do things like commit suicide

    If the person I wrote to 23 years later committed suicide, I'd be over the moon with delight, it's a fantasy however

    Remorseless people don't do things like that


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    #58
    qwerty13
    Registered Users Posts: 1,272 ✭✭✭qwerty13


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    People like the driver in the OP,s story don't do things like commit suicide

    If the person I wrote to 23 years later committed suicide, I'd be over the moon with delight, it's a fantasy however

    Remorseless people don't do things like that

    You don’t know this to be true. What’s true for one person isn’t true for another. And what’s true for the stage of life circumstances for the potential letter recipient then, may not longer be true.

    Putting things in writing gives it permanency. That letter could be used to show others, and create a backlash against the OP. I don’t know about a legal backlash.

    IMO, if the desired outcome is legal or compensation ramifications, then an anonymous letter is a foolish way of going about it, as it will achieve nothing. If the desired outcome is ‘closure’, then the letter does not need to be given to this person - I’d suggest that writing but not sending it, and dealing with it through therapy, is a far better solution. And one with less unforeseen backlash for the OP.


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    #59
    Andrea B.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,920 ✭✭✭Andrea B.


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    People like the driver in the OP,s story don't do things like commit suicide

    If the person I wrote to 23 years later committed suicide, I'd be over the moon with delight, it's a fantasy however

    Remorseless people don't do things like that
    Just asking that OP should consider if they could deal with all known potential outcomes and of course, the unknowns.


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    #60
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    qwerty13 wrote: »
    You don’t know this to be true. What’s true for one person isn’t true for another. And what’s true for the stage of life circumstances for the potential letter recipient then, may not longer be true.

    Putting things in writing gives it permanency. That letter could be used to show others, and create a backlash against the OP. I don’t know about a legal backlash.

    IMO, if the desired outcome is legal or compensation ramifications, then an anonymous letter is a foolish way of going about it, as it will achieve nothing. If the desired outcome is ‘closure’, then the letter does not need to be given to this person - I’d suggest that writing but not sending it, and dealing with it through therapy, is a far better solution. And one with less unforeseen backlash for the OP.

    the OP has not once said they are looking for " compensation "


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    #61
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Andrea B. wrote: »
    Just asking that OP should consider if they could deal with all known potential outcomes and of course, the unknowns.

    dont be coy all of a sudden , you made a highly inflammatory suggestion by posing the idea of the driver in the story taking their own life , its actually offensive what you wrote in that it puts a responsibility on the OP for what the driver could theoretically do , its borderline a form of gas lighting on your part


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