Young wans nowadays

super_furry · 28-08-2019 10:35am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

That a what they tell me anyway.

And that's exactly it. I've an 18-month-old and another one on the way. Hadn't a clue what I was doing at the start and am still learning every day.

Tchaikovsky · 28-08-2019 10:41am

Don't we have the same thread going at the moment, talking about severe anxiety in students?

mariaalice · 28-08-2019 10:42am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

My FIL says they didn't have a clue about having children either. MIL had younger siblings do she had done experience. They just muddled through as best they could. He tells me that we can expect to make bad decisions as parents and there are lots of ways of parenting, the the only thing you HAVE to do is love the children. They Made mistakes, made good decisions and learned as they went. That's what everyone does, isn't it?

That a what they tell me anyway.

Of course, but its more the lack of embarssemet at saying they are too immature int their 20s or even 30s that is a big change. Now maybe people though it 40 years ago but they would not say that in public as society reflect to the person that they were an adult by their 20s with adult responsibility.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 10:46am

mariaalice wrote: »

Of course, but its more the lack of embarssemet at saying they are too immature int their 20s or even 30s that is a big change. Now maybe people though it 40 years ago but they would not say that in public as society reflect to the person that they were an adult by their 20s with adult responsibility.

I wonder if being told they're gobshytes by old people, at every turn, is having the most obvious effect.

is_that_so · 28-08-2019 10:49am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I wonder if being told they're gobshytes by old people, at every turn, is having the most obvious effect.

Which may be a response to what they are calling older people!

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 11:00am

is_that_so wrote: »

Which may be a response to what they are calling older people!

What are they calling old people?

jmayo · 28-08-2019 11:13am

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Firstly I’m auld enough.
Fifteen years or so ago I thought young people coming up were very impressive, very hard working, quite clever, generous to others.
Now it seems to have turned, they want things handy, have a real sense of entitlement, very easily upset and crucially not a bit resilient.

Now don’t get me wrong, of course there were young people with these traits and ones without them now, but generally the point is true.

Would people agree? And what advice would you give to someone looking to make an adult out of someone in their late teens or early 20s now?

Comfort can often breed laziness and complacency.
And life has got more comfortable for a hell of a lot of people in Ireland on the whole.

When I was in school and in college in late 70s, 80s and early 90s, we didn't expect a lot from this country.
Most people, especially in the West, expected to have to at least leave their local area if not the country.
Everyone did not expect third level education.

You didn't expect to be able to buy a new/newish car until you were working for quite a while.
You didn't expect to be able to go on foreign breaks/holidays.
I knew no one that got to go abroad to celebrate leaving cert unless you count working on the buildings in London or the Chunnel.

Now saying that some things were easier.
If you did get to college it was easier and cheaper to live away from home.
If you did get to college you had much better chance of good job as there was way less competition.

And if people did get a job they could afford to move out and even get a mortgage at younger age.
Now of course mortgage rates were indeed high.

Although this does lead me on to another point about more recent generations.
Modern generations expect when they do buy a property to be able to full furnish it from day one, they still expect to be able to afford a nice car and the foreign holidays.
Years ago a property purchase meant you often went without those things for a number of years until "you got on your feet".

Life was simple in many ways, there wasn't this constant need to be "online".
There wasn't this constant need to be putting yourself out there to be judged.

mariaalice · 28-08-2019 11:16am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

What are they calling old people?

They are the cause of high property prices, pampered by the politicians becasue they vote, massive pensions, hoging 3/4-bed houses when they should be happy in a small apartment and give the 3 bed to a family and so on.

mariaalice · 28-08-2019 11:17am

O and free bus passes.

nthclare · 28-08-2019 11:18am

It's very simple.

We grow older we're in our 40' mid 40's in my case.

I'm still in the same business I was when I finished college, looking after parklands, horticulture and tree management.

I'm older wiser and clued in, it took year's of learning about myself, humanity and my quirks and other people's quirks.
Dealing with different personalities, people dealing with my personality....

I'm not as physically fit as I was in the 90's but I'm much more clever and logical with my approach.

It's all about experience, when I was out of college I made mistakes, pissed off bosses for being slower, struggling at times.
Different emotional upheavals, break ups, my son getting very Sick.

Being a bit moody or quite, not firing to my potential...

But my superiors understood a young guys struggles throughout their 20's and thirties.

They let me flourish and learn by my mistakes.

Now I'm standing on my own two feet, running my own department my mentors have retired.

Now I'm managing a new generation of people, and I know they'll be ok as long as they're left to learn their own way.

Push them when they need it without being a dickhead.

After all we've all had to grow up

is_that_so · 28-08-2019 11:19am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

What are they calling old people?

Older not old. Those to blame for their lives being terrible amongst other things.

chrissb8 · 28-08-2019 11:20am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

So do you think those people were always hardy and strong mentally and able to deal with things? Maybe they're skills people learn over time.

Every generation thinks The old people are hardy and young people are rubbish.

So either young people are always lesser than their parents, or young people grow into old people an then complain about how young people are rubbish.

Not too long ago young men from all over the world picked up arms and went to fight tyranny in mainland Europe.

Today we are now "traumatised" by a waiter who said something rude to them. We have gone completely soft.

Presented with something that is difficult and takes effort we crumble. We use anxiety and mental illness, that although very real and prevalent today, as reasons to fall behind in basic life tasks.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 11:48am

chrissb8 wrote: »

Not too long ago young men from all over the world picked up arms and went to fight tyranny in mainland Europe.

Today we are now "traumatised" by a waiter who said something rude to them. We have gone completely soft.

Presented with something that is difficult and takes effort we crumble. We use anxiety and mental illness, that although very real and prevalent today, as reasons to fall behind in basic life tasks.

As long as you're speaking for yourself. I don't recognise the idea that young people today are traumatised by a rude waiter. Some obscure twitter story notwithstanding.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 11:56am

mariaalice wrote: »

They are the cause of high property prices, pampered by the politicians becasue they vote, massive pensions, hoging 3/4-bed houses when they should be happy in a small apartment and give the 3 bed to a family and so on.

So they have their investments and pensions paid by young people who will never have comparable properties or pensions. And they get upset when that pointed out? That's a bit previous, isn't it? Sounds a bit like the dreadful young people they continually call gobshytes and pussies (between cashing rent as pensions).

Church on Tuesday · 28-08-2019 12:06pm

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Firstly I’m auld enough.
Fifteen years or so ago I thought young people coming up were very impressive, very hard working, quite clever, generous to others.
Now it seems to have turned, they want things handy, have a real sense of entitlement, very easily upset and crucially not a bit resilient.

Now don’t get me wrong, of course there were young people with these traits and ones without them now, but generally the point is true.

Would people agree? And what advice would you give to someone looking to make an adult out of someone in their late teens or early 20s now?

An Irish version of Battle Royale.

Edgware · 28-08-2019 12:45pm

chrissb8 wrote: »

Not too long ago young men from all over the world picked up arms and went to fight tyranny in mainland Europe.

Today we are now "traumatised" by a waiter who said something rude to them. We have gone completely soft.

Presented with something that is difficult and takes effort we crumble. We use anxiety and mental illness, that although very real and prevalent today, as reasons to fall behind in basic life tasks.

Most of the whingers ringing Joe Duffy about important matters such as not enough pillows in their hotel room or slow service in McDonalds are Mammies and Daddies.
"Ah Joe the Immigration Official at J.F.K. wouldnt allow my daughter in without a Visa. Its a disgrace Joe after we building America"

the-island-man · 28-08-2019 1:55pm

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

You’re certainly not the type I was referring to! Fair play. A lot of people think this is me being a crotchety aul fella. I don’t think it is, because when I was 50 I was old enough to think like that but it was only in the last few years I’ve seen this in young people. I meet them in different spheres, employ a few, rent houses to a number of them and am involved in a sporting organization with others. The difference in a few years is huge. Btw social media is definitely part of the reason.

I do not think that there is a particular issue with any age group in Ireland. It's the system here. There's always sob stories that will get people out of taking personal responsibility for anything. Sometimes them sob stories are genuine and people need help. I have no facts but it seems like a lot of people are taking the piss:

Tradesmen continuously taking cash in hand
Social Welfare fraud (Public Services Card was meant to stop this)
Goverment \ public service wasting tax payers money and taking the piss with expenses
Tenants expecting more rights without seeing any need to sign up to liability for damage to properties
Landlords thinking they rent out a mouldy kip
Insurance fraud

I cannot say whether or not I would take advantage in any of these situations too but the point is the system should prevent me from doing so or heavily penalise me if I do.

In relation to young people while that "plop on top and skinned around the sides" haircut drives me nuts I would say that they are not the generation who added about 150 billion to the states debt. That **** up will be the defining moment for Ireland in years to come and still there doesn't seem to be any rush to sell off AIB to pay some of it off or to use the money from Apple for the same purpose.

jmayo · 28-08-2019 3:52pm

mariaalice wrote: »

They are the cause of high property prices, pampered by the politicians becasue they vote, massive pensions, hoging 3/4-bed houses when they should be happy in a small apartment and give the 3 bed to a family and so on.

Ah yes why should fook someone who may have worked damn hard all their lives to purchase and maintain a property get to keep it in their old age.
Fook them into a one bed and give it to someone deserving.

Except who figures out who deserves stuff ?
You ?

Talking about a sense of entitlement which is something that has grown out of all proportion in Ireland.
And it now seems to inflict all generations, but most particularly those from 60 downwards.

Ever wonder why we had high property prices even when we had the highest percentage of defaulting mortgages in the whole world ?

Hint, it wasn't pensioners or the ones who had worked damn hard to pay off their mortgages.

It was often generally the 20 somethings to 50 somethings who had blown wads of cash, wrere mortgaged to the hilt, refused to repay their debts and believed they still had a right to keep their homes.

BTW someday you will also be old and might want to keep what you worked damn hard all your life to gain, rather than be fooked out of it and dumped somewhere you have no links to finish out your days.

mariaalice · 28-08-2019 4:49pm

Jaymo I was replying to someone who asked what is said about the older generation.

Sunny Disposition · 28-08-2019 7:43pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Do you said you think young people changedm, en mass, in about 2009. What else changed in 2009?

I wonder if it's even occurred to you that people who were young in 2009 have a completely different set of prospects from old people. Owning a house, having wage growth over a career, career progression, paying more in rent to old people than any geberation has ever paid before. The first 3 are less likely than ever before, the 4th is a certainly.

Young people haven't had fewer prospects than their parents for a few generations, but here we are. Young people are paying unreasonable rent to pay for old people's properties. They're literally buying old people's investments for them, while getting lower pay and almost no wage growth relative to previous generations.

Young people have never had less to gain by bursting their balls paying for other people's investment property, being paid less and getting buckets of abuse from old people.

The social contract has been broken

Ah dry up let you. There are issues for young people now, of course there are. But there’s loads on offer in Ireland, they won’t end up queuing for work at 7am in Kilburn or Woodside or somewhere. Nearly all young ones are going to college too, great prospects with a bit of work.
People telling them they have it hard are doing them no favors, even four years ago things were harder for a lot of people.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 8:15pm

mariaalice wrote: »

Jaymo I was replying to someone who asked what is said about the older generation.

Yes J. They were doing a caricature of someone giving out about old people.

bee06 · 28-08-2019 8:18pm

I wouldn’t agree. We have a grad programme at work and the majority of them are really impressive. Work so hard, pick things up really quickly and happy to help anyone on the team out.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 8:19pm

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Ah dry up let you. There are issues for young people now, of course there are. But there’s loads on offer in Ireland, they won’t end up queuing for work at 7am in Kilburn or Woodside or somewhere. Nearly all young ones are going to college too, great prospects with a bit of work.
People telling them they have it hard are doing them no favors, even four years ago things were harder for a lot of people.

Ok so you've dismissed anything I've said. So what do you think changed in 2009 that affected all young people en masse?

Second question, do you think old people said the same about your generation before you were old?

Yamanoto · 28-08-2019 8:24pm

What gets me is a sizeable proportion of young enough women in particular, with good degrees & in decent jobs, but with no intellectual curiousity about the world whatsoever.

It's all an odd mix of Jägerbombs, Love Island & garlic & cheese chips vommed up in a Taxi on a Friday night.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 9:09pm

Yamanoto wrote: »

What gets me is a sizeable proportion of young enough women in particular, with good degrees & in decent jobs, but with no intellectual curiousity about the world whatsoever.

It's all an odd mix of Jägerbombs, Love Island & garlic & cheese chips vommed up in a Taxi on a Friday night.

What was it like back in your day? Discussing Descartes and the situation in the middle East?

Like most things, I'd say intellectual curiosity and knowledge grow over time. It just seems different because people forget they were ever not so curious or knowledgeable.

Sunny Disposition · 28-08-2019 9:14pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Ok so you've dismissed anything I've said. So what do you think changed in 2009 that affected all young people en masse?

Second question, do you think old people said the same about your generation before you were old?

Don’t know to the first one, don’t think you could say it was that precise, that it all changed in 09.
On the second one I don’t think so, there were other complaints for sure. I was in England for all of my 20s and there was nearly a giddy feeling that people of all ages, young and old, were able to get along without the threat of war. It actually was a bit like here during the boom. Would have worked with a heap of guys who fought and don’t think they felt us younger Irish lads were too bad, maybe some of them felt there should be more rewards for their friends who had fallen on harder times. They were right too.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 10:40pm

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Don’t know to the first one, don’t think you could say it was that precise, that it all changed in 09.
On the second one I don’t think so, there were other complaints for sure. I was in England for all of my 20s and there was nearly a giddy feeling that people of all ages, young and old, were able to get along without the threat of war. It actually was a bit like here during the boom. Would have worked with a heap of guys who fought and don’t think they felt us younger Irish lads were too bad, maybe some of them felt there should be more rewards for their friends who had fallen on harder times. They were right too.

Ok just checking how self aware you are. All generations think they young people are pussies, soft, rude, stupid etc etc etc. Like the quotes I and others have posted, old people say this stuff about young people today and they said the same things thousands of years ago. that’s just how things are for whatever reason.

The fact that you don’t know that old people said it about your generation is telling. You genuinely think you’re original in thinking the young people aren’t as good as the old? Lol.

Yamanoto · 28-08-2019 11:27pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

What was it like back in your day? Discussing Descartes and the situation in the middle East?

Like most things, I'd say intellectual curiosity and knowledge grow over time. It just seems different because people forget they were ever not so curious or knowledgeable.

It was necking yokes in Sir Henry's and nicking traffic cones to take back to pokey rented flats, so I suppose we were fcukin eejits in our own way. But there were also discussions and debate about art, cinema, politics, music, history and comedy.

As for knowledge growing over time, the older I get, the more I realise I know little of the world. Still curious about it mind.

El_Duderino 09 · 28-08-2019 11:54pm

Yamanoto wrote: »

It was necking yokes in Sir Henry's and nicking traffic cones to take back to pokey rented flats, so I suppose we were fcukin eejits in our own way. But there were also discussions and debate about art, cinema, politics, music, history and comedy.

As for knowledge growing over time, the older I get, the more I realise I know little of the world. Still curious about it mind.

Sounds like you were just like the young people today. Young people today smoke and drink less today though. Not sure about drugs.

“As for knowledge growing over time, the older I get, the more I realise I know little of the world. Still curious about it mind”. I get that but it’s a cute way of saying exactly what I said. People grow more curious and knowledgeable about the world over time.

Young people today are the same flesh and blood as every other generation. Giving out about young people is just something old people do.

Young wans nowadays

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