organic farming

you are going back to reps. Under Glas you got paid for Organics too. I'm being told that the Organics payment is going to increase for the Suckler/dry stock side up to that of Dairy which would be €250 / hectare. But nothing official announced yet, we'll just have to wait and see the details but it looks like there is going to be a big push to get a lot of fringe Suckler farmers into the Scheme as it forces a reduction in the herd size

Will 10k do the shed?

Good assessment though. I have done similar.

Did you spread anything artificial on silage ground? If I recall from images your lands would be fairly good and you were grazing in January.

I have done similar assessment (18 cows and 26ha, some of the land very poor). My land type is what is putting me off in one way. As an example it’s impossible avoid damage at different times of the year. There was a down pour in April and the weanlings reddened two small meadows. This will be a mass of weeds and creeping buttercup etc if not sprayed at some point, which you can’t in Organics.

Ah now I've been well behaved lately, it's been over a month since I got a warning!

Don't have to do the course first. I'm after doing it online with https://nots.ie/ I think it's around €200 all done online. I was surprised by how many were already in Organics but were only doing the course now. I was one of the few who did it for investigation purposes first.

Course is ok, Andrew Chilton is the main speaker. I found him very good very knowledgeable and entertaining plus he will go out of his way to get answers to any questions you'd have he can't answer. Every part of the course was online even the "farm walks". Content wise it was good and well worth the entry fee.

My advice would be to do the course first, it will open your eyes. I'm still enthusiastic about organics but I will do a detailed evaluation before making a decision.

Have a notepad and ask every possible question, you are paying so get value for your money.

My main disappointment was a bit of a lack of Top of the range Suckler farmers in Organics. Yes plenty of good Organic dairy and Horticulture operations but the Suckler lads are a bit of a let down. Poor looking stock, and the places look a bit rundown.

Correct, you can't get payments for LIPP and organics on the same parcel. With the new AECM scheme replacing GLAS the hope is that you'll get paid for both. Organic bodies seem to think we will. Time will tell on that though as nothing is confirmed yet.

High input inflation hits conventionals alot harder - just look at the basket case the factory farmed pigs and poultry sector is.

Not saying it doesn't but high prices will reduce the spending power of the shopper and the dearer stuff will be left on the shelf. Wpuld be the same craic with any increase in volume the factories will take any margin to be had

Average suckler herd is 15 cows I think, and majority of beef farmers are not in dero and prob farm rel extensively as it is. Talks of input savings and schemes is all well and good but until the market can return a sustainable price for it, it won't get the take up.

We have "market failure" across the board in most agri commodities atm. Alot of it was caused by market distorting production subs from the 70's onwards. Tis why the CAP needs ongoing radical overhaul. Its not unique to the EU either - similar issues in the US and in rice producing countries across Asia. This was one of the reasons why the US diverted nearly half its corn crop towards the biofuel scam in the past 20 years. Good article in the latest issue of The Economist on these matters

It'll only get easier as more people get into organic sucklers. There's nothing stopping a person selling organic cattle conventionally other than the fact that it sort of defeats the purpose of it.

I don't really buy the paperwork argument either, at least not in beef farming where there wouldn't be much paperwork really.

Fair enough for a horticultural system where everything planted and harvested has to be all recorded. The inspections aren't too bad either, I was quite nervous for my first one but they've all been fine.

The one thing that's always said, is that it's not for everyone, but for sure it's the answer for a lot of people who just don't realize it yet. Certain systems suit certain farmers. There were times when I got quite frustrated with it (still do) but I don't see myself leaving it any time soon.

How do you winter your cows, are they outside all winter?

No you can ouwinter. Herself is in organics and everything is out all year round. Would depend on you're stocking rate though I would imagine.

There’s no requirement to have a shed so? Just certain regulations if you do have one?

Anyone on here running sheep enterprise organically

At it here closed herd,suckler to weaning changed from ch to polled Hereford,perfect animal for the job no anastic easy calving,hardy and no scour problems,agreed no better off price wise but just as much for Hereford organic as ch conventional with less hassle and more calves on the ground

Jesus so much wrong in that post that it's hard to know where to start. Yes stock are to be outdoors for 2/3 of the year but the caveat in the organic standards is "where the weather conditions allow" I know lads in Leitrim housing cows for 5/6 months of the year with no hassle from their inspector, you can't plough the land with stock either as nitrates regs trump Organic regs. There is no one measuring the amount of days cattle are at grass.

Cubicles in any shape or form are allowed either old or new. I bought calves off a guy this year with the new type easyfix cubicles. Once you allow the right amount of space for the animal in the cubicle you're fine and I can't see that changing anytime soon, the lads with Cubicles still have to bed them tho.

Yes sorry doesn't have to be straw, it's the same for lie backs it doesn't have to be straw, I know some lads using woodchip and sawdust. I've heard of lads over Leitrim bedding with dried rushes on the bottom with straw rolled out on top.