Israeli - Palestinian Conflict Threadbans in OP

Housefree · 12-05-2021 4:15pm

ypres5 wrote: »

These people just use Israel as a pinata to vent their anti semitism, I always find it amazing how silent these 'activists' are about the dozens of other counties who commit far far worse crimes than Israel yet it's the one Jewish majority country on the planet that causes such grave offense to them.

Labelling it Anti semitism when you call out Apartheid

Israel is an apartheid state
https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/04/27/abusive-israeli-policies-constitute-crimes-apartheid-persecution

Palestinians live under constant human rights abuses
https://www.amnesty.org/en/countries/middle-east-and-north-africa/israel-and-occupied-palestinian-territories/report-israel-and-occupied-palestinian-territories/

Ireland has a great Palestinian solidarity group
https://www.ipsc.ie/

Make sure you check out the boycott campaign
https://bdsmovement.net/

Israel employs an army of social media warriors, make sure you don't get caught up debating them
https://electronicintifada.net/content/inside-israels-million-dollar-troll-army/27566

wes · 12-05-2021 4:17pm

ypres5 wrote: »

These people just use Israel as a pinata to vent their anti semitism, I always find it amazing how silent these 'activists' are about the dozens of other counties who commit far far worse crimes than Israel yet it's the one Jewish majority country on the planet that causes such grave offense to them.

Falsely accusing others of racism, while supporting an ethno state is some hypocrisy

.

Those who support Israel, an ethno state, something the Israeli government has made clear via the nation state law, referred to earlier in this thread, are clearly racist.

Fandymo · 12-05-2021 4:25pm

Housefree wrote: »

https://bdsmovement.net/pinkwashing

Rory Cowan is a famous Irish pinkwasher.

J Mysterio · 12-05-2021 4:29pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Do you think the IRA forcibly removed the British army from Ireland and that this led to independence? Guerilla warfare achieved very little. World War 1 was the catalyst for our independence.

The aim was to make it difficult or impossible for the English to continue in the effective colonial administration of Ireland. That was achieved and brought England to the negotiating table. Guerilla warfare achieved a lot. Obviously WW1 and other external factors were an enormous help.

ypres5 · 12-05-2021 4:32pm

Mysterypunter wrote: »

How anyone can defend the actions of the Israeli government is beyond me, especially Irish people who are subject to an occupation themselves. Israel would not be as bold in their bullying tactics without the backing of the Jewnited States, who are the ultimate bully boys. The influence of Jews in a slow genocide is not surprising, they use the holocaust as a free pass to eradicate their enemies, but are just as bad, and worse in some cases, although nazi Germany set a high benchmark. That still doesn't excuse their behaviour.

What's this occupation I'm currently living under as an Irish person?

Housefree · 12-05-2021 4:32pm

Mysterypunter wrote: »

How anyone can defend the actions of the Israeli government is beyond me, especially Irish people who are subject to an occupation themselves. Israel would not be as bold in their bullying tactics without the backing of the Jewnited States, who are the ultimate bully boys. The influence of Jews in a slow genocide is not surprising, they use the holocaust as a free pass to eradicate their enemies, but are just as bad, and worse in some cases, although nazi Germany set a high benchmark. That still doesn't excuse their behaviour.

Plenty of Jewish people are against the Israeli/Zionist actions.

Fandymo · 12-05-2021 4:35pm

Manic Moran wrote: »

CNN had an interesting OpEd yesterday I had not considered. We have generally been focusing on two-state solutions, mainly because it's the sort of thing we are conditioned to think as 'correct'. Palestine for the palestinians, Israel for the Israelis. The catch with this is that you end up with inter-state power issues. (Legitimate ones, not "we will invade" types).

The proposal was that if the whole shebang is simply given to Israel, and all palestinians given full rights and priviliges accorded to all Israeli citizens, they would not be in an inferior position with respect to 'settlers' under Israeli laws. Quite how protected the 20% of Israelis who are not jews are under Israeli law, I'm not sufficiently up to speed to say. Like anything else Israel-related, a cursory search online results in politically tainted commentary.

Sounds like an excellent idea.

I propose that you head up the Shankill a few weeks after the vote for the unification of Ireland (whenever it happens) and explain to the unionists, that they'll become Irish, but they'll have "full rights and priviliges accorded to all Irish citizens". I'm sure they'd be delighted with that.

Fandymo · 12-05-2021 4:38pm

ypres5 wrote: »

These people just use Israel as a pinata to vent their anti semitism, I always find it amazing how silent these 'activists' are about the dozens of other counties who commit far far worse crimes than Israel yet it's the one Jewish majority country on the planet that causes such grave offense to them.

What other first world countries massacre children daily? Arrest kids daily? Bomb residential areas daily? Bulldoze minorities homes daily?

Mimon · 12-05-2021 4:39pm

ypres5 wrote: »

These people just use Israel as a pinata to vent their anti semitism, I always find it amazing how silent these 'activists' are about the dozens of other counties who commit far far worse crimes than Israel yet it's the one Jewish majority country on the planet that causes such grave offense to them.

I actually take offence at you accusing me of being an anti semite because I do not agree with how Israel act in these situations. Cop to fk on

12-05-2021 4:40pm

wes wrote: »

Falsely accusing others of racism, while supporting an ethno state is some hypocrisy .

Those who support Israel, an ethno state, something the Israeli government has made clear via the nation state law, referred to earlier in this thread, are clearly racist.

Israel is an ethno state in the same way the Islamic Republic of Iran is. Why do you make it sound worse than Iran?

ypres5 · 12-05-2021 4:41pm

Fandymo wrote: »

What other first world countries massacre children daily? Arrest kids daily? Bomb residential areas daily? Bulldoze minorities homes daily?

Any link to these daily massacres and residential bombings? I'm sure if there were 'massacres' going on daily it might be considered a bit newsworthy

ypres5 · 12-05-2021 4:42pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Israel is an ethno state in the same way the Islamic Republic of Iran is. Why do you make it sound worse than Iran?

Because Jews, some people have a serious problem with Jewish people

12-05-2021 4:42pm

Fandymo wrote: »

What other first world countries massacre children daily? Arrest kids daily? Bomb residential areas daily? Bulldoze minorities homes daily?

What other first world countries have rockets fired at its citizens daily?

Mimon · 12-05-2021 4:44pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Israel is an ethno state in the same way the Islamic Republic of Iran is. Why do you make it sound worse than Iran?

Iranians are living where their ancestors have lived for hundreds/thousands of years.

Israel is ethnically cleansing areas to move into. According to their laws someone who is Jewish from Russia/the U.S./wherever has the right to move to an area that has been stolen off the people who did live there. Bonkers.

ypres5 · 12-05-2021 4:47pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What other first world countries have rockets fired at its citizens daily?

It's amazing how some people hate Jews so much they're willing to side with a bunch of suicidal jihadists out of pure spite

Overheal · 12-05-2021 4:48pm

ypres5 wrote: »

It's amazing how some people hate Jews so much they're willing to side with a bunch of suicidal jihadists out of pure spite

It's not possible to just express distaste with other humans blowing up other humans? It automatically must be anti-semitism if it's the IDF doing the blowing up?

Mimon · 12-05-2021 4:49pm

ypres5 wrote: »

Because Jews, some people have a serious problem with Jewish people

Is it possible for you to make some sort of point and contribute to the thread instead of falsely accusing people of being anti semites because their opinion differs from yours.

12-05-2021 4:49pm

ypres5 wrote: »

These people just use Israel as a pinata to vent their anti semitism, I always find it amazing how silent these 'activists' are about the dozens of other counties who commit far far worse crimes than Israel yet it's the one Jewish majority country on the planet that causes such grave offense to them.

Every country can (more or less) claim to be the one <name the ethnic group> majority country in the world. China is the one Chinese majority country in the world. And Russia is the one Russian majority country on the world.

And why should we be allowed, using this logic, to criticise Russia? Didn’t the Nazis kill millions of Russians. Wasn’t the idea to exterminate the slavs and move them back past the Urals. Are critics of Russians like Nazis?

Far from being over covered Israel barely makes the news. Shootings of Palestinians go on all the time but are not covered.

This is big news.

12-05-2021 4:56pm

ypres5 wrote: »

It's amazing how some people hate Jews so much they're willing to side with a bunch of suicidal jihadists out of pure spite

It just seems to me that people have no sense of perspective on history or current affairs.

If somebody with a slightly light skin tone does something against a darker skin tone, it must be racist and is the most evil thing in the world. Libya would be a place of far worse evil than Israel yet most people couldn't give a monkeys about it.

Overheal · 12-05-2021 4:57pm

ypres5 wrote: »

I always find it amazing how silent these 'activists' are about the dozens of other counties who commit far far worse crimes than Israel.

What other country besides Israel is engaged in ethnic cleansing and also is a defacto partner and ally to the United States? What other country does the US defend in the security counsel for that activity? What other country does every US presidential candidate swear to defend?

There are a whole host of reasons to be critical of Israel none of which hinge upon Judaism, a fact underscored by the overwhelming lack of discussion of the religion or the ethnicity that would normally be seen in parallel discussions about Islamic aggression, which is almost universally attributed to religion and ethnicity. You don't need to know the depths of Islam or Judaism to find the violence there appalling.

Fandymo · 12-05-2021 4:57pm

ypres5 wrote: »

Any link to these daily massacres and residential bombings? I'm sure if there were 'massacres' going on daily it might be considered a bit newsworthy

Thats just the Gaza Strip: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_Israeli_attacks_on_the_Gaza_Strip

IDF using children as human shields: "Amnesty International's report into the 2008 Gaza War stated that they had found instances in which the IDF endangered the lives of civilians, including children, by using them as human shields."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/7/31/palestinian-baby-burned-to-death-in-settler-attack

Its there if you look for it.

Housefree · 12-05-2021 4:57pm

Israel is the only apartheid State in the world

https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/04/27/abusive-israeli-policies-constitute-crimes-apartheid-persecution

namloc1980 · 12-05-2021 5:00pm

ypres5 wrote: »

Because Jews, some people have a serious problem with Jewish people

Bravo. Everyone who criticises Israel is a Jew hater right? It's so predictable in every thread about Israeli actions that the anti-Semitic card is thrown out.

igCorcaigh · 12-05-2021 5:01pm

Wow, that's some scene on the live cam...

Stovepipe · 12-05-2021 5:04pm

Mimon wrote: »

Israel purports to be a civilized state. Ridiculous comparison/whataboutery here.

It is, compared to Lebanon, Syria and a few other Arab states. Every time fighting like this kicks off, the many Palestinians who work in Israel have to stay home and don't get an income so they suffer the law of unintended consequences. Hamas clearly don't give a flying **** about their own people,as they are prepared to have Gaza flattened to achieve the square root of nothing. Even Hizbollah,not known to be unwilling to fight to the death against Israel, realised that they were on a hiding to nothing by fighting Israel. They effectively dominate a large chunk of Lebanon so they somewhere to live and as long as they don't provoke Israel, they get to live normal lives.

namloc1980 · 12-05-2021 5:08pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Wow, that's some scene on the live cam...

What cam?

Manic Moran · 12-05-2021 5:09pm

Fandymo wrote: »

Sounds like an excellent idea.

I propose that you head up the Shankill a few weeks after the vote for the unification of Ireland (whenever it happens) and explain to the unionists, that they'll become Irish, but they'll have "full rights and priviliges accorded to all Irish citizens". I'm sure they'd be delighted with that.

They don't have to be delighted with it, they just have to live with it, just as the current residents of the Falls are currently living as being citizens of the UK in a generally peaceable condition.

J Mysterio · 12-05-2021 5:11pm

https://twitter.com/simoncoveney/status/1392475869424373760?s=20

igCorcaigh · 12-05-2021 5:16pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

What cam?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxVLf4OMIO0

It's live, but go back around 20 mins or so.
That tower block was taken out.

Hope all residents got out safely.

Overheal · 12-05-2021 5:18pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxVLf4OMIO0

It's live, but go back around 20 mins or so.
That tower block was taken out.

Hope all residents got out safely.

Now I can watch human misery with my coffee and crackers... live!

namloc1980 · 12-05-2021 5:20pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxVLf4OMIO0

It's live, but go back around 20 mins or so.
That tower block was taken out.

Hope all residents got out safely.

Israeli air force demolishing apartment buildings in Gaza. Horrific. I'm sure the Israel defenders will be along shortly to justify it.

Triangle · 12-05-2021 5:20pm

Overheal wrote: »

It's not possible to just express distaste with other humans blowing up other humans? It automatically must be anti-semitism if it's the IDF doing the blowing up?

There's three viewpoints here

1) isreal bad guys
2) palastinians bad guys
3) 1 and 2 are bad guys.

They were saying picking option 1 is anti Jewish.

Just like picking option 2 is anti palistinian.

Overheal · 12-05-2021 5:22pm

Triangle wrote: »

There's three viewpoints here

1) isreal bad guys
2) palastinians bad guys
3) 1 and 2 are bad guys.

They were saying picking option 1 is anti Jewish.

Just like picking option 2 is anti palistinian.

Why is 1 antisemitic but opt 2 is not anti-islam? Why is 2 anti-palestine but option 1 is not anti-israel?

There is a difference between the Jewish ethnicity and the nation of Israel and the actions it takes as a sovereignty.

wes · 12-05-2021 5:24pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Israel is an ethno state in the same way the Islamic Republic of Iran is. Why do you make it sound worse than Iran?

Iran is irrelevant to the discussion and is pure whataboutism.

Israel is an Ethno state plain and simple, as clearly defined in their nation state law, whereas before they would beat around the bush, with that law they are an admitted ethno state.

igCorcaigh · 12-05-2021 5:42pm

https://twitter.com/lummideast/status/1392518857571569666

igCorcaigh · 12-05-2021 5:44pm

Something beautiful about this.

https://twitter.com/IntelCrab/status/1392519639238860801

Hopes and prayers to all

cnocbui · 12-05-2021 5:45pm

Israel is esentially apartheid, South Africa, but with more powerful friends.

namloc1980 · 12-05-2021 5:48pm

Israel demolishing more buildings in Gaza.

.

Odhinn · 12-05-2021 5:51pm

cnocbui wrote: »

Israel is esentially apartheid, South Africa, but with more powerful friends.

Actually Apartheid south Africa lasted as long as it did due in no small part to US blocking action against it at the UNSC level for many years. once that stopped its end was assured. Likewise Rhodesia.

Overheal · 12-05-2021 5:53pm

Trevor Noah Asks Israel ‘What Is Your Responsibility?’ in Palestinian Conflict: It’s ‘Not a Fair Fight’

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NeZ4yXyzUG0

I appreciate his insight as always, he himself has his entire life experience defined in part by the South African Apartheid.

Banana Republic 1 · 12-05-2021 6:11pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ge45R9qoW_Y

Overheal · 12-05-2021 6:15pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxVLf4OMIO0

It's live, but go back around 20 mins or so.
That tower block was taken out.

Hope all residents got out safely.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6memUTPNjCI

Tel Aviv for comparison. New stream, 40 mins old, see no evidence of attacks

Riots on Israeli streets

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHrxa9I75q8

J Mysterio · 12-05-2021 6:28pm

I'd rather not click on anything by The Sun.

namloc1980 · 12-05-2021 6:30pm

J Mysterio wrote: »

I'd rather not click on anything by The Sun.

It's a YouTube live cam of Gaza and Tel Aviv. Don't worry, it's not a link to a Page 3 girl or anything like that. That might upset you.

Overheal · 12-05-2021 6:36pm

It's not even monetized I don't think.

end of the road · 12-05-2021 6:40pm

Mysterypunter wrote: »

How anyone can defend the actions of the Israeli government is beyond me, especially Irish people who are subject to an occupation themselves. Israel would not be as bold in their bullying tactics without the backing of the Jewnited States, who are the ultimate bully boys. The influence of Jews in a slow genocide is not surprising, they use the holocaust as a free pass to eradicate their enemies, but are just as bad, and worse in some cases, although nazi Germany set a high benchmark. That still doesn't excuse their behaviour.

while i agree with what you are saying, you should change "jews" to the state of israel and it's supporters.
plenty of jews, probably most really, disagree with the behaviour of israel and don't believe the holocaust gives them an excuse to behave how they see fit.

J Mysterio · 12-05-2021 6:43pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

It's a YouTube live cam of Gaza and Tel Aviv. Don't worry, it's not a link to a Page 3 girl or anything like that. That might upset you.

I'm not upset by page 3 girls, I don't want to support the Sun in any way, by increasing their hits, or otherwise.

The Sun is a diabolical paper. A hateful rag.

J Mysterio · 12-05-2021 6:44pm

Fair play to Sturgeon for being straight up on this - none of the 'both sides' rubbish.

https://twitter.com/NicolaSturgeon/status/1391012494345388035?s=20

Overheal · 12-05-2021 6:57pm

J Mysterio wrote: »

Fair play to Sturgeon for being straight up on this - none of the 'both sides' rubbish.

https://twitter.com/NicolaSturgeon/status/1391012494345388035?s=20

What is Israel's proclaimed justification for the assaults and human rights abuses?

Housefree · 12-05-2021 7:03pm

Overheal wrote: »

What is Israel's proclaimed justification for the assaults and human rights abuses?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hh0dkscOXw

Israeli - Palestinian Conflict *Threadbans in OP*

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Israeli - Palestinian Conflict Threadbans in OP