Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Irish Property Market 2020 Part 2

1…158159161163164…203

Comments

  • #8002
    Browney7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,100 ✭✭✭Browney7


    Timing belt wrote: »
    https://investorrelations.bankofireland.com/app/uploads/Q3_IMS_27.10.2020-FV-1.pdf

    Bank of Ireland Q3 reporting not showing a deterioration in rates of default. 6k mortgages on payment breaks and banks capital position looks strong.

    It was realistically impossible for the default rate to increase in the period due to the availability of the payment break. Taking the payment break meant you couldn't default or be categorised as impaired. Once arrears go above 180 days then the loan becomes classified as default.


  • #8003
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    JJJackal wrote: »
    If these loans are not defaulting it is unlikely the bank is losing money on them (although its unlikely that they are highly profitable if tracker based)

    These properties are likely worth close to what was paid for them - if the borrower has continued to repay all these years - it is improbable that they will suddenly default 12 plus years after the crash? Presumably a significant proportion will have a clear exit strategy.

    These are not borrowers who have been distressed for years

    The problem is that they are interest-only until maturity. None of the capital has been repaid. They've only being meeting repayments to date as they only had to pay the interest and that was most likely a tracker loan with very low repayments. When they look to remortgage, they won't be able to (IMO) and the fund will take control of the properties. This loan sale is a property play by the buyers and won't work out IMO.


  • #8004
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    PropQueries wrote: »
    When they look to remortgage, they won't be able to (IMO) and the fund will take control of the properties.

    Would it be fair to say you're just guessing and you really have no idea how the banks will approach such cases?


  • #8005
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Graham wrote: »
    Would it be fair to say you're just guessing and you really have no idea how the banks will approach such cases?

    Isn't that the point of a property forum board. Making educated guesses based on the data currently available to us. Just like there would be no need for court cases if everyone knew the outcome before it happened...

    My 'educated guess' on how the banks will approach these interest-only buy-to-let loans when they mature is that the borrower may not be able to re-mortgage so they will have to sell them at a loss.

    These are Celtic Tiger property plays and the rental payments (should rents fall by 50% over the next 2 years) won't cover the principal and interest repayments if the borrower has no other income to make up the shortfall.

    Would you re-mortgage in such a scenario when such a borrower cannot meet the repayments going forward? You would have to take charge of the underlying asset in such a scenario as such a borrower would be defaulting on month one of any re-mortgage term.


  • #8006
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Isn't that the point of a property forum board. Making educated guesses based on the data currently available to us.

    Educated guess would suggest there's something behind the guesses.

    If that's the case, it's a good idea to share what the something is.


  • #8007
    fliball123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭fliball123


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Isn't that the point of a property forum board. Making educated guesses based on the data currently available to us. Just like there would be no need for court cases if everyone knew the outcome before it happened...

    My 'educated guess' on how the banks will approach these interest-only buy-to-let loans when they mature is that the borrower may not be able to re-mortgage so they will have to sell them at a loss.

    These are Celtic Tiger property plays and the rental payments (should rents fall by 50% over the next 2 years) won't cover the principal and interest repayments if the borrower has no other income to make up the shortfall.

    Would you re-mortgage in such a scenario when such a borrower cannot meet the repayments going forward? You would have to take charge of the underlying asset in such a scenario as such a borrower would be defaulting on month one of any re-mortgage term.

    Not very educated why would the bank force someone to sell at a loss when the mortgage has been interest only meaning the bank are still owed the full amount, what you suggest would mean the banks would also have to take a loss. where are you getting a 50% loss in rent over 2 years. They are going down now currently as we have no tourists , no students, no immigration inwards, in 2 years time I would hazard a guess that all three of these will be back along with the influx of foreigners coming to live in the only English speaking country in the EU. So there is only a snowball's chance in hell that rents will be down 50% in 2 years time. Corona will not be impacting us as severely in 2 years time as it is now.

    Your guessing at how the borrower is fixed, you don't know if they can or cannot repay the interest + principal. Interest can be written off in tax so if they are getting current or even the current rent minus say 3/4% to allow for further rent reductions they may well be able to pay .. See everyone can make a scenario that suits their point of view. Your scenarios here always seem to have outrageous and unfounded figures for things like 50% drops in rent. Try being a bit more rational


  • #8008
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Graham wrote: »
    Educated guess would suggest there's something behind the guesses.

    If that's the case, it's a good idea to share what the something is.

    From Irish Independent in 2017 when everyone thought house prices and rents were going to keep increasing for the next 20 years. Times have changed since then?: "Day of reckoning looms for those who took out interest-only mortgages in boom era".

    Worth a read as you appear to believe all those Celtic Tiger interest-only buy-to-let mortgages are all fine. The situation in the UK is in the first half of the article and then Ireland in the second half.

    Link to Irish Independent article here: https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/day-of-reckoning-looms-for-those-who-took-out-interest-only-mortgages-in-boom-era-35970364.html


  • #8009
    Timing belt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,567 ✭✭✭Timing belt


    PropQueries wrote: »
    From Irish Independent in 2017 when everyone thought house prices and rents were going to keep increasing for the next 20 years. Times have changed since then?: "Day of reckoning looms for those who took out interest-only mortgages in boom era".

    Worth a read as you appear to believe all those Celtic Tiger interest-only buy-to-let mortgages are all fine. The situation in the UK is in the first half of the article and then Ireland in the second half.

    Link to Irish Independent article here: https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/day-of-reckoning-looms-for-those-who-took-out-interest-only-mortgages-in-boom-era-35970364.html

    Banks would have proactively been managing this for a while explaining to customers the consequences and trying to move them over to a principal and interest mortgage. Any of the BTL should have sufficient money from there rental income to repay.

    Yes some will be in difficulty but it is not a total collapse as you predict.


  • #8010
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Timing belt wrote: »
    Banks would have proactively been managing this for a while explaining to customers the consequences and trying to move them over to a principal and interest mortgage. Any of the BTL should have sufficient money from there rental income to repay.

    Yes some will be in difficulty but it is not a total collapse as you predict.

    Rents have only being rising significantly each year for each of the past 6 years. They also paid tax on that rental income. Many are small business owners who were hoping to rely on these investment properties for their pension. Even if most did save all the rental income (as you appear to believe), they will have to re-mortgage over the next 20 years on a principal and interest basis at probably in excess of 5% and on the property price they paid back in 2006/2007.

    You're also expecting rents to keep at todays level for the duration of the new mortgage term. That's very doubtful in my opinion.


  • Advertisement
  • #8011
    Timing belt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,567 ✭✭✭Timing belt


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Rents have only being rising significantly each year for each of the past 6 years. They also paid tax on that rental income. Many are small business owners who were hoping to rely on these investment properties for their pension. Even if most did save all the rental income (as you appear to believe), they will have to re-mortgage over the next 20 years on a principal and interest basis at probably in excess of 5% and on the property price they paid back in 2006/2007.

    You're also expecting rents to keep at todays level for the duration of the new mortgage term. That's very doubtful in my opinion.

    If they have been on interest only they have made money on renting the properties. If they were relying on it as a pension then unfortunately it didn’t work out the same as a lot of people that put money into a pension only to find that the March crash wiped 50% of its value.

    I am not surprised that you expected rent to drop that would be inline with your thinking that house prices are going to crash and everyone will move to Leitrim to WFH. The glass is never half full


  • #8012
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Worth a read as you appear to believe all those Celtic Tiger interest-only buy-to-let mortgages are all fine

    Read the title of the article:

    Day of reckoning looms......... in 2017
    :rolleyes:


  • #8013
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Timing belt wrote: »
    If they have been on interest only they have made money on renting the properties. If they were relying on it as a pension then unfortunately it didn’t work out the same as a lot of people that put money into a pension only to find that the March crash wiped 50% of its value.

    I am not surprised that you expected rent to drop that would be inline with your thinking that house prices are going to crash and everyone will move to Leitrim to WFH. The glass is never half full

    You're assuming the initial rent freeze (2014) and the rent pressure zone legislation (2016) doesn't apply to most of these buy-to-let landlords? Those high rents you see advertised are captured by a relatively small percentage of the buy-to-let market in Dublin.


  • #8014
    Timing belt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,567 ✭✭✭Timing belt


    PropQueries wrote: »
    You're assuming the initial rent freeze (2014) and the rent pressure zone legislation (2016) doesn't apply to most of these buy-to-let landlords? Those high rents you see advertised apply to a relatively small percentage of the buy-to-let market in Dublin.

    Even with that they will have made money as they were only paying interest.


  • #8015
    PommieBast
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,805 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    Ursabear wrote: »
    Prime Dublin residential rents down 12% https://www.businessworld.ie/property-news/Prime-Dublin-residential-rents-down-12-since-March-574715.html
    Not out of line with what is/was being discussed over in Dublin - Significant reduction in rents coming?


  • #8016
    fliball123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Timing belt wrote: »
    Even with that they will have made money as they were only paying interest.

    They can also write off all interest on a mortgage now. This was not always the case it was 80% for a good few years and it crept up to 100% which is the case now. So they would of made money in the years to now. So the title of your is from 2017 how many of these properties have been forced into selling in the last 3 years?? Oh wait you don't do actual up to date figures, you do conjecture, doom and gloom and base most of your ideas on numbers from 3/4 years ago.


  • Advertisement
  • #8017
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Timing belt wrote: »
    Even with that they will have made money as they were only paying interest.

    Ok, say they purchased their buy-to-let for c. €500,000 in 2006. Paying 1% interest. They receive rent of c. €1,500 per month and that would be at the high end for many landlords. After tax and paying interest, how much play money have they left?

    Will all that savings make much of a dent in their €500,000 mortgage?


  • #8018
    fliball123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭fliball123


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Ok, say they purchased their buy-to-let for c. €500,000 in 2006. Paying 1% interest. They receive rent of c. €1,500 per month and that would be at the high end for many landlords. After tax and paying interest, how much play money have they left?

    Will all that savings make much of a dent in their €500,000 mortgage?

    OK even at that low level of rent 1.5k a month for a 500k property which seems fairly low not sure where your getting this is at the high end. So 1% works out at 5k a year so 14 years of 5k is 70k and 1.5k a month over 14 years is 252k. Now you could write a substantial amount of that 70k of interest off on tax at least 80%. So 56k you will not pay tax on, so take away. So tax paid (assuming your already on the top rate of interest) will be on about 200k odd (rounding it up) you will lose about half of this on tax. So the person would of made (give or take) 100k or so .. and that is with a low rent of 1.5k on a 500k property. So if they sold up or in your words were frogmarched into the bank and told to sell and sell now even if they got 450k for the property (giving a 12.5% haircut on the original price) adding that to their 100k loan income they still made 50k odd profit. Now there are caveats like breakage, washing machine breaking, painting, etc. But you also have the huge increases in rent from 2013 onwards.

    The questions I have for you are
    Why would the bank force you to sell.

    Why do you think a 500k property is only getting 1.5k a month.


  • #8019
    Hubertj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭Hubertj


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Ok, say they purchased their buy-to-let for c. €500,000 in 2006. Paying 1% interest. They receive rent of c. €1,500 per month and that would be at the high end for many landlords. After tax and paying interest, how much play money have they left?

    Will all that savings make much of a dent in their €500,000 mortgage?

    only an idiot would think mortgage holders wouldn't have been forward planning for when the interest only period expires.

    Even if they run into arrears, according to some of your genius theories, the government could purchase at market value and use for direct provision. 2 objectives achieved by government.

    waste of time reading some of the nonsense the last few pages.


  • #8020
    Marius34
    Registered Users Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭Marius34


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Ok, say they purchased their buy-to-let for c. €500,000 in 2006. Paying 1% interest. They receive rent of c. €1,500 per month and that would be at the high end for many landlords. After tax and paying interest, how much play money have they left?

    Will all that savings make much of a dent in their €500,000 mortgage?

    You would need at least 10% deposit (normally more) if it's Buy-to-Let, even in 2006. The 100% mortgage was mostly for FTB buyers


  • #8021
    Browney7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,100 ✭✭✭Browney7


    fliball123 wrote: »
    Not very educated why would the bank force someone to sell at a loss when the mortgage has been interest only meaning the bank are still owed the full amount, what you suggest would mean the banks would also have to take a loss. where are you getting a 50% loss in rent over 2 years. They are going down now currently as we have no tourists , no students, no immigration inwards, in 2 years time I would hazard a guess that all three of these will be back along with the influx of foreigners coming to live in the only English speaking country in the EU. So there is only a snowball's chance in hell that rents will be down 50% in 2 years time. Corona will not be impacting us as severely in 2 years time as it is now.

    Your guessing at how the borrower is fixed, you don't know if they can or cannot repay the interest + principal. Interest can be written off in tax so if they are getting current or even the current rent minus say 3/4% to allow for further rent reductions they may well be able to pay .. See everyone can make a scenario that suits their point of view. Your scenarios here always seem to have outrageous and unfounded figures for things like 50% drops in rent. Try being a bit more rational

    The banks don't want to take ownership of assets and go through foreclosure processes and they have little to no appetite to sit on non performing loans and tie up capital against these loans (plus banks models for future expected defaults on a portfolio are based on their observed experience over time). Buy to let's also don't have the press toxicity of making some "poor cratur doing their best" homeless.

    They focus on a macro level - a bank may have 1 billion of BTL loans secured on property worth 1 billion but due to capital regimes and prescribed rules they have to hold further capital on top of this to cover expected defaults on the portfolio which could be better deployed elsewhere. That's why they fire out these portfolios out the back door at a haircut. If the initial period of interest only has ended and the capital repayment portion has kicked in, if the borrower is in arrears, this moves to a default state triggering even more hassle and provisions for the bank.

    I expect the number and amount of loans given out on an interest only basis in the mid 2000's on an interest only basis which are hitting their capital repayment period to be low at the same time.

    It's not inconceivable that some property in Dublin is still trading at levels well below boom time prices (I know of 2 bed apartments in Dublin 15 that would have sold for mid to high 400s in the mid 2000s only getting low 300s at present and the gross rental on these is approx 1800 p.m. at present but would have been far lower in 2010-2014 for example).


  • Advertisement
  • #8022
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    Discussion of land costs split into a new thread


  • #8023
    Smiley11
    Registered Users Posts: 247 ✭✭Smiley11


    I think its safe to say that the market is utterly unpredictable for the foreseeable future. We're chain free buyers & the market in Cork City is chronically bad in my humble opinion. A few high end properties coming on, a few nice 3 bed semis in desirable areas. Seems to be a lot of former rentals being marketed but none of the above appeal to us to be honest. We're dying to buy a house & have a good upsizing budget but the supply is awful.

    If I was selling, I'd be laughing & would probably get a bit more than we did this time last year. We don't know when we're going to find a house & worse, we may have an awful bidding war as seems to be standard these days. Spoke to my friend today who is a manager in one of the "big" banks & she said they're very busy with mortgage applications...same lady told me in March that we'd do very well out of all this as the banks wouldn't be lending. Again, utterly unpredictable. I wish prices would drop but I just don't see it happening any time soon.


  • #8024
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Grafton Street landlord cuts high street property values by 26%

    "One of the main landlords on Dublin’s Grafton Street, the capital’s premier shopping street, has slashed the value of its high street properties by 26 per cent over the first nine months of the year, as Covid-19 decimated retail trading in the city centre."

    Link to Irish Times here: https://www.irishtimes.com/business/commercial-property/grafton-street-landlord-cuts-high-street-property-values-by-26-1.4393537


  • #8025
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    General discussion of FTBers moved to a new thread.


  • #8026
    Smouse156
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 529 ✭✭✭Smouse156


    House prices surge as Covid upends economics
    https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/house-prices-surge-as-covid-upends-economics-39679973.html

    More property pumping from the IO & David Chancer. Trying to spin global rises into rising prices here. Desperately don’t want prices to fall as the last line highlights “ Sadly for us, the global nature of capital markets means contagion will spread here in the event of a crash elsewhere.”


  • #8027
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    PropQueries wrote: »
    "One of the main landlords on Dublin’s Grafton Street, the capital’s premier shopping street, has slashed the value of its high street properties by 26 per cent over the first nine months of the year, as Covid-19 decimated retail trading in the city centre."

    That's hardly surprising given the very immediate impact of the pandemic on retail. Retail/leisure were always going to bear the brunt of the loss in trade given that's it's not easy for the sector to switch to a WFH model.

    When the pandemic is eventually behind us, I'd expect valuations to bounce back.


  • #8028
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Graham wrote: »
    That's hardly surprising given the very immediate impact of the pandemic on retail. Retail/leisure were always going to bear the brunt of the loss in trade given that's it's not easy for the sector to switch to a WFH model.

    When the pandemic is eventually behind us, I'd expect valuations to bounce back.

    Retail commercial space is primarily valued on footfall. The only way these valuations can 'bounce back' is if, post-Covid, all pre-covid office workers return to working 9 to 5 five days a week back at the office. Otherwise, footfall is down permanently and by extension, retail property values are down permanently.


  • #8029
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Retail commercial space is primarily valued on footfall. The only way these valuations can 'bounce back' is if, post-Covid, all pre-covid office workers return to working 9 to 5 five days a week back at the office. Otherwise, footfall is down permanently and by extension, retail property values are down permanently.

    While that's true, I've no doubt footfall will return to premium retail areas like Grafton Street but that's probably a discussion for another thread.


  • #8030
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Graham wrote: »
    While that's true, I've no doubt footfall will return to premium retail areas like Grafton Street but that's probably a discussion for another thread.

    It's only 'prime' because of footfall e.g. office workers from the southside/northside travelling through Grafton Street to get to the other side. Less footfall, less potential customers, less sales, rents drop, property values drop. These are all businesses and sales are all that matters.

    I'm also sure the new idea will be to make the area a 'recreational zone' or something similar with more restaurants etc. They tried that in the big shopping centres in the UK and all that happened was that there were more food outlets competing for the same limited number of visitors and sales of all existing food outlets went down.


  • #8031
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Dublin City Council seeks to use Docklands tower block for social housing

    "A 15-storey privately developed apartment block in Dublin’s south docklands could be used exclusively for social housing if permission is granted by An Bord Pleanála.

    The council’s head of housing, Brendan Kenny, said any agreement with the developers would be pursued only if planning permission was granted and would also be subject to negotiations on price. However, he said the council would be “very, very interested” in acquiring the entire block.

    We would get a lot of criticism over the scarcity of social housing in Dublin 4, so to have an opportunity like this, we would be very, very interested, if the place gets planning permission, if it gets built, and if the price is right.”

    Given all this social housing being leased or purchased in Dublin 4, Dermot Desmond wasn't too far off for calling them 'Ballymun Towers South Dublin'.

    Full story in Irish Times today: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/dublin-city-council-seeks-to-use-docklands-tower-block-for-social-housing-1.4393441


  • Advertisement
  • #8032
    nerrad01
    Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭nerrad01


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Dublin City Council seeks to use Docklands tower block for social housing

    "A 15-storey privately developed apartment block in Dublin’s south docklands could be used exclusively for social housing if permission is granted by An Bord Pleanála.

    The council’s head of housing, Brendan Kenny, said any agreement with the developers would be pursued only if planning permission was granted and would also be subject to negotiations on price. However, he said the council would be “very, very interested” in acquiring the entire block.

    We would get a lot of criticism over the scarcity of social housing in Dublin 4, so to have an opportunity like this, we would be very, very interested, if the place gets planning permission, if it gets built, and if the price is right.”

    Given all this social housing being leased or purchased in Dublin 4, Dermot Desmond wasn't too far off for calling them 'Ballymun Towers South Dublin'.

    Full story in Irish Times today: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/dublin-city-council-seeks-to-use-docklands-tower-block-for-social-housing-1.4393441

    do they ever get it right!? the whole purpose of having a social housing requirement in new developments was to integrate people not create a bloody social housing tower!


  • #8033
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    nerrad01 wrote: »
    do they ever get it right!? the whole purpose of having a social housing requirement in new developments was to integrate people not create a bloody social housing tower!

    They are getting it right. It's basically the start of a back-door bailout for all those empty 'luxury' apartment blocks developers have being building over the past 3 years which they couldn't rent or sell.

    It's like the carbon taxes. Dressed up as 'protecting the environment' while in reality, it's just a back-door tax increase on poor people to keep the Government coffers full.


  • #8034
    fliball123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭fliball123


    PropQueries wrote: »
    They are getting it right. It's basically the start of a back-door bailout for all those empty 'luxury' apartment blocks developers have being building over the past 3 years which they couldn't rent or sell.

    It's like the carbon taxes. Dressed up as 'protecting the environment' while in reality, it's just a back-door tax increase on poor people to keep the Government coffers full.

    How do the government make out of this?


  • #8035
    KennisWhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 186 ✭✭KennisWhale


    Smouse156 wrote: »
    House prices surge as Covid upends economics
    https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/house-prices-surge-as-covid-upends-economics-39679973.html

    More property pumping from the IO & David Chancer. Trying to spin global rises into rising prices here. Desperately don’t want prices to fall as the last line highlights “ Sadly for us, the global nature of capital markets means contagion will spread here in the event of a crash elsewhere.”

    The famous line, "this time it's different". I love the optimism, he should replace Tony Holohan as CMO.


  • #8036
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    <SNIP>


  • #8037
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    PropQueries wrote: »
    <SNIP>

    What's a 'link dump'? For future reference


  • #8038
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    folks if you're going to link to an article/tweet/video, there's an expectation that it's relevant and that you include your opinion/connection to the discussion.

    Specifically for this thread, that should be at least loosely how the linked item is connected to the Irish Property Market 2020.


  • #8039
    nerrad01
    Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭nerrad01


    seems to be an increase in the number of properties being listed, my daft/ my home notifications have definitely increased significantly over the last few days. I wonder is there an increased appetite to get places sold before xmas


  • #8040
    fliball123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭fliball123


    nerrad01 wrote: »
    seems to be an increase in the number of properties being listed, my daft/ my home notifications have definitely increased significantly over the last few days. I wonder is there an increased appetite to get places sold before xmas

    I don't know where you are seeing that if you look at the myhome.ie homepage available properties 16414 yesterday there was 50 more available so it is actually going down on a daily basis. Maybe the area you have set up for your notifications have had a few properties up for sale but its not typical of the rest of the country


  • Advertisement
  • #8041
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I've a pretty broad range for my filter on daft.ie and there have been 2 new properties listed since the 23rd of October, if anything I've noticed things dry up


  • #8042
    nerrad01
    Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭nerrad01


    fliball123 wrote: »
    I don't know where you are seeing that if you look at the myhome.ie homepage available properties 16414 yesterday there was 50 more available so it is actually going down on a daily basis. Maybe the area you have set up for your notifications have had a few properties up for sale but its not typical of the rest of the country

    yep i was purely talking anecdotally, as my notifications had practically stopped. So nice to see something going again


  • #8043
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Dublin City Council seeks to use Docklands tower block for social housing

    "A 15-storey privately developed apartment block in Dublin’s south docklands could be used exclusively for social housing if permission is granted by An Bord Pleanála.

    The council’s head of housing, Brendan Kenny, said any agreement with the developers would be pursued only if planning permission was granted and would also be subject to negotiations on price. However, he said the council would be “very, very interested” in acquiring the entire block.

    We would get a lot of criticism over the scarcity of social housing in Dublin 4, so to have an opportunity like this, we would be very, very interested, if the place gets planning permission, if it gets built, and if the price is right.”

    Given all this social housing being leased or purchased in Dublin 4, Dermot Desmond wasn't too far off for calling them 'Ballymun Towers South Dublin'.

    Full story in Irish Times today: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/dublin-city-council-seeks-to-use-docklands-tower-block-for-social-housing-1.4393441




    How much are they going to pay to lease that I wonder.
    Would they not be better off doing what we all do, when we look at D4 and realize buying there is going to break us, and look for value by leasing in a cheaper location.


  • #8044
    combat14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,271 ✭✭✭combat14


    Banks turning the screw on some covid mortgage applicants

    Bank defends asking mortgage applicants whether their employer is seeking State Covid assistance

    https://www.thejournal.ie/banks-ewss-mortgage-applicants-5245714-Oct2020/


  • #8045
    PropQueries
    Registered Users Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    How much are they going to pay to lease that I wonder.
    Would they not be better off doing what we all do, when we look at D4 and realize buying there is going to break us, and look for value by leasing in a cheaper location.

    I wonder will they get a better deal than the Herbert Hill apartments in Dundrum?

    "The Herbert Hill apartments are now set to be used as social housing with the council reportedly paying monthly rents of some €2,000 for one-bed apartments, €2,500 for two-bed units and €3,000 for three-bed units. However, protesters argue that rent paid by the council over the next 25 years will end up exceeding what Realis paid for the complex, which stands in a prime location next to Dundrum Town Centre."

    Link to Irish Times article here: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/council-chairman-defends-dundrum-lease-deal-with-foreign-cuckoo-fund-1.4108443


  • #8046
    thefridge2006
    Registered Users Posts: 220 ✭✭thefridge2006


    combat14 wrote: »
    Banks turning the screw on some covid mortgage applicants

    Bank defends asking mortgage applicants whether their employer is seeking State Covid assistance

    https://www.thejournal.ie/banks-ewss-mortgage-applicants-5245714-Oct2020/

    Great to see


  • Advertisement
  • #8047
    DelBoy Trotter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭DelBoy Trotter


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I've a pretty broad range for my filter on daft.ie and there have been 2 new properties listed since the 23rd of October, if anything I've noticed things dry up

    I've noticed the same thing over the last month, very few properties coming to the market in the areas I've been searching


  • #8048
    fliball123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭fliball123


    Yara Rich Camouflage wrote: »
    Yep , same here in Cork.

    But surely with the 50% price decreases coming before the end of the year everyone would be saturating the market with their property in order to get as much as they can :) .. God the amount of properties available on myhome is just drying up so fast. Anyone a take on why this is happening?


  • #8049
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    fliball123 wrote: »
    But surely with the 50% price decreases coming before the end of the year everyone would be saturating the market with their property in order to get as much as they can :) .. God the amount of properties available on myhome is just drying up so fast. Anyone a take on why this is happening?

    Are you selling a house?


  • #8050
    TheSheriff
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,108 ✭✭✭TheSheriff


    fliball123 wrote: »
    But surely with the 50% price decreases coming before the end of the year everyone would be saturating the market with their property in order to get as much as they can :) .. God the amount of properties available on myhome is just drying up so fast. Anyone a take on why this is happening?

    I would expect supply to remain low until we are well out of this, why would you move now unless you absolutely had too; too many factors at play.

    Rather than causing a dramatic decrease in the market as expected, it's possibly and looking likely covid will just cause it to seize up for the foreseeable.

    Obviously this is not good for both buyers and sellers, irrespective of prices achieved.


  • #8051
    Billythekid19
    Registered Users Posts: 166 ✭✭Billythekid19


    fliball123 wrote: »
    But surely with the 50% price decreases coming before the end of the year everyone would be saturating the market with their property in order to get as much as they can :) .. God the amount of properties available on myhome is just drying up so fast. Anyone a take on why this is happening?

    Theres a clear chronic supply issue whilst at the same time pent up demand for from the last last 6 months of lockdowns ect.
    It would be a very risky move for a family to put their house on the market in the current climate, I know I certainly wouldnt. Whos to say the seller will have a job in 6 months time, would be reckless to plan a move with so much uncertainty and almost impossible to search for a new house with the 5km travel limit.


  • Advertisement
This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement