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Crossing outside GMIT on the Dublin road?

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    #32
    Crumbs868
    Closed Accounts Posts: 438 ✭✭Crumbs868


    What about moving the bus stop a small bit in the direction towards town and adding ped lights. I think ped lights at the current bus stop won't work - Reasoning being even if there are lights at the current location pedestrians will generally not wait for green ped light if road looks clear and also cars come off the roundabout too fast (at the moment peds leg it across / are cautious whereas if there is a green led light they may not give traffic a 2nd look).


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    #33
    fergiesfolly
    Registered Users Posts: 3,325 ✭✭✭fergiesfolly


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    Right, so the Swiss, Dutch, Danish, Germans, French, Italians et al are "beyond stupid" but we Irish are ahead of the curve with not providing a sufficiency of pedestrian crossings in urban areas, especially at junctions, roundabouts and adjacent to public transit.

    I guess the fact that more than half of Irish travellers use cars for journeys under 2km and that at 74% our national level of car use is second highest in the EU is a sign of our superior collective intelligence compared to those dumb Europeans. Beep beep.

    I'm only talking about that specific bus stop on that road.
    You keep expanding the topic to push your own agenda re road use and users.
    You've said more than once that you're not familiar with that section of road, but you keep insisting that you know what's best for that particular road, bus stop and crossing.


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    #34
    fergiesfolly
    Registered Users Posts: 3,325 ✭✭✭fergiesfolly


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    A little research is a wonderful thing.

    This map shows the position of the GMIT main Dublin Rd exit (blue flag) and the pedestrian lights (red flag).

    Measuring the distance between them is approx 200 metres. So a round trip of 400 metres = about 440 yards.

    Bus commuters would be closer to the next bus stop so probably wouldn't do the round trip. But there are lots of students living in Lurgan Park / Glenn Rua, who are also not provided with any safe way of getting across the road here. The chances that they will extent their trip home by half a km .. close to nil, I would say.

    The real madness is that the bus-stop is so close to the roundabout, and that the roundabout has been allowed to stay so long after it became clearly inadequate to handle peak loads.

    And I do really do wonder why people who use cars react so badly to the idea of infrastructure that makes the urban environment better for anyone other than themselves. It's almost like they have a need to prove they're superior to everyone else.

    I can agree about the proximity of the bus stop to the roundabout and to the retention of the roundabout and I think the best solution would be a fully lighted junction with pedestrian access.
    Hadn't realised about the distance from the exit to the crossing( walk it regularly, never seemed that far) but it's still only a couple of minutes and I will use the crossing rather than dash across the road.
    I drive, walk and occasionally cycle around town. I have no problem with pedestrians, cyclists being catered for, but as a car driver whose taxes pay for most of the infrastructure, if anyone has to inconvenienced, it shouldn't be me.
    He who pays the piper and all that.


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    #35
    Crumbs868
    Closed Accounts Posts: 438 ✭✭Crumbs868


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    I would put pedestrian crossings wherever there are significant 'desire lines'.

    Even when it's not safe? That's just dam wreckless.


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    #36
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    Crumbs868 wrote: »
    Even when it's not safe? That's just dam wreckless.

    If the roads are not safe then they need to be made safe. The source of the danger is motorised traffic, so the solutions flow from that fact.

    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    A little research is a wonderful thing.

    This map shows the position of the GMIT main Dublin Rd exit (blue flag) and the pedestrian lights (red flag).

    Measuring the distance between them is approx 200 metres. So a round trip of 400 metres = about 440 yards.

    Bus commuters would be closer to the next bus stop so probably wouldn't do the round trip. But there are lots of students living in Lurgan Park / Glenn Rua, who are also not provided with any safe way of getting across the road here. The chances that they will extent their trip home by half a km .. close to nil, I would say.

    The real madness is that the bus-stop is so close to the roundabout, and that the roundabout has been allowed to stay so long after it became clearly inadequate to handle peak loads.

    And I do really do wonder why people who use cars react so badly to the idea of infrastructure that makes the urban environment better for anyone other than themselves. It's almost like they have a need to prove they're superior to everyone else.

    Bravo -- well said all round.

    The real madness is perhaps not the bus stop so close to the roundabout but an Irish roundabout so close to an institution where so many people walk, cycle and take the bus (and where latent demand for same could be further accommodated). I'm just back from France, where every roundabout I encountered in urban areas (and there vast numbers of rondes points) had a pedestrian crossing on each arm. In some locations there were several pedestrian crossings before and after the roundabout. Irish road engineers and motorists are simply unable to comprehend such arrangements -- it's still too far outside their insular, parochial world view.

    The other madness -- utterly endemic in this country by now -- is that the windscreen view of traffic and transport predominates. It's so deeply rooted at this stage that even pedestrians, cyclists and bus users seems to have internalised the belief that the car is king and must be given due deference in all situations. It's the societal effect of the second highest level of car dependence in the EU28 -- you now have to look to the US for comparisons, though some UK cities are as bad if not worse.

    With regard to students living close to GMIT, I was reliably informed a few years ago that there were students based in nearby accommodation (advertised as being a minute's walk away) who drove to college every day, and who complained about insufficient parking.

    This kind of thing has gone way beyond an Irish joke, and is now becoming an American joke imo. I heard recently of a left-wing elected representative referring to public transport as being for "the great unwashed". It's going to take years of effort to turn this around, and unfortunately we can't rely on local or national elected representatives for the necessary leadership and vision.


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    #37
    Crumbs868
    Closed Accounts Posts: 438 ✭✭Crumbs868


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    If the roads are not safe then they need to be made safe. The source of the danger is motorised traffic, so the solutions flow from that fact..

    WOW what a surprising angle you have taken!!!!! Would you not give the location of the bus stop a little more thought???? - I have posted above why I why I think ped lights / zebra crossing at the current location would be a bad idea.

    Great to hear about your French holiday, looking forward to hearing much more about it. If only we were all as well travelled as yourself


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    #38
    pmasterson95
    Registered Users Posts: 3,074 ✭✭✭pmasterson95


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    If the roads are not safe then they need to be made safe. The source of the danger is motorised traffic, so the solutions flow from that fact.




    Bravo -- well said all round.

    The real madness is perhaps not the bus stop so close to the roundabout but an Irish roundabout so close to an institution where so many people walk, cycle and take the bus (and where latent demand for same could be further accommodated). I'm just back from France, where every roundabout I encountered in urban areas (and there vast numbers of rondes points) had a pedestrian crossing on each arm. In some locations there were several pedestrian crossings before and after the roundabout. Irish road engineers and motorists are simply unable to comprehend such arrangements -- it's still too far outside their insular, parochial world view.

    The other madness -- utterly endemic in this country by now -- is that the windscreen view of traffic and transport predominates. It's so deeply rooted at this stage that even pedestrians, cyclists and bus users seems to have internalised the belief that the car is king and must be given due deference in all situations. It's the societal effect of the second highest level of car dependence in the EU28 -- you now have to look to the US for comparisons, though some UK cities are as bad if not worse.

    With regard to students living close to GMIT, I was reliably informed a few years ago that there were students based in nearby accommodation (advertised as being a minute's walk away) who drove to college every day, and who complained about insufficient parking.

    This kind of thing has gone way beyond an Irish joke, and is now becoming an American joke imo. I heard recently of a left-wing elected representative referring to public transport as being for "the great unwashed". It's going to take years of effort to turn this around, and unfortunately we can't rely on local or national elected representatives for the necessary leadership and vision.

    The only time I ever read about "car is king" is on the Galway forum. In reality thats not prevalent. And the other faux outrage points? Well....

    Students being lazy ****s is hardly a revelation tbf. A pedestrian light isnt going to make them suddenly walk. They will still be lazy. Fair play to them for actually going to the college not every student does.

    Snobish idiots that look down on public transport are just snobs. Pedestrian lights wont suddenly decrease and change the mind of snobs.


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    #39
    Skidfingers
    Registered Users Posts: 334 ✭✭Skidfingers


    There's a seperation in the centre off the road where pedestrians can stand on the Dublin Road, so it shouldn't be that difficult to make it easier to cross with that there?


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    #40
    fergiesfolly
    Registered Users Posts: 3,325 ✭✭✭fergiesfolly


    Skidfingers wrote: »
    There's a seperation in the centre off the road where pedestrians can stand on the Dublin Road, so it shouldn't be that difficult to make it easier to cross with that there?

    Easier, if you're not a pensioner, someone with a disability or someone with a buggy and a couple of kids in tow.
    Unless there's a lighted crossing, most motorists won't stop there and it would be chaos if they did.
    That junction needs a major re-design.


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