Changing Covid situation- how do you plan for 2021 races

tunney · 12-01-2021 1:20pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Got this from Mallorca 140.6 this morning. Interesting how they mention they returned the registration fee for the cancelled 2020 event.

Ironman and big city marathons will potentially face similar challenges with restrictions on numbers they're allowed to have.

I got my "six months to race day" email about IM Austria. I would put it at < 10% that it happens.

RacoonQueen · 12-01-2021 1:36pm

tunney wrote: »

I got my "six months to race day" email about IM Austria. I would put it at < 10% that it happens.

They keep trying to get me to re-reg for Vitoria. They don't even know I already got my money back from their bank. :pac:

peter kern · 12-01-2021 3:34pm

tunney wrote: »

I got my "six months to race day" email about IM Austria. I would put it at < 10% that it happens.

given that skiing is open for austrians right now i would put that higher than 10 % more like 30 to 49%

tunney · 12-01-2021 3:43pm

peter kern wrote: »

given that skiing is open for austrians right now i would put that higher than 10 % more like 30 to 49%

Key word highlighted there

peter kern · 12-01-2021 4:16pm

tunney wrote: »

Key word highlighted there

i did not know you are the race,and no dave no race. sorry

tunney · 12-01-2021 4:25pm

peter kern wrote: »

i did not know you are the race,and no dave no race. sorry

Okay, I'll bite.

By highlighting the word Austrians I was highlighting the fact that the slopes are open to domestic visitors. This is very, very different to being open to international travellers. I can see events, such as IM Austria or Dublin City Marathon for example, being restricted to domestic competitors - with proof of residency in the host country being required to take part. Or a certificate of vaccination for all entrants either but the average IM participant is probably not in the at risk categories.

S_D · 12-01-2021 8:44pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Aus and NZ aside the first few races on the IM calendar for 2021 are already postponed. With countries have different vaccination rates and vaccines not being available privately there is no way events like these can go ahead not before Autumn and not with normal IM numbers anyway.

In 2020 from CoachCox analysis
US had 2 full IM go ahead.
Europe 1 (+2 70.3)
Asia Pac 2 (+6 70.3)
Africa (1 70.3)

Hardly a promising sign that 2021 events will go ahead especially since most/all on here will be looking at European events.

Well considering you've retired , you wont need to worry about it then I guess

S_D · 12-01-2021 8:49pm

tunney wrote: »

Okay, I'll bite.

By highlighting the word Austrians I was highlighting the fact that the slopes are open to domestic visitors. This is very, very different to being open to international travellers. I can see events, such as IM Austria or Dublin City Marathon for example, being restricted to domestic competitors - with proof of residency in the host country being required to take part. Or a certificate of vaccination for all entrants either but the average IM participant is probably not in the at risk categories.

Lol thank god you're not in charge eh:rolleyes:

Nidot · 13-01-2021 9:45am

S_D wrote: »

Lol thank god you're not in charge eh:rolleyes:

What's with that response?

I think those are valid controls to put in place. Look at Aus and NZ (the only sensible countries holding events right now) - they require anyone entering the country to isolate in government run residences for two weeks before being allowed mix with the general population and that's how they're controlling the spread of the virus from visitors among the general population.

Once we do get the virus under control I don't think it would be too harsh to restrict entry to events within Ireland to Irish residents and thereby reduce the chances that a visitor to the country would inadvertently bring the virus with them to an event.

RacoonQueen · 13-01-2021 9:52am

Nidot wrote: »

Once we do get the virus under control I don't think it would be too harsh to restrict entry to events within Ireland to Irish residents and thereby reduce the chances that a visitor to the country would inadvertently bring the virus with them to an event.

I think this is the only way Dublin Marathon can go ahead. Irish only and you must show proof of vaccination when picking up your number. Will depend on % that take up vaccine etc also...given you can still get the virus and spread it when vaccinated we're not going to just bounce back to normal events and normal numbers straight away, not in events that attract international competitors anyway.
Different in Asia Pacific where some regions have all but eradicated the virus.

peter kern · 13-01-2021 10:48am

RacoonQueen wrote: »

I think this is the only way Dublin Marathon can go ahead. Irish only and you must show proof of vaccination when picking up your number. Will depend on % that take up vaccine etc also...given you can still get the virus and spread it when vaccinated we're not going to just bounce back to normal events and normal numbers straight away, not in events that attract international competitors anyway.
Different in Asia Pacific where some regions have all but eradicated the virus.

how can you be so negative on ironman events if you think there is a chance to run major marathons this year ?

RacoonQueen · 13-01-2021 11:48am

peter kern wrote: »

how can you be so negative on ironman events if you think there is a chance to run major marathons this year ?

I don't think there is a chance of major marathons happening this year simply presenting a scenario that could see Dublin marathon go ahead but that is not going to happen, way too convoluted to work out.

peter kern · 13-01-2021 12:33pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

I don't think there is a chance of major marathons happening this year simply presenting a scenario that could see Dublin marathon go ahead but that is not going to happen, way too convoluted to work out.

ok so your are presenting arguments how an event that is about 10 times bigger than an ironman , run mostly in a very densely populated area , can work...
while you are sure that its not going to work!

can i ask what is the point of that ?

RacoonQueen · 13-01-2021 1:13pm

peter kern wrote: »

ok so your are presenting arguments how an event that is about 10 times bigger than an ironman , run mostly in a very densely populated area , can work...
while you are sure that its not going to work!

can i ask what is the point of that ?

That is kind of the whole point of a discussion forum Peter.

peter kern · 13-01-2021 3:47pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

That is kind of the whole point of a discussion forum Peter.

deflecting a question with a unrelated remark?
i thought that is more likely the definition of trolling than the point of a discusion.
anyway best to leave it there.
thanks

griffin100 · 13-01-2021 5:11pm

For the larger events it's going to come down to whatever rules are in place at a national level in the country in question.

International travel is going to change anyway in 2021 and accessing international races will become a bit clearer over the coming months.

You'll probably need a negative Covid test before being allowed entry and possibly a vaccination cert if you plan on staying more than a certain time for most countries.

The vaccinations currently available do not stop a person spreading the virus, so a negative test is many ways is more important than a vaccination cert. The technology behind the antigen tests is improving all the time and hopefully it won't be too long before a cheap and quick widely approved antigen test will replace the expensive and long winded PCR test - you could be tested in minutes upon arrival at an airport, race registration, etc.

I can definitely see some international travel for races in 2021 using a combination of vaccination certs and negative covid test results, but I think it will be a few months yet before we know for sure what races will happen.

peter kern · 14-01-2021 10:02am

iam a bit surprised that some people here say that the vaccine does not stop spreading the virus when this is scientifically far from concluded and the more likely result at the moment is some of the drugs will stop it more than others but how much nobody can say yet.

tunney · 14-01-2021 12:47pm

peter kern wrote: »

iam a bit surprised that some people here say that the vaccine does not stop spreading the virus when this is scientifically far from concluded and the more likely result at the moment is some of the drugs will stop it more than others but how much nobody can say yet.

Yup, it was unproven that the vaccine(s) stopped transmission. Recent evidence suggests the Pfizer one may very well prevent transmission but more investigation and data required. Best to act as if it does not until proven that it does.

griffin100 · 14-01-2021 1:15pm

peter kern wrote: »

iam a bit surprised that some people here say that the vaccine does not stop spreading the virus when this is scientifically far from concluded and the more likely result at the moment is some of the drugs will stop it more than others but how much nobody can say yet.

The WHO considers that the vaccine does not stop the spread, but speaking to a researcher this morning he tells me there is some evidence coming out of Israel that in fact it does have an impact on transmissibility. A safe vaccine that stops both infection and spread is the panacea

RacoonQueen · 14-01-2021 2:35pm

Well all the discussion was along the lines of you can still get the virus and can still spread the virus with vaccine, it's only more recently that research is coming through to suggest otherwise and that was always going to change once the vaccine started rolling out to the masses. There'll be big uptake of it now if they tell you restrictions don't apply to you if you've been vaccinated :pac:

catweazle · 18-01-2021 1:00am

I am signed up for Cascais 70.3 in late October, slap bang in mid term so hoping to make a family holiday out of it....hoping it’s late enough in the year to have a good chance of going ahead

EC1000 · 18-01-2021 2:26pm

catweazle wrote: »

I am signed up for Cascais 70.3 in late October, slap bang in mid term so hoping to make a family holiday out of it....hoping it’s late enough in the year to have a good chance of going ahead

I'm in for that by default as last year's entry rolled over to this year. The new date clashes with DCM (if it were to go ahead) - probably not going to be a problem!

Chris871 · 18-01-2021 5:09pm

My Barcelona entry is deferred to early October too, pretty hopeful it will get the green light. Have a Youghal 70.3 entry too but I'd be very surprised if that goes ahead.

Nidot · 19-01-2021 9:42am

Chris871 wrote: »

My Barcelona entry is deferred to early October too, pretty hopeful it will get the green light. Have a Youghal 70.3 entry too but I'd be very surprised if that goes ahead.

I think IM Cork this year will be very dependent on how other sports proceed.

If the GAA get the go-ahead to run a championship with some elements of fans in attendance then I could see IM trying to run a very paired back version (similar to the IM events in America) with no merch sales, pre-race events and certainly no official spectator facilities.

Chris871 · 19-01-2021 10:50am

Nidot wrote: »

I think IM Cork this year will be very dependent on how other sports proceed.

If the GAA get the go-ahead to run a championship with some elements of fans in attendance then I could see IM trying to run a very paired back version (similar to the IM events in America) with no merch sales, pre-race events and certainly no official spectator facilities.

Hopefully it does. Hard to see though with the numbers expected for both events over the one weekend. But who knows what position we'll be in by then

peter kern · 19-01-2021 11:04am

Nidot wrote: »

I think IM Cork this year will be very dependent on how other sports proceed.

If the GAA get the go-ahead to run a championship with some elements of fans in attendance then I could see IM trying to run a very paired back version (similar to the IM events in America) with no merch sales, pre-race events and certainly no official spectator facilities.

fair points.
but then of course the issue is why would one pay 3 times as much than for a hardman race. 400 euro for a closed road seems a bit expensive.

Nidot · 19-01-2021 12:27pm

Chris871 wrote: »

Hopefully it does. Hard to see though with the numbers expected for both events over the one weekend. But who knows what position we'll be in by then

Yes, also in reality controlling spectators in a town like Youghal would be nigh on impossible.

I would expect that by middle of the summer we will be atleast back to some sort of return to normality (similar to last summer) so I can't see how the hotelliers, cafes, restaurants and shops wouldn't be open as is in Youghal - so trying to run any event (full or 70.3) would be particularly hard if you were trying to discourage supporter attendance.

Nidot · 19-01-2021 12:29pm

peter kern wrote: »

fair points.
but then of course the issue is why would one pay 3 times as much than for a hardman race. 400 euro for a closed road seems a bit expensive.

Because that's what you pay for when you pay for the IM experience - the closed roads, the build up, the supprt system, the merch, the attendance by spectators - these are all part of the package and for many paying for that is worth it.

peter kern · 19-01-2021 3:34pm

Nidot wrote: »

Because that's what you pay for when you pay for the IM experience - the closed roads, the build up, the supprt system, the merch, the attendance by spectators - these are all part of the package and for many paying for that is worth it.

but you said this experience is not going to happen.

If the GAA get the go-ahead to run a championship with some elements of fans in attendance then I could see IM trying to run a very paired back version (similar to the IM events in America) with no merch sales, pre-race events and certainly no official spectator facilities.

so if you were right that would really cost you 400 euro for a closed road as the rest is not there.

Nidot · 20-01-2021 9:39am

peter kern wrote: »

but you said this experience is not going to happen.

If the GAA get the go-ahead to run a championship with some elements of fans in attendance then I could see IM trying to run a very paired back version (similar to the IM events in America) with no merch sales, pre-race events and certainly no official spectator facilities.

so if you were right that would really cost you 400 euro for a closed road as the rest is not there.

People, including myself, paid the entry fee on the basis that the whole show was to go ahead. No-one could of taken their crystal ball back in September and forseen where we are now with any degree of accuracy never mind see 6 months from now to when it's due to be held.

Do you have a bee in your bonnet about people signing up to IM branded races or something?

I also plan on racing some local races this year but we were discussing IM races - do you have similar issues with locally run events?

EDit · 20-01-2021 9:56am

peter kern wrote: »

but you said this experience is not going to happen.

If the GAA get the go-ahead to run a championship with some elements of fans in attendance then I could see IM trying to run a very paired back version (similar to the IM events in America) with no merch sales, pre-race events and certainly no official spectator facilities.

so if you were right that would really cost you 400 euro for a closed road as the rest is not there.

This is my issue with racing IM this year. I’m signed up for IM Hamburg and have no desire whatsoever to go unless I get the “full experience” (ie, my money’s worth). With that race scheduled for early June, I cant see that happening, so I’d rather a refund or option to defer to 2022 (neither of which, in reality, will be forthcoming). I’m kinda resigned to losing my money now.

peter kern · 20-01-2021 10:17am

EDit wrote: »

This is my issue with racing IM this year. I’m signed up for IM Hamburg and have no desire whatsoever to go unless I get the “full experience” (ie, my money’s worth). With that race scheduled for early June, I cant see that happening, so I’d rather a refund or option to defer to 2022 (neither of which, in reality, will be forthcoming). I’m kinda resigned to losing my money now.

in germany the rule is if the race does not happen they have to give you a voucher if you demand that and then if you dont use it until the end of 2022 they have to return the money.

now persosnally i dont think this is right either as ironmnan does have costs to organise the race and they should be allowed at least to keep the money to pay the stuff which they have to retain .

at the same time i would agree with you its not fair to pay 600 euro for something you dont get . its a bit like paying for a 5 star hotel with sea view and on arrival you get a 3 star hotel with no sea view.

S_D · 20-01-2021 11:48am

So much speculation when the reality is no one knows what's going to happen. I think people are a bit ansy (myself included) as I train hard for events and the uncertainty is hard to deal with. Its stressful to put so much time into such a big event without knowing if it will go ahead

But with optimism - they were able to run paired back events last year with no vaccine and managing hospital admission - we had level 3/4 pretty much for most of that. (Hardman went ahead + many other CI events etc ) Once the majority of this country is vaccinated and the risk of increased hospital admission is lower, we will start to open up. Thats planned for March if we go by our government. I would very much expect local national series to run by June if that goes to plan, similar to CI events etc.

By middle of summer we aim to have not just the elderly and vulnerable completely vaccinated but the majority of our country by August/Sept This naturally opens up more as we progress through the vaccinations as the increase risk on hospital admission is constantly getting lower.

The events industry is HUGE and the pressure mounting on government to open this is up is even greater(for the summer based on our roadmap outlined with 'living with covid', Not just our events, but concerts etc etc.

No one has a mystic ball but if the above goes to plan, they have to naturally start opening up. if not then, when? Never? We cant wait for the world to be 100% vaccinated. That's not how it works.

Will people from other countries be allowed enter? Off course. Sure jesus we're the worlds worst for letting people in! I HOPE they make all competitors have either a proof of vaccine or negative test to be allowed toe the line. Reality is, that wont happen IMO. We arent that smart (as we've all seen)

Anyway thats my 2 cents.

Shell to Run · 20-01-2021 3:56pm

If I was a Youghal resident I would be objecting to this event going ahead for the health and safety of my community. The event is not all about the athletes, look at preparations for the Australian Open. Participants can get too caught up in their needs and wants and forget that hosting such an event holds greater implications for local residents!!

tunney · 20-01-2021 3:59pm

Shell to Run wrote: »

If I was a Youghal resident I would be objecting to this event going ahead for the health and safety of my community. The event is not all about the athletes, look at preparations for the Australian Open. Participants can get too caught up in their needs and wants and forget that hosting such an event holds greater implications for local residents!!

+1

Very rarely are we seeing people consider others these days

peter kern · 20-01-2021 8:46pm

Shell to Run wrote: »

If I was a Youghal resident I would be objecting to this event going ahead for the health and safety of my community. The event is not all about the athletes, look at preparations for the Australian Open. Participants can get too caught up in their needs and wants and forget that hosting such an event holds greater implications for local residents!!

i guess that depends on many factors
and at some stage when you have real numbers, you have to weigh up risk vs benefits for the community, which iam sure they will do , i mean races have been cancelled in race week because of health and safty.

interestingly enough the authorities agreed to add anohter race last year.

RacoonQueen · 22-01-2021 3:48pm

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2021/01/21/spain-wont-welcome-tourists-until-the-end-of-the-summer/?fbclid=IwAR1f-As89T50XATFCF1pT9EdPHtoISgXbJboqZFeK_i1r_VEeMIqTX3yLM0

Ironman Vitoria not happening then.

tunney · 22-01-2021 3:55pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2021/01/21/spain-wont-welcome-tourists-until-the-end-of-the-summer/?fbclid=IwAR1f-As89T50XATFCF1pT9EdPHtoISgXbJboqZFeK_i1r_VEeMIqTX3yLM0

Ironman Vitoria not happening then.

As the sane people here have said from the start - no IMs this year

peter kern · 22-01-2021 6:12pm

tunney wrote: »

As the sane people here have said from the start - no IMs this year

like last year i bet with you again up to 100 euro chose the amount.

S_D · 22-01-2021 9:09pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2021/01/21/spain-wont-welcome-tourists-until-the-end-of-the-summer/?fbclid=IwAR1f-As89T50XATFCF1pT9EdPHtoISgXbJboqZFeK_i1r_VEeMIqTX3yLM0

Ironman Vitoria not happening then.

https://www.godsavethepoints.com/spain-tourism-reboot-travel-2021/?fbclid=IwAR2fJR8SklP8FvhK0VCkQdIKPaxjYCIlbIYfQZEdvDvIYYHR_VUr_Oz9Fso

depends what article you read eh

'According to Spanish Tourism authorities, Spain will begin reopening for wider tourism in April.'

peter kern · 22-01-2021 10:49pm

S_D wrote: »

https://www.godsavethepoints.com/spain-tourism-reboot-travel-2021/?fbclid=IwAR2fJR8SklP8FvhK0VCkQdIKPaxjYCIlbIYfQZEdvDvIYYHR_VUr_Oz9Fso

depends what article you read eh

I guess it depends if you believe the leader of a country that shapes the strategy , or an tourism agency that lobbies for tourism .

dpforce · 23-01-2021 1:39pm

As government just announced that tough restrictions will stay in place for first six months of 2021, AstraZeneca announced that vaccines supply for first quarter will be just half or even less of what was agreed upon (Norway will get 200K instead of 1.2mil), Pfizer reducing supply by 20% and most likely all the travel restrictions - it doesn't look good at all.....

Chris871 · 23-01-2021 1:57pm

dpforce wrote: »

As government just announced that tough restrictions will stay in place for first six months of 2021, AstraZeneca announced that vaccines supply for first quarter will be just half or even less of what was agreed upon (Norway will get 200K instead of 1.2mil), Pfizer reducing supply by 20% and most likely all the travel restrictions - it doesn't look good at all.....

yeah my optimism is waning big time reading the news over the last 24hrs. Putting myself on a news black out for a few days, its not good for the health

tunney · 26-01-2021 6:24pm

peter kern · 26-01-2021 6:25pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2021/01/21/spain-wont-welcome-tourists-until-the-end-of-the-summer/?fbclid=IwAR1f-As89T50XATFCF1pT9EdPHtoISgXbJboqZFeK_i1r_VEeMIqTX3yLM0

Ironman Vitoria not happening then.

btw this article is fake news
i listened to the speech he gave.
he expects * in this speech * international tourism to come back start of Q3

https://murciatoday.com/spanish-prime-minister-says-tourism-does-not-face-lack-of-demand-but-lack-of-mobility_1552631-a.html?#bottom_navigate

this article reflects much better what he said

Kurt_Godel. · 26-01-2021 7:33pm

tunney wrote: »

Thats an incredibly meaningless statement. Stupendously so, in fact. A perfect report on tumbleweed, delivered breathlessly.

Less twitter, more training Tunney.

tunney · 16-02-2021 12:31pm

Roth postponed two months.

peter kern · 16-02-2021 3:15pm

tunney wrote: »

Roth postponed two months.

and i would say same will happen to european ironman branded races
the only difference is that ironman s contracts dont seem to allow it to postpone a race that early.

BTH · 16-02-2021 9:23pm

Email today to postpone Aix-en-Provence 70.3 supposed to run 16 May.
Moved to September. Although same happened last year and it didn't happen in September either

Options are
1. Race in September
2. Defer to 2022
3. Voucher to be used against any IM France race up to Dec 2024.

I'd prefer my money back.

S_D · 16-02-2021 9:34pm

BTH wrote: »

Email today to postpone Aix-en-Provence 70.3 supposed to run 16 May.
Moved to September. Although same happened last year and it didn't happen in September either

Options are
1. Race in September
2. Defer to 2022
3. Voucher to be used against any IM France race up to Dec 2024.

I'd prefer my money back.

yeah i've got a few now and i just want my money back and to start again fresh, two chances though

Changing Covid situation- how do you plan for 2021 races

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